Texas athletes petitioning University to replace "The Eyes of Texas" and to no longer require athletes to sing it

[UTEX_ME 4754]

3 minutes ago, gyroprotagonist said:

I just wonder where the current team is in all this.  If the "very small minority" is only 85 out of the 50K students, then depending on how overlapping the ven diagram is between those 85 people and the football team, you could still have a big problem no matter how unifying and awesome the Eyes is.  singing the Eyes is awesome.  Love it.  I get chills standing in a crowd seeing the raised hook'em horns hands bob forward to emphasize the 'til Gabriel blows his horn' at the end (fuck people who do it the whole song).  But again, having all the athletes, corches, former players, former alumnus on board with it seems like a big deal.  UT could always just run off or alienate the ones that don't get in line, but is that in line with the university's mission?  

And to your point, can we please stop playing Gary Glitter before a kickoff?  

This is the shit that would be on top of my demand list..

[MrBig 5292]

11 minutes ago, UTEX_ME said:

This is the shit that would be on top of my demand list..

If they put removing the song at the top of the list, a lot of people would stop reading.

Edit: you were referring to the hand bobs and not the athletes’ requests. 

Edited June 15, 2020 by MrBig

[SydneyCarton 47935]

7 minutes ago, MrBig said:

If they put removing the song at the top of the list, a lot of people would stop reading.

Edit: you were referring to the hand bobs and not the athletes’ requests. 

The good news:

CDC seems to understand the importance of this conversation as a school. Former players (african americans) have called him and and insisted they be allowed to come back and speak with the current kids and have a conversation about what the Eyes of Texas means to them, and why they sing it. His main effort now is to have a conversation with these kids and just discuss issues all the way around and go from there. 

The Bad News: There's still plenty of white donors with the "Well, this is what it means to me and my family for the last X generations, so tell them this is what the song should mean to them too, and it's not about race." I've also heard someone go so far as to say "This is a democracy, so if 80% of the people want to keep The Eyes thats what we should do." I guess the whole concept of a subjugated minority of the population not getting a fair shake didn't really resonate in his overall thinking, because there was no recognition of irony there to be seen. 

[mdmost 42878]

 

[Hiphopopotamos 20865]

Is this in response to the interim Pres letter?

 

[Pig Bellmont 8695]

8 minutes ago, mdmost said:

 

I think this is smart. 

[SydneyCarton 47935]

4 minutes ago, Hiphopopotamos said:

Is this in response to the interim Pres letter?

 

I can't imagine it would be. The athletes will start meeting with the administration later this week, and again in July. 

[Hiphopopotamos 20865]

7 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

I think this is smart. 

Indeed - I also appreciate him using 'equity' rather than 'equality'. 

[Nope 3113]

Hope this cheers you guys up 

 

 

[GHOSTUSER 361]

What needs to happen quickly is for the players to understand that the "Eyes of Texas are upon you" does not in any way refer to a slave master's eyes never leaving his slaves. There is nothing to support that interpretation. The lyrics to the Eyes intentionally mocks Prather who would parrot Robert E Lee's "Eyes of the South are upon you" that he'd heard when he was a student at W&L. Last I checked, there were no slaves at that time nor any blacks attending W&L. The song is making fun of Robert E Lee's saying. That does not support the claim that the song is racist. I am pissed about this because I am a history nerd - if this song had racist lyrics or sung with racist intent then get rid of it. At least then we would have a historical record of racist intent. Scrapping the alma mater based on fake history is bullshit and offensive and runs counter to the entire mission of the university in promoting knowledge and the seeking of truth. Explore the history of the minstrel shows. Denounce them. Use this as a source of reconciliation and greater understanding to unify all of us. The Eyes of Texas are upon US.

Edited June 15, 2020 by Iconoclast Texan

[Mantis Toboggan, MD 1499]

21 minutes ago, Hiphopopotamos said:

Indeed - I also appreciate him using 'equity' rather than 'equality'. 

Equality is CANCELLED 

[Deej 76600]

Wait until we have to get rid of the Stormtrooper white uniforms.  

[GHOSTUSER 361]

37 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

I think this is smart. 

Excellent move. This is what should happen.

[GHOSTUSER 361]

12 minutes ago, Nope said:

Hope this cheers you guys up 

 

 

Get rid of every Confederate statue in this country and put them in the museum called Losers and Traitors to their Country. We are Texas. I never have understood why anyone from Texas would want to glorify that sad chapter of our state's history. We have a great history of our own with the best state flag with a barrel full of heroes and greats. We are not Mississippi that needs to glom onto the pathetic Confederacy. 

[Neonmoon 38127]

I keep hearing the same arguments over and over again from Alumni

1. Mob Rule

(Alumni). The majority want the song. Why does a small minority get to control things?

       - Protecting the minority against the majority when it comes to equal rights has kind of been one of America's big things. It doesn't mean the minority get to control everything, it means when it comes to being treated equally, especially when it comes to historically subjugated classes, maybe we should listen and all pick a song together. 

2. Take My Ball and Go Home

(Alumni) - If they take away the song, I'm no longer giving any money

- good I'm sure you can still make it to the Aggy Anti-BLM protest 

3. The Song Means What I think It Means, Not What They Think It Means

(Alumni) I'm not a racist. I sing the song. My kids sing the song. Are you saying my kids are racist? The song to me means kicking OU's ass. Fuck Yeah

  - No one is saying you are a racist. Your kid is not racist. New shit has not come to light, but we are just really looking at the old shit, like REALLY looking at it. Like, we read it before, but now we're like,  imagine Texas announced they created a new song, and in premiering the new song, they showed the video of some white dudes singing the new song in black face. If that happened today, they kids would be expelled, and no one would continue to sing that song ever again. No one would be like, man, the lyrics don't seem that bad right?, and it's pretty catchy, so let's sing it anyway. Huh fellas?

4. You're Erasing History Bro, What's Next The National Anthem?

(Alumni) Yeah people did bad shit back in the day, that's not my fault, I voted for Obama. If we give in to their "demands", what's next, we change the National Anthem? We give the land back to the Indians?

Quote

-  A slippery slope argument (SSA), in logic, critical thinking, political rhetoric, and caselaw, is often viewed as a logical fallacy[1] in which a party asserts that a relatively small first step leads to a chain of related events culminating in some significant (usually negative) effect.[2] The core of the slippery slope argument is that a specific decision under debate is likely to result in unintended consequences. The strength of such an argument depends on the warrant, i.e. whether or not one can demonstrate a process that leads to the significant effect. This type of argument is sometimes used as a form of fearmongering, in which the probable consequences of a given action are exaggerated in an attempt to scare the audience.

- Making changes doesn't mean we're all going to be under Commanche Rule soon. Also, isn't changing so the song to be inclusive to everyone a good thing? Why is change a bad thing? Change is what makes America great. American was founded on the desire to change. People wanted religious freedom, so they changed continents. People didn't want to be under unfair British Rule, so they changed governments. People wanted to to be free from slavery, so they changed the Constitution.  And on and on. 

 

 

[DanTheHorn 4902]

If the Eyes still means what it was meant to communicate to people back in the day now then change it. It did not mean that to me and I am sure to many other folks that are just finding out. The displays of the Confederate flag and Confederate statues still have the same intention today that they had when the Klan started to put them up in the 20's so I support that move. Personally, I would be OK with changing the Eyes since I always hated the fact that I could not defend it being set to I've been working on the railroad. Now I come to find out that someone was not lazy and stupid instead someone was a dick and sore loser.

[NeverMarryAStripper 21784]

1 minute ago, Neonmoon said:

       - Protecting the minority against the majority when it comes to equal rights has kind of been one of America's big things. It doesn't mean the minority get to control everything, it means when it comes to being treated equally, especially when it comes to historically subjugated classes

If I'm not mistaken the Supreme Court just reiterated that fact

[GHOSTUSER 361]

If the players are following Prof. Gordon's lead, these statements of his seem to indicate that having conversations and addressing the history of the song would be enough to keep it IMO. Thankfully our administration is taking those steps.

“What I think is that we need to use these images to teach us about what the past was and as a warning of how not addressing the past can lead to a reproduction of these inequities,” he said. “And then we need to take the action necessary in the present to move beyond the past, whether or not we take down those statues.”

If the university is not prepared to address past inequities, Gordon said, “I’m for eliminating them. But if we are prepared to use these tools as some form of scarlet letter to warn us about the shame of our past and to push us forward to the future, I would say we should keep them.

“If you’re going to own up to your past and use it as a basis for a continual reminder that you’re trying to be different in the present than in the past, I think there is every reason to keep them.”

Edited June 15, 2020 by Iconoclast Texan

[texashorn13 227]

Sorry if this has already been posted, but I didn't feel like going through the 15 pages I've missed today.  I received this picture in a text from a SA at UT, and supposedly this is what they are proposing.  And now I'm confused.  I thought they wanted the whole song gone because of its ties to a minstrel show.  That does not appear to be the case.  They are requesting lyrics changes, and I'm not sure why they chose the lyrics they did to replace.  And we are keeping it to the tune of "I've been working on the railroad" so it can't be that, and we are keeping "The Eyes of Texas" even though those lyrics could be argued against because Robert E. Lee said them.

I'm good with making changes to make this less racially based, but I seriously do not understand this whole thing at all if we are only changing a few lyrics.

 

[Burt Macklin 19000]

2 hours ago, Hiphopopotamos said:

The percentage of African American males with felony convictions went from 10% in 1980 to 33% in 2010. 

Then you have to account for African American males not convicted but sitting in jail cells because they can't afford the increased bail given to AA defendants.  Most people in jail haven't been convicted of a crime.  

20% of people in prison are there for drug offenses.

Of all drug arrests the last few years - more than 80% are for drug possession - fewer than 15% were for manufacture or sale of a drug.

 

 

 

 

Get out of here with your stats and actual information! John Lawrence has watched the Wire. He understands how things work on the streets. Actual data about who gets arrested is irrelevant to his *checks post* objective statement about who actually gets arrested. 

[taybo20 2815]

10 minutes ago, texashorn13 said:

Sorry if this has already been posted, but I didn't feel like going through the 15 pages I've missed today.  I received this picture in a text from a SA at UT, and supposedly this is what they are proposing.  And now I'm confused.  I thought they wanted the whole song gone because of its ties to a minstrel show.  That does not appear to be the case.  They are requesting lyrics changes, and I'm not sure why they chose the lyrics they did to replace.  And we are keeping it to the tune of "I've been working on the railroad" so it can't be that, and we are keeping "The Eyes of Texas" even though those lyrics could be argued against because Robert E. Lee said them.

I'm good with making changes to make this less racially based, but I seriously do not understand this whole thing at all if we are only changing a few lyrics.

 

Maybe the students are willing to compromise, and to do so is to change the lyrics to be more inclusive. Also a way of co-opting a song that has a certain past and remake it into something everyone can appreciate. I have no problem with this if this is indeed what is wanted. And frankly it speaks to compromise and understanding of two opposing views. Which is good!

[Gatorubet 30139]

Scrapping the alma mater based on fake history is bullshit and offensive and runs counter to the entire mission of the university in promoting knowledge and the seeking of truth.

[Ricky Butler 2662]

29 minutes ago, Burt Macklin said:

Get out of here with your stats and actual information! John Lawrence has watched the Wire. He understands how things work on the streets. Actual data about who gets arrested is irrelevant to his *checks post* objective statement about who actually gets arrested. 

And based on his takeaway, it feels like he might need to rewatch the series.

[Bash Riprock 1695]

Confederate statues are just participation trophies.

[Goo Punch 4275]

2 hours ago, Eugene11 said:

You have made mention several times that “people JUST found out” Or lJUST realized”. As well as mention “ very small minority”. Both of these comments completely devalue any other argument you may have (and in my opinion make it absurd).

Just finding out is in no way an excuse for wrong doing. It’s the farthest thing from it and complete insensitive and quite frankly a stupid argument. “I robbed the bank and shot someone. I’m excused  though because I didn’t know you couldn’t do that. Carry on.”

ignorance is not an excuse.

 

no one is "excusing" the wrong doings of the minstrel shows of 150 years ago, and your bombastic analogy re:the bank robbery/shooting is frankly retarded and probably a sign that i shouldn't even give you a serious response, but i guess i'll try anyway (although if my last post went over your head -which it clearly did- then i'll probably just be repeating myself). but let's try this again:

you are grouping this song in with a group of things that is does not belong to. should a black student at UT have to study in a building named after an outright racist who refused to teach blacks? nope. totally legit beef there. should an institution of higher learning such as the University of Texas have statues around campus honoring known racists/members of the Confederacy? Nope. again, that's a total no-brainer, and something that should have been changed a long time ago. Should Julius Whittier already have been recognized by UT in some meaningful way like naming part of the stadium after him? absolutely. and it makes 100% total sense that issues like these would truly bother and affect black students and student athletes at UT, to a point where we can all agree that change needs to be made.

Now then. Let's talk about The Eyes of Texas like adults (save the armed robbery/shooting analogies for the people in your echo chamber). We've already established the song has never ever ever ever EVER been divisive or hateful in its use at the University of Texas (quite the opposite), but since you are somehow  nonplussed by this fact and insistent on being triggered, let's address your point of contention:

those statues, and the names on those buildings hurt people. the people who are being honored by those statues/buildings hurt people. celebrating racists hurts people. systemic racism hurts people. singing The Eyes of Texas does not, nor has it ever hurt anyone. that's why it is absolutely 100% relevant and important to point out that 99.99% of people familiar with the song *just now* found out that it was written by a racist/performed in minstrel shows more than a century ago. That absolutely matters. The song has been bringing hundreds of thousands of people together in unity for decades, and THAT should outweigh the fact that a tiny group of people are choosing to become upset over the fact that a racist guy wrote the song a million years ago, or what's more equating that fact with building statues in honor of slave owners. they are not the same thing. here, i'll use my own analogy that's on par with yours:

I used the term "woke zealots" earlier on purpose, because with this particular request it's like they're at a buffet of Black Justice, and they've gotten to the end of the line with a big ole plate full of substantive, sizable helpings, served to them by truly emphatic and compassionate white people, only now they've said, "I want more. Is your chef white? make him give me his hat. I want the chef's hat. and because he's white and i'm black, and because this important to me, this MUST be done, otherwise you're a racist." that's what you're saying with your post- that literally because a small number of black people ask for it, that anyone who tries to to say that it's nonsensical/not helpful is "a part of the problem." that's ridiculous. 

[Dnaguy 11780]

1 hour ago, NeverMarryAStripper said:

If I'm not mistaken the Supreme Court just reiterated that fact

[David Dennison 18703]

1 hour ago, Iconoclast Texan said:

What needs to happen quickly is for the players to understand that the "Eyes of Texas are upon you" does not in any way refer to a slave master's eyes never leaving his slaves. There is nothing to support that interpretation. The lyrics to the Eyes intentionally mocks Prather who would parrot Robert E Lee's "Eyes of the South are upon you" that he'd heard when he was a student at W&L. Last I checked, there were no slaves at that time nor any blacks attending W&L. The song is making fun of Robert E Lee's saying. That does not support the claim that the song is racist. I am pissed about this because I am a history nerd - if this song had racist lyrics or sung with racist intent then get rid of it. At least then we would have a historical record of racist intent. Scrapping the alma mater based on fake history is bullshit and offensive and runs counter to the entire mission of the university in promoting knowledge and the seeking of truth. Explore the history of the minstrel shows. Denounce them. Use this as a source of reconciliation and greater understanding to unify all of us. The Eyes of Texas are upon US.

The truth is the Eyes of Texas is divisive. It is not a unifying medium for all students and alums. That runs counter to the mission of the university. 

 

[Goo Punch 4275]

oh and as a follow-up to my last post, i have a fun little exercise for @Eugene11 and everyone who repped his post: 

you know a lot of our black athletes listen to and promote rap music that is FILLED with misogynistic, racist, sexist, and antagonistic lyrics, not to mention the glorifying of violence, guns, selling drugs, and prostitution/pimping. and, many of the artists themselves are criminals, convicted felons, gang bangers, rapists, and woman-beaters. so why can't i demand that our athletes stop listening to this music, and posting it on their IG pages and in their highlight reels? I mean these artists and this music are affecting people *today*, time now; not 150 years ago, and not in some "six degrees of kevin bacon" type of way, but right now. drugs (both usage and selling) have been a scourge on the black community, as has gun violence. thousands of women are sex trafficked and pimped out in this country every year. And beating/abusing women is a problem that has affected countless families for generations. so i don't think our athletes should be allowed to listen to that music anymore. it affects me. you agree, right? no more rap music for our athletes? ok good, glad we could all be sensible about this. 

Edited June 15, 2020 by Goo Punch

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

3 hours ago, John Lawrence said:

Only 2 percent of black males are in prison.  It does not account for a significant percentage of absentee dads.

Citing drug use by race is very misleading.  People in prison for drugs are almost always dealers.  Not users.  Because the dealers are the ones with the weight dealers are the ones targeted.  Cops target Avon and Marlo, not Bubbles.

 

I’d love to know the percentages on this, because I feel like it’s a stereotype that we run with way too often. I’m not going to pretend like I have a shit ton of black friends, but I grew up playing team sports and definitely stay close with a lot of my teammates from high school. Other than one dude who’s dad died in a car accident, none of my black friends growing up didn’t have fathers in their lives. Maybe divorced houses where a step dad was in the picture more than the real dad, but none of this “they didn’t have a father figure in their life” bullshit more than any of my shire friends. I know stereotypes are stereotypes for a reason, but I think this one is a little blown out of proportion. 

Edited June 15, 2020 by youdunnf'dup

[Cairn Horn88 8208]

I'm thinking the Beatles solved this years ago:

Try to see it my way
Do I have to keep on talking 'til I can't go on?
While you see it your way
Run the risk of knowing that our song may soon be gone
We can work it out
We can work it out

Think of what you're saying
You can get it wrong and still you think that it's alright
Think of what I'm saying
We can work it out and get it straight, or say good night
We can work it out
We can work it out

Life is very short, and there's no time
For fussing and fighting, my friend
I have always thought that it's a crime
So, I will ask you once again
Try to see it my way

We can work it out
We can work it out
 

[Goo Punch 4275]

19 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

The truth is the Eyes of Texas is divisive. It is not a unifying medium for all students and alums. That runs counter to the mission of the university. 

 

oh it's divide, it's just that the division literally 99/1, if not 99.9/0.1 how many *millions* of UT alums, players, and fans have been singing the song together for decades? ok now how big is this group of people who became offended by the song two days ago when they found out that a racist wrote it? gotcha.

also, why isn't this same group of people just leaving the country entirely? because of systemic racism, the overwhelming majority of shit that we've accomplished in this country can be traced back to racist white men. our buildings were built by them; our roads were paved by them; our biggest businesses were started by them; you don't think there were any racists who helped build DKR? Wrigley Field? Fenway Park? what about Jerryworld? was anyone on the crew who built Jerryworld a racist? because if this is the precedent that we're setting- that anything that was remotely touched by a racist must be done away with- then i don't see how anyone who believes these things can even live in the United States. if it's THAT serious, then they're going to have to boycott just about everything. 

Edited June 15, 2020 by Goo Punch

[David Dennison 18703]

6 minutes ago, Goo Punch said:

oh and as a follow-up to my last post, i have a fun little exercise for @Eugene11 and everyone who repped his post: 

you know a lot of our black athletes listen to and promote rap music that is FILLED with misogynistic, racist, sexist, and antagonistic lyrics, not to mention the glorifying of violence, guns, selling drugs, and prostitution/pimping. and, many of the artists themselves are criminals, convicted felons, gang bangers, rapists, and woman-beaters. so why can't i demand that our athletes stop listening to this music, and posting it on their IG pages and in their highlight reels? I mean these artists and this music are affecting people *today*, time now; not 150 years ago, and not in some "sox degrees of kevin bacon" type of way, but right now. drugs (both usage and selling) have been a scourge on the black community, as has gun violence. thousands of women are sexy trafficked and pimped out in this country every year. And beating/abusing women is a problem that has affected countless families for generations. so i don't think our athletes should be allowed to listen to that music anymore. you agree, right?

They should absolutely be able to listen to it. 

Just like you should absolutely be able to listen to and sing the Eyes of Texas. Go nuts if that's your thing.

That does not mean the university should sanction or play those songs at athletic events.

[David Dennison 18703]

2 minutes ago, Goo Punch said:

oh it's divide, it's just that the division literally 99/1, if not 99.9/0.1 how many *millions* of UT alums, players, and fans have been singing the song together for decades? ok now how big is this group of people who became offended by the song two days ago when they found out that a racist wrote it? gotcha.

also, why isn't this same group of people just leaving the country entirely? because of systemic racism, the overwhelming majority of shit that we've accomplished in this country can be traced back to racist white men. our buildings were built by them; our roads were paved by them; our biggest businesses were started by them; you don't think there were any racists who helped build DKR? Wrigley Field? Fenway Park? what about Jerryworld? was anyone on the crew who built Jerryworld a racist? because if this is the precedent that we're setting- that anything hang was remotely touched by a racist must be done away with- then i don't see how anyone who believes these things can even live in the United States. 

You're making their point.

[Fuck Tim Beck 3806]

2 hours ago, Hiphopopotamos said:

Is this in response to the interim Pres letter?

 

English DeMarvion! Do you speak it?

[MirrOlure 14663]

The truth is the Eyes of Texas is divisive. It is not a unifying medium for all students and alums. That runs counter to the mission of the university. 
 

Someone shoot me. Now. Please.

[Js1 85155]

1 hour ago, texashorn13 said:

Sorry if this has already been posted, but I didn't feel like going through the 15 pages I've missed today.  I received this picture in a text from a SA at UT, and supposedly this is what they are proposing.  And now I'm confused.  I thought they wanted the whole song gone because of its ties to a minstrel show.  That does not appear to be the case.  They are requesting lyrics changes, and I'm not sure why they chose the lyrics they did to replace.  And we are keeping it to the tune of "I've been working on the railroad" so it can't be that, and we are keeping "The Eyes of Texas" even though those lyrics could be argued against because Robert E. Lee said them.

I'm good with making changes to make this less racially based, but I seriously do not understand this whole thing at all if we are only changing a few lyrics.

 

This would be a fair compromise between “song gotta go” or “OMG KEEP IT TURDITIONS!!!!!” 

And if they don’t want stay and sing, they don’t have to. Because like the national anthem, it’s kinda weird. 

[Goo Punch 4275]

oh yeah here's something else i love- our UT athletes, *especially* our football players, almost exclusively wear custom UT/Nike gear that was made in sweat shops. why do they keep wearing all of that gear? almost every time you see a UT players he's wearing some custom Nike shoes or shorts or a workout shirt- why is that ok? if we're going to become "Woke U" then we have to cancel all of our contracts with Nike and sign a new deal with a locally owned and operated shoe/apparel company that pays fair wages and gives health benefits to employees. how can we claim to be woke and wear Nike?

[notre dame joe 173]

I didn't object when they came for the Robert E Lee statues.

[Goo Punch 4275]

10 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

They should absolutely be able to listen to it. 

Just like you should absolutely be able to listen to and sing the Eyes of Texas. Go nuts if that's your thing.

That does not mean the university should sanction or play those songs at athletic events.

well i hate to break it to you, but the university DOES play those songs at athletic events and in the highlight reels they make. did i miss all of the protests about this practice, or does it just not matter because i'm not a young black person and therefore my feelings are irrelevant. 

[Eugene11 379]

4 minutes ago, MirrOlure said:

Someone shoot me. Now. Please.

Just because you don't believe something doesnt make it not true for someone else...

that's a pretty insensiteve and selfish comment

 

que the right wing sensitive someone got their feelings hurt toughen up buttercup comments......

[Armybrat 40755]

25 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

The truth is the Eyes of Texas is divisive. It is not a unifying medium for all students and alums. That runs counter to the mission of the university. 

 

The truth about the origins of the song should set us free.

[mdmost 42878]

3 minutes ago, Goo Punch said:

oh yeah here's something else i love- our UT athletes, *especially* our football players, almost exclusively wear custom UT/Nike gear that was made in sweat shops. why do they keep wearing all of that gear? almost every time you see a UT players he's wearing some custom Nike shoes or shorts or a workout shirt- why is that ok? if we're going to become "Woke U" then we have to cancel all of our contracts with Nike and sign a new deal with a locally owned and operated shoe/apparel company that pays fair wages and gives health benefits to employees. how can we claim to be woke and wear Nike?

Yeah, they should just not care about anything unless they care about everything. Maybe you should tweet some of them and they might see about holding Nike accountable for that. Or you can just throw out every slippery slope argument you can think of. 

[George Clooney 378]

It’s very telling how angry some people get when a viewpoint they’re uncomfortable with is shared. These athletes and the entire black community at UT just want to tell you about their struggles, and they wanted to be treated as true equals in every aspect of life. The condescension and arrogance toward them by some in this fan base is incredibly disappointing.

[Armybrat 40755]

Why do the athletes think the song is racist? Because of what Dr. Gordon claims?

[Goo Punch 4275]

2 minutes ago, mdmost said:

Yeah, they should just not care about anything unless they care about everything. Maybe you should tweet some of them and they might see about holding Nike accountable for that. Or you can just throw out every slippery slope argument you can think of. 

how are you not getting my point? it's like you don't even realize that you just reemphasized the exact point i'm making. 

[ChiTownDoc 21107]

6 minutes ago, notre dame joe said:

I didn't object when they came for the Robert E Lee statues.

That’s a lie.  

[mdmost 42878]

2 minutes ago, Goo Punch said:

how are you not getting my point? it's like you don't even realize that you just reemphasized the exact point i'm making. 

You have a point? A lot of it reads like freaking out and grasping at any straw you can find. 

Edited June 15, 2020 by mdmost

[Gatorubet 30139]

no one is "excusing" the wrong doings of the minstrel shows of 150 years ago, and your bombastic analogy re:the bank robbery/shooting is frankly retarded and probably a sign that i shouldn't even give you a serious response, but i guess i'll try anyway (although if my last post went over your head -which it clearly did- then i'll probably just be repeating myself). but let's try this again:
you are grouping this song in with a group of things that is does not belong to. should a black student at UT have to study in a building named after an outright racist who refused to teach blacks? nope. totally legit beef there. should an institution of higher learning such as the University of Texas have statues around campus honoring known racists/members of the Confederacy? Nope. again, that's a total no-brainer, and something that should have been changed a long time ago. Should Julius Whittier already have been recognized by UT in some meaningful way like naming part of the stadium after him? absolutely. and it makes 100% total sense that issues like these would truly bother and affect black students and student athletes at UT, to a point where we can all agree that change needs to be made.
Now then. Let's talk about The Eyes of Texas like adults (save the armed robbery/shooting analogies for the people in your echo chamber). We've already established the song has never ever ever ever EVER been divisive or hateful in its use at the University of Texas (quite the opposite), but since you are somehow  nonplussed by this fact and insistent on being triggered, let's address your point of contention:
those statues, and the names on those buildings hurt people. the people who are being honored by those statues/buildings hurt people. celebrating racists hurts people. systemic racism hurts people. singing The Eyes of Texas does not, nor has it ever hurt anyone. that's why it is absolutely 100% relevant and important to point out that 99.99% of people familiar with the song *just now* found out that it was written by a racist/performed in minstrel shows more than a century ago. That absolutely matters. The song has been bringing hundreds of thousands of people together in unity for decades, and THAT should outweigh the fact that a tiny group of people are choosing to become upset over the fact that a racist guy wrote the song a million years ago, or what's more equating that fact with building statues in honor of slave owners. they are not the same thing. here, i'll use my own analogy that's on par with yours:
I used the term "woke zealots" earlier on purpose, because with this particular request it's like they're at a buffet of Black Justice, and they've gotten to the end of the line with a big ole plate full of substantive, sizable helpings, served to them by truly emphatic and compassionate white people, only now they've said, "I want more. Is your chef white? make him give me his hat. I want the chef's hat. and because he's white and i'm black, and because this important to me, this MUST be done, otherwise you're a racist." that's what you're saying with your post- that literally because a small number of black people ask for it, that anyone who tries to to say that it's nonsensical/not helpful is "a part of the problem." that's ridiculous. 

I read that in this voice.

[Js1 85155]

1 minute ago, mdmost said:

You have a point? A lot of it reads like freaking out and grasping at any straw you can find. 

Haaaaaaave you met Derka? 

[David Dennison 18703]

1 minute ago, Js1 said:

Haaaaaaave you met Derka? 

Change is painful. This is not going to be easy for a lot of proud Longhorns.

But the days of the university sanctioning the playing of the Eyes of Texas at athletic events are numbered. It's not if, but when.