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Texas athletes petitioning University to replace "The Eyes of Texas" and to no longer require athletes to sing it

Goo Punch

By Goo Punch
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Deej
Deej

Considering it is sung to the tune of "I've Been Working on the Railroad", shouldn't the Chinese students be the ones with the problem?

NorthLoop
NorthLoop

I'm a Trump hating liberal and hope the Republican party withers and dies before my children are of voting age.  That being said....  The song isn't racist. The bullshit 6 degrees of Kevin Bacon

crash_davis
crash_davis

I don't like some if the demands but I'm not a black athlete representing the University of Texas. I don't know what it's like to deal with the fucked up system that they've grown up under.  Fuck

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BurntOrange&White

BurntOrange&White 41649

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29 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

We're trolls because we disagree with your reactionary takes.

OK.

You’re literally a CR troll. It’s you’re entire posting history here and under your old name Kevin on the other site. The only time you venture out is when you’re engaging in semi political post such as this one You stupid mother fucker who is a dog shit poster. 

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Macanudo

Macanudo 13254

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At this point, I don't really give a shit about the outcome of this.   I've kind of given up on caring about UT football because for the last 10 years we've put a shit product on the field.   But I do have a question.   

Up thread someone said something to the effect of "Black people have always known what the song meant/where it came from/the minstrel nature/etc."   

Really?   I'm not PhD in UT history.  But I do have a BA in History from UT and wrote several papers on the history of certain UT related things during my time on the 40 Acres (which I'd be shocked if that's also not something we see in the cross hairs soon as well.)    I was well aware of who Painter and RLM were along with their mind sets on race.   I knew who Heman Sweatt was.  I was there when the "Spooks" got their named changed.  And I understood why.  

But I just can't see why we don't either acknowledge the origin of the song and move on or replace it.   All this hand wringing ignores so many other things we need to deal with AS WELL.     

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immamac

immamac 44199

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2 hours ago, sheeeit said:

I am fascinated by this comment.  I think I understand it but I have no idea where the line, if there actually is one, gets crossed.  And I am not trying to call anyone out.  I'm genuinely curious about your answer based on your posts in this thread.

https://www.technologyreview.com/2020/06/03/1002589/technology-perpetuates-racism-by-design-simulmatics-charlton-mcilwain/

The above is an article written by a black professor from NYU.  He basically tries to argue that advancements in technology have been used by white people to discriminate against black people.  It is his opinion and he is entitled to it.

So if a black member of this site said that your avatar of Steve Jobs shows that you are racist because Jobs was one of the most famous and influential people in creating and advancing technology that is being used to and was specifically designed to systematically discriminate against black people and that unless you change your avatar you are a true racist and that person will accuse this site of racism (since you are a moderator) and post it all over social media.  Do you get to respond?  Defend yourself?  Change your avatar?  

 

Vehemently disagreeing with it and defending your position is absolutely something that should be done. 

Saying the guy doesn't possess critical thinking skills or is otherwise incapable of understanding why it isn't racist is crossing a line. 

Saying you don't think the eyes is racist is a fine argument. Saying others need to share that sentiment because they feel racial oppressions from it is crossing a line. 

Defending whether or not this site is racist is absolutely on me, but I wouldn't ever say it wasn't because the people of color that post here think it isn't. That's bogus. I can talk about the sites mission and what we want to accomplish, and whoever thinks it's racist can bring that up or not come here. See how that works? 

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CastHorn

CastHorn 893

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23 minutes ago, Helobious said:

I’m Mexican. I can still remember my great aunts from Mexico giving me money and gifts for birthdays & Christmas and getting my darker-skinned sister absolutely nothing. In their own words they would say they liked me more because I looked white. There’s lots of racism between mexicans and Central Americans, and between white and dark skinned mexicans. However everyone thumping their chest about white Americans being “the least racist people on the planet” should perhaps open up a history book, visit 4chan or Twitter or Facebook or learn about who Patrick Crusius or Dylan Roof are.

Those same people will label you “white washed”  if your Spanish is weak or if you culturally align with more American traditions. They ignore the legendary past of the natives of that region & glorify their connection to the homicidal diseased rapists who forced their language and religion on their ancestors.   

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Texas73

Texas73 422

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1 hour ago, bar said:

When I attended, we used to make fun of the Aggies and their adherence to tradition. Funny how things change.

First, you misspelled aggy and second, aggy has stupid traditions, and third, singing The Eyes, the most recognized and unifying school song in the history of the world is a great tradition. 

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immamac

immamac 44199

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I love the takes that race has nothing to do with this and it's all about spoiled kids.

This is ALL about race and how it makes people feel of a certain race. 

This isn't about YOU. 

Singing the song after the game is about ALL OF UT AND ITS FANS. 

I haven't seen any arguments for banishment of the song on the grounds of erasure of a long standing Texas tradition. I have seen plenty that say there needs to be an evolution that doesn't put people in a position where they feel something unintended en masse formally requested by hundreds of student athletes who are presently attending and playing for the University. 

No one wants to take the eyes from you, not even the players. They want to share a moment that doesn't include the eyes and then let you have the eyes as well.

What happened Saturday was that players made a personal choice that had 2 devastating effects. 

1) abandonment of their leader and their fanbase

2) a forced decision to choose what they think is right over what they wanted to do.

It's crushing not just for the fans, it was crushing for the players. They just lost a game and they didn't get to feel the support after the game. It was an unfair choice and that's what the problem is, it's one that these young men shouldn't have been compelled to make. 

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BurntOrange&White

BurntOrange&White 41649

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As stated before what the volleyball team has settled on is the correct approach. Having football players stay one week(after a win) and walking off(after a loss/losses) is absolutely the wrong approach. 
 

Sing, don’t sing, throw up the hook em, or don’t throw up the hook em. After games the players should honor the fans/alumni who stayed the entire game and help provide these players with the means for the amenities they get to benefit from.

 

 

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David Dennison

David Dennison 19441

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3 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

As stated before what the volleyball team has settled on is the correct approach. Having football players stay one week(after a win) and walking off(after a loss/losses) is absolutely the wrong approach. 
 

Sing, don’t sing, throw up the hook em, or don’t throw up the hook em. After games the players should honor the fans/alumni who stayed the entire game and help provide these players with the means for the amenities they get to benefit from.

Or take a knee and throw up a fist.

 

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bschoolprof

bschoolprof 6335

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19 minutes ago, immamac said:

 

I haven't seen any arguments for banishment of the song on the grounds of erasure of a long standing Texas tradition. I have seen plenty that say there needs to be an evolution that doesn't put people in a position where they feel something unintended en masse formally requested by hundreds of student athletes who are presently attending and playing for the University. 

No one wants to take the eyes from you, not even the players. They want to share a moment that doesn't include the eyes and then let you have the eyes as well.

No, the original demand was to replace the EOT with a new song.  The argument is still being made: "rewrite, not reclaim"

 

 

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Apex73

Apex73 313

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Posted
10 hours ago, bad_teammate said:

That's not analogous to this situation at all.

The black athletes aren't demanding anyone else do anything. They want the choice to not stand for The Eyes. That's it. If the players were saying "no one should be allowed to sing it at all" that would be an entirely different conversation. Their request is imminently reasonable.

Your foray into white victimhood doesn't represent reality at all.

"Do what tradition demands you do!" is not the position of an independent thinker.

Nope.

Unfortunately, those other people ran out of eligibility so we have the team we have and it's the team we're going to have for a long time. And if our fan base keeps acting like this, it's going to be a less and less talented team over time because of an extremely toxic environment.

We had a choice to unite behind the players and create a positive environment. But a bunch of furious old white guys aren't letting that happen.

Letting the inmates run the asylum isn't the position of an independent thinker either.  What they did the other day was just flat out disrespectful.  It's not so much about the song as it is that they just left the only guy on the team who looks like he cares out there by himself.  You have to understand why that looks bad.  But then again, it seems you don't understand much.

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

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Upon further reflection and thinking about this more today and listening to the Horn on radio I have come to the conclusion this Eyes shitshow is 100 percent Tom Herman’s fault.
 

First of all if he wasn’t such a shitty coach and we won a game OU and the football gods were desperately trying to give us almost nobody would give a shit.

Putting that fact aside, as Rod B said on the radio, how can you as the head coach not have a plan as to how to address this? It’s important to the alumni, it’s important to the fans, the players don’t like it, and you just fucking Let it Ride? Hope it all works out?

Its actually a pretty good microcosm of the entire program. No attention to details unless it’s the color of your piss. Multiple penalties. Bonehead coaching decisions. Binders calling plays. Bonehead on the field decisions. Time for a change.

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Apex73

Apex73 313

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It's also just hilarious that anytime you criticize this nonsense it automatically makes you a racist in a lot of people's eyes on here.  Don't have many thinkers on here I can tell.  To the people doing this (you know who you are), why do you insist on acting like children?

 

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BurntOrange&White

BurntOrange&White 41649

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2 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Upon further reflection and thinking about this more today and listening to the Horn on radio I have come to the conclusion this Eyes shitshow is 100 percent Tom Herman’s fault.
 

First of all if he wasn’t such a shitty coach and we won a game OU and the football gods were desperately trying to give us almost nobody would give a shit.

Putting that fact aside, as Rod B said on the radio, how can you as the head coach not have a plan as to how to address this? It’s important to the alumni, it’s important to the fans, the players don’t like it, and you just fucking Let it Ride? Hope it all works out?

Its actually a pretty good microcosm of the entire program. No attention to details unless it’s the color of your piss. Multiple penalties. Bonehead coaching decisions. Binders calling plays. Bonehead on the field decisions. Time for a change.

This is my biggest issue with it thus far. 

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Bruno Sardine

Bruno Sardine 147

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5 hours ago, bad_teammate said:

- The song's title/theme was inspired by Robert E Lee.
You can care about that or not, up to you, but that's the history.

This is a lie by omission. The president is the one who borrowed and adapted the phrase from Lee. The songs mock the President and, by extension, the phrase from Lee. 

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13479

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15 minutes ago, Bruno Sardine said:

This is a lie by omission. The president is the one who borrowed and adapted the phrase from Lee. The songs mock the President and, by extension, the phrase from Lee. 

Mock as in to disagree/ridicule or merely imitate for humorous effect?

There's so much "WELL, ACTUALLY" in this whole shitshow.

1 minute ago, OUsucks69 said:

You're the only getting butthurt fag boy. 

lol why don't Stanford PhD professors listen to guys like you more often?

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The Doctor

The Doctor 108

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The whole Eyes of Texas debate is tired and should be settled. Try no blue chip Black athletes ever wanting to play for UT if you roll back what you settled on - they should not have to sing a song they find offensive. Then the Alums can spend their $$ and time figuring how keep from becoming SMU circa 1980s, 1990's, 2000's. The BLM movement is bigger than a song and these kids didn't demand as much as they could have. Come to think of why did they even have to? Be better.         

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Honeysucklerose

Honeysucklerose 1006

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The whole Eyes of Texas debate is tired and should be settled. Try no blue chip Black athletes ever wanting to play for UT if you roll back what you settled on - they should not have to sing a song they find offensive. Then the Alums can spend their $$ and time figuring how keep from becoming SMU circa 1980s, 1990's, 2000's. The BLM movement is bigger than a song and these kids didn't demand as much as they could have. Come to think of why did they even have to? Be better.         

so dumb
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MirrOlure

MirrOlure 15185

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Posted
The whole Eyes of Texas debate is tired and should be settled. Try no blue chip Black athletes ever wanting to play for UT if you roll back what you settled on - they should not have to sing a song they find offensive. Then the Alums can spend their $$ and time figuring how keep from becoming SMU circa 1980s, 1990's, 2000's. The BLM movement is bigger than a song and these kids didn't demand as much as they could have. Come to think of why did they even have to? Be better.         

They can’t demand shit because they suck at winning football games, and therefore have no leverage. “Oooohh y’all gonna be really mad when we lose to TCU, Baylor, ..... oh. Wait....”
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Bruno Sardine

Bruno Sardine 147

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16 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Mock as in to disagree/ridicule or merely imitate for humorous effect?

At least own what you wrote. You said Lee inspired the theme yet the song wasn’t 
directed at or written as a commentary on Lee. The song was directed at the president and served as a backhanded stab at his policies/demeanor (“do not think you can escape them” speaks unflatteringly of the president’s perceived heavy-handedness and authoritarian tendencies). The way you phrased it conveys a false impression. 

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The Doctor

The Doctor 108

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LOL! Seems like the players have more leverage than ya thought, right? Listen, better to be a 2-2 ballclub with real upside in the next 12-24  months, than one that damages itself so badly with Black athletes that it can't attract flies (or elite and conscious players) to a picnic. Progressive change is good. Better to be on the right side of it (with the players) vs. struggling through complete irrelevance, despite every possible resource at your disposal.  

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13479

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6 minutes ago, Bruno Sardine said:

At least own what you wrote. You said Lee inspired the theme yet the song wasn’t 
directed at or written as a commentary on Lee. The song was directed at the president and served as a backhanded stab at his policies/demeanor (“do not think you can escape them” speaks unflatteringly of the president’s perceived heavy-handedness and authoritarian tendencies). The way you phrased it conveys a false impression. 

It was a "backhanded stab" or just a gentle ribbing? Because the reality of how we interpret "The Eyes of Texas" IS that those eyes are looking at us in a heavy-handed and judgmental way. We certainly aren't deriding the notion that The Eyes are judging us, we're encouraging it and celebrating it, exactly as Lee did the eyes of the South.

As I've said repeatedly, I don't think the song ITSELF is a racist song. I haven't eschewed it in my own life and have no plans to. I sang it at my wedding with deep friends and family and it will likely be played at my funeral given what I know of the unlucky souls who will be left to either mourn me or celebrate my exit.

It's over. Let's let it be over.

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HtownHorn

HtownHorn 15243

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10 hours ago, alincoln said:

The Eyes is done.  Best to eliminate it during the Herman regime so the next coach doesn't have to deal with it and can instead focus on instilling personal accountability and "purging the malcontents."  The transition from Charmin soft to a winning football culture is going to be difficult enough without a lingering racial issue further dividing the team.  Herman also deserves to be forever associated with killing The Eyes.  An appropriate legacy for him.

That said, I have no idea how CDC will obtain the $50 million he needs to dump Herman and hire Urban after squeezing the BMDs for the SEZ and basketball arena and dumping The Eyes.

He's not. 6 and 7 figure donations are already getting pulled. This was a colossal fuck up by the university and Del Conte and it bled out over the summer into the locker room.

The Eyes will return once the University gets tired of losing hundreds of millions in donations to the school, because that is where this is heading. I imagine that professor that instigated this shit, will be sent packing soon.

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The Doctor

The Doctor 108

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I've been a Horns fan since the 80's but some of the things I'm reading here are downright befuddling and suddenly explains so much about why the program has struggled since VY and Colt and that weird pre-Mack Brown wilderness. Some Alums and idiots on this forum think alum $$ can buy a winning program overnight. Let's get Saban! Let's get Urban! Let's get Andy Reid! Bump it, let's buy Belichick! Really? No, they don't see you the way you see you. If it were that simple and only about $$, UT would already be Alabama before BAMA was BAMA. If it were that simple Jimbo and his $75 mil would be righting the ship at A&M. The recipe for success is certainly NOT alienating Black athletes over a song - not matter how beloved.                   

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Bruno Sardine

Bruno Sardine 147

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5 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

It's over. Let's let it be over.

Yeah but here's the thing. You've criticized other posters for playing fast and loose with the truth. Yet you wrote the following: “The song's title/theme was inspired by Robert E Lee.” I’ve pointed out how this is a demonstrably misleading statement. The sentence, “We certainly aren't deriding the notion that The Eyes are judging us…” is some space-time shifting sophistry. The remark in question – your remark - had to do with the mindset of the students who wrote the song, not how we interpret the song today. You've yet to acknowledge the fact you made a misleading statement. 

My bad for feeding you, just pointing out to others that you obfuscate the truth as much as anybody here.

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El Squared

El Squared 1838

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23 hours ago, bad_teammate said:

 

Our athletes have told us their position. We can either stand with them in unity and move forward or we can rage and create problems. Which one do you want to do?

I am not sure about your reading comprehension skills: I said I don’t have a problem with the players not singing The Eyes.

People can choose to do what they want. My issue is calling the song racist and having it “banned” by “the committee” for anyone who wants to sing it. Anyone should be able to choose what to do on an individual basis. What they shouldn’t do is tell the rest of us we are racist for singing this song.

Read carefully, words matter.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13479

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14 minutes ago, Bruno Sardine said:

Yeah but here's the thing. You've criticized other posters for playing fast and loose with the truth. Yet you wrote the following: “The song's title/theme was inspired by Robert E Lee.” I’ve pointed out how this is a demonstrably misleading statement. The sentence, “We certainly aren't deriding the notion that The Eyes are judging us…” is some space-time shifting sophistry. The remark in question – your remark - had to do with the mindset of the students who wrote the song, not how we interpret the song today. You've yet to acknowledge the fact you made a misleading statement. 

It WAS inspired by Lee, even if by proxy. Prather himself loved the song, so it's not like it was written to actually disagree or satirize his adoption of Lee's phrase. It was clearly a gentle ribbing performed at a minstrel show.

So it's an approving send-up of a phrase inspired by Lee. You're working hard to make it seem like the authors were criticizing Prather/Lee's phrasing, but the evidence isn't there for that.

4 minutes ago, El Squared said:

My issue is calling the song racist and having it “banned” by “the committee” for anyone who wants to sing it. Anyone should be able to choose what to do on an individual basis. What they shouldn’t do is tell the rest of us we are racist for singing this song.

I've got great news for you. You can sing it whenever you want and I'm 99.99999% certain you will never hear anyone call you racist for doing so!

21 minutes ago, The Doctor said:

The recipe for success is certainly NOT alienating Black athletes over a song - not matter how beloved.                   

This.

$10k lockers don't make a shit. Properly motivated players make a shit. That's all there is to it.

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futureman

futureman 22664

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29 minutes ago, The Doctor said:

The recipe for success is certainly NOT alienating Black athletes over a song - not matter how beloved.                 

we’re losing black athletes in recruiting to college station.  I don’t think alienating them is the problem.  

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MirrOlure

MirrOlure 15185

Posted
Posted
I've been a Horns fan since the 80's but some of the things I'm reading here are downright befuddling and suddenly explains so much about why the program has struggled since VY and Colt and that weird pre-Mack Brown wilderness. Some Alums and idiots on this forum think alum $$ can buy a winning program overnight. Let's get Saban! Let's get Urban! Let's get Andy Reid! Bump it, let's buy Belichick! Really? No, they don't see you the way you see you. If it were that simple and only about $$, UT would already be Alabama before BAMA was BAMA. If it were that simple Jimbo and his $75 mil would be righting the ship at A&M. The recipe for success is certainly NOT alienating Black athletes over a song - not matter how beloved.                   

The recipe for success is recruiting ATHLETES who care about playing fucking football first, and everything else second.

 

Whether the “second” is academics, BLM, SJW, chasing pussy, being a diva on social media....what the fuck ever, doesn’t matter. As long as living, eating, breathing, shitting football isn’t first on their list, this half ass shitshow of mediocrity we’ve seen for 10 years will go on and on and on.

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