Black Lives Matter

[TwiceHorn 31987]

On 8/27/2020 at 10:53 AM, Anastasis said:

Technically, it happened twice. 

She's not the only poster.  DalTxHornFan got it, too, some months ago, and for pretty conservative takes.  I can't recall other specific instances, but it has happened before.

[TwiceHorn 31987]

On 8/28/2020 at 10:33 AM, RomaVicta said:

This past year, as I've mentioned before, I have thoughts that I would have never expected as an American.

Where does the Army stand in all of this?

The leadership of the military (not including civilians), regardless of personal political affiliation or belief, seems to be pretty uniform in its belief that its role in domestic affairs is limited to nearly nothing.

See, e.g., https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/28/politics/milley-2020-election/index.html

Edited August 30, 2020 by TwiceHorn

[Mapache 1117]

17 hours ago, Ted Lange said:

 

"Get down boy" seriously? These racist, fucking asshole cops need to be fired.

Edited August 30, 2020 by Mapache

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13619]

12 hours ago, Jive Turkey said:

 

I've been in and out of these threads, but is there any footage of KR being the target of an unprovoked attack as is being claimed? Is there any actual footage of him protecting any business as was the given reason for him traveling to Kenosha?

[Celery Man 21076]

He was definitely being harassed at the gas station, although of course it was not a molotov cocktail thrown at him (it was a plastic bag). There's some footage from earlier where people are accusing him of pointing his gun at people and cars. Probably a lot of chicken and egg about "which side" threatened the other first, although of course this guy drove there with a gun precisely in order to have these kinds of confrontations.

[Aqua Buddha 14782]

18 minutes ago, Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand said:

I've been in and out of these threads, but is there any footage of KR being the target of an unprovoked attack as is being claimed? Is there any actual footage of him protecting any business as was the given reason for him traveling to Kenosha?

Not really.  We're told he was there to protect a car dealership or something but all of the video I've seen is him running down the street.  Makes me think he really wasn't there to "defend" anything.

[Aqua Buddha 14782]

13 hours ago, Jive Turkey said:

 

I'll say it.  If a black kid from a single parent him was posting pics of gang colors and waving his piece around and then shot two people and beat up a girl, the racial code words would be deafening.

[HenryJames 67116]

 

[RomaVicta 30501]

2 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

The leadership of the military (not including civilians), regardless of personal political affiliation or belief, seems to be pretty uniform in its belief that its role in domestic affairs is limited to nearly nothing.

See, e.g., https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/28/politics/milley-2020-election/index.html

That's reassurring. As I'm sure you recognized, the larger point of my post was that in the USA the question even has to be raised. The fact of the report is reassuring; that the issue, by necessity, was  raised is somewhat alarming.

If we were an actual banana republic, would the generals openly say they were  going to seize an election?

In this repubic such as it is, do the generals know for sure where the actual army stands on this?

I am nowhere near predicting that the military will support the subversion of an election or violate their constitutional oaths. I don't like that the possibilities even flitter across my mind for even a second. It's a new thing. I hate it, in fact. But feature this:

I gave the Army bullets. I rebuilt them so they had everything they need. I gave them pay raises.

The GOP chorus repeats every word of the above.

It begins to sound like an appeal. The order won't be to overthrow the election. The order will be to protect the process and ensure others don't thwart our sacred democracy. At worst, it won't seem like much more than casual violation of the Hatch Act or deploying to protect the border from invading caravans.

The orders would be close enough to legal to make disobeying them very close to mutiny or career-ruining. The Attorney General of the US will bless the orders as legal. Hell, a few Supreme Court justices might just opine off the cuff that's it's all perfectly constitutional. The Secretary of Defense says it's all okay in these dangerous times.

Colonel RomaVicta, are you saying you will not obey a lawful order to deploy to a riot torn, Democrat-run city to protect our democratic processes from looters, rioters, anarchists, and thugs? 

Should it come, it will unfold with sly subtlety. The order will not be, "betray the Constitution and your country." The order will be to save them!

Thus, I never assertively predict anything anymore. I see possibilities all the time, but, in the end, it always feels like destiny is determiend by random acts of idiocy, greed, cruelty, or some anomalous altruistic urge.

Who brought the dice?

[TwiceHorn 31987]

13 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

That's reassurring. As I'm sure you recognized, the larger point of my post was that in the USA the question even has to be raised. The fact of the report is reassuring; that the issue, by necessity, was  raised is somewhat alarming.

If we were an actual banana republic, would the generals openly say they were  going to seize an election?

In this repubic such as it is, do the generals know for sure where the actual army stands on this?

I am nowhere near predicting that the military will support the subversion of an election or violate their constitutional oaths. I don't like that the possibilities even flitter across my mind for even a second. It's a new thing. I hate it, in fact. But feature this:

I gave the Army bullets. I rebuilt them so they had everything they need. I gave them pay raises.

The GOP chorus repeats every word of the above.

It begins to sound like an appeal. The order won't be to overthrow the election. The order will be to protect the process and ensure others don't thwart our sacred democracy. At worst, it won't seem like much more than casual violation of the Hatch Act or deploying to protect the border from invading caravans.

The orders would be close enough to legal to make disobeying them very close to mutiny or career-ruining. The Attorney General of the US will bless the orders as legal. Hell, a few Supreme Court justices might just opine off the cuff that's it's all perfectly constitutional. The Secretary of Defense says it's all okay in these dangerous times.

Colonel RomaVicta, are you saying you will not obey a lawful order to deploy to a riot torn, Democrat-run city to protect our democratic processes from looters, rioters, anarchists, and thugs? 

Should it come, it will unfold with sly subtlety. The order will not be, "betray the Constitution and your country." The order will be to save them!

Thus, I never assertively predict anything anymore. I see possibilities all the time, but, in the end, it always feels like destiny is determiend by random acts of idiocy, greed, cruelty, or some anomalous altruistic urge.

Who brought the dice?

Yeah, the fact that the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff has to write such a letter is distressing and alarming.

Sadly for the rationals, I think that letter was written at least in part in response to assertions that the military would forcibly remove Trump from office come January.  But it applies with equal force and was probably also written to reaffirm that the military will not police the ballot boxes, either.

Edited August 30, 2020 by TwiceHorn

[Nivek 17330]

Just don't criticize China because that might hurt him financially.

How do we criticize China for their treatment of Uighers when our own country is locking up and traumatizing children as a matter of policy, rampant police corruption, right wingers shooting people, and with the tacit support of the cops, and we have an administration that is hostile to a certain religious group as a matter of policy.

So maybe take your stupid takes and blow them up your own ass and fuck off, kindly or otherwise.

[Mrs Whiggins 13050]

White life angrily getting into a truck. Isn't shot seven times in the back. Black Lives Matter.

 

[Brisketexan 106625]

So, after careful deliberation, I think that society has presented Black Lives Matter as a question.  "Do Black Lives Matter?

And the answer from our leadership, and a sizable percentage of the population that supports them is "nope."  We were all too ready to toss out the entire movement because violent unrest happened among a fraction of the people aligned with the movement.  We cut white folks 1,000 times the slack a black man gets.  The answer is "no, black lives do not matter."  Go ahead and write it down, close the book, and put it back on the shelf.  Maybe we'll ask again in another 20-30 years.  I doubt the answer will change.

[UpperWestside 6263]

24 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

So, after careful deliberation, I think that society has presented Black Lives Matter as a question.  "Do Black Lives Matter?

And the answer from our leadership, and a sizable percentage of the population that supports them is "nope."  We were all too ready to toss out the entire movement because violent unrest happened among a fraction of the people aligned with the movement.  We cut white folks 1,000 times the slack a black man gets.  The answer is "no, black lives do not matter."  Go ahead and write it down, close the book, and put it back on the shelf.  Maybe we'll ask again in another 20-30 years.  I doubt the answer will change.

We’re more than four centuries in and they are still waiting for their lives to matter. It’s an indictment of our society as a whole that people are protesting for the right to be looked at as equal to everyone else in this country and to, you know, not get randomly shot and killed by police. I truly believe that we are getting better, but change is never easy and the path to a better life is an uphill battle. Our African-American brothers and sisters need the help of everyone who is sick of living in a country where storefront racism continues to happen. I am not going to rely on the government to ever fix the problem because it will always be a half-arsed effort that falls well short.

Edited August 30, 2020 by UpperWestside

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13619]

Shouldn't have to explain this to any functioning adult, but when a person calls for the execution of innocent Americans and obstinately refuses to retract it,

you. don't. vote. for. that. person. for. president.

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2020/aug/31/yusef-salaam-trump-would-have-had-me-hanging-from-a-tree-in-central-park

[TonyTexas 10683]

Quite a cogent thought from a man who has been widely thought an idiot in the past

 

[Brothahorn 10096]

So the frauds and 'lookatmes' don't forget

Quote

 

A 7-year-old girl who was shot Saturday while attending another child’s birthday party has died from her injuries.

Police were called to the 800 block of E. Donald St. in South Bend for reports of a shooting at 7:41 p.m.

They arrived to find the girl shot and in very serious condition. Medics took her to a local hospital where she would later be pronounced dead.

She has been identified as seven-year-old Chrisyah Stephens.

 

Say her name cowards!

https://www.wndu.com/2020/08/30/south-bend-police-investigating-second-shooting-saturday/

 

[Brisketexan 106625]

5 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

So the frauds and 'lookatmes' don't forget

Say her name cowards!

https://www.wndu.com/2020/08/30/south-bend-police-investigating-second-shooting-saturday/

 

Absolutely horrible story.

Remind me....was she killed by someone working for me, literally acting in my name (as I am one of "we the people"), wearing my flag, and acting under the color of my laws?  No?  Okay then.  Perhaps you can see the distinction as to why people react more strongly to crimes committed by THAT group of people than they do to crimes committed by ordinary criminals.

Further, we all expect that her killer will be pursued and brought to justice, and will not use and abuse the defense of "qualified immunity," and will not demand that he is entitled to use deadly force at any given moment because it's the job we gave him, and we should "Back the....bad guy."  So, I mean, this line of logic is one of the dumbest fucking things I've seen come out of the current social shitfest.

[Brothahorn 10096]

4 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Absolutely horrible story.

Remind me....was she killed by someone working for me, literally acting in my name (as I am one of "we the people"), wearing my flag, and acting under the color of my laws?  No?  Okay then.  Perhaps you can see the distinction as to why people react more strongly to crimes committed by THAT group of people than they do to crimes committed by ordinary criminals.

Further, we all expect that her killer will be pursued and brought to justice, and will not use and abuse the defense of "qualified immunity," and will not demand that he is entitled to use deadly force at any given moment because it's the job we gave him, and we should "Back the....bad guy."  So, I mean, this line of logic is one of the dumbest fucking things I've seen come out of the current social shitfest.

The state had a hand in her death by not keeping her safe from the dogs that killed her. 

The 'fantasy' that her killer will be pursued and brought to justice is a joke. The state of Indiana ranked 48th(2017) as whole.  So there is a better chance that her killer goes free and will kill again. Failure of the state to protect the innocent.

I wonder if anyone will take a day off work/practice for Chrisyah?

https://www.courierpress.com/story/opinion/columnists/jon-webb/2019/10/21/study-claims-indiana-pretty-bad-solving-homicides/3928747002/

 

[Brisketexan 106625]

2 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

The state had a hand in her death by not keeping her safe from the dogs that killed her. 

The 'fantasy' that her killer will be pursued and brought to justice is a joke. The state of Indiana ranked 48th(2017) as whole.  So there is a better chance that her killer goes free and will kill again. Failure of the state to protect the innocent.

I wonder if anyone will take a day off work/practice for Chrisyah?

https://www.courierpress.com/story/opinion/columnists/jon-webb/2019/10/21/study-claims-indiana-pretty-bad-solving-homicides/3928747002/

 

Well then, it seems like we ought to demand better of Indiana law enforcement.  I mean, I would demand better of the bad guys "hey murderers, don't be murdery," but that seems like a fool's errand.  Whereas "hey cops, do a better job of investigating homicides" and "hey cops, protect people instead of hurting them" seems to be a pretty sound message we should send.  And, you know, the police should like, listen to that.  Because it's literally their job.

Edited August 31, 2020 by Brisketexan

[406W30th 1111]

13 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

The state had a hand in her death by not keeping her safe from the dogs that killed her. 

The 'fantasy' that her killer will be pursued and brought to justice is a joke. The state of Indiana ranked 48th(2017) as whole.  So there is a better chance that her killer goes free and will kill again. Failure of the state to protect the innocent.

I wonder if anyone will take a day off work/practice for Chrisyah?

https://www.courierpress.com/story/opinion/columnists/jon-webb/2019/10/21/study-claims-indiana-pretty-bad-solving-homicides/3928747002/

 

So we agree that cops are truly awful at their job? Cool. Let's stop spending obscene amounts of money on their bloated budgets.

 

[Brothahorn 10096]

11 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Well then, it seems like we ought to demand better of Indiana law enforcement.  I mean, I would demand better of the bad guys "hey murderers, don't be murdery," but that seems like a fool's errand.  Whereas "hey cops, do a better job of investigating homicides" and "hey cops, protect people instead of hurting them" seems to be a pretty sound message we should send.  And, you know, the police should like, listen to that.  Because it's literally their job.

In order to do that, you would have to change the voting patterns. And we all know that ain't happening.

So her life doesn't matter. No money, no fame.

[UpperWestside 6263]

41 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

So the frauds and 'lookatmes' don't forget

Say her name cowards!

https://www.wndu.com/2020/08/30/south-bend-police-investigating-second-shooting-saturday/

 

What was the moment in your life that caused your brain to be permanently broken? Do you honestly think people do not care about this senseless death if her name is not chanted? Good Lord man find a therapist and talk it out. They can help you live a better life than what you are exhibiting to everyone in here.

[Anastasis 23699]

4 minutes ago, 406W30th said:

So we agree that cops are truly awful at their job? Cool. Let's stop spending obscene amounts of money on their bloated budgets.

But then how are they going to afford the maintenance bill on the MRAP?

[Guest]

On 8/30/2020 at 9:27 AM, TwiceHorn said:

The leadership of the military (not including civilians), regardless of personal political affiliation or belief, seems to be pretty uniform in its belief that its role in domestic affairs is limited to nearly nothing.

See, e.g., https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/28/politics/milley-2020-election/index.html

LOLz at how different things would be if guys like Milley were calling bigger shots, but they're also "aware" of their position.  Milley si a BAMF.  period.  So is Mattis, and he recognized he was in a shit storm.  I'm glad he hit the eject button in an unwinnable battle.

[wildcat09 29557]

1 hour ago, Brothahorn said:

The state had a hand in her death by not keeping her safe from the dogs that killed her. 

The 'fantasy' that her killer will be pursued and brought to justice is a joke. The state of Indiana ranked 48th(2017) as whole.  So there is a better chance that her killer goes free and will kill again. Failure of the state to protect the innocent.

I wonder if anyone will take a day off work/practice for Chrisyah?

https://www.courierpress.com/story/opinion/columnists/jon-webb/2019/10/21/study-claims-indiana-pretty-bad-solving-homicides/3928747002/

 

The State of Indiana has had a Republican Governor since 2005 and has controlled the governorship, the Indiana house, and the Indiana senate since 2011. What voting pattern changes do you think would help improve the rate at which police in Indiana solve crimes?

[Guest]

1 minute ago, wildcat09 said:

The State of Indiana has had a Republican Governor since 2005 and has controlled the governorship, the Indiana house, and the Indiana senate since 2011. What voting pattern changes do you think would help improve the rate at which police in Indiana solve crimes?

no.

[Brothahorn 10096]

1 hour ago, UpperWestside said:

What was the moment in your life that caused your brain to be permanently broken? Do you honestly think people do not care about this senseless death if her name is not chanted? Good Lord man find a therapist and talk it out. They can help you live a better life than what you are exhibiting to everyone in here.

Oh Snap, mental health smack. 

Nothing says I'm a lil bitch with no ideas better than mental health smack. Do you even post outside of your safe place-echo chamber(cloak room)?

Stay in your lane, lil dude.

And thank you for raising your hand and letting me know that you are a chickenshit fraud as well.

[Brothahorn 10096]

11 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

The State of Indiana has had a Republican Governor since 2005 and has controlled the governorship, the Indiana house, and the Indiana senate since 2011. What voting pattern changes do you think would help improve the rate at which police in Indiana solve crimes?

I said the 'state'. But of course your clown ass can't read.

[Guest Lobo]

If Tito Jackson still ran Indiana, things would be different...I tell you that right now my friends. 

[wildcat09 29557]

6 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

I said the 'state'. But of course your clown ass can't read.

Please explain the import of the distinction for those of us who are too dumb to get your point.

[JimmyJames 12271]

12 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Please explain the import of the distinction for those of us who are too dumb to get your point.

He can’t and he won’t. 

[JimmyJames 12271]

Whenever a crime is committed it’s because of the fault of whoever I don’t support.

[JimmyJames 12271]

27 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

Oh Snap, mental health smack. 

Nothing says I'm a lil bitch with no ideas better than mental health smack. Do you even post outside of your safe place-echo chamber(cloak room)?

Stay in your lane, lil dude.

And thank you for raising your hand and letting me know that you are a chickenshit fraud as well.

You don’t own a pizza joint do you?

[JimmyJames 12271]

1 hour ago, Brothahorn said:

In order to do that, you would have to change the voting patterns. And we all know that ain't happening.

So her life doesn't matter. No money, no fame.

So the voters killed her?

[UpperWestside 6263]

37 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

Oh Snap, mental health smack. 

Nothing says I'm a lil bitch with no ideas better than mental health smack. Do you even post outside of your safe place-echo chamber(cloak room)?

Stay in your lane, lil dude.

And thank you for raising your hand and letting me know that you are a chickenshit fraud as well.

You have anger issues. I say that to you as someone who uses therapy and enjoys it for a different reason than why I mention it to you. I feel free to speak about it because you are clearly exhibiting the behavior of someone who has some mental issues that a therapist can help you with. 
 

Again I will ask you this question. What was the moment in your life that caused your brain to be broken? You continue to verbally assault the BLM Movement for not adhering to something that is not the focus of their movement. You know exactly what the movement is centered on and it is police brutality. You attack them constantly like you are a real live caricature of Uncle Ruckus. It’s embarrassing to see you continue to do this for no real reason. If you don’t like the BLM Movement go and start your own and have it focus precisely on what you want.

I do genuinely feel for you. You are a broken man who is too proud to admit you need the help. I was there once. Many of us were if people here want to be completely honest. You are showing it here that you do need it with what you write. I do not want to be in the lane you are in because it is one filled with hate, unstable anger and that is repulsive to me and most everyone else who posts here. Try and do better and find a more positive way to vent your frustration man.

Edited September 1, 2020 by UpperWestside

[JimmyJames 12271]

When a 7 year old is shot and killed by some asshole the very last reaction should be whose particular political party is at fault. 
 

Geezus.

[Brothahorn 10096]

Please explain the import of the distinction for those of us who are too dumb to get your point.

Whoever is in charge from the Governor to the Mayor and is not doing their job needs to be replaced. Doesn’t matter if it is Republican Governor or a Democrat Mayor if they are not doing their job they need to be replaced.

My response to Brisketexan was from an earlier conversation in another thread where we both said the American people as voters are responsible for this mess. And are ok with it.

Of course your simple ass decided to make it about Republicans. A weak ass gotcha.

[Brothahorn 10096]

He can’t and he won’t. 

Your turn simple jack..

[Brothahorn 10096]

You don’t own a pizza joint do you?

BBQ trailer in front of the club. Stop by sometime.

[UpperWestside 6263]

1 minute ago, JimmyJames said:

When a 7 year old is shot and killed by some asshole the very last reaction should be whose particular political party is at fault. 
 

Geezus.

The focus should be squarely on a life lost way too young. I am in school and will within the next year and a half be working with children that age. It makes me incredibly sad to see stuff like this. I can never understand how anyone feels that killing someone is the answer to a problem. Spraying bullets like that and taking out a child makes me want to see that person responsible spend the rest of their life in a prison cell. 

[JimmyJames 12271]

3 minutes ago, Brothahorn said:

Your turn simple jack..

Fine. No particular politician or party is responsible for the tragic the murder of that girl.

But leadership starts at the top and shit flows downhill. And when the president of the United States openly incites violence on twitter, that has consequences. When the mayor of Portland or the governor of Wisconsin openly incites violence on twitter, I will condemn them for that, just like any other politician should be, including trump.
 

 Will you?

[JimmyJames 12271]

If trump wasn’t the president he would have been banned from twitter along time ago.

Any of you trolls care to argue that point?

[Guest]

1 minute ago, JimmyJames said:

If trump wasn’t the president he would have been banned from twitter along time ago.

Any of you trolls care to argue that point?

who fucking cares?  Seriously.  Gotdam slapfight disqualification?

[JimmyJames 12271]

3 minutes ago, slorch said:

who fucking cares?  Seriously.  Gotdam slapfight disqualification?

I care that the president is openly inciting violence and spreading disinformation on twitter.

Sorry bout that. You obviously don’t. I’m sure you would have been ok with that black dude from Kenya doing the same.

Edited September 1, 2020 by JimmyJames

[Brothahorn 10096]

Feel free to dump on Trump all you want. I won’t stop you.

State and local government are responsible for enforcing criminal law that could have saved this child.

[totallynotabuttpirate 5477]

Brothahorn feeling frisky tonight spouting his nonsense. 

[TwiceHorn 31987]

2 hours ago, 406W30th said:

So we agree that cops are truly awful at their job? Cool. Let's stop spending obscene amounts of money on their bloated budgets.

 

Yeah, this is another thing.  The cops so rarely actually SAVE anyone directly.  Which is not really a dig at cops, that's just a timing issue.  It is not possible to have enough cops to actually interdict crime in progress.

But the notion that you will immediately become unsafe if there are fewer cops or fewer on the streets, or unarmed, is just flat-out silly, as is the notion that you will be markedly safer if there are more, or better armed.

Crime is never, ever going to be reduced to zero.  Efforts to do so will have diminishing returns.  And even negative returns, see, e.g. the drug war.

I agree that it is the state's responsibility to enforce criminal laws, as nearly as practicable to the exclusion of the federal government.

Edited September 1, 2020 by TwiceHorn

[workswithseed 2201]

1 hour ago, Brothahorn said:

Your turn simple jack..

[TwiceHorn 31987]

16 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Yeah, this is another thing.  The cops so rarely actually SAVE anyone directly.  Which is not really a dig at cops, that's just a timing issue.  It is not possible to have enough cops to actually interdict crime in progress.

But the notion that you will immediately become unsafe if there are fewer cops or fewer on the streets, or unarmed, is just flat-out silly, as is the notion that you will be markedly safer if there are more, or better armed.

Crime is never, ever going to be reduced to zero.  Efforts to do so will have diminishing returns.  And even negative returns, see, e.g. the drug war.

I agree that it is the state's responsibility to enforce criminal laws, as nearly as practicable to the exclusion of the federal government.

Tragedies are going to happen in this life.  Some will be wholly accidental, others the result of negligence or recklessness, still others the result of criminal intentions and acts.

It is unrealistic, and actually probably anti-conservative, to believe that government can or should protect you from all of the tragedies.