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Trump’s Gestapo in Portland

Hugo Stiglitz

By Hugo Stiglitz
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TexArcher
TexArcher

If you won't vote against the guy who's using federal agents in unmarked gear to arrest people who are protesting murder by police... If you won't vote against the guy who's using federal agents

High Plains Drifter
High Plains Drifter

If I was the mayor of Portland, I'd tell the police dept to arrest unidentified armed men in unmarked vans.   Also, the people we need to be defunding are ICE and Border Patrol.  

pyrohornIII
pyrohornIII

Libertarians are those who have no clue what the answers are, so they espouse a policy of no answers/no regulation/no government.  They even developed their own party to support this idea.  That way t

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Mrs Whiggins

Mrs Whiggins 13050

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54 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

If that’s your concern and you don’t think they can/are documenting and tracking your “anonymous” online history on this board and a there else I’ve got a bridge Is like to sell you. 

I am aware of that. This is about standing in front of someone/ groups of someones with weapons who have apparently had little training,  isn't sure what constitutes a legal arrest, and will remove you because you're standing next to someone who looks like they might be thinking of doing something suspicious. It was a priority kind of thing.

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cactusflinthead

cactusflinthead 27626

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Are we going to get a new thread for every city where he tries out this Trump Gestapo?

@Bill Brasky nobody that I know that's attended a protest against police brutality wants to kill anyone. That's kinda the point. However, it would be really fucking cool if the police stopped killing people for no good reason.

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Sawbonz

Sawbonz 28081

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2 hours ago, Bill Brasky said:

questioning why conservative gun owners aren't putting their lives on the line to defend people who want them dead is a brilliant take 

They don’t want you dead. They want to make it home safe to their families 

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BearSchlong

BearSchlong 8231

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Just talked to my sister who writes the indictments. 50 so far, and the offenders are mainly from out of state. Zero charges for property damage, all are for assault, aiming lasers at planes, trying to blind people, shooting Roman candles at feds, etc.

The protests are now just a tourist destination.

Also, Beaumont, TX (population 118K) has 10,000 more black residents than Portland.

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hpslugga

hpslugga 4096

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5 hours ago, Bill Brasky said:

questioning why conservative gun owners aren't putting their lives on the line to defend people who want them dead is a brilliant take 

I’ve seen some pretty dishonest shit on this board. This one is pretty fucking low

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ousuxndallas

ousuxndallas 65

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If history holds true, there will be a response to the Marxist/communist violence. And it will likely be groups of far, far right people that start rounding up agitators, and taking things into their own hands. If the Marxists can't self police, and the local governments don't keep them in check, then it falls to the feds to intervene. If that is rejected, history shows us the ensuing response will not be favorable to the Marxists. Examples abound in Central America and Eastern Europe post WWII.

Pick your poison. Be careful what you wish for.

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Pescado_Rojo

Pescado_Rojo 19558

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8 minutes ago, ousuxndallas said:

If history holds true, there will be a response to the Marxist/communist violence. And it will likely be groups of far, far right people that start rounding up agitators, and taking things into their own hands. If the Marxists can't self police, and the local governments don't keep them in check, then it falls to the feds to intervene. If that is rejected, history shows us the ensuing response will not be favorable to the Marxists. Examples abound in Central America and Eastern Europe post WWII.

Pick your poison. Be careful what you wish for.

Is it difficult to write fan fiction like that with your finger up your own ass? 

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 46976

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6 hours ago, Bill Brasky said:

questioning why conservative gun owners aren't putting their lives on the line to defend people who want them dead is a brilliant take 

So, it wasn't about America, it was just about some Americans.  Thanks for clarifying.  We all knew it.

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Foosters

Foosters 18225

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56 minutes ago, ousuxndallas said:

If history holds true, there will be a response to the Marxist/communist violence. And it will likely be groups of far, far right people that start rounding up agitators, and taking things into their own hands. If the Marxists can't self police, and the local governments don't keep them in check, then it falls to the feds to intervene. If that is rejected, history shows us the ensuing response will not be favorable to the Marxists. Examples abound in Central America and Eastern Europe post WWII.

Pick your poison. Be careful what you wish for.

And in a functional state those far right terrorists would be rounded up and charged with all sorts of crimes that would ensure they never step outside a Federal prison again.

Do you think this administration would charge those people?

 

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Bone3421

Bone3421 716

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Trump the domestic terrorist is trying to turn American cities into Belfast during the Troubles. Soon people will be banging metal garbage can lids on pavement to signal approaching occupying British troops, I mean federal law enforcement.
Shit, the Proud Boy marches are similar to the Orangemen marching through Catholic neighborhoods in order to antagonize the political minorities. Trumpism is sectarian and we are intentionally being moved towards violence.
 


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washparkhorn

washparkhorn 9967

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19 minutes ago, ousuxndallas said:

If history holds true, there will be a response to the Marxist/communist violence. And it will likely be groups of far, far right people that start rounding up agitators, and taking things into their own hands. If the Marxists can't self police, and the local governments don't keep them in check, then it falls to the feds to intervene. If that is rejected, history shows us the ensuing response will not be favorable to the Marxists. Examples abound in Central America and Eastern Europe post WWII.
 

An unfortunate relic trope from the Cold War days.  We won that war economically - and because we built a fuckton of military might to beat those son of a bitches. We did it using economic weapons, not thugs in the street.

 
 
 
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Spoiler

 

The "Thugs in the street" trope was used by Nazi's rounding up citizens and conquered people. We beat those pigs in WWII. 

Marxism is dead. Communism is dead. Capitalism won. America and the World won that war. 

The Cold War Victory was a big win for most of humanity. That strain of the Revolutionary Communist helped Russians break away from monarchy.  But oppressive and brutal tactics were deployed. And the quick consolidation of power by party elites was forboding. It was a dumb way to govern.

Now that is gone in terms of a threat. Russia is a pipsqueak economically. They still have nukes, but I think we have that figured out. They have a gangster economy. That's not revolutionary. 

There are a lot of people in peaceful protests that media lumps into violent anarchists. I know because I watch it periodically. Some of those protestors out there voted for Trump in 2016. No one should want overzealous police tactics. That is not Marxism. That's human.

 

 

But a good topic to explore further.

Spoiler

Everyone has a duty to be reasonable. That is the social compact we live by - as enshrined in our laws and the Constitution. I have no doubt some want violence, but that will end poorly. Better to be Americans now. There will be a peaceful transition of power - with dignity as the Office of the Presidency deserves.  Talk of roving federal agents will be closely controlled by career leadership following established guidelines for civil gatherings. Those guidelines mandate strict action against those who seek to sow civil unrest - especially if motivated or influenced by racial animus. So expect to see those federal agents see vigilantes as a bigger threat to the peace. Brandishing weapons might be seen as a threat to a federal agent. We know how those things work. 

 

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Bullneck

Bullneck 19454

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5 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

One of y’all asked a couple of days ago if there was any way to donate to support the protesters - thought I’d pass this along.

I’ve also seen tweets about a bail fund as well but can’t find it again. If I do I’ll post it too.

 

Donated.

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Captainant

Captainant 28387

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9 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

Here’s something fun. Many of us regularly interact with FPS officers, US Marshals, and CBP agents. Now, every time you do so, you get to wonder whether they were part of the group committing war crimes against their own people. So, that’s fun.

One of my neighbors is a DHS agent that just got back after spending a week "somewhere". I wonder where he was sent...

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Gatorubet

Gatorubet 30631

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If history holds true, there will be a response to the Marxist/communist violence. And it will likely be groups of far, far right people that start rounding up agitators, and taking things into their own hands. If the Marxists can't self police, and the local governments don't keep them in check, then it falls to the feds to intervene. If that is rejected, history shows us the ensuing response will not be favorable to the Marxists. Examples abound in Central America and Eastern Europe post WWII.

Pick your poison. Be careful what you wish for.

Yeah. Like those Marxist moms
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Nivek

Nivek 17330

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If history holds true, there will be a response to the Marxist/communist violence. And it will likely be groups of far, far right people that start rounding up agitators, and taking things into their own hands. If the Marxists can't self police, and the local governments don't keep them in check, then it falls to the feds to intervene. If that is rejected, history shows us the ensuing response will not be favorable to the Marxists. Examples abound in Central America and Eastern Europe post WWII.

Pick your poison. Be careful what you wish for.

Part of the problem with a limited imagination and a poor education is that one cannot discern situations.

Being on the wrong side of the intellectual bell curve is not a problem as long as you accept it or work on some skill to offset the disadvantage.

You may be unfamiliar with history, so I will share with you a simple fact that there were many revolutions and insurrections before Marx and they had multiple reasons too. One could even argue that this country was founded on a now solely Democratic Party belief in the right of representation (voting) that the right loves to suppress and restrict at every turn.

What you see as Communism was actually totalitarianism and not so much in disguise but you could not see beyond the words and your emotions with those words. Thus you don’t actually understand and cannot see how the right embraces authoritarianism and is much closer to those “communists” you so fear.
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wildcat09

wildcat09 29556

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7 hours ago, ousuxndallas said:

If history holds true, there will be a response to the Marxist/communist violence. And it will likely be groups of far, far right people that start rounding up agitators, and taking things into their own hands. If the Marxists can't self police, and the local governments don't keep them in check, then it falls to the feds to intervene. If that is rejected, history shows us the ensuing response will not be favorable to the Marxists. Examples abound in Central America and Eastern Europe post WWII.

Pick your poison. Be careful what you wish for.

When did you stop beating your wife?

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23367

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

In all fairness, there are like 12 black people in Portland. 

I know but that’s where this goes when black people stand up for their rights every single time, going back to the civil rights movement.  White folks join in support and they all become Marxists over night.  It’s a trick to delegitimization protests and movements.

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Zonahorn

Zonahorn 8079

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1 hour ago, Bullneck said:

 

 

Narrator: they did not

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/portland-mayor-tear-gassed-amid-protests-over-federal-agents/ar-BB175QVS?ocid=msedgntp

Quote

PORTLAND—Mayor Ted Wheeler joined protesters here on the front lines Wednesday night and was tear-gassed with the crowd, days after criticizing the Trump administration’s deployment of federal agents.

Videos and photographs of Mr. Wheeler posted on social media showed him wearing goggles and a surgical mask and coughing amid a cloud of gas.

 

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23699

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20 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I know but that’s where this goes when black people stand up for their rights every single time, going back to the civil rights movement.  White folks join in support and they all become Marxists over night.  It’s a trick to delegitimization protests and movements.

Maybe he learned the tactic from the FBI?

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23367

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Just now, Anastasis said:

Maybe he learned the tactic from the FBI?

Yes, the practices of the FBI were evil and wrong during the Civil Rights Era and there are pieces of shit in the FBI now but like political parties, the FBI is an institution made up of people, which can be good or bad and have the ability to change.  My point here is the institution is not inherently evil but it can easily earn that perception when it’s led by evil people. The same holds true for political parties.
 

“But the democrats are the real racist party, just look at their history!”  

Takes like these are specious and only intended to avoid accountability.  

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23699

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Posted

 

6 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

“But the democrats are the real racist party, just look at their history!”  

Takes like these are specious and only intended to avoid accountability.  

Yeah, I am not saying anything like that and not sure what it really has to do with the current exchange.  

7 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Yes, the practices of the FBI were evil and wrong during the Civil Rights Era and there are pieces of shit in the FBI now but like political parties, the FBI is an institution made up of people, which can be good or bad and have the ability to change.

I think that I found the problem.

These federal institutions have both historically and contemporaneously been used as tools of domestic and foreign oppression. I think that we need to simply eliminate some of these institutions (e.g., DHS) and significantly constrain others (ICE, FBI, CIA, NSA). If some of those are resistant to constraint, or abuse the powers they have been given by working outside the guardrails that have been established, then they need to be salvaged through decapitation. But instead what we have is people caping for one or the other based on momentary political inclinations.     

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23367

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16 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Yeah, I am not saying anything like that and not sure what it really has to do with the current exchange.  

It was an analogy.  
 

16 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

These federal institutions have both historically and contemporaneously been used as tools of domestic and foreign oppression. I think that we need to simply eliminate some of these institutions (e.g., DHS) and significantly constrain others (ICE, FBI, CIA, NSA). If some of those are resistant to constraint, or abuse the powers they have been given by working outside the guardrails that have been established, then they need to be salvaged through decapitation. But instead what we have is people caping for one or the other based on momentary political inclinations.     

These institutions are all vehicles of law enforcement and have been used and abused to protect, reinforce, and advance status quo wealth/white supremacy.  That’s the ugly truth as I know it.  We’re told we have them to protect our freedoms but often their purpose is to protect power from the people.

Major reforms in these institutions are absolutely necessary and if we still want to call ourselves a free democratic society with a straight face, some of these institutions probably need to go or repurposed.  

Edited by Hugo Stiglitz
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Anastasis

Anastasis 23699

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1 minute ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

It was an analogy.  

And a totally irrelevant and specious one to the current exchange. 

2 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Major reforms in these institutions are absolutely necessary and if we still want to call ourselves a free democratic society with a straight face, some of these institutions probably need to go and/or repurposed.  

Agreed.  And the necessity of those reforms have been obvious for quite some time.  Perhaps the current environment and the near term change in political leadership will bring about the necessary reforms.  I remain skeptical, but hope to be proven wrong. 

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Huckleberry

Huckleberry 34407

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Posted (edited)

Anastasis completely agrees with Hugo right now but can't stop saying both sides or trying to withdraw from the specific actions actually happening in order to seem like he's not blaming a particular group. It's funny.

Edited by Huckleberry
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Anastasis

Anastasis 23699

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Posted
1 minute ago, Huckleberry said:

Anastasis completely agrees with Hugo right now but can't stop saying both sides. It's funny.

I don't think that I made an explicit both sides argument up thread. Of course, the both sides is implicit in discussion of domestic and foreign abuses by federal three letter agencies, because reality and things. So I will grant you that. 

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 106618

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10 hours ago, BearSchlong said:

Just talked to my sister who writes the indictments. 50 so far, and the offenders are mainly from out of state. Zero charges for property damage, all are for assault, aiming lasers at planes, trying to blind people, shooting Roman candles at feds, etc.

The protests are now just a tourist destination.

Also, Beaumont, TX (population 118K) has 10,000 more black residents than Portland.

Cool.  If certain individuals commit illegal acts, they can and should face legal consequences.  That seems like an EXCELLENT principle to uphold, wouldn't you agree?  I have no problem with any individual who points a laser into another person's eyes facing criminal charges.  I presume you likewise agree that any individual who viciously swings a club at a person who does not constitute any threat to the attacker or others, to the point of shattering the victim's bones, and then shooting him in the face with chemicals, should likewise face criminal charges....right?

The law applies to everyone.

Or it doesn't apply at all.  That's the way the Rule of Law works.

7 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

What an idiot.

 

 

7 hours ago, washparkhorn said:

It is shameful Americans have to use homemade defensive shields to exercise their freedom of speech and assembly. He has shit for brains when it comes to judgment. 

Yep, "look at the fact that the way we deal with any and all protesters, including the fucking MAYOR of the city, means that any protester with a brain is going to gear up to protect himself.  Look what I have proven!"

Dumbass fascist.

1 hour ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I know but that’s where this goes when black people stand up for their rights every single time, going back to the civil rights movement.  White folks join in support and they all become Marxists over night.  It’s a trick to delegitimization protests and movements.

The "we have to go out and fight these marxists" is lazy unoriginal shit ripped right out of 1963.  What a CLEVER attack!

Fucking seriously, the stupidity.....it burns.

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wildcat09

wildcat09 29556

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Posted
10 hours ago, BearSchlong said:

Just talked to my sister who writes the indictments. 50 so far, and the offenders are mainly from out of state. Zero charges for property damage, all are for assault, aiming lasers at planes, trying to blind people, shooting Roman candles at feds, etc.

The protests are now just a tourist destination.

Also, Beaumont, TX (population 118K) has 10,000 more black residents than Portland.

Now other people who sympathize with the protesters shouldn't go to Portland to join them? I'm so confused by these right-wing takes.

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