Do We Have a Christ Followers Thread?

[Bernard 879]

I’m no believer, but I can’t deny there are some benefits to forgoing all logic and reason and just believing.

Bernard

[936horn 910]

Q: How do you know if someone’s an atheist?

A: they’ll tell you every chance they get. This thread is living proof

Edited August 21, 2020 by 936horn

[dcbc 14465]

3 minutes ago, 936horn said:

Q: How do you know if someone’s an atheist?

A: they’ll tell you every chance they get. This thread is living proof

I thought that was a vegetarian?

[936horn 910]

Just now, dcbc said:

I thought that was a vegetarian?

You could sub in vegetarian, vegan, or crossfitter and it still works imo. 

[Bullneck 19070]

5 hours ago, dittohead said:

Gave myself to Him 9 years ago (45 now).  Good to know how the book "ends"... especially in this craptastic time we are in now.

 

Dittohead?  Fuck you.

[Bullneck 19070]

 

[Bash Riprock 1695]

Religion is for people that are afraid to go to hell. Spirituality is for people that have already been to hell. 

[BearSchlong 8083]

Religion is for people that are afraid to go to hell. Spirituality is for people that have already been to hell. 

Amen.

[NeverMarryAStripper 21872]

39 minutes ago, dcbc said:

I thought that was a vegetarian?

and biker riders

[Celery Man 20931]

3 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

It is currently en vogue in the recovery community to call oneself "recovered" as opposed to the "recovering" that was common for decades.  I don't think I'm a big fan of that.

I have similar feelings about "saved," or even "born again."  It's an ongoing process that can stop at any time and restart. That is probably more implicit in "born again" than in "saved."

Present participles seem appropriate, past not so much.

Is there new testament scriptural basis for this?

[Anastasis 23458]

Just now, Celery Man said:

Is there new testament scriptural basis for this?

Yes, and a strong patristic basis for it as well. 

[South Austin 52446]

3 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

Pretty far from it. However, a mocking of anyone else's beliefs falls outside mine. While may differ on my vision of faith, my beliefs first and foremost acknowledge at the core, the good have far more in common than differences. I even accept atheist even if their path is different from mine. 

Others have already noted similar idea to mine in that, your path is yours. I accept it. Mine is mine and if your interested in learning about I'm happy to explain. If not, no problem. If upon explanation you disagree but accept my path, cool. 

I died. Literally. Yes I'm using the word correctly. 

I've stood at the divide between this world and next. Unlike most, my beliefs are based on first hand experience. 

Whether or not you see value in what I learned is entirely up to you and I'm good with it either way. 

One love

*you’re

[Spankytoes 1739]

1 hour ago, 936horn said:

You could sub in vegetarian, vegan, or crossfitter and it still works imo. 

Does it, though?

[Helobious 9456]

I was raised catholic, am an atheist now. Honest question: let’s say I live my whole life as a non-believer and just act like a general dirtbag. When I’m on my death bed, can I not just say I’m sorry for all I’ve done and accept Christ as my lord and savior, and end up going to the same place as a lifelong devout Christian?

[NeverMarryAStripper 21872]

I've stood at the divide between this world and next. Unlike most, my beliefs are based on first hand experience. 

I would be interested in hearing that tale if you ever care to share it

[Zepol87 9185]

Jesus came with the original "fuck the police". 

Then I'm in!!

Also my new shirt came in yesterday

 

 

 

 

[ztejas 43411]

3 hours ago, StruggleBus said:

Leave it to two lawyers to ruin the thread

So you say you turned the jug of water into wine, yet my client cannot recall ever seeing the jug full of water. I then, ask you, would it be possible that the jug never contained anything but wine all along - and that this man, Jesus, as he is referred to by his "disciples" is merely a conjurer of cheap tricks attempting to dissuade, amongst others, my client into a belief that he and he alone is the son of God?

[NeverMarryAStripper 21872]

If you are speaking of the death experience I'm willing to share many parts, some are mine and mine alone. 
If it is the how of the incident, too much self doxing. In short head injury.

I was speaking of the experience itself, not the how

[TheRealChuckWoolery 72]

1 hour ago, 936horn said:

Q: How do you know if someone’s an atheist?

A: they’ll tell you every chance they get. This thread is living proof

Oh hey that's really funny considering the whole fucking thing is people repping their savedness

[TheRealChuckWoolery 72]

Fuck your God, by the way!

[TheRealChuckWoolery 72]

Just kidding. But He does so some fucked up shit.

[ztejas 43411]

4 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

Know how I know you don't have any friends who have been in prison?

No. I don't. And that's very far from the truth.

[Bash Riprock 1695]

I grew up Church of Christ. The hard asses. "You're going to hell for this you're going to hell for that". I got baptized on a Sunday morning and then later that day I lied about getting out in wiffle ball, thought I was going to hell for sure unless I prayed all night. 

My whole upbringing I felt there was no hope. I would go to Hell no matter what. Then in my early 30s I started reading the New Testament. I learned who Jesus was. He hung out with the gamblers. drunks and the prostitutes trying to help them. He told the Pharisees that they were just a bunch of judgmental ass holes. The pharisees to me was the Church of Christ I grew up in. The people who turned up their nose when my parents sent me to another rehab. I learned that Jesus was about Grace an understanding. I wasn't going to hell and most of all I WASNT A PIECE OF SHIT.  I put my faith in Him. 

There were so many times in life where I could have died. Layed out in my bedroom floor choking on my own vomit from drinking (I had many friends die that way). But I never did. And I thank Him for that. Yes there are things that happen in this world that I do not understand. Child Abuse, Domestic Abuse all of it. But all I can do is keep my faith in Jesus. I wish the world would end today so we wouldn't have see people hurt. God warns us that you will struggle in this world. It's those who have a strong heart and have faith who will see it through.

Joel Osteen is hack, Jim Bakker is a hack, 15% of the ministers and pastors out there are a hack. 

So the naysayers on here saying its stupid, that's fine, I don't care. I'm not going to try and argue with you or try and save you on Surly fucking Horns. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

I always thought I would die young like my Father and Brother did at a young age to substance abuse. But I am made that promise I wouldn't.
 

I love this scripture:

Psalm 118:17 - I shall not die, but live, And declare the works of the LORD.

 

[Mole 4330]

4 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

It is currently en vogue in the recovery community to call oneself "recovered" as opposed to the "recovering" that was common for decades.  I don't think I'm a big fan of that.

I have similar feelings about "saved," or even "born again."  It's an ongoing process that can stop at any time and restart. That is probably more implicit in "born again" than in "saved."

Present participles seem appropriate, past not so much.

I agree. The concepts surrounding things like “once saved, always saved” render flat the depth of scripture. There’s too much biblical discussion of people falling away, endurance to the end, working out salvation with fear and trembling, etc. to boil it down to trite truisms like this.

The “once saved, always saved” crowd often tries to wave this away with something about people falling away having never been saved in the first place, but that seems like a distinction without a difference.

24 minutes ago, Helobious said:

I was raised catholic, am an atheist now. Honest question: let’s say I live my whole life as a non-believer and just act like a general dirtbag. When I’m on my death bed, can I not just say I’m sorry for all I’ve done and accept Christ as my lord and savior, and end up going to the same place as a lifelong devout Christian?

According to Jesus, yes. See Matthew 20, the parable of the workers of the vineyard. If God gives me a wonderful and undeserved gift, why should I be jealous if someone “less deserving” gets the same gift? It’s not my gift to give.

Edited August 21, 2020 by Mole

[Gatorubet 30185]

I gave up Christianity for Lent, and then found myself in a Theological pickle.

[SA-KC_Horn 1295]

[Bash Riprock 1695]

@BurntEyes doesn't believe in Paragraphs either. 

Edited August 21, 2020 by Bash Riprock

[Helobious 9456]

1 minute ago, Mole said:

 

According to Jesus, yes. See Matthew 20, the parable of the workers of the vineyard. If God gives me a wonderful and undeserved gift, why should a be jealous if someone “less deserving” gets the same gift? It’s not my gift to give.

That’s what I’d figured, just one of many things about religion that I don’t understand. It made more sense to me that a place in heaven should be earned through living a righteous life, in service to God. 

I will say I’ve always been fond of the artistry that religion can evoke in people. There’s beautiful poetry in the Bible. “O death where is thy sting, o grave where is thy victory” -Cor 15:55 (thanks Johnny)

[ztejas 43411]

5 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:

Relax, it was pruno joke.

Ah okay. Was wondering what direction you were going in. 

[Bash Riprock 1695]

Why does Brisket vomit on every thread? The EXPERT of every thing on surly!

[Sawbonz 27534]

nvm saw your other posts

Edited August 21, 2020 by Sawbonz

[Sawbonz 27534]

43 minutes ago, Helobious said:

That’s what I’d figured, just one of many things about religion that I don’t understand. It made more sense to me that a place in heaven should be earned through living a righteous life, in service to God. 

I will say I’ve always been fond of the artistry that religion can evoke in people. There’s beautiful poetry in the Bible. “O death where is thy sting, o grave where is thy victory” -Cor 15:55 (thanks Johnny)

You can’t earn heaven it’s a gift. Be content you received the gift rather than being jealous of others who received the gift under what you might consider less worthy circumstances 

Works are important though. It is how a Christian is known to be such. We (I) generally do a really poor job on this count

Edited August 21, 2020 by Sawbonz

[TwiceHorn 31438]

8 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

You can’t earn heaven it’s a gift. Be content you received the gift rather than beInfo jealous of others who received the gift under what you might consider less worthy circumstances 

Works are important though. It is how a Christian is known to be such. We (I) generally do a really poor job on this count

It's funny.  I was raised Methodist, the original "faith without works is dead" sect.

I was a "good kid" growing up but not a total goody-goody, and grew up in the church and then fell away sort of, as the young often do.  My faith and spirituality was rekindled by my experiences with alcoholism and recovery, where action and works are very important.

Which is why I think if you aren't continually working at it, mostly through others, your faith becomes empty and salvation is in jeopardy.  I'm not really concerned with salvation at present.  I need my faith/spiritual tools to get through this life without imploding.

[BayouBill 835]

1 hour ago, Helobious said:

I was raised catholic, am an atheist now. Honest question: let’s say I live my whole life as a non-believer and just act like a general dirtbag. When I’m on my death bed, can I not just say I’m sorry for all I’ve done and accept Christ as my lord and savior, and end up going to the same place as a lifelong devout Christian?

If you actually believe in your heart that Christ is the son of God and repent of those sins, then yes...I believe you are saved (read the story of the thief on the cross Luke 23:39-43). Despite what some denominations may portray salvation as just say it and forget it, there is no evidence in the bible it works that way. But if you truly do believe, even on your deathbed and you stabbed 14 hookers earlier in your life, then there is redemption for you. It may seem fucked up for some horrible shitty person to have salvation after living there whole life that way, but again if they truly do believe AND repent then it shows that salvation is available no matter what we have done.

[Rougarou 594]

28 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

You can’t earn heaven it’s a gift. Be content you received the gift rather than beInfo jealous of others who received the gift under what you might consider less worthy circumstances 

Works are important though. It is how a Christian is known to be such. We (I) generally do a really poor job on this count

Yes.

The question of "Can i be an unbelieving piece of crap my whole life and then as i lay dying (shout out to William F.), repent and believe in Jesus because there are no atheists in foxholes and deathbeds" I think it's a faulty premise, because of this quote above.

Faith and knowing Jesus is not something you can fake or just say you do. He will say "I never knew you"  (Matthew 7:21). Faith is a gift that only can be given; you can't seek it hard enough or study hard enough or be legalistic enough, which is why Paul said he can't boast for it was nothing he did to get Faith.

And that is where my testimony begins: I was certainly not looking or seeking for Jesus but, when I pause and reflect that in all the infinite wisdom, mercy and love outside the bounds of infiniteness and time and space, I was still saved and given the gift of faith, I am grateful and I weep.

It's easy to get wrapped up in obvious sin. It's even easier to get wrapped up in self-serving sin and worshiping your lifestyle or a new car or bigger house or nice job with beautiful kids and all that fleeting stuff that doesn't mean anything after the blip of time we are on this fallen speck of dust. It is when I am too much of the world that I find it's helpful to meditate on the vast expanse of our universe, our limited understanding of time and space and light, and try to understand what infinite means. And then understand what being spiritually and infinitely dead means and never being called by my creator in infinite peace and joy.

A wretch like me, indeed.

 

 

Edited August 21, 2020 by Rougarou

[ztejas 43411]

Yes that's all fine and well but could Jesus microwave a burrito so hot that he himself couldn't eat it?

[Gatorubet 30185]

2 hours ago, Bash Riprock said:

Religion is for people that are afraid to go to hell. Spirituality is for people that have already been to hell. 

Nonsense.     Sounds like you had some fucked up shit in your life.  And I'm genuinely sorry that happened, and very glad you are doing better.  But I know tons of folks who are very spiritual - yet have never 'been to Hell'.   They are just good, kind, spiritual people.  I have a great friend who is now a Quaker, and she was headed toward that service to others path when I met her forty years ago.  She had a great childhood,  married a great guy while young, and has a wonderful family.   She is just a spiritual soul.   Also, there are tons of folks I know who who treat religion and church like a social club, and they don't have the faintest worry about going to hell.

That sound like some fortune cookie shit.

[RollLeft 5040]

3 hours ago, Helobious said:

I was raised catholic, am an atheist now. Honest question: let’s say I live my whole life as a non-believer and just act like a general dirtbag. When I’m on my death bed, can I not just say I’m sorry for all I’ve done and accept Christ as my lord and savior, and end up going to the same place as a lifelong devout Christian?

Per the Bible, Yes and No.  For eternity every believer ends up in the same place, eventually, so to answer your question Yes.  That said prior to eternity but after the days of judgement, of the living and the dead, there is a period of time of reward for some and a period of regret for others, a mix for the rest.  Since God says He is righteous and cannot be mocked He would be a liar if everyone got the same judgement, for instance when one tries to live a believers life while another lives a life mocking it.  Therefore He must, to be righteous and true to His own word, for a period of time reward those who believed and lived according to those beliefs.  How and what the judgement is for each only He knows.  For the unbeliever It says a range of things but for many they will spend time in a place of regret.  For how long the period of regret/reward is also not really known, some say up to a 1000 years.  To receive a gift, sonship, requires only ones belief at a high cost to Him.  Salvation, a life long process of maturation, requires more of a cost to the believer.  That said after that period of time for all people, each according to their judgements, all believers end up wherever He is for eternity.  

Edited August 21, 2020 by RollLeft

[PRONG HORN 3133]

When did they change the names of the guys named Luke, John, Paul, etc?  You think those were the names of the guys who wrote those books?  

[ztejas 43411]

10 minutes ago, PRONG HORN said:

When did they change the names of the guys named Luke, John, Paul, etc?  You think those were the names of the guys who wrote those books?  

Yes?

If they sound strange to you and not archaic enough it's because we've been using the same fucking names for 2,000 years. 

[PRONG HORN 3133]

Was Jesus a European name?  Or Middle Eastern?  Where were the people who named a kid Jesus from?  

[ztejas 43411]

10 minutes ago, PRONG HORN said:

Was Jesus a European name?  Or Middle Eastern?  Where were the people who named a kid Jesus from?  

Hebrew

John is also Hebrew. Luke is Latin. Paul is Latin.

(I mean obviously these names have been translated and spelled differently in different languages over the years - but their roots go back just as far or farther than the time of Christ)

Edited August 21, 2020 by ztejas

[TwiceHorn 31438]

49 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

Nonsense.     Sounds like you had some fucked up shit in your life.  And I'm genuinely sorry that happened, and very glad you are doing better.  But I know tons of folks who are very spiritual - yet have never 'been to Hell'.   They are just good, kind, spiritual people.  I have a great friend who is now a Quaker, and she was headed toward that service to others path when I met her forty years ago.  She had a great childhood,  married a great guy while young, and has a wonderful family.   She is just a spiritual soul.   Also, there are tons of folks I know who who treat religion and church like a social club, and they don't have the faintest worry about going to hell.

That sound like some fortune cookie shit.

It is. It comes from AA. Not AA doctrine or official anything. It's just a saying that is used to help overcome resistance or skepticism toward the program because of it's religious/Christian roots. 

We use a lot of simple tools to try to save people's lives. And a lot of newcomers are neither particularly intellectual, intelligent, or favorably disposed toward religion. 

[TwiceHorn 31438]

58 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

 

Two-times, two-times. 

Edited August 21, 2020 by TwiceHorn

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

This is a topic I’ve struggled with dating back to as young as I can remember. Both of my parents go to church every Sunday and I used to go with them. But I’ve always had this overwhelming doubt that lingers in my subconscious mind, so going to church has always been a struggle for me. I always have to catch myself from rolling my eyes at certain comments preachers make.

I understand the value of committing your life to Christ, and having faith that you aren’t in this alone. That there is a higher power that genuinely has our best interests at heart. I genuinely want to get there, not just for myself but for my parents. They beat themselves up all the time because in their opinion, they failed in this regard. But I don’t know how to get there. I don’t know how to get the light bulb to turn on.

I know there are plenty of people like me that finally turned a corner. What happened for you? What clicked? I’ve been struggling to get there for awhile now and I feel like I haven’t made any progress. I feel like my faith has gotten worse as I’ve gotten older.

 

edit: I apologize if this is derailing the thread. Looking at the OP, I feel like this might be off base, and not really what the thread was intended for.

Edited August 21, 2020 by youdunnf'dup

[ztejas 43411]

6 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

I know there are plenty of people like me that finally turned a corner. What happened for you? What clicked? I’ve been struggling to get there for awhile now and I feel like I haven’t made any progress. I feel like my faith has gotten worse as I’ve gotten older.

I went back and forth between wanting to die and being terrified of it. I decided that I wasn't going to jump, and that I wanted to quit digging, so I did. 

That was how it clicked for me, but I'm not religious or a practicing Christian, and I'm not sure you have to reach a point of desperation to change your outlook (but it can make it easier). I just try and have faith that things will be okay and that in the grand scheme of things my problems are insignificant, so there's no point in worrying about what is going to happen. Part of that too is a pretty high tolerance for what other people choose to beleive in. I don't beleive in hell, but if that belief helps people live a better, happier life then it isn't my place to judge.

Now, surrounding this was a relationship with drugs and alcohol that I had to end. I won't get into that because it doesn't seem topical, but there's a lot of good discussion on the alcoholic thread. You can pretty much come ask anything you want there. We're good at talking about ourselves and telling people what to do. (a little self-derision there)

[52-80 19146]

10 hours ago, staboner said:

much love friends

 

[Clintonaldo 2572]

9 hours ago, NeverMarryAStripper said:

and biker riders

And people with MBA’s. 

[Anastasis 23458]

1 hour ago, 52-80 said:

 

Nice minivan. 

[52-80 19146]

8 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Nice minivan. 

please, it's a sporty utility vehicle