Several shot during 3rd night of Kenosha riots

[JimmyJames 12271]

31 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Almost as evil as spreading COVID and vaccine disinformation 

Yep. The only evil person here is GRUHorn

 

28 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

Just give us one more of your thought on capitalism, binary gender absolutism,  and global warming, and we can close this book

Both of us were responding to posts by well known troll GRUHorn. If you want to bitch about the thread getting totally off topic look at the source. 

Edited November 21, 2021 by JimmyJames

[immortal13 4059]

2 minutes ago, TXSG8R said:

That shows he’s smart enough not to shoot people randomly and have an out like self defense. Like I said, I know what the jurors were given in the trial, and based on that the verdict is pretty straight forward.  But that video changes his intent for being there, and likely gives jurors an entirely different context for his actions. “Going to put out fires and give first aid” becomes “roaming around until someone finally gives him the excuse to fulfill his wishes.” 

If your theory were true, why did he retreat instead of just blasting the pedo on the spot?

[immortal13 4059]

1 minute ago, JimmyJames said:

Yep. The only evil person here is GRUHorn

 

Both of us were responding to posts by well known troll GRUHorn. If you want to bitch about the thread getting totally off topic look at the source. 

No bitch. A warning was given to stay on topic. Do you think that doesn't apply to certain posters

[52-80 19205]

6 minutes ago, TXSG8R said:

Yea, I’m curious to hear a juror’s thoughts after learning about the wanting to shoot rioters video. I still am not lawyerly enough to understand why that wasn’t admissible, but I think that makes or breaks the case against KR. 

If the video was on the same night as the shooting, IMO it would materially change the dynamics of the case.  But it was filmed weeks before, in slightly different context. 

I personally really don't like the idea of people openly carrying long rifles around into a knowingly-incendiary situation.  That obviously is in itself an antagonistic gesture... but fortunately for Kyle, besides having the rifle, there was not even 1 second of him that night acting in a way that could even mistakenly be construed as aggressive.  Not even a shouting match.

If it was one of the other guys (e.g. at the gas station) it would be a different story.

[JimmyJames 12271]

27 minutes ago, TXSG8R said:

Yea, I’m curious to hear a juror’s thoughts after learning about the wanting to shoot rioters video. I still am not lawyerly enough to understand why that wasn’t admissible, but I think that makes or breaks the case against KR. 

That ruling totally gutted the prosecution case. It normally would be inadmissible to prove murder but the defense made it relevant by claiming self defense and Kyle taking the stand. The judge was a clown and that was his most egregious ruling in the case. 
 

And for you in the camp that it never should have prosecuted that ruling didn’t get made until right before and during the trial. There’s no way for a prosecution to know for sure the judge was going to be a dumbass and keep it out of evidence while Kyle gets to take the stand and give his sob story. 

[TXSG8R 3362]

3 minutes ago, immortal13 said:

If your theory were true, why did he retreat instead of just blasting the pedo on the spot?

It’s not my theory, I’m just point out the obvious implications of that piece of evidence not being allowed. Do you think he still walks if they showed the jurors that video?  Do you think jurors are as emotionally responsive to him crying on the stand if they allowed the free as fuck tshirt picture with the proud boys as evidence?  Those things change the case, and again, I’m curious to hear a juror’s thoughts about it after the fact. Won’t change the outcome, but I’m betting the jurors will feel like they let an asshole dodge some prison time knowing that stuff. Even knowing Rosenbaum is a piece of shit. 

[JimmyJames 12271]

Also the very fact they Kyle took the stand in his defense shows you that this was a good enough case to prosecute. If it was such a slam dunk case for the defense that NEVER would have happened. 

[immortal13 4059]

2 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

That ruling totally gutted the prosecution case. It normally would be inadmissible to prove murder but the defense made it relevant by claiming self defense and Kyle taking the stand. The judge was a clown and that was his most egregious ruling in the case. 
 

And for you in the camp that it never should have prosecuted that ruling didn’t get made until right before and during the trial. There’s no way for a prosecution to know for sure the judge was going to be a dumbass and keep it out of evidence while Kyle gets to take the stand and give his sob story. 

But it's ok for the prosecution to withhold evidence and attempt tamper with a witness? And you're crying about the judge not being fair...lmao

[immortal13 4059]

2 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Also the very fact they Kyle took the stand in his defense shows you that this was a good enough case to prosecute. If it was such a slam dunk case for the defense that NEVER would have happened. 

Wrong. Kyle could have insisted to take the stand. It definitely was not necessary for his defense

[JimmyJames 12271]

1 minute ago, immortal13 said:

But it's ok for the prosecution to withhold evidence and attempt tamper with a witness? And you're crying about the judge not being fair...lmao

Despite what the right wing hate machine has told you there was no withholding of evidence nor witness tampering. The defense attorney didn’t even complain about the latter because he would’ve looked like a complete idiot if he did. 

[52-80 19205]

3 minutes ago, TXSG8R said:

Do you think jurors are as emotionally responsive to him crying on the stand if they allowed the free as fuck tshirt picture with the proud boys as evidence?  Those things change the case...

(1) I dont think the 2 minute crying episode makes a difference against the backdrop of 10 days of hearing  and (2) photo post-dates the incident and should minimally affect facts of the incident itself.

[JimmyJames 12271]

1 minute ago, immortal13 said:

Wrong. Kyle could have insisted to take the stand. It definitely was not necessary for his defense

Keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better. There’s no way an 18 year old facing life in prison ignores the advice of his attorney and takes the stand if his defense attorneys don’t want him to. That’s like believing in the tooth fairy. 

[TXSG8R 3362]

3 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

(1) I dont think the 2 minute crying episode makes a difference against the backdrop of 10 days of hearing  and (2) photo post-dates the incident and should minimally affect facts of the incident itself.

I’m well aware of how both sides in here think it would play out. My entire post was about picking the brains of jurors post trial knowing these additional items.

[TXSG8R 3362]

8 minutes ago, immortal13 said:

Wrong. Kyle could have insisted to take the stand. It definitely was not necessary for his defense

I believe his defense attorney said that him taking the stand came out better in their mock juries. It was a calculated move by his defense team.  

[Willfully Horn 8040]

25 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Yep. Post fail but couldn’t delete. 

Hmmm. I am able to delete any post I’ve made. Costs like tree fiddy for the privilege to do so, though.

[52-80 19205]

1 minute ago, Willfully Horn said:

Hmmm. I am able to delete any post I’ve made. Costs like tree fiddy for the privilege to do so, though.

i just use my immamac sock when i need to do some post pruning

[immortal13 4059]

8 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Despite what the right wing hate machine has told you there was no withholding of evidence nor witness tampering. The defense attorney didn’t even complain about the latter because he would’ve looked like a complete idiot if he did. 

Lmao you don't even believe that!!  Debruin(autistic guy) gave sworn testimony that Binger tried to get him to alter his original statement and fed him info that he then asked if he wanted to add it in. And the HD video file was also proven in court to have been suppressed. Get the fuck out of here with your bullshit bro

[immortal13 4059]

9 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better. There’s no way an 18 year old facing life in prison ignores the advice of his attorney and takes the stand if his defense attorneys don’t want him to. That’s like believing in the tooth fairy. 

Link? 

[JimmyJames 12271]

3 minutes ago, Willfully Horn said:

Hmmm. I am able to delete any post I’ve made. Costs like tree fiddy for the privilege to do so, though.

So that’s how they get ya. 

[Willfully Horn 8040]

1 minute ago, JimmyJames said:

So that’s how they get ya. 

It’s a tip. 

[blacklab 11941]

I'm busy right now but will be back in a little bit to give some time off to about a dozen of you. Keep this in mind as you post here. 

[52-80 19205]

4 minutes ago, blacklab said:

I'm busy right now but will be back in a little bit to give some time off to about a dozen of you. Keep this in mind as you post here. 

 

[Willfully Horn 8040]

Edited November 21, 2021 by blacklab
off topic

[JimmyJames 12271]

12 minutes ago, TXSG8R said:

I believe his defense attorney said that him taking the stand came out better in their mock juries. It was a calculated move by his defense team.  

That would make sense. I would think claiming self defense and not taking the stand wouldn’t play well with a jury. 

[Cement 314]

1 hour ago, Bravo said:

Im curious to find out the jury's thoughts on Rosenbaum raping 5 boys under 11 and serving 15 yrs in prison for it. Also, his 2 recent suicide attempts. He's quite the poster child for the left. (pun) 

What this case has shown is that you can be a serial pedophile and use the n-word repeatedly (as a white man) and the media and the left will still prop you up as a martyr as long as you are on their side.

[immortal13 4059]

6 minutes ago, Cement said:

What this case has shown is that you can be a serial pedophile and use the n-word repeatedly (as a white man) and the media and the left will still prop you up as a martyr as long as you are on their side.

Right. And then have the media and left wing nut jobs label the defendant as a racist/white supremacist. You can't make this shit up.

[Brothahorn 10087]

I'm busy right now but will be back in a little bit to give some time off to about a dozen of you. Keep this in mind as you post here. 

[Bullneck 19185]

2 hours ago, Willfully Horn said:

I was #3. 

I met some of #4, including one who was a mercenary against SWAPO because he wanted to "see if he like the job or not."

Edited November 21, 2021 by blacklab
off topic

[workswithseed 2108]

1 hour ago, Willfully Horn said:

Hmmm. I am able to delete any post I’ve made. Costs like tree fiddy for the privilege to do so, though.

I'm paying, but I don't know where to do that. All on phone.

[workswithseed 2108]

1 hour ago, Bullneck said:

I was #3. 

I met some of #4, including one who was a mercenary against SWAPO because he wanted to "see if he like the job or not."

Better to do it legally than on the civilian population I guess.

Edited November 21, 2021 by blacklab
off topic

[JimmyJames 12271]

26 minutes ago, immortal13 said:

Right. And then have the media and left wing nut jobs label the defendant as a racist/white supremacist. You can't make this shit up.

[Willfully Horn 8040]

10 minutes ago, Bravo said:

Just the? 

If that. 

[Bullneck 19185]

22 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

Better to do it legally than on the civilian population I guess.

Actually, he murdered someone while he was there.  Murdered, as in a war crime.  

[workswithseed 2108]

1 minute ago, Bullneck said:

Actually, he murdered someone while he was there.  Murdered, as in a war crime.  

[Bullneck 19185]

Heart of Darkness

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Heart of Darkness (1899) is a novella by Polish-English novelist Joseph Conrad. It tells the story of Charles Marlow, a sailor who takes on an assignment from a Belgian trading company as a ferry-boat captain in the African interior. The novel is widely regarded as a critique of European colonial rule in Africa, whilst also examining the themes of power dynamics and morality. Although Conrad does not name the river where the narrative takes place, at the time of writing the Congo Free State, the location of the large and economically important Congo River, was a private colony of Belgium's King Leopold II. Marlow is given a text by Kurtz, an ivory trader working on a trading station far up the river, who has "gone native" and is the object of Marlow's expedition.

Central to Conrad's work is the idea that there is little difference between "civilised people" and "savages." Heart of Darkness implicitly comments on imperialism and racism.^[1] The novella's setting provides the frame for Marlow's story of his obsession with the successful ivory trader Kurtz. Conrad offers parallels between London ("the greatest town on earth") and Africa as places of darkness.^[2]

[immortal13 4059]

48 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

What is that supposed to prove?

[JimmyJames 12271]

7 minutes ago, immortal13 said:

What is that supposed to prove?

I suppose that it's fair to allege someone is a white supremacist when they flash white supremacy signs. Not sure what's so confusing about that.

[atomheartbevo 89758]

1 hour ago, Bullneck said:

Heart of Darkness

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Heart of Darkness (1899) is a novella by Polish-English novelist Joseph Conrad. It tells the story of Charles Marlow, a sailor who takes on an assignment from a Belgian trading company as a ferry-boat captain in the African interior. The novel is widely regarded as a critique of European colonial rule in Africa, whilst also examining the themes of power dynamics and morality. Although Conrad does not name the river where the narrative takes place, at the time of writing the Congo Free State, the location of the large and economically important Congo River, was a private colony of Belgium's King Leopold II. Marlow is given a text by Kurtz, an ivory trader working on a trading station far up the river, who has "gone native" and is the object of Marlow's expedition.

Central to Conrad's work is the idea that there is little difference between "civilised people" and "savages." Heart of Darkness implicitly comments on imperialism and racism.^[1] The novella's setting provides the frame for Marlow's story of his obsession with the successful ivory trader Kurtz. Conrad offers parallels between London ("the greatest town on earth") and Africa as places of darkness.^[2]

Wow, that sounds cool as hell.

They should make it into a movie, maybe a war movie.  Not during Iraq or Afghanistan, but maybe 30 or 40 years ago.  Maybe set it during the invasion of Grenada, and have the Kurtz character be a colonel in the Green Berets.  Have him go completely native in the span of a few hours of landing on the island, and then the Army has to send somebody to bring him back to the airport because the soldiers will be leaving in a few days.  Charles Marlow is not a good name, maybe go with Willem or Willard. Make this new character a captain.  Anyways, have him track Kurtz down on this road that's like 2 miles long.  Captain Willem or Willard or whatever could have a chef, a driver, and a gunner in his Humvee, and maybe he's got problems with the Humvee so it takes him like 4 hours to go down the road and find Kurtz.  Along the way, he gets sidetracked by some guy on the beach that wants to surf and listen to German operas or something. You have to have something in the 2nd act.

In the 4 hours it's taken this Willard guy to go down the road to find Kurtz, Kurtz has setup a successful nutmeg plantation and tourist resort, and Willard is jealous of that and yells at him or something, or thinks about resigning his commission and moving to Grenade. Or maybe he snaps and kills Kurtz.  Probably not that dark.  I don't know, we can workshop this, but we need to hurry before somebody else in Hollywood comes across this book and makes a modern war movie out of it.

Edited November 21, 2021 by blacklab
off topic

[atomheartbevo 89758]

1 hour ago, Bullneck said:

I was #3. 

I met some of #4, including one who was a mercenary against SWAPO because he wanted to "see if he like the job or not."

I was #3 as well (this was the 90s under Clinton).  Did meet a couple of #4's in the recruiters office.  One was boasting to the recruiters about how he had watched all of these war movies and he was going to be a Ranger and Green Beret.  A few weeks later I was back to drop off some paperwork, and I asked about the guy, and they said they pushed him off into a non-infantry MOS. Sounded like they BSed and told him that the infantry slots were full and he'd have to wait but he could take this other MOS and get a big bonus.  Short time passes and I head off to basic. Motherfucker shows up in my platoon in basic training, with an artillery MOS (we were at Fort Sill). At some point the drill instructors took the piss out of him, because he was not the same guy I met in the recruiters' office. 

[52-80 19205]

29 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Wow, that sounds cool as hell.

They should make it into a movie, maybe a war movie.  Not during Iraq or Afghanistan, but maybe 30 or 40 years ago.  Maybe set it during the invasion of Grenada, and have the Kurtz character be a colonel in the Green Berets.  Have him go completely native in the span of a few hours of landing on the island, and then the Army has to send somebody to bring him back to the airport because the soldiers will be leaving in a few days.  Charles Marlow is not a good name, maybe go with Willem or Willard. Make this new character a captain.  Anyways, have him track Kurtz down on this road that's like 2 miles long.  Captain Willem or Willard or whatever could have a chef, a driver, and a gunner in his Humvee, and maybe he's got problems with the Humvee so it takes him like 4 hours to go down the road and find Kurtz.  Along the way, he gets sidetracked by some guy on the beach that wants to surf and listen to German operas or something. You have to have something in the 2nd act.

In the 4 hours it's taken this Willard guy to go down the road to find Kurtz, Kurtz has setup a successful nutmeg plantation and tourist resort, and Willard is jealous of that and yells at him or something, or thinks about resigning his commission and moving to Grenade. Or maybe he snaps and kills Kurtz.  Probably not that dark.  I don't know, we can workshop this, but we need to hurry before somebody else in Hollywood comes across this book and makes a modern war movie out of it.

They should also have a 15 minute long scene of the protagonist eating dinner with a bunch of french people

[Sawbonz 27580]

3 hours ago, TXSG8R said:

That shows he’s smart enough

[South Austin 52523]

If I’m Kyle’s attorney for his defamation suits, I’m going to tell him to stop getting his pictures taken with white supremacists and making while supremacist hand gestures. But that would just be my approach. 

[txhorns 2410]

9 minutes ago, South Austin said:

If I’m Kyle’s attorney for his defamation suits, I’m going to tell him to stop getting his pictures taken with white supremacists and making while supremacist hand gestures. But that would just be my approach. 

Not sure it will matter as a lot of media companies continue to push narratives that were proven false during the trial.  

[Mrs Whiggins 13050]

1 hour ago, Bravo said:

 The OK sign [...] are clear signs of white supremacy. All things I learned during this trial. 

Sort of. Plausible deniability is a fascist tactic (not wholly, but primarily) but with the publicity surrounding this event, there are potentially several agendas here w/respect to Mr. Rittenhouse.

First off:

*The OK sign can usually mean one of 3 things:

1. All is fine, all good here.

2. A troll, which has to do with the original co-opting (based on the plausible deniability and the WP symbol that the alt right began using during their rise) by white supremacists in which the users flood the chatter with the symbol in order to create chaos and 'trigger' people who are offended. The trolling nature began in the 4chan arena and hasn't really stopped.

3. A way of signalling to white supremacists that one is of a like mind.

As with many things, its meaning has a lot to do with the company one keeps. It is never innocent when displayed around the Proud Boys, a neo-fascist group. Mr. Rittenhouse appearing with them may appeal to his wish to belong, but the more time spent in their presence the less he can claim the good nature of the first meaning. For folks who think the trolling is innocent as well, it really isn't as it permeates throughout society with a toxicity that shuts out anyone who is not deemed worthy of belonging. Kind of like the gamers who didn't want women to belong, or to code, or to do anything they deemed a 'male' centric field. It also normalizes ideologies that shouldn't be acceptable to society. For example, the KKK presented itself as  mischievous boys who want to have some fun go on a masquerading frolic to scare the Negroes, but they do not interrupt them, do not hurt them in any way. That was in 1871, and well it was just a troll, right? (this is actually in the Congressional Record as it was the testimony of Rep John Christy to whom that quote is attributed.)

However, Mr. Rittenhouse may also have been used by those he was with to further their agenda. Young men are susceptible to wanting to belong to something and the Proud Boys are more than happy to accept males.

So, context matters. A lot. So does being obtuse. I expect graduates of the University of Texas to be aware of current events up to a point, so if you were unaware of these various meanings of the OK symbol, you've now been made aware of some of them and can now use that when considering other's perceptions and perspectives of events, especially if they may differ from yours.

 

*The information was paraphrased from several sources including ADL, SPLC, Cracked, Medium, and elsewhere.

Edited November 21, 2021 by Mrs Whiggins

[South Austin 52523]

3 minutes ago, txhorns said:

Not sure it will matter as a lot of media companies continue to push narratives that were proven false during the trial.  

So don’t give the media lawyers any fodder.  But it’s hard to feel sorry for this dipshit and his “unfair media portrayal” when there are photos out there like this.

[Mrs Whiggins 13050]

1 minute ago, Bravo said:

Serious question, I know the Proud Boys a very right wing but are they white supremacists? They're led by a black guy and have a lot of races as members. Doesn't seem like a very good white supremacist group. 

They are male and neo fascist first, the ties to white supremacy depend on the individual local groups. Fascists seeking to grow in numbers are not going to be selective (beyond the requirement of male) with whom they form alliances. They are not unique in that.

[MissingInAction 25132]

2 hours ago, Bullneck said:

Heart of Darkness

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Heart of Darkness (1899) is a novella by Polish-English novelist Joseph Conrad. It tells the story of Charles Marlow, a sailor who takes on an assignment from a Belgian trading company as a ferry-boat captain in the African interior. The novel is widely regarded as a critique of European colonial rule in Africa, whilst also examining the themes of power dynamics and morality. Although Conrad does not name the river where the narrative takes place, at the time of writing the Congo Free State, the location of the large and economically important Congo River, was a private colony of Belgium's King Leopold II. Marlow is given a text by Kurtz, an ivory trader working on a trading station far up the river, who has "gone native" and is the object of Marlow's expedition.

Central to Conrad's work is the idea that there is little difference between "civilised people" and "savages." Heart of Darkness implicitly comments on imperialism and racism.^[1] The novella's setting provides the frame for Marlow's story of his obsession with the successful ivory trader Kurtz. Conrad offers parallels between London ("the greatest town on earth") and Africa as places of darkness.^[2]

So Apocalypse Now! Is a remake?

[El Diablo 4232]

Just now, Bravo said:

Im sure there are members who are white supremacists. I won't doubt that but to me they always appeared to be the drunk hellraiser right wingers looking to face off with antifa who is kinda the same thing for the left. The fact theit leader is a black guy and I see other races in these vids when they face off with antifa tells me it really isn't a white supremacists group. 

 

7 minutes ago, Bravo said:

Serious question, I know the Proud Boys are very right wing but are they white supremacists? They're led by a black guy and have a lot of races as members although mainly white. Doesn't seem like a very good white supremacist group. 

Seems serious. 

[Poolflood 845]

2 minutes ago, Bravo said:

This would seem like the worst leader ever for a white supremacist group. Seems like they wouldn't accept that. 

White claw tells you all you need to know.

[TXSG8R 3362]

28 minutes ago, Bravo said:

Serious question, I know the Proud Boys are very right wing but are they white supremacists? They're led by a black guy and have a lot of races as members although mainly white. Doesn't seem like a very good white supremacist group. I always viewed them as the violent wing that was formed to kick antifa ass. 

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2021/02/trumpism-the-proud-boys-and-the-extremist-allure-for-people-of-color