Several shot during 3rd night of Kenosha riots

[tchookem 3900]

Do any of you look at data?  Is there any evidence open carry makes the jurisdictions they have it less safe than before they had it?  Or less safe than other jurisdictions?
I rarely carry outside of a pistol I keep in my console safe these days.  I’d conceal carry if I felt the need.  Only time I’d open carry is when I’m hunting and just too lazy to take off my pistol before heading to town.  Or like yesterday when hiking in Big Bend NP or today hiking in Big Bend Ranch SP, I had my 5-7 on my shoulder harness and it was warm enough where I didn’t wear a jacket. 

Did you look badass? I bet you looked like a badass.

[JimmyJames 12271]

5 minutes ago, tchookem said:

4 hours ago, Johnny Sack said:

Do any of you look at data?  Is there any evidence open carry makes the jurisdictions they have it less safe than before they had it?  Or less safe than other jurisdictions?
I rarely carry outside of a pistol I keep in my console safe these days.  I’d conceal carry if I felt the need.  Only time I’d open carry is when I’m hunting and just too lazy to take off my pistol before heading to town.  Or like yesterday when hiking in Big Bend NP or today hiking in Big Bend Ranch SP, I had my 5-7 on my shoulder harness and it was warm enough where I didn’t wear a jacket. 

Did you look badass? I bet you looked like a badass.

Looked like if you mixed the Marlboro man with Ricky Schroeder 

[TheRealRonWeaver? 1258]

[Harrison Bergeron 1798]

1 hour ago, TXSG8R said:

So I was going to ask this in the Waukesha thread in DT but figured it would turn into a shit show. How will the Waukesha guy’s anti-white rap stuff be admissible if KR’s I want to shoot looters video wasn’t? Not trolling, I’m genuinely curious on the law side since I still don’t get how KR’s video wasn’t relevant. 

(Non-lawyer randomly speculating)

I've always wondered about this. I get that a person' previous actions do not necessarily mean they acted unlawfully in a subsequent situation. I know if I was a juror - and this is where the lawyers will yell at me - I would would want to know if a person has a long history of violence or a squeaky clean record. But I get the inherent bias. 
 

Specifically with the Waukegan situation, might be critical to establish motive since there is really no rational explanation for driving through a crowd (outside of a clear explanation).

 

[Azbadlands 109]

7 hours ago, Neonmoon said:

I'm sorry I messed up that facts. I agree with everything you said. I would also prefer that guns be used for hunting animals and only that. This is the common ground I'm getting at. Why can't we work towards that? I don't want to live in the wild west. Where people feel the need to carry guns around. You say the world has always been a bad place, that's life. You're saying we should all just live with this reality we live in. People carrying guns, people fighting each other, and people getting shot. that IS the wild wild west. 

The view that "bad people should stop doing bad shit" is not a solution. Human have been fighting and killing each other since the stone age. My issue is this. I think it is fundamentally insane that people think we will solve the human condition (aka bad man stop being bad man) before solving the gun problem. 

There's a war on gun owners that are hunters all over the country.  Look at the West, they are trying to re-introduce wolves all over the place and so far it has been disastrous for hunters...Herds of elk and deer have declined by the thousands in a lot of areas where they have been re-introduced...A lot of people think it's a ploy to get rid of guns.  If there is no game to hunt, then why do you need a gun?

I have no problem with gun control or even a little stricter gun control than we have now, but it seems like they are going after the wrong kind of gun owners, the low hanging fruit...I know many hunters that don't even own AR's nor care to own one because they are not really useful for hunting or they'd rather spend the money on a nice hunting rig..

 

[jimmyjazz 45910]

Ah, I see we're back to the "libs just want to get all the guns".

Never mind that libs have never tried to do this, it gets the base all riled up and trigger happy.

[Texaspython 231]

10 minutes ago, Azbadlands said:

There's a war on gun owners that are hunters all over the country.  Look at the West, they are trying to re-introduce wolves all over the place and so far it has been disastrous for hunters...Herds of elk and deer have declined by the thousands in a lot of areas where they have been re-introduced...A lot of people think it's a ploy to get rid of guns.  If there is no game to hunt, then why do you need a gun?

I have no problem with gun control or even a little stricter gun control than we have now, but it seems like they are going after the wrong kind of gun owners, the low hanging fruit...I know many hunters that don't even own AR's nor care to own one because they are not really useful for hunting or they'd rather spend the money on a nice hunting rig..

 

Reasonable take although I disagree. As a hunter who votes for Dems, I have encountered such people. That said, overall, I prefer them to gun nuts.

[Azbadlands 109]

53 minutes ago, Texaspython said:

Reasonable take although I disagree. As a hunter who votes for Dems, I have encountered such people. That said, overall, I prefer them to gun nuts.

I much prefer the typical hunter way over the dudes that constantly go to the shooting range with their AR's and pistols to burn up buckets of ammo.  That's not to say everyone who owns an AR or pistol is a bad person with criminal intentions.  I run into more of the AR/pistol owner type guys though in the gun range and especially the deserts out here in AZ that are very careless and wild with their guns and just seem to have a different mentality about gun ownership..I mean I buy a gun as a hunter hoping/ praying I would never have to use it to defend myself or my family against another human being..I think some of the AR/ pistol dudes dream about that though...I watched my dad struggle for years with PTSD from having to kill people in war, I don't want any part of that..

Edited November 23, 2021 by Azbadlands

[TwiceHorn 31457]

10 hours ago, Texaspython said:

Also, most those cheering aren’t concerned with justice. These people aren’t dialed in on civil rights issues or judicial inequities until a weak white boy gets charged with murder. 

Agreed.

But, by the same token, a lot of people cheering for unfair convictions of unpopular defendants have thrown any of their usual concern with civil rights out the window.

This was a complete shitshow on #bothsides.

 

[cactusflinthead 27598]

9 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Agreed.

But, by the same token, a lot of people cheering for unfair convictions of unpopular defendants have thrown any of their usual concern with civil rights out the window.

This was a complete shitshow on #bothsides.

 

This was a shitshow from the start and it ain't over yet.

That judge, DA, and the kid are going to wear this the rest of their lives.

There's a weregild due. Legal issues aside. Karma will be done.

I wouldn't trade with any of them. 

[workswithseed 2103]

4 hours ago, Anastasis said:

Most posters here are too intelligent to go to a place like Kenosha on 25 Aug 2020 (or any other time for that matter). And there are some really bottom mid grade barrel intelligence posters here tbh. Which should give you a sense as to what we are working with here in terms of the otg subject matter. 

I went downtown Portland to film the going one for here, but didn't feel like I was going to get attacked. 

[MNLonghornFUKM 8817]

Actually since the case is over, do we really need a thread where immortal and sack can remind us every day that a pedo got shot and they think the case should never have been brought? And then call everyone else “Libs?” Because that’s all they ever talk about now. 

I think it’s a good thread to mock those REEEEing at the thought of a dead pedo not getting his Justice served.

[workswithseed 2103]

32 minutes ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

I think it’s a good thread to mock those REEEEing at the thought of a dead pedo not getting his Justice served.

 

poor JoJo, he didn't do nothing.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

Vilifying the victims in an effort to absolve wrongdoing is THE go to move of the right.  See also George Floyd (druggie), the Parkland Kids (crisis actors), Gold Star Father Khan, the Sandy Hook parents. It’s a great trick by sick motherfuckers. 
 

ETA: See also every woman with a credible sexual assault allegation. 

Edited November 23, 2021 by Hugo Stiglitz

[workswithseed 2103]

7 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Vilifying the victims in an effort to absolve wrongdoing is THE go to move of the right.  See also George Floyd (druggie), the Parkland Kids (crisis actors), Gold Star Father Khan, the Sandy Hook parents. It’s a great trick by sick motherfuckers. 

It's worse when the only thing wrong was everyone shouldn't have been there, otherwise self defense isn't wrong doing. 

[TXSG8R 3362]

8 hours ago, Harrison Bergeron said:

(Non-lawyer randomly speculating)

I've always wondered about this. I get that a person' previous actions do not necessarily mean they acted unlawfully in a subsequent situation. I know if I was a juror - and this is where the lawyers will yell at me - I would would want to know if a person has a long history of violence or a squeaky clean record. But I get the inherent bias. 
 

Specifically with the Waukegan situation, might be critical to establish motive since there is really no rational explanation for driving through a crowd (outside of a clear explanation).

 

His record I get, I’m talking about the rap stuff or any video similar to KR where he said something months prior. If anything, I would think it’s easier to argue that rap doesn’t really show intent, it’s entertainment. I’m honestly all for it being relevant, just like KR’s should have been IMO. I’m just really curious since it’s the same state if the same rules will be applied. Something tells me it won’t. 
 

I think the initial assessment that he was fleeing a scene of a crime and chose the worst route possible seems the most plausible. If he was really out to kill whitey he blew past a lot of them before he got to a point where he didn’t have any room to get past people anymore. He even slowed down behind the band before he started rolling over people. It’s that or he really had it out for white marching bands and dancing groups specifically because he bypassed a lot of other people.  

[52-80 19151]

7 hours ago, cactusflinthead said:

There's a weregild due.

ok calm down there, Jarl Cnut

[52-80 19151]

45 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

 

poor JoJo, he didn't do nothing.

"After all we have seen and heard about these weapons of war, these killing machines, there is no doubt that people who faced this young man were more afraid of him than he was of them"

 

That's how you know Hulk definitely didn't watch a second of the trial / videos

[Eastwood 4394]

There's a war on gun owners that are hunters all over the country.  Look at the West, they are trying to re-introduce wolves all over the place and so far it has been disastrous for hunters...Herds of elk and deer have declined by the thousands in a lot of areas where they have been re-introduced...A lot of people think it's a ploy to get rid of guns.  If there is no game to hunt, then why do you need a gun?
I have no problem with gun control or even a little stricter gun control than we have now, but it seems like they are going after the wrong kind of gun owners, the low hanging fruit...I know many hunters that don't even own AR's nor care to own one because they are not really useful for hunting or they'd rather spend the money on a nice hunting rig..
 

Wow. Haven't seen that conspiracy theory before. We drive a species almost to extinction to eliminate competition for food sources, that species being an Apex predator of the game we also like to hunt and a predator of our livestock, and we bring them back from the brink of extinction after we are no longer food insecure to... Eliminate guns? Pray tell, who are these "a lot of people" you speak of?

[Kdub 498]

1 minute ago, Eastwood said:

 

 

Wow. Haven't seen that conspiracy theory before. We drive a species almost to extinction to eliminate competition for food sources, that species being an Apex predator of the game we also like to hunt and a predator of our livestock, and we bring them back from the brink of extinction after we are no longer food insecure to... Eliminate guns? Pray tell, who are these "a lot of people" you speak of?

 

Idiots 

[Johnny Sack 8397]

1 hour ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Vilifying the victims in an effort to absolve wrongdoing is THE go to move of the right.  See also George Floyd (druggie), the Parkland Kids (crisis actors), Gold Star Father Khan, the Sandy Hook parents. It’s a great trick by sick motherfuckers. 
 

ETA: See also every woman with a credible sexual assault allegation. 

The three people shot in Kenosha weren’t victims.  They were left wing domestic terrorists who got shot because they attacked a kid.  

[JimmyJames 12271]

1 minute ago, Johnny Sack said:

The three people shot in Kenosha weren’t victims.  They were left wing domestic terrorists who got shot because they attacked a kid.  

You forgot to mention that one was a pedo and the case never should have been brought. Or were you saving that for the afternoon session? 

[JimmyJames 12271]

Hey has anyone heard about Kyle allegedly beating up a woman? Is that true? 

[TwiceHorn 31457]

7 hours ago, cactusflinthead said:

This was a shitshow from the start and it ain't over yet.

That judge, DA, and the kid are going to wear this the rest of their lives.

There's a weregild due. Legal issues aside. Karma will be done.

I wouldn't trade with any of them. 

True enough.  All the politics aside, Rittenhouse has to live with killing two and maiming one.  The court may have justified that, but I don't imagine it is going to be easy to live with.

[Eastwood 4394]

Hey has anyone heard about Kyle allegedly beating up a woman? Is that true? 

Shortly after the shooting, a video made the rounds of an individual who looked like Kyle Rittenhouse wearing a pair of glasses cheap shotting a girl with a punch to the head while she was engaged in a fight with another person. I saw the video, thought it looked like him, but no names were said and I don't know if the video is really him. I'm on mobile, otherwise I would dig for it and post it.

Edited for clarity. It's early and I'm on the move.

[DDD Dad 14338]

Shortly after the shooting, a video made the rounds of an individual who looked like Kyle Rittenhouse wearing a pair of glasses cheap shotting a girl with a punch to the head while she was engaged in a fight with another person. I saw the video, thought it looked like him, but no names were said and I don't know if the video is really him. I'm on mobile, otherwise I would dig for it and post it.

Edited for clarity. It's early and I'm on the move.

It’s been discussed in this and the other thread a half dozen times.

Round and round. What goes around comes around.

[MNLonghornFUKM 8817]

Vilifying the victims in an effort to absolve wrongdoing is THE go to move of the right.  See also George Floyd (druggie), the Parkland Kids (crisis actors), Gold Star Father Khan, the Sandy Hook parents. It’s a great trick by sick motherfuckers. 
 
ETA: See also every woman with a credible sexual assault allegation. 

It’s vilifying because we’re not shedding crocodile tears?

[Guest Lobo]

25 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Hey has anyone heard about Kyle allegedly beating up a woman? Is that true? 

I seriously doubt that.  That kid couldn't punch his way out of a wet paper bag.  I'm glad justice prevailed but the kid looks, sounds, and acts like a gaping pussy wrapped in Nickelback merch.  Just send him some wrap-around Oakleys and let the cliche run itself out...

Edited November 23, 2021 by Lobo

[Anastasis 23469]

https://chicago.cbslocal.com/2021/11/22/as-kyle-rittenhouse-speaks-for-first-time-since-acquittal-question-of-who-gets-his-2-million-in-bail-money-is-up-in-the-air/

CHICAGO (CBS) — Kyle Rittenhouse has been acquitted of all criminal charges in Kenosha, Wisconsin, but now he is facing a new legal battle – who gets to keep the $2 million dollars bond that was posted for him?

[Hate 20108]

1 hour ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Vilifying the victims in an effort to absolve wrongdoing is THE go to move of the right.  See also George Floyd (druggie), the Parkland Kids (crisis actors), Gold Star Father Khan, the Sandy Hook parents. It’s a great trick by sick motherfuckers. 
 

ETA: See also every woman with a credible sexual assault allegation. 

Unless the accuser was assaulted by the husband of a presidential candidate and former president himself. 

And THE go to move of the right?  It's THE go to move of people.  The left does it in every single situation as well and you know it.  What a stupid fucking post, but I shouldn't be surprised.  Maybe one day your Russian handlers will have you go on to another site.

[52-80 19151]

guys, i beg you all to stop the character assassination of the guys who molested 5 teenage boys, threatened to kill his grandmom, and put a knife to his brothers throat.

 

by the way, did you know that the chubby gun kid once got in a school fight?

[Guest Lobo]

I heard that George Floyd had drugs in his system when he died.  I think it could be a small part of why he died.  The main cause though was the being murdered part.  

Although there is no known cure for death, you can look for the early warning signs.  A rotting smell, rigor mortis, and occasional drowsiness.  

[Azbadlands 109]

1 hour ago, Eastwood said:

 

 

Wow. Haven't seen that conspiracy theory before. We drive a species almost to extinction to eliminate competition for food sources, that species being an Apex predator of the game we also like to hunt and a predator of our livestock, and we bring them back from the brink of extinction after we are no longer food insecure to... Eliminate guns? Pray tell, who are these "a lot of people" you speak of?

 

Go to any hunting forum on the internet and you will find plenty of people bitching about wolves....It's mostly that there were no studies done before releasing them on the impact of the environment and no plan to manage them...Everyone points to Yellowstone as the study, but Yellowstone is not like any other forest in most of the west.  It is pristine untouched wilderness, where as most of the places they release these wolves have farms, ranches, developments,  timber cutting, etc...Actually, the timber cutting and roads for timber cutting gives wolves advantages in hunting ungulates they never had in the past before our ancestors killed them off.

 Trying to get a Liberal Federal Judge to allow a hunting season on them is damn near impossible and they reproduce like damn rabbits...

[wildcat09 29353]

I speculated in another thread that this new poster is literally a child and he's doing nothing to dissuade me.

[Guest Lobo]

I say we give the Wolves some AR-15's and let nature sort itself out.

Edited November 23, 2021 by Lobo

[jimmyjazz 45910]

11 minutes ago, Lobo said:

I say we give the Wolves some AR-15's and let nature sort itself out.

User name checks out.

[babysdaddy 2721]

12 hours ago, TXSG8R said:

So I was going to ask this in the Waukesha thread in DT but figured it would turn into a shit show. How will the Waukesha guy’s anti-white rap stuff be admissible if KR’s I want to shoot looters video wasn’t? Not trolling, I’m genuinely curious on the law side since I still don’t get how KR’s video wasn’t relevant. 

Not a lawyer so don't know but did KR shoot any looters?  I don't think he did but I don't know if those 3 guys were looting.  If he would've gone to a store where there were looters and started picking them off then he'd probably be getting ready to be executed at this point.

[StruggleBus 3922]

23 hours ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Look, the issue a lot of us have with this is very simple. 

Regular citizens should not be able to open carry and LARP as militia. Even moreso in these volatile situations. It should not be legal. Seeing a 17 year old do it with an AR-15 in hand is nauseating. 

It looks like the right verdict was reached. But there is understandable concern that we've opened Pandora's Box. Is looting good? Of course not. Is the answer to have any regular Joe legally open carry?  FUCK NO. 

Feels like a lot of people on the right are actively hoping more citizens open carry in public. This is madness. Use your fucking brains. 

 

The problem is 99% of the population that is upset about the verdict is simply screaming about murder and racism. 

If they said what you just said it would be much easier to agree. 

[wildcat09 29353]

5 minutes ago, StruggleBus said:

The problem is 99% of the population that is upset about the verdict is simply screaming about murder and racism. 

If they said what you just said it would be much easier to agree. 

Literally every liberal posting about it here on Surly has (1) complained about the evidence being limited in the way it was, (2) said, given the limits on the evidence, either that the verdict was correct or at least reasonable, and (3) said that what he did SHOULD be a crime and his acquittal is going to encourage more militia types to provoke liberal protesters to justify shooting them. Not a single one of us is simply "screaming about murder and racism." The simplest posts are all from the worst of the DT crew mindlessly repeating "child molester!," "domestic terrorists!," and "REEEEEEE" (that last one might've only been said once). 

[huge 3793]

Makes zero sense to me to keep bringing up what these assholes had done previously.  The fact that they were bad people doesn't/shouldn't matter when it comes to self defense.  They could have been Eagle Scouts, doesn't change the facts of the case.  Then in retrospect you can say "not surprising that these idiots attacked a guy with a gun, they had a history of making bad decisions or being a human pile of shit". 

 

I think this thread is better in CR now.  Everyone can be themselves.

[StruggleBus 3922]

7 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Literally every liberal posting about it here on Surly has (1) complained about the evidence being limited in the way it was, (2) said, given the limits on the evidence, either that the verdict was correct or at least reasonable, and (3) said that what he did SHOULD be a crime and his acquittal is going to encourage more militia types to provoke liberal protesters to justify shooting them. Not a single one of us is simply "screaming about murder and racism." The simplest posts are all from the worst of the DT crew mindlessly repeating "child molester!," "domestic terrorists!," and "REEEEEEE" (that last one might've only been said once). 

Hop on twitter for 15 minutes and report back here

[tchookem 3900]

I speculated in another thread that this new poster is literally a child and he's doing nothing to dissuade me.

It is always funny when these accounts pop-up out of nowhere and they have overly-specific causes.

"Oh yeah, well what about the wolves?"

[tchookem 3900]

Hop on twitter for 15 minutes and report back here

Maybe you should hop off of Twitter?

[huge 3793]

22 minutes ago, StruggleBus said:

The problem is 99% of the population that is upset about the verdict is simply screaming about murder and racism. 

If they said what you just said it would be much easier to agree. 

Hank and I are friends IRL.  He would have seen plenty of that on Facebook if he were to go on there...

[Harrison Bergeron 1798]

3 hours ago, TXSG8R said:

His record I get, I’m talking about the rap stuff or any video similar to KR where he said something months prior. If anything, I would think it’s easier to argue that rap doesn’t really show intent, it’s entertainment. I’m honestly all for it being relevant, just like KR’s should have been IMO. I’m just really curious since it’s the same state if the same rules will be applied. Something tells me it won’t. 
 

I think the initial assessment that he was fleeing a scene of a crime and chose the worst route possible seems the most plausible. If he was really out to kill whitey he blew past a lot of them before he got to a point where he didn’t have any room to get past people anymore. He even slowed down behind the band before he started rolling over people. It’s that or he really had it out for white marching bands and dancing groups specifically because he bypassed a lot of other people.  

Ask Dave Chapelle about the "entertainment" exception. LOL.

I can see both sides, but as you demonstrate it seems like an obvious way to inject bias into a finding of fact not directly germane to the facts of a particular case.

[wildcat09 29353]

12 minutes ago, tchookem said:

It is always funny when these accounts pop-up out of nowhere and they have overly-specific causes.

"Oh yeah, well what about the wolves?"

I'd love an explanation of what he thinks federal judges have to do with wolf hunting seasons.

[workswithseed 2103]

4 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

I'd love an explanation of what he thinks federal judges have to do with wolf hunting seasons.

Last time I heard, nothing. Kinda a weird tangent to go on about, especially for hunting. Ranchers, sure, but hunters is definitely a new one. I also have no problem with wolves back in native habits.

[tchookem 3900]

I'd love an explanation of what he thinks federal judges have to do with wolf hunting seasons.

You obviously aren't well-versed in Wolf Law. It's the semester after Bird Law

[Guest Lobo]

It's all fun and games until they mate, and we have to study WolfBird Law.  The only thing that can kill them is when a wind turbine gets toppled to the ground during a massive ice storm.

Edited November 23, 2021 by Lobo

[hayden_horn 11362]

31 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Literally every liberal posting about it here on Surly has (1) complained about the evidence being limited in the way it was, (2) said, given the limits on the evidence, either that the verdict was correct or at least reasonable, and (3) said that what he did SHOULD be a crime and his acquittal is going to encourage more militia types to provoke liberal protesters to justify shooting them. Not a single one of us is simply "screaming about murder and racism." The simplest posts are all from the worst of the DT crew mindlessly repeating "child molester!," "domestic terrorists!," and "REEEEEEE" (that last one might've only been said once). 

i'm tempted to ban anyone using REEEE seriously on this board.

not you, referencing the poster that did, but jesus, yall, have some awareness. we aren't stupid. your dogwhistles only go so far.