2020 PRESIDENTIAL DEBATES: Joe Biden vs Donald Trump

[Sbbruin 21704]

Whatever. 
 
I see JBJ got assigned to be the thread troll this morning. Tough assignment. But he’s managing it. 

I welcome Trump supporters expressing themselves. I honestly want to understand their perspective. Out here there are very few vocal Trump supporters so I don't hear the justification for their support. There's a few I know on social media but they mostly just posts memes and shit.

[bad_teammate 13132]

4 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

Brisket is a white supremacists?

I don't know, has he been involved with "anti-Communist" rallies?

Just now, JBJ said:

Except that Biden wasn't asked to denounce Democracy.  He was asked to denounce child rape.

And according to the transcript someone else provided he did immediately. Which you seem to have lied about. Did you lie about it?

[workswithseed 2033]

Just now, High Plains Drifter said:

 

It ain't all about you, white boy.

 

Oh, I guess I shouldn't worry about it even outside my window.

[crash_davis 23081]

2 minutes ago, Sbbruin said:

I welcome Trump supporters expressing themselves. I honestly want to understand their perspective. Out here there are very few vocal Trump supporters so I don't hear the justification for their support. There's a few I know on social media but they mostly just posts memes and shit.

so now you know what it's like to lose a few brain cells trying to understand the logic and mental gymnastics.

[JimmyJames 12271]

7 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

Pivoting a little bit here.

As a Biden voter, I will say that I think there's more upside going forward in debates 2 and 3 for Biden than Trump. Trump has made two things clear:

- He's going to play the greatest hits, which everyone has heard, and don't really have any impact anymore
- He's going to be himself, a flaming, over-talking asshole. He can't help it.

I don't see Trump as really capable of shifting his strategy. He's going to do what he do. But there is definitely some correctable room for improvement with Biden. They have two weeks to focus group and figure out how to parry the absolute insanity coming out of Trump. I'm sure they prepared for insanity, but I don't think they were expecting that level of it.

Stay the course, stay under control, don't get mad, come up with a few good zingers and "Scranton Joe is riled up!" moments to queue up for Trump's very predictable lines, keep laughing at him and being dismissive, and keep letting Trump hang himself.

I feel better about the debate today than last night. Nobody won, but Joe lost less than Trump lost.

Excellent post and absolutely correct. Joe isn’t the greatest debater but he held his own and now knows how trump will attack him. He will be better prepared for the lunatic next time. Meanwhile trump will just snort some more Adderall and borrow some coke from his son for the next one.  

Edited September 30, 2020 by JimmyJames

[C-Man 27029]

3 hours ago, Sbbruin said:

I really don’t care what your political views are.  Personally, I would classify myself as a center right Republican if I had to put a label on it.  We need more fiscal responsibility than either party has shown.  We need more strategic social programs, rather than what is becoming a universal minimum wage.  But I digress.  My point is, irrespective of your politics, how on earth can ANYONE support four more years of a man who has made it his mission to tear the country apart, continually and continuously embarrasses the country and the office he holds, who caters only to those who support him and the rest be damned, and has made our country an international laughing stock?  It baffles me that anyone can stand behind this guy.  And please don’t say I support his policies, not him as an individual.  You don’t get to separate the two.  I am no fan of Joe Biden, but his comment that Donald Trump is the worst president in American history could not be more spot on.  We absolutely can not afford 4 more years of this.  We deserve better.   MUCH better.  

Beautiful. Just beautiful.

2 hours ago, SydneyCarton said:

Not to defend google, but apparently after watching that documentary, everyone gets different suggestions based on their search history. So google knows you're politically minded right now.

I'm sure that proud boy piece of human shit on the video above, when he types in "WH" gets an autocomplete suggestion like: Where to lynch blacks

Let's be honest. Gavin's search would auto-populate with the N-word.

[Voldemort86 2259]

Changes are coming.

[FondrenRoad 4378]

2 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

Pivoting a little bit here.

As a Biden voter, I will say that I think there's more upside going forward in debates 2 and 3 for Biden than Trump. Trump has made two things clear:

- He's going to play the greatest hits, which everyone has heard, and don't really have any impact anymore
- He's going to be himself, a flaming, over-talking asshole. He can't help it.

I don't see Trump as really capable of shifting his strategy. He's going to do what he do. But there is definitely some correctable room for improvement with Biden. They have two weeks to focus group and figure out how to parry the absolute insanity coming out of Trump. I'm sure they prepared for insanity, but I don't think they were expecting that level of it.

Stay the course, stay under control, don't get mad, come up with a few good zingers and "Scranton Joe is riled up!" moments to queue up for Trump's very predictable lines, and keep letting Trump hang himself.

I feel better about the debate today than last night. Nobody won, but Joe lost less than Trump lost.

I don't know. I think Trump can be baited into saying and doing much worse things than he has already said and done so a better strategy may be to push Trump's buttons while remaining calm.  Calmly delivering rebuttals and attacks drive people who are on irrational tirades crazy. 

Like my ex girlfriend. She would be screaming about something I found insignificant that I supposedly did. I would calmly reply. She'd go nuts. 

[High Plains Drifter 10970]

 

lol chris wallace and professionalism in the same sentence.

edit replyiing to voldemort's tweet

 

 

 

Edited September 30, 2020 by High Plains Drifter

[4th&Five 41457]

 

[Francisco 2.0 32313]

3 minutes ago, Voldemort86 said:

Changes are coming.

 

Because these changes are unfair, Trump will refuse to debate.

 

Cue up Fox, Rush, etc saying that everything is fixed for Biden.

[RomaVicta 29769]

48 minutes ago, CDAK said:

You quoted the exact same sentence as me. I read the sentences we both quoted as supporting the Green New Deal. It would be odd to not support something and refer to it as a "crucial framework" that "powerfully captures two basic truths." Last night, he said "[n]o, I don't support the Green New Deal." I didn't distort anything. I quoted him and linked to his site. Those quotes are contradictory.

Negged again for doubling down. You said he waffled and quoted his site which clearly distinguishes between the Green New Deal and his plan. You're sticking with that. That's dishonest.

You seem to have bought into the habit of sophistry where any answer is a valid answer if you can point to absolutely anything that seems to support it. If you are what you seem, you're dishonesty is killing a republic that can only thrive with some sort of honest, civil discourse.

Neg me back. I could give a shit, but I don't. One way or another, you're acting the part of the amateur operative- a Kellyanne without even asking for a salary. I suppose that's the difference between a slut and a whore. 

[Mo Horn 8807]

From the crazies 

[BradInATX 9208]

6 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Excellent post and absolutely correct. Joe isn’t the greatest debater but he held his own and now knows how trump will attack him. He will be better prepared for the lunatic next time. Meanwhile trump will just snort some more Adderall and borrow some coke from his son for the next one.  

Yeah, and @FondrenRoad brings up a good point which is that there's a lot of downside for Trump as well.. he could sink even lower and embarrass himself even worse. I didn't really consider that or bring it up because "there is no bottom" is sort of baked into my every thought about Trump, so I take it for granted.

Edited September 30, 2020 by BradInATX

[JBJ 3648]

17 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

Biden was asked to denounce violence, he did that with authority.

Trump was asked to denounce white supremacy. He did the opposite.

You're either a fucking idiot or a disingenuous piece of shit or maybe both. 

The responses you quoted are fine to me.  Was the quote I took issue with fine to you?

Edited September 30, 2020 by JBJ

[crash_davis 23081]

trump won last time because hillary sucks, he was something different, and he riled up people's worst fears. he has nothing new to add this time. he doesn't have the build the wall pitch anymore because it'll remind people that 1. no meaningful wall got built and 2. mexico did in fact not pay for shit and 3. he's a lying piece of shit. so he's left with his true base which are mostly racists fucking shitheads.

most sane independent and republican voters now see voting for him was a GIGANTIC fucking mistake leading to 4 years of utter chaos and embarrassment. last night's showing did nothing but solidify that he's a not a sane civil adult, which was already solidified after a few months in office to anyone with half a brain.

[Irwin F Fletcher 3550]

7 minutes ago, Voldemort86 said:

Changes are coming.

I can already hear maga fans crying that they're trying to handcuff Trump even further.

 

[bad_teammate 13132]

I want Joe hooked up to electrodes and implants and doped up. Why would that bother me?

Does USADA test presidents?

[BradInATX 9208]

8 minutes ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

 

Because these changes are unfair, Trump will refuse to debate.

 

Cue up Fox, Rush, etc saying that everything is fixed for Biden.

I could definitely live with this outcome. We can let the voters' last memory of Trump juxtaposed against Biden be a screaming incoherent child. 

Even though I think the upside for the next two debates is mostly on Joe's side, I think I'd be perfectly fine with packing up shop after this one and locking in the current position and letting the chips fall where they may in October. Trump appears to need a hail mary and the less opportunities given to him the better.

Edited September 30, 2020 by BradInATX

[Snake Diggity 4614]

2 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

Oh, and Biden missed a LOT of easy layups.  Seriously, there were some zingers there to be had.  Now, that's never really been his style, so it's not really fair to expect it from him, but yeah.

Some easy ones:

When Wallace called out Trump for not following the debate rules, follow with "why would you expect him to follow the rules?  He can't even follow the law?"

On the topic of "law and order," say "I absolutely believe in The Rule of Law.  And it starts at the top.  We need a president who will follow the law, and not build a criminal gang -- with dozens of indictments and convictions so far.  We need a president who will follow the constitution, including the emoluments clause, and not take money from foreign countries.  Law and Order starts at the top, and it starts with FOLLOWING the law."

On the ballots -- "you aren't talking about ballots.  Those aren't being sent.  What's being sent is ballot applications.  So, add that to the list of things you know absolutely nothing about.  Trying to undermine our election by yammering about things you don't even understand -- that's par for the Trump course."

There were plenty of others -- there was something about "it's in my blood" - it was a great opportunity for Biden to say that "loyalty to my country and its people -- that's what's in my blood."  He did say that he would be the president to ALL Americans, even those who don't vote for him, and that was important.  He needs to send that message more frequently, and more pointedly.  He needs to contrast -- Trump thinks his job is to lead red states, and punish blue states.  I will be president of the UNITED States.  All of them.  Being president is a solemn obligation and a duty to every single American.  I will serve all of them.  Petty grudges are for children, not presidents.

Biden could have shut the door last night and he wasn’t up to it.  He is nothing that could be described as “sharp” or “quick-witted”.  Basically any other democratic candidate (Pete, Warren, Sanders, Harris) would have eviscerated Trump. It’s a shame.  Of course, that doesn’t change the fact that Trump’s display (not just last night but for his entire life) should leave no voter undecided; anyone who votes Trump at this point is a sadist or an idiot.

[Aqua Buddha 14501]

7 minutes ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

 

Because these changes are unfair, Trump will refuse to debate.

 

Cue up Fox, Rush, etc saying that everything is fixed for Biden.

This.  They'll give the moderator a kill switch and Trump will refuse.

[Neonmoon 38127]

7 minutes ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

 

Because these changes are unfair, Trump will refuse to debate.

God I hope so, no one should be subjected to voter intimidation, inciting violence, white supremacy, baseless voter fraud accusations. 

There's a reason you're not allowed to yell fire in a theatre. jesus

[JimmyJames 12271]

3 minutes ago, Irwin F Fletcher said:

I can already hear maga fans crying that they're trying to handcuff Trump even further.

 

You should see them bitching about Facebook fact checking their stupid ass posts. 
 

I realize Mark Zuckerburg is an asshole but it ain’t 2016 anymore. 

[Dahobbs 17420]

3 minutes ago, JBJ said:

The responses you quoted are fine to me.  Was the quote I took issue with fine to you?

Yes. He doesn't need to denounce Antifa because (1) isn't a singular organization and (2) isn't the radical violent boogieman you've been told to be afraid of. Yes, some people have been violent. Those people should be prosecuted. Antifascism as a concept doesn't need to be and shouldn't be denounced. Like my father-in-law, you've bought this bullshit narrative that Antifa is this ominous organization that is coming to rape everybody. You probably also thought there were hoards of angry and violent caravans coming to cause chaos in the United States.

[RomaVicta 29769]

18 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

Oh, I guess I shouldn't worry about it even outside my window.

The problem is that you want to keep your focus that narrow to protect yourself from the reality beyond your front yard.

[crash_davis 23081]

1 minute ago, Dahobbs said:

Yes. He doesn't need to denounce Antifa because (1) isn't a singular organization and (2) isn't the radical violent boogieman you've been told to be afraid of. Yes, some people have been violent. Those people should be prosecuted. Antifascism as a concept doesn't need to be and shouldn't be denounced. Like my father-in-law, you've bought this bullshit narrative that Antifa is this ominous organization that is coming to rape everybody. You probably also thought there were hoards of angry and violent caravans coming to cause chaos in the United States.

don't bother engaging JBJ on antifa. trump fucking doubled down on white supremacy, but JBJ wants to argue semantics of Biden denouncing violence.

 

[StassneyHorn 6535]

19 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

Oh, I guess I shouldn't worry about it even outside my window.

Please ask for their Antifa license next time and I’ll refer them to their local chapter boss.

[Voldemort86 2259]

16 minutes ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

 

Because these changes are unfair, Trump will refuse to debate.

 

Cue up Fox, Rush, etc saying that everything is fixed for Biden.

Any mature, sane minded, self-respecting, American adult would be turned off by President Trump dragging all of us deep into his core of hatred last night.

the only question is are there enough sane and mature adults in America to get trump out of office? He’s an embarrassment and a disgrace.

[BehoId, The Underminer! 11668]

15 minutes ago, Mo Horn said:

From the crazies 

If that gif is supposed to imply that Biden has one of those Django unchained wrist pistols, I’m in.

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20342]

Got an email from my cousin, who is normally apathetic and has only voted once since 2000 (for Obama in 2008). She lives in Kansas and is normally like "there's no point in voting. My vote won't make a difference."   She said she wouldn't have voted this year but last night's performance on Trump's part is driving her to the voting booth (for Biden).  We talk about conservatives and liberals and undecideds and whatever but I wonder if there's a huge vote that's being overlooked: the apathetic vote.  In my opinion, there could be a much larger voter turnout this year, one that is fueled by people like her who are going to vent their fury against Trump. She's a waitress on furlough at the moment and said she has nothing better to do.

[JBJ 3648]

1 minute ago, Dahobbs said:

Yes. He doesn't need to denounce Antifa because (1) isn't a singular organization and (2) isn't the radical violent boogieman you've been told to be afraid of. Yes, some people have been violent. Those people should be prosecuted. Antifascism as a concept doesn't need to be and shouldn't be denounced. Like my father-in-law, you've bought this bullshit narrative that Antifa is this ominous organization that is coming to rape everybody. You probably also thought there were hoards of angry and violent caravans coming to cause chaos in the United States.

Here is your problem: Biden was never asked to denounce antifa.

[CDAK 216]

13 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Negged again for doubling down. You said he waffled and quoted his site which clearly distinguishes between the Green New Deal and his plan. You're sticking with that. That's dishonest.

Here are the two quotes - both from Biden directly, one on his website and one from his mouth. I don't think there is any way to say with a straight-face that they are consistent. They conflict.

• "No, I do not support the Green New Deal."
• "Biden believes the Green New Deal is a crucial framework for meeting the climate challenges we face. It powerfully captures two basic truths, which are at the core of his plan: (1) the United States urgently needs to embrace greater ambition on an epic scale to meet the scope of this challenge, and (2) our environment and our economy are completely and totally connected." (emphasis added)

I don't think it's a huge deal but you keep posting a spate of histrionics so I feel compelled to respond (I probably shouldn't). I think his actual beliefs likely are more aligned with bullet 2 than bullet 1.

[Satchel 6908]

14 hours ago, TexEx15 said:

What a bitch.

 

Trump is a weak man’s idea of a strong man.

[Horn Dog 9670]

17 minutes ago, Mo Horn said:

From the crazies 

Gotcha Grampa Jo!  Caught you hiding a microphone in your sleeve cause your handlers wouldn't possibly be able to hear what  you said with that big ass microphone mounted on your podium....or  is that supposed to he some kind of hearing device implanted on your wrist??  I am so confused.

[Dahobbs 17420]

Just now, JBJ said:

Here is your problem: Biden was never asked to denounce antifa.

Then what are you complaining about you vapid fuck? He denounced violence on his own and unprompted. Trump embraced white supremacy. You can go fuck yourself with all the rusty nails in the world and then do it again.  

[washparkhorn 9934]

20 minutes ago, Mo Horn said:

From the crazies 

Dead son's rosary beads. 

[Chuckie Finster 22598]

1 minute ago, CDAK said:

Here are the two quotes - both from Biden directly, one on his website and one from his mouth. I don't think there is any way to say with a straight-face that they are consistent. They conflict.

• "No, I do not support the Green New Deal."
• "Biden believes the Green New Deal is a crucial framework for meeting the climate challenges we face. It powerfully captures two basic truths, which are at the core of his plan: (1) the United States urgently needs to embrace greater ambition on an epic scale to meet the scope of this challenge, and (2) our environment and our economy are completely and totally connected." (emphasis added)

I don't think it's a huge deal but you keep posting a spate of histrionics so I feel compelled to respond (I probably shouldn't). I think his actual beliefs likely are more aligned with bullet 2 than bullet 1.

Jesus Christ dude.  The Green New Deal is close to, but not exactly, the Biden Plan.  His comment last night was his way of saying "I am my own man and create my own plan and am not owned by the left, although I will hear input from them."  This isn't fucking rocket science.

[Brisketexan 104537]

1 minute ago, Satchel said:

Trump is a weak man’s idea of a strong man.

He's an utter coward.

A man lives in the world of responsibility.

A coward lives in the world of blame and excuses.

A man stands up for others.

A coward stands up only for himself.

Trump is not a man.  He's a pathetic creature.  And admiring him is possibly the most humiliating thing that a person can reveal about themselves.

[G650 14074]

42 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

ANTIFA isn't Joe's base. They hate him and he hates them.

White supremacists are Trump's base. They love him and he loves them.

This isn't hard to understand.

"Anti-Communism" in America is, and always has been, a mask for white supremacy and fascism. Communism doesn't exist here as a political force.

ANTIFA doesn't actually do that much violence. Lots of property crime. Lots of yelling and making people mad, but not a lot of "violence". And violence certainly isn't something they celebrate or make part of their initiations or self-image.

Are you looking for the word "disorder"?

This is all dead on.

[CDAK 216]

2 minutes ago, Chuckie Finster said:

Jesus Christ dude.  The Green New Deal is close to, but not exactly, the Biden Plan.  His comment last night was his way of saying "I am my own man and create my own plan and am not owned by the left, although I will hear input from them."  This isn't fucking rocket science.

I completely accept that his comment last night was a gaffe or mistake. Perhaps he got caught up in the moment and misspoke. I tend to believe what people say rather than re-write their quotes for them, as you chose to do.

[Gourmand 7774]

2 hours ago, Laga4 said:

I feel so fucking smart after this debatacle for not voting for a Democrat or Republican since Richard Nixon.

These are two loser parties full of people that only help themselves and not the people they were elected to serve.  If you don't believe me just look at who was nominated to lead  the parties.  

We need a strong third party.

You.

 

Are a fucking idiot.

[Red Five 40627]

I just told a friend that last night's debate was the debate equivalent of Tyson biting off Holyfield's ear. Thought it was a pretty good comparison. 

[Chuckie Finster 22598]

8 minutes ago, CDAK said:

I completely accept that his comment last night was a gaffe or mistake. Perhaps he got caught up in the moment and misspoke. I tend to believe what people say rather than re-write their quotes for them, as you chose to do.

Chris Wallace: (59:05)
So, do you support the Green New Deal?

Vice President Joe Biden: (59:07)
Pardon me?

Chris Wallace: (59:08)
Do you support the-

Vice President Joe Biden: (59:08)
No, I don’t support the Green New Deal.

President Donald J. Trump: (59:10)
Oh, you don’t? Oh, well, that’s a big statement.

Vice President Joe Biden: (59:12)
I support [crosstalk 00:05:13]-

President Donald J. Trump: (59:13)
You just lost the radical left.

Vice President Joe Biden: (59:15)
I support [crosstalk 00:59:17] the Biden plan that I put forward.

Chris Wallace: (59:19)
Okay.

Vice President Joe Biden: (59:19)
The Biden plan, which is different than what he calls the radical Green New Deal.

[JBJ 3648]

 

3 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

Then what are you complaining about you vapid fuck? He denounced violence on his own and unprompted. Trump embraced white supremacy. You can go fuck yourself with all the rusty nails in the world and then do it again.  

Biden gave a tacit defense of Antifa when faced with the topic of extremist violence.

It doesn't even make sense if Antifa is not his base and isn't related to extremist violence.

[Voldemort86 2259]

I’ve been hearing that lots of Trumpkins are blaming Wallace for the debate being a shit show and flying off the rails.

these people are crazy and I’m glad I have nothing in common with them and no friends who think like them.

[Continental Op 3934]

2 hours ago, JBJ said:

Yeah only gullible fucks think that they were talking about violent extremism in a question about extremist groups "adding to the violence in a number of our cities."

One candidate is on the record criticizing violence from both sides.  The other candidate told a group with a history of violence to "stand by."  This isn't that hard. 

[Dbeasy 14961]

Here are the two quotes - both from Biden directly, one on his website and one from his mouth. I don't think there is any way to say with a straight-face that they are consistent. They conflict.

• "No, I do not support the Green New Deal."
• "Biden believes the Green New Deal is a crucial framework for meeting the climate challenges we face. It powerfully captures two basic truths, which are at the core of his plan: (1) the United States urgently needs to embrace greater ambition on an epic scale to meet the scope of this challenge, and (2) our environment and our economy are completely and totally connected." (emphasis added)

I don't think it's a huge deal but you keep posting a spate of histrionics so I feel compelled to respond (I probably shouldn't). I think his actual beliefs likely are more aligned with bullet 2 than bullet 1.

Do you seriously not understand a reference to another framework for ideas on preparing one’s own plan? Jeez.

[JBJ 3648]

4 minutes ago, Voldemort86 said:

I’ve been hearing that lots of Trumpkins are blaming Wallace for the debate being a shit show and flying off the rails.

these people are crazy and I’m glad I have nothing in common with them and no friends who think like them.

Wallace wasn't great.  But blaming Wallace is crazy.  They should really get a longform-interview type person to moderate.  News anchors aren't equipped to do this anymore.  When they do longform at all, it's cut up and editted to shit.

Edited September 30, 2020 by JBJ

[Dbeasy 14961]

I completely accept that his comment last night was a gaffe or mistake. Perhaps he got caught up in the moment and misspoke. I tend to believe what people say rather than re-write their quotes for them, as you chose to do.

Good lord this poster is not very bright.

[ChiTownDoc 21097]

45 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Excellent post and absolutely correct. Joe isn’t the greatest debater but he held his own and now knows how trump will attack him. He will be better prepared for the lunatic next time. Meanwhile trump will just snort some more Adderall and borrow some coke from his son for the next one.  

We need a master debater.