Fuck Big 12 refs

[Had Enough 2120]

It is worded this way:
"When in question a pass thrown in or behind the neutral zone is forward rather than a backwards pass."
That's rule 2.19.2.b.  It is a reviewable ruling.

It says nothing about it being immediate. You can let it play out then after it’s played out make the incomplete call. Then replay can rule differently if warranted.

On a play like that, no ref can tell whether it’s forward or backwards.

At a minimum, I’d want the 5 yard loss. Not certain how they’d rule but if they blow it dead and ruled no clear recovery, it should be at the spot when blown dead.

Just stop the game and review.

[Jimbob 424]

3 hours ago, DFW Horn said:

Well, that is Sark's job after all.

He should've been raising hell. I didn't notice. Maybe he's too "California cool"? IDK

He’s definitely got a passive personality on the sidelines.  The only coach I can think of with that didn’t seem to get visibly angry at times and was very effective was sweater vest at OSU

[ousux 5639]

Im actually not convinced of this, go watch the A&M Bama game. A&M got considerably fairer ref action than we typically get against OU or the infamous OSU game 

If A&M v Bama happened in the Big12, there is 0 chance A&M pulled that off 

aggy has learned to "take care of" the refs calling their games..at least that's the rumor heard by an aggy coworker who ran track there and doesn't really care about football.

[bullet 1630]

8 hours ago, Bigbend1812 said:

Are we playing count the holds?

Just multiply OU offensive plays by 1.5 and save yourself some time.

[JBJ 3827]

15 minutes ago, ousux said:

3 hours ago, BigHornedLurker said:

Im actually not convinced of this, go watch the A&M Bama game. A&M got considerably fairer ref action than we typically get against OU or the infamous OSU game 

If A&M v Bama happened in the Big12, there is 0 chance A&M pulled that off 

aggy has learned to "take care of" the refs calling their games..at least that's the rumor heard by an aggy coworker who ran track there and doesn't really care about football.

The SEC has good officiating compared to the rest of CFB.

[bullet 1630]

19 hours ago, Jkwellborn said:

What about the Jamison strip? The fucking announcers kept saying that you had to give it to the offense because of his effort to get down there.

His knee did get down.  In slow mo it was clear the strip was just after the one knee went down.  I thought it was a fumble live, but it wasn't.

[Jkwellborn 7039]

His knee did get down.  In slow mo it was clear the strip was just after the one knee went down.  I thought it was a fumble live, but it wasn't.

I didn’t say it wasn’t correct, but they were gonna absolutely give it back to ou.

[ousux 5639]

The SEC has good officiating compared to the rest of CFB.

This was about 4-5 years ago when I heard that, may have changed. They used to be notoriously biased towards the top teams.

[ATXhorn17 1677]

There ain’t no way in hell the Big 12 allows Texas to beat an undefeated OSU on Saturday… Brace yourselves for some BS. 

[Tex Pete 21489]

1 hour ago, bullet said:

His knee did get down.  In slow mo it was clear the strip was just after the one knee went down.  I thought it was a fumble live, but it wasn't.

You could actually never see the ball itself in the review. IJS.

[Nivek 17415]

3 hours ago, Eskimohorn said:

The SEC wants Texas, but know Texas doesn’t have to be elite to bring in viewers. I expect routine screwjobs in the SEC, maybe even more egregious. Out of the frying pan, into the fire. Think we should be independent in football and we’ll regret the move to the SEC where the power teams covet our recruiting pipeline.

I actually don't.  I know they had some issues in the past, but their mistakes in officiating genuinely seem more like honest mistakes than one-sided systemic fuckery.  No matter what other conference people tell me about their officials, we always do better when it is someone else's officiating crew and the OU/TTechs suffer from it. 

Poona Ford would have been a monster at Texas if for not all the god-damn holding.   It is why he is a monster in the NFL.  

[USNALonghorn 5188]

3 hours ago, ATXhorn17 said:

There ain’t no way in hell the Big 12 allows Texas to beat an undefeated OSU on Saturday… Brace yourselves for some BS. 

Didn’t seem to be a factor when Herman got out-Herman’d by undefeated Gundy in Stoolwater.

[bullet 1630]

4 hours ago, ousux said:

4 hours ago, JBJ said:

The SEC has good officiating compared to the rest of CFB.

This was about 4-5 years ago when I heard that, may have changed. They used to be notoriously biased towards the top teams.

They still are.  My wife went to UGA so I watch a lot of SEC games too.

[bullet 1630]

3 hours ago, Tex Pete said:

You could actually never see the ball itself in the review. IJS.

The review on TV was perfect.  The back knee goes down an instant before Jamison strips it.  Jamison was half a second slow with his strip.

[Had Enough 2120]

Why do we have conference officials?

There needs to be a national organization. You still have crews work together. They still can work regionally.

The conferences obviously want the control. The whys are the question. They don’t want the problems associated with independence.

[Surly Bevo 25750]

And they should have media availability like every other “adult” on the field.

[Nueces River Rat 5796]

9 minutes ago, Had Enough said:

Why do we have conference officials?

There needs to be a national organization. You still have crews work together. They still can work regionally.

The conferences obviously want the control. The whys are the question. They don’t want the problems associated with independence.

This would be a good concept to try.   Similar to Texas high school in someways.    In Texas,  you have a state association.   It is broken into regional chapters and the coaches get to strike certain crews as they are assigned.   If both coaches can’t agree on a Ref crew within their own regional chapter, they can pay the costs to have another chapter send a crew.   Occurs from time to time in key district games and in the playoffs.  
 

In the college ranks you could divide  the nation into several regions and all the conferences in FCS would pre select and strike certain crews in a similar fashion.  

[Nueces River Rat 5796]

6 hours ago, bullet said:

His knee did get down.  In slow mo it was clear the strip was just after the one knee went down.  I thought it was a fumble live, but it wasn't.

I’m old to remember when the replay technology was used just to confirm catches and not every play.  That one play is  an example when at the moment it occurred I wish we had the old rule.  But it’s probably best we have the ability to review more plays.   It’s just the Rig 12 Refs seem to think we have all day for them to review things.

[Tex Pete 21489]

2 hours ago, bullet said:

The review on TV was perfect.  The back knee goes down an instant before Jamison strips it.  Jamison was half a second slow with his strip.

Yet you still could not actually see the football. “Conclusive.”

[Jkwellborn 7039]

Yet you still could not actually see the football. “Conclusive.”

Exactly. That was a fumble live and you couldn’t prove otherwise.

[Nivek 17415]

14 hours ago, Had Enough said:

Why do we have conference officials?

There needs to be a national organization. You still have crews work together. They still can work regionally.

The conferences obviously want the control. The whys are the question. They don’t want the problems associated with independence.

Mack was saying this decades ago, too.

[Nivek 17415]

15 hours ago, bullet said:

The review on TV was perfect.  The back knee goes down an instant before Jamison strips it.  Jamison was half a second slow with his strip.

I think he was down before the strip.  But the review was fucking far from perfect and you could not actually see the ball in the TV review.  It is absolutely inconclusive based on those reasons alone.    You are just making up stuff in this post like you officiated the game.  

[Cajun 11777]

3 minutes ago, Nivek said:

Mack was saying this decades ago, too.

Then it's a terrible idea by definition.

[dcar00 14974]

20 hours ago, ATXhorn17 said:

There ain’t no way in hell the Big 12 allows Texas to beat an undefeated OSU on Saturday… Brace yourselves for some BS. 

I fully expect a couple of BS drive killing holding calls, 1 or 2 DPI calls to extend OSU drive  maybe a targeting for good measure.  need to bring it for 4 quarters.

[Ghost of Shag 2730]

Does the conference release any type of correction from games? Some shit like “officials were wrong to award a completion to an OU receiver who ran out of bounds against Texas?”

Or so they just not give a shit? 

Oh, they don’t give a shit?

Fuck this conference.

[ousux 5639]

Does the conference release any type of correction from games? Some shit like “officials were wrong to award a completion to an OU receiver who ran out of bounds against Texas?”
Or so they just not give a shit? 
Oh, they don’t give a shit?
Fuck this conference.

Lololol..if they didn't apologize for Okie Lite 2015, there won't be any for this one.
I keep hearing "officials don't decide the outcome of games blah blah" but there is no denying two of the blown calls led to 10 gooner points when it should have been a punt and turnover respectively. Did we do enough bad things to lose the game without that? Sure, but we also did enough good things to win with the lead built up in the first half.

[Had Enough 2120]

Mack was saying this decades ago, too.

Maybe I’m Mack.

[Nivek 17415]

1 hour ago, Had Enough said:

Maybe I’m Mack.

More like Watson

[BurntOrange&White 41870]

So going back and rewatching the Boise State Oklahoma State game I noticed one distinct feature:

 

The crew who called that game which screwed Boise State was the big 12 crew who called our TCU game which includes Kelly Deterding.

Edited October 14, 2021 by BurntOrange&White

[bullet 1630]

On 10/13/2021 at 1:54 PM, Nivek said:

I think he was down before the strip.  But the review was fucking far from perfect and you could not actually see the ball in the TV review.  It is absolutely inconclusive based on those reasons alone.    You are just making up stuff in this post like you officiated the game.  

Some of you are seeing things through Burnt Orange tinted glasses.  You could see the knee down just as Jamison is pulling it out.  There is zero doubt it was right to overturn the fumble.  Absolute zero.  I hated it, but there was absolutely no question it was the right call.  Y'all sound like the TCU fans whining about how they got hosed the week before against UT.  They weren't watching the same game I was.

[Js1 87186]

1 minute ago, bullet said:

Some of you are seeing things through Burnt Orange tinted glasses.  You could see the knee down just as Jamison is pulling it out.  There is zero doubt it was right to overturn the fumble.  Absolute zero.  I hated it, but there was absolutely no question it was the right call.  Y'all sound like the TCU fans whining about how they got hosed the week before against UT.  They weren't watching the same game I was.

Yes, overturning it was the right call.  It was pretty clear and obvious. 

[NeverMarryAStripper 22304]

But not as clear and obvious as the OU receiver being out of bounds

[BachelorTrek 3321]

On 10/13/2021 at 1:48 PM, Ghost of Shag said:

Does the conference release any type of correction from games? Some shit like “officials were wrong to award a completion to an OU receiver who ran out of bounds against Texas?”

Or so they just not give a shit? 

Oh, they don’t give a shit?

Fuck this conference.

Yep, notice the 11am kicks for the rest of this season (even though many are TBA yet, they will be made all 11am-- just watch it happen!). Hell, they'd make it 5am kicks if they could get away with it.  

The more the Big12 does this shit, the more it makes me happier for the SEC move BY THE DAY, and I was happy with it as soon as I heard it!  And, this bullshit treatment will help reinforce that this is our last Big12 season.

Fuck the Big12!

[DFW Horn 6654]

On 10/13/2021 at 1:48 PM, Ghost of Shag said:

Does the conference release any type of correction from games? Some shit like “officials were wrong to award a completion to an OU receiver who ran out of bounds against Texas?”

Or so they just not give a shit? 

Oh, they don’t give a shit?

Fuck this conference.

I know the NFL will occasionally acknowledge officiating mistakes, but does any other NCAA conference? I don't think so. Agree with the sentiment though.

Done with shitty Big 12 officials and 11 AM kick-offs

[Tex Pete 21489]

14 hours ago, bullet said:

Some of you are seeing things through Burnt Orange tinted glasses.  You could see the knee down just as Jamison is pulling it out.  There is zero doubt it was right to overturn the fumble.  Absolute zero.  I hated it, but there was absolutely no question it was the right call.  Y'all sound like the TCU fans whining about how they got hosed the week before against UT.  They weren't watching the same game I was.

Yet, you could only assume where the ball was because you could not actually see it in any angle of replay. That is not “indisputable.” That’s the problem with the way replay is executed, and we seem to always be on the losing end of the reviews. 

[Liquor and Poker 3659]

15 hours ago, Js1 said:

Yes, overturning it was the right call.  It was pretty clear and obvious. 

 

14 hours ago, NeverMarryAStripper said:

But not as clear and obvious as the OU receiver being out of bounds

Both of these are true. I don’t buy the idea that the officials are in the tank for OU, but I do believe they see an “elite” team over and over and sort of get used to thinking that team isn’t fucking up on every single play. It’s kind of a blind spot more than bias. 

[Tex Long 4665]

The number of reviews in XII football is ridiculously large compared with other conferences' officiating. The excessive length of the reviews is even worse. Hell, I thought we had a 2-minute rule put on reviews a while back: from the time the replay officials stop play to look at forty-eight different camera angles, they have two (2) minutes to overturnor uphold the field call, and no decision by that time is a "play stands as called" and spectators can quit wondering wtf and start spectating again. Did I imagine that, or was it just lip service?

[Tex Pete 21489]

4 minutes ago, Tex Long said:

The number of reviews in XII football is ridiculously large compared with other conferences' officiating. The excessive length of the reviews is even worse. Hell, I thought we had a 2-minute rule put on reviews a while back: from the time the replay officials stop play to look at forty-eight different camera angles, they have two (2) minutes to overturnor uphold the field call, and no decision by that time is a "play stands as called" and spectators can quit wondering wtf and start spectating again. Did I imagine that, or was it just lip service?

And they still can’t be bothered to rule correctly. 

[Tex Long 4665]

7 minutes ago, Tex Pete said:

And they still can’t be bothered to rule correctly. 

Depends on what you mean by "corrrectly".

First things first: did the check clear?

[Nivek 17415]

15 hours ago, bullet said:

Some of you are seeing things through Burnt Orange tinted glasses.  You could see the knee down just as Jamison is pulling it out.  There is zero doubt it was right to overturn the fumble.  Absolute zero.  I hated it, but there was absolutely no question it was the right call.  Y'all sound like the TCU fans whining about how they got hosed the week before against UT.  They weren't watching the same game I was.

No, you said it was perfect and you could see it on TV.  It was not a perfect angle as the ball was not observable from the TV replay angles shown.  I believe it was the right call as well, but I also know that without seeing the ball, it is not possible to call it conclusive evidence.   Once again, you are reacting to something that was not said.    My shirt might be burnt orange but my glasses are clear.    And I am clearly seeing bias in officiating within the conference, and I can point to multiple incidents of it throughout the years not just some one-off event.      

[CowtownHorn 5126]

My son and I are headed down tomorrow morning for our first game of the season. Please tell me it will be a fair, hard-fought battle with the Pokes without any fuckery from the officials. Is that too much to ask? I guess we’ll fuck around and find out.

[BigHornedLurker 2176]

29 minutes ago, CowtownHorn said:

My son and I are headed down tomorrow morning for our first game of the season. Please tell me it will be a fair, hard-fought battle with the Pokes without any fuckery from the officials. Is that too much to ask? I guess we’ll fuck around and find out.

lets reset those expectations now. 

there will be a game, the weather will be nice, there will be points scored, and there will be ref-fuckery abound 

[ousux 5639]

But not as clear and obvious as the OU receiver being out of bounds

Or Coburns helmet being stripped off on the same play..

Or the fumble we recovered, yet even though Williams arm was still on the backstroke it was ruled an "incomplete forward pass"...when the ball spun behind him, not forward.

Those two moments alone led to 10 gooner points even if all the other bad calls/no calls are ignored.

[ousux 5639]

Both of these are true. I don’t buy the idea that the officials are in the tank for OU, but I do believe they see an “elite” team over and over and sort of get used to thinking that team isn’t fucking up on every single play. It’s kind of a blind spot more than bias. 

The problem is, even if we came into the game as the "elite team" (say we were undefeated and blowU lost to Kstate or something) I dont believe we get the same conscious or unconscious bias.

[ousux 5639]

Yep, notice the 11am kicks for the rest of this season (even though many are TBA yet, they will be made all 11am-- just watch it happen!). Hell, they'd make it 5am kicks if they could get away with it.  

The more the Big12 does this shit, the more it makes me happier for the SEC move BY THE DAY, and I was happy with it as soon as I heard it!  And, this bullshit treatment will help reinforce that this is our last Big12 season.

Fuck the Big12!

We all knew we would get the screwjob from Big12 officials after the SEC announcement, but it really hurts when it not only comes in our biggest conference game, but the only one with a chance of being called evenly since BlowU is also throwing up the double birds to the conference.

[txhorns 2421]

I don't believe that the Big 12 has instructed the refs to rule against Texas in any manner.  It's definitely possible that they have instructed refs to protect OU since they have been the conference's best playoff shot the last few years.

The problem for Texas is pretty simple, the talent pool that the refs are drawn from.  Most fans of college football in the Big 12 footprint either love or hate Texas.  Many of the fans who hate Texas blame Texas for a lot of their school's problems.  They find it funny when Texas gets fucked over, often chalking it up to karma.

So when the Big 12 picks refs they can't send Texas fans to ref Texas games, therefore, we get the refs who hate Texas.  At best we get a ref who is indifferent but there's bound to be at least one Texas hater on the crew, likely more.

[Nueces River Rat 5796]

3 hours ago, Tex Long said:

The number of reviews in XII football is ridiculously large compared with other conferences' officiating. The excessive length of the reviews is even worse. Hell, I thought we had a 2-minute rule put on reviews a while back: from the time the replay officials stop play to look at forty-eight different camera angles, they have two (2) minutes to overturnor uphold the field call, and no decision by that time is a "play stands as called" and spectators can quit wondering wtf and start spectating again. Did I imagine that, or was it just lip service?

Yep..   The game last Saturday went way too long...   I think Boise/BYU were well into the 1st qtr in the next time slot for the day when our game ended.

The number of reviews and time notwithstanding with how long it takes is all one needs to know the quality if crap. I think they had to call the replay booth two or three times last week just to confirm the spot.     

[dcar00 14974]

I applaud Sark for saying he wants another crack at them.  I'm sure he's thinking that everything had to go OU's way to lose, if they don't fuck up one of the calls, call obvious holding a couple of times or they don't overturn the fumble we win.  

what he doesn't understand/know about the Big 12 is a rematch with OU(1 loss or undefeated) at the end of the year with Big 12 in the playoff on the line will be the exact same situation with the exact same fuckery.

that said, I hope we get another crack at them.  starting with the game this week.

[Tex Long 4665]

Do refs screw OSU in Bedlam to the same extent?

[BigHornedLurker 2176]

6 minutes ago, Tex Long said:

Do refs screw OSU in Bedlam to the same extent?

probably depends on the records of the teams involved, same answer for the big12 championship 

i do think for whatever reason Texas is shouldering the realignment hate , and OU is getting the easy treatment