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Mo Horn

By Mo Horn
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PenelopeWitherspoon
PenelopeWitherspoon

I am cross posting the hell out of this.      

Walser
Walser

Those aren't mortuary trailers. They're Freedom Freezers.

Chooky
Chooky

Greg Abbott puts his pants on with one humiliating and degrading motion like you're shaking a pillow into a case and then he has to be rolled to one side to have everything buttoned and zipped and the

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elfenix

elfenix 34331

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6 minutes ago, Ag with kids said:

BTW...

EVERYONE is FREE to wear a mask.  There is no mandate to NOT wear one.

Mask up to your heart's content!!!  I don't care and neither does anyone else.

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workswithseed

workswithseed 2109

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, GRHorn said:

I agree that it should be left to local governments, where applicable. 
 

what’s cruel about this?

Vote with your feet, boss

Fuck that, let the people choose. Either the vax does or does not work, either way if you don't want to die, you had your choice. I don't get why so many people here want to be party of big government, but the fewer laws/mandates the better.

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hobbes2702

hobbes2702 13052

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36 minutes ago, Ag with kids said:

Can you show me where these entities were granted the power to mandate masks?  It has to be codified somewhere, right?

Because, all the government entities are granted their powers from the state gov't in Texas...

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ChuckNorrisActionJeans

ChuckNorrisActionJeans 2682

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Kids under 12 can't be vaccinated, and they tend to go to school, together.

The only protection they have is masks, and the hope that they aren't one of the unlucky ones to get this shit and have a negative outcome.  

But fuck kids and elementary schools/middle schools, right? Fuck public education altogether, I'm sure is part of the calculus, along with the general desperation of Abbott not to get primaried.   So pro-life. 

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Mrs Whiggins

Mrs Whiggins 13050

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1 minute ago, ChuckNorrisActionJeans said:

 I'm sure is part of the calculus, along with the general desperation of Abbott not...

wanting you to notice your energy bill. Or your insurance bill for that matter.

It's not like something could've been done while the Lege met about safeguarding the energy grid to proactively address a glaring omission.

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Updawg

Updawg 2286

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Gov. Greg Abbott has signed a bill into law that prohibits Texas cities from banning natural gas as a fuel source for new construction and utility services.

House Bill 17, which Abbott signed Tuesday according to the Texas Legislature’s online portal, is a response to a trend in progressive California cities. Abbott’s office did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

The bill’s sponsor, state Rep. Joe Deshotel, D-Beaumont, argued that banning natural gas would restrict consumer choices. Deshotel was not immediately available for comment Tuesday, but he previously told the Tribune that he filed the bill in response to “what is happening on the West coast” where cities have passed energy efficiency plans that prohibit new subdivisions from offering natural gas heating, requiring instead that new homes be heated by electricity.

https://www.texastribune.org/2021/05/18/texas-natural-gas-bans-climate-plans/

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Dahobbs

Dahobbs 17642

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41 minutes ago, Ag with kids said:

Can you show me where these entities were granted the power to mandate masks?  It has to be codified somewhere, right?

Because, all the government entities are granted their powers from the state gov't in Texas...

 

This was discussed earlier in some thread (maybe this one), but generally the county commissioners courts and county judges in Texas and have quite a bit of authority delegated to them by the legislature under a number of statutes. 

For starters, Chapter 418 of the Government Code (the Texas Disaster Act) is applicable here, although it isn't my area of practice (@Brisketexan is probably the best person to answer). 

418.108 provides, among other things:

"Sec. 418.108. DECLARATION OF LOCAL DISASTER.

(a) Except as provided by Subsection (e), the presiding officer of the governing body of a political subdivision may declare a local state of disaster. 

...

(f) The county judge or the mayor of a municipality may order the evacuation of all or part of the population from a stricken or threatened area under the jurisdiction and authority of the county judge or mayor if the county judge or mayor considers the action necessary for the preservation of life or other disaster mitigation, response, or recovery.

(g) The county judge or the mayor of a municipality may control ingress to and egress from a disaster area under the jurisdiction and authority of the county judge or mayor and control the movement of persons and the occupancy of premises in that area."

It wasn't Abbott's executive order that empowered the counties to issue mask mandates, but rather this independent statutory authority. What Abbott did do is issue an executive order under his authority that purported to preempt those requirements. He does have authority under the Chapter 418 to  suspend certain regulatory laws in some circumstances. And he generally has the authority to control the state's resources for emergency management purposes, and he argues that  includes overriding the county's power under 418.108. I'm not entirely convinced that is supported by the text of the statute. 

But, other sources of authority exist for the counties, including Chapters 121 and 122 of the Health and Safety Code, which among other things empower them to address threats to the public health and public health nuisances. In Chapter 341 of the Health and Safety Code, public health nuisance is defined a "an object, place, or condition that is a possible and probable medium of disease transmission to or between humans." 

Reference guide for you: https://www.county.org/TAC/media/TACMedia/About Texas Counties/Guide-to-Laws-2018.pdf

 

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 89775

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17 minutes ago, ChuckNorrisActionJeans said:

But fuck kids and elementary schools/middle schools, right? Fuck public education altogether, I'm sure is part of the calculus, along with the general desperation of Abbott not to get primaried.   So pro-life. 

All Abbott cares about is his primary.

Speaking of.

 

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DDD Dad

DDD Dad 14346

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30 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

Fuck that, let the people choose. Either the vax does or does not work, either way if you don't want to die, you had your choice. I don't get why so many people here want to be party of big government, but the fewer laws/mandates the better.

So a statewide mandate prohibiting local control constitutes smaller government?

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wildcat09

wildcat09 29365

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1 hour ago, Ag with kids said:

The local gov't only had the power to issue mandates because king Abbott granted it to them last year with his emergency EOs.

So, are you happy you have a king Abbott or mad you have a king Abbott?

Section 418.108 of the Texas Local Government Code grants the presiding officer of a governing body of a political subdivision the power to declare a local state of disaster. Once a local disaster is declared, Section 418.1015 grants such presiding officer(s) the same powers as are granted to the governor for statewide disasters.

These powers don't come from Abbott, they come from the legislature. 

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Biff Tannen

Biff Tannen 45702

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1 hour ago, Updawg said:

Gov. Greg Abbott has signed a bill into law that prohibits Texas cities from banning natural gas as a fuel source for new construction and utility services.

House Bill 17, which Abbott signed Tuesday according to the Texas Legislature’s online portal, is a response to a trend in progressive California cities. Abbott’s office did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

The bill’s sponsor, state Rep. Joe Deshotel, D-Beaumont, argued that banning natural gas would restrict consumer choices. Deshotel was not immediately available for comment Tuesday, but he previously told the Tribune that he filed the bill in response to “what is happening on the West coast” where cities have passed energy efficiency plans that prohibit new subdivisions from offering natural gas heating, requiring instead that new homes be heated by electricity.

https://www.texastribune.org/2021/05/18/texas-natural-gas-bans-climate-plans/

I'm actually for this in the short term, since my gas fireplace is what kept me from freezing to death for 6 straight days in February when our electrical grid shit the bed.  Oh wait, that was the Rs fault too.

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hobbes2702

hobbes2702 13052

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Posted
1 hour ago, Ag with kids said:

Can you show me where these entities were granted the power to mandate masks?  It has to be codified somewhere, right?

Because, all the government entities are granted their powers from the state gov't in Texas...

 

33 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

 

This was discussed earlier in some thread (maybe this one), but generally the county commissioners courts and county judges in Texas and have quite a bit of authority delegated to them by the legislature under a number of statutes. 

For starters, Chapter 418 of the Government Code (the Texas Disaster Act) is applicable here, although it isn't my area of practice (@Brisketexan is probably the best person to answer). 

418.108 provides, among other things:

"Sec. 418.108. DECLARATION OF LOCAL DISASTER.

(a) Except as provided by Subsection (e), the presiding officer of the governing body of a political subdivision may declare a local state of disaster. 

...

(f) The county judge or the mayor of a municipality may order the evacuation of all or part of the population from a stricken or threatened area under the jurisdiction and authority of the county judge or mayor if the county judge or mayor considers the action necessary for the preservation of life or other disaster mitigation, response, or recovery.

(g) The county judge or the mayor of a municipality may control ingress to and egress from a disaster area under the jurisdiction and authority of the county judge or mayor and control the movement of persons and the occupancy of premises in that area."

It wasn't Abbott's executive order that empowered the counties to issue mask mandates, but rather this independent statutory authority. What Abbott did do is issue an executive order under his authority that purported to preempt those requirements. He does have authority under the Chapter 418 to  suspend certain regulatory laws in some circumstances. And he generally has the authority to control the state's resources for emergency management purposes, and he argues that  includes overriding the county's power under 418.108. I'm not entirely convinced that is supported by the text of the statute. 

But, other sources of authority exist for the counties, including Chapters 121 and 122 of the Health and Safety Code, which among other things empower them to address threats to the public health and public health nuisances. In Chapter 341 of the Health and Safety Code, public health nuisance is defined a "an object, place, or condition that is a possible and probable medium of disease transmission to or between humans." 

Reference guide for you: https://www.county.org/TAC/media/TACMedia/About Texas Counties/Guide-to-Laws-2018.pdf

 

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wildcat09

wildcat09 29365

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2 minutes ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

False.  There is plenty of video evidence of maskless morons bitching out masked people for wearing masks.  You don't even have to go looking for it.

Bitching about people wearing masks has been basically the entirety of JD Vance's senate campaign so far, and it's clearly his very calculated attempt to seem like a normal blue collar conservative guy. A lot of conservatives care about it very much.

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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 29966

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1 hour ago, Dahobbs said:

 

This was discussed earlier in some thread (maybe this one), but generally the county commissioners courts and county judges in Texas and have quite a bit of authority delegated to them by the legislature under a number of statutes. 

For starters, Chapter 418 of the Government Code (the Texas Disaster Act) is applicable here, although it isn't my area of practice (@Brisketexan is probably the best person to answer). 

418.108 provides, among other things:

"Sec. 418.108. DECLARATION OF LOCAL DISASTER.

(a) Except as provided by Subsection (e), the presiding officer of the governing body of a political subdivision may declare a local state of disaster. 

...

(f) The county judge or the mayor of a municipality may order the evacuation of all or part of the population from a stricken or threatened area under the jurisdiction and authority of the county judge or mayor if the county judge or mayor considers the action necessary for the preservation of life or other disaster mitigation, response, or recovery.

(g) The county judge or the mayor of a municipality may control ingress to and egress from a disaster area under the jurisdiction and authority of the county judge or mayor and control the movement of persons and the occupancy of premises in that area."

It wasn't Abbott's executive order that empowered the counties to issue mask mandates, but rather this independent statutory authority. What Abbott did do is issue an executive order under his authority that purported to preempt those requirements. He does have authority under the Chapter 418 to  suspend certain regulatory laws in some circumstances. And he generally has the authority to control the state's resources for emergency management purposes, and he argues that  includes overriding the county's power under 418.108. I'm not entirely convinced that is supported by the text of the statute. 

But, other sources of authority exist for the counties, including Chapters 121 and 122 of the Health and Safety Code, which among other things empower them to address threats to the public health and public health nuisances. In Chapter 341 of the Health and Safety Code, public health nuisance is defined a "an object, place, or condition that is a possible and probable medium of disease transmission to or between humans." 

Reference guide for you: https://www.county.org/TAC/media/TACMedia/About Texas Counties/Guide-to-Laws-2018.pdf

 

Hey, man, that's not what he's hearing on the radio and on the TV.

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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 29966

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5 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

Yes, the people are smaller than their local government. They can wear if they want, but less police force on individuals is better.  

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As my world fades away, at least let me keep my slogans! They can take our lives, but they will never take...our...SLOGANS!

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Bookman

Bookman 4639

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Posted
2 hours ago, Ag with kids said:

Can you show me where these entities were granted the power to mandate masks?  It has to be codified somewhere, right?

Because, all the government entities are granted their powers from the state gov't in Texas...

Well no, it could just be a statute.

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Ag with kids

Ag with kids 581

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1 hour ago, wildcat09 said:

Section 418.108 of the Texas Local Government Code grants the presiding officer of a governing body of a political subdivision the power to declare a local state of disaster. Once a local disaster is declared, Section 418.1015 grants such presiding officer(s) the same powers as are granted to the governor for statewide disasters.

These powers don't come from Abbott, they come from the legislature. 

Can they declare the disaster ad infinitum?

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Ag with kids

Ag with kids 581

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Posted
1 hour ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

False.  There is plenty of video evidence of maskless morons bitching out masked people for wearing masks.  You don't even have to go looking for it.

There is plenty of video evidence of masked morons bitching out non-masked people for not wearing masking.  You don't even have to go looking for it.

What's your point?  People are assholes.

Persons tend not to be...

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Hank Scorpio

Hank Scorpio 17729

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6 minutes ago, Ag with kids said:

Can they declare the disaster ad infinitum?

Yes. The county judge can declare a mega disaster that never ends. Sorry, that was a flippant little joke, quit saying stupid fucking shit pretending to “just be asking questions” you imbecile. 

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GRHorn

GRHorn 105

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2 hours ago, 4th&Five said:

Bingo. My 9yo can’t be vaxxed so it’d be great if the district could have the kids wear masks. 

To younger kids Covid is less dangerous than the flu. Should they have to wear masks from here on out to protect each other against the flu? Gimme a break.
 

The protecting grandma reason is gone. 

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gmr548

gmr548 16592

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The local gov't only had the power to issue mandates because king Abbott granted it to them last year with his emergency EOs.
So, are you happy you have a king Abbott or mad you have a king Abbott?

Lmao aggy
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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 29966

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16 minutes ago, Jive Turkey said:

 

it's always one roll forward, two rolls back.

Goddamn. Exactly what do we have to be proud of as Texans? 

Bunch of needle dicks carrying around autorifles and shouting lies repeatedly. What kind of a man has to proclaim his manliness in a group exercise with the other needle dicks?

Democratic Texas was a unique mix of individualism and willingness to pick somebody up if they were down. It was about looking at something, anything, as square as you could and calling it what you saw. Now it's a charade where a few of remember echoes of what was. 

I'm a suburban boy. Not a cowboy. Not a gun totin' killer. I did work the oilfields in my youth. The hard scrabble past and unique brand of humor in the face of a truth could still be heard from time to time. Now we're about 65% Anywhere, USA. That's the goddamn fact.

The best possibilty for Texas is the growing influence of Mexican and other south of the border ethnicities here. It's part of the original fabric of the state and probably at the heart of Texan friendliness. 

I'm about four beers in plus a couple of pain pills (goddamn back). My focus is not optimal. But the sentiment is real. 

When I discovered Hornfans back in '99, I was in California. I became very emotional reading familiar voices and the distinct brand of humor our state has (all states have their own varieties of the virtues we think are unique to us. It's really matter of nuance.) based in a sense of the absurd.

Somewhere in there, a poster started a thread about a friend at Swarthmore who'd written a very articulate and logical letter about what a waste college football was and how he was glad Swarthmore had no team. The person starting the thread asked for advice on answering the letter on the Texas Longhorn football board.

Early on, somebody reponded, "that's really a good argument. I think the only thing you can do is kick him in the nuts and call him a fag."

That sentiment was echoed for pages with twists and tweaks. I nearly passed out laughing.

I guess it reminds me also of George Forman's story about fighting Ali in Africa. As Foreman was wearing out, Ali asked him, "Is that all you got?"

Foreman kinda tilts his head recounting the moment, "Yeah, that's about all I got."

Truth. Truth. Truth. Cut to the core and face it.

Texans, of course, weren't the only ones doing it. Everywhere you go you find humor, courage, and virtue. The Texan flavor of all of that was special. I hate to see it fade away and be replaced to adherence to Big Lies and nostalgia about things that never existed.

Have a good night. I believe I will turn more to drinking and less to writing.

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GRHorn

GRHorn 105

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Posted
9 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

To younger kids Covid is less dangerous than the flu. Should they have to wear masks from here on out to protect each other against the flu? Gimme a break.
 

The protecting grandma reason is gone. 

Cmon @4th&Five. You have no viable rebuttal so you can only neg? That’s a sad scene. 
 

Should kids be forced to wear masks every flu season?

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4th&Five

4th&Five 41577

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It’s pointless to rehash that argument with a moron. I don’t really want to take the chance of my 9yo being a long haul Covid victim before she can get the shot. She can get a flu shot so it doesn’t really worry me too much. 

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23481

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, 4th&Five said:

It’s pointless to rehash that argument with a moron. I don’t really want to take the chance of my 9yo being a long haul Covid victim before she can get the shot. She can get a flu shot so it doesn’t really worry me too much. 

Long covid (post-acute sequelae of COVID/PASC) is an interesting phenomena. We don't really know much about it. It's curious that historically there has never been much discussion around long flu, but maybe there should be. And maybe we should contrast PASC and PASI to try to really understand the issue. 

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CooterBrown

CooterBrown 18022

Posted
Posted
It’s pointless to rehash that argument with a moron. I don’t really want to take the chance of my 9yo being a long haul Covid victim before she can get the shot. She can get a flu shot so it doesn’t really worry me too much. 

If you’re in Austin, ARC and Benchmark are still signing kids up for Pfizer trials for age 5-12. We did the first phone screening today with Benchmark for my 8YO and will do a final one next week, then the first shot. For this trial, 2/3 get the vaccine so the odds are better than the older age group trials.
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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 89775

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

To younger kids Covid is less dangerous than the flu. Should they have to wear masks from here on out to protect each other against the flu? Gimme a break.
The protecting grandma reason is gone. 

6 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

Cmon @4th&Five. You have no viable rebuttal so you can only neg? That’s a sad scene. 
Should kids be forced to wear masks every flu season?

How about this:  We all act like responsible parents and we all respect that other parents have lives and that not everybody can take off from work at the drop of a hat, and so we don't send our sick kids to school.

Every morning, check your kid for symptoms of illnesses and a fever.

If they have something that clearly isn't allergies, then keep them the fuck home, rather than send them to school, and thereby getting other kids sick, who then pass it on to their parents, whether it's the cold or the flu or whatever.  I've gotten sick so many fucking times from my kids, who caught something at school.

My wife taught for years, and still works in the district, and the amount of parents who sent their clearly sick kids to school pre-covid screenings was ridiculous.

There's a Surly poster whose wife is a school nurse, and she has the same stories of parents thinking they are being clever by giving the kids something to knock their fever down, etc. just so they could get them out of the house and to school.

Do the asymptomatic kids slip through the cracks and make it to school?  Yes.  Do the kids who clearly have a cold or flu make it to school?  No.

 

 

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GW Hayduke

GW Hayduke 1953

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Can a Texas governor suspend statutes by executive order? I don’t recall seeing it before.
 

From his order:

 

To the extent necessary to ensure that local governmental entities or officials do not impose any such face-covering requirements, I hearby suspend the following:
a. Sections 418.1015(b) and 418.108 of the Texas Government Code;
b. Chapter 81, Subchapter E of the Texas Health and Safety Code;
c. Chapters 121, 122, and 341 of the Texas Health and Safety Code;
d. Chapter 54 of the Texas Local Government Code; and
e. any other statute invoked by any local governmental entity or official in support of a face-covering requirement.

 

 

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Dahobbs

Dahobbs 17642

Posted
Posted
36 minutes ago, Ag with kids said:

Can they declare the disaster ad infinitum?

Under the law, yes. They have to renew the declaration regularly, but there is no absolute limit. I provided the law to you. You're free to read it yourself. There may be some judicially defined limits in instances where no actual emergency exists. But you're not going to get very far with the argument during a pandemic that has killed over 600,000 in the US alone. 

Now, if you ask me, the state legislature should not have delegated this extensive of authority to other entities. But that is a different question as to whether the authority exists.  

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Dahobbs

Dahobbs 17642

Posted
Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, GW Hayduke said:

Can a Texas governor suspend statutes by executive order? I don’t recall seeing it before.
 

From his order:

 

To the extent necessary to ensure that local governmental entities or officials do not impose any such face-covering requirements, I hearby suspend the following:
a. Sections 418.1015(b) and 418.108 of the Texas Government Code;
b. Chapter 81, Subchapter E of the Texas Health and Safety Code;
c. Chapters 121, 122, and 341 of the Texas Health and Safety Code;
d. Chapter 54 of the Texas Local Government Code; and
e. any other statute invoked by any local governmental entity or official in support of a face-covering requirement.

 

 

Certain regulatory statutes, yes. It isn't an infinite power and has a variety of preconditions. I don't believe that power has near the scope that Abbott's order suggests. 

Edited by Dahobbs
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