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The Robert Mueller Investigation

Hugo Stiglitz

By Hugo Stiglitz
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notre dame joe

notre dame joe 187

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Horn Dog said:

Which would you prefer:

1.  A president who is corruptable by a foreign government, but who’s corruption would require an elaborate scheme of overcoming that person’s natural loyalty to his country utilizing sophisticated mental manipulation. This president would have to consider all the logical arguments for or against his actions, and although he ends up choosing the wrong path, there is a true rational and intelligent pathway to his decision tree and an actual point at which he decides to betray his government . 

2.  A president who is so clueless and manipulatable that a foreign government doesn’t even have to convince or coordinate with him in any way in order to get what they want?  Kinda  like Forest Gump at a peace rally...no clue what is actually happening but happy to play his part without question...and without any ”collusion”.

1.  The mole is way less dangerous than the star struck dopes like Harry Hopkins.  1 moves slowly to cover his tracks while 2 exuberantly gives away the store.  Even if the talking point posts have an element of truth, Trump has been hard on Russia while Obama is a foreign powers' dream President. 

Edited by notre dame joe
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Goredho
Goredho

Just to make sure I have the alternative facts straight...  Our government -- but I'm guessing only the deep state part of it --- is now guilty of torturing a poor, naive Russian exchange student who

Incredulity
Incredulity

liberals suddenly being terrified of Russia and manic for election integrity is just pure comedy gold.

Chooky
Chooky

I don't believe for a moment that any of this is entertaining to you.  I think it gives you a bit of anxiety knowing that your best weapon against a group who you despise is a bumbling fraud as a busi

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retread

retread 2,951

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 minute ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

The difference is in 1998 Congress was handed over everything immediately including grand jury testimony. 

Nadler wanted Congress to do a better job of protecting the innocent with redactions.

That tweet is misleading propaganda bullshit. 

Get the distorted 'facts' out there as red meat for the 40%. /trumpplaybook

Edited by retread
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Dahobbs

Dahobbs 17,534

Posted
Posted (edited)
18 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Please show me one negative thing Trump has said about Putin.

I read that post. I just assumed he meant "has hard on for Russia." It never occurred to me that any life form above a sea slug could actually think that Trump has been hard on Russia. 

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31,451

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44 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

The difference is in 1998 Congress was handed over everything immediately including grand jury testimony. 

Nadler wanted Congress to do a better job of protecting the innocent with redactions.

That tweet is misleading propaganda bullshit. 

Because the statute at that time provided that the Independent Counsel "shall advise the House of Representatives of any substantial and credible information which such independent counsel receives, in carrying out the independent counsel’s responsibilities under this chapter, that may constitute grounds for an impeachment."

Whereas, with respect to the report:

(h) Reports by Independent Counsel.—

(1)Required reports.—An independent counsel shall—(A)

file with the division of the court, with respect to the 6-month period beginning on the date of his or her appointment, and with respect to each 6-month period thereafter until the office of that independent counsel terminates, a report which identifies and explains major expenses, and summarizes all other expenses, incurred by that office during the 6-month period with respect to which the report is filed, and estimates future expenses of that office; and

(B)

before the termination of the independent counsel’s office under section 596(b), file a final report with the division of the court, setting forth fully and completely a description of the work of the independent counsel, including the disposition of all cases brought.

(2)Disclosure of information in reports.—

The division of the court may release to the Congress, the public, or any appropriate person, such portions of a report made under this subsection as the division of the court considers appropriate. The division of the court shall make such orders as are appropriate to protect the rights of any individual named in such report and to prevent undue interference with any pending prosecution. The division of the court may make any portion of a final report filed under paragraph (1)(B) available to any individual named in such report for the purposes of receiving within a time limit set by the division of the court any comments or factual information that such individual may submit. Such comments and factual information, in whole or in part, may, in the discretion of the division of the court, be included as an appendix to such final report.

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GW Hayduke

GW Hayduke 1,953

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5 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Because the statute at that time provided that the Independent Counsel "shall advise the House of Representatives of any substantial and credible information which such independent counsel receives, in carrying out the independent counsel’s responsibilities under this chapter, that may constitute grounds for an impeachment."

Whereas, with respect to the report:

(h) Reports by Independent Counsel.—

(1)Required reports.—An independent counsel shall—(A)

file with the division of the court, with respect to the 6-month period beginning on the date of his or her appointment, and with respect to each 6-month period thereafter until the office of that independent counsel terminates, a report which identifies and explains major expenses, and summarizes all other expenses, incurred by that office during the 6-month period with respect to which the report is filed, and estimates future expenses of that office; and

(B)

before the termination of the independent counsel’s office under section 596(b), file a final report with the division of the court, setting forth fully and completely a description of the work of the independent counsel, including the disposition of all cases brought.

(2)Disclosure of information in reports.—

The division of the court may release to the Congress, the public, or any appropriate person, such portions of a report made under this subsection as the division of the court considers appropriate. The division of the court shall make such orders as are appropriate to protect the rights of any individual named in such report and to prevent undue interference with any pending prosecution. The division of the court may make any portion of a final report filed under paragraph (1)(B) available to any individual named in such report for the purposes of receiving within a time limit set by the division of the court any comments or factual information that such individual may submit. Such comments and factual information, in whole or in part, may, in the discretion of the division of the court, be included as an appendix to such final report.

?

And the tweet is still misleading propaganda.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31,451

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The impeachment information may have been transmitted to the HJC, as required by the statute.

The report, however, to the extent it constitutes different information, was made public and to Congress simultaneously.

I'm not hugely interested in playing word games about politicians tweets.

But the laws were different then than they are now.  They probably ought to come to the same or a similar result, ultimately, but that doesn't mean you don't go through the process called for by the law.

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GW Hayduke

GW Hayduke 1,953

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37 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

The impeachment information may have been transmitted to the HJC, as required by the statute.

The report, however, to the extent it constitutes different information, was made public and to Congress simultaneously.

I'm not hugely interested in playing word games about politicians tweets.

But the laws were different then than they are now.  They probably ought to come to the same or a similar result, ultimately, but that doesn't mean you don't go through the process called for by the law.

@PolishPatriotTM isn’t a politician 

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Winona's Big Orange Bevo

Winona's Big Orange Bevo 197

Posted
Posted
20 hours ago, Horn Dog said:

Which would you prefer:

1.  A president who is corruptable by a foreign government, but who’s corruption would require an elaborate scheme of overcoming that person’s natural loyalty to his country utilizing sophisticated mental manipulation. This president would have to consider all the logical arguments for or against his actions, and although he ends up choosing the wrong path, there is a true rational and intelligent pathway to his decision tree and an actual point at which he decides to betray his government . 

2.  A president who is so clueless and manipulatable that a foreign government doesn’t even have to convince or coordinate with him in any way in order to get what they want?  Kinda  like Forest Gump at a peace rally...no clue what is actually happening but happy to play his part without question...and without any ”collusion”.

[trumpster] whynotboth.gif [trumpster]

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Horn Under a Bad Sign

Horn Under a Bad Sign 20,395

Posted
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2 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

The women around Paul Manfort seem to have exceptional taste in men.

 

Yohai is the crazy fuck who got mixed up with Dustin Hoffman in a ponzi scheme.  He and Manafort's daughter were sued over a 14 million dollar real estate scam.

https://www.entitymag.com/paul-manaforts-daughter-jessica-manafort-jeffrey-yohai-sued-14-million-real-estate-deals/

 

Virtually nothing in Manafort's life was legitimate. Even his daughter and son-in-law are con artists. 

 

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23,367

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WASHINGTON — Some of Robert S. Mueller III’s investigators have told associates that Attorney General William P. Barr failed to adequately portray the findings of their inquiry and that they were more troubling for President Trump than Mr. Barr indicated, according to government officials and others familiar with their simmering frustrations.

At stake in the dispute — the first evidence of tension between Mr. Barr and the special counsel’s office — is who shapes the public’s initial understanding of one of the most consequential government investigations in American history. Some members of Mr. Mueller’s team are concerned that, because Mr. Barr created the first narrative of the special counsel’s findings, Americans’ views will have hardened before the investigation’s conclusions become public.

Mr. Barr has said he would move quickly to release the nearly 400-page report but needed time to scrub out confidential information. The special counsel’s investigators had already written multiple summaries of the report, and some team members believe that Mr. Barr should have included more of their material in the four-page letter he wrote on March 24 laying out their main conclusions, according to government officials familiar with the investigation. Mr. Barr only briefly cited the special counsel’s work in his letter.

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23,367

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Perhaps Trump is so beholden to Putin because deep down Trump knows he never would have been elected without Putin’s help and he’s Trump’s only hope at re-election. 

If Trump is so confident in his ability to win elections without Kremlin interference wouldn’t Trump tell Putin to fuck off and quit casting doubt on his legitimacy?  There’s never been any kind of pushback like that.

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Biff Tannen

Biff Tannen 45,675

Posted
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1 hour ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Some members of Mr. Mueller’s team are concerned that, because Mr. Barr created the first narrative of the special counsel’s findings, Americans’ views will have hardened before the investigation’s conclusions become public.

They didn't see this fucking coming?  

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Patron

Patron 230

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Posted
1 hour ago, retread said:

New Barr same as the old Barr.

Honestly, I think they're just dancing as fast as they can right now. There's no way out. They took a shot and they missed.
 

They were banking on being able to sway public opinion with Barr's misleading "summary that's not a summary" in their direction, alleging there's really nothing to see here, move along, move along, before the full report was released.

Didn't work.

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Horn Dog

Horn Dog 9,818

Posted
Posted

Que the “I’d like to see Trump get out of this mess unscathed” meme.

They really should make a 80’s style TV series out of the Trump Presidency.  Every week he gets is some kooky mess and then escapes in the nick of time.  Like a modern day Dukes of Hazzard.

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triplehorn

triplehorn 2,664

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WASHINGTON — Some of Robert S. Mueller III’s investigators have told associates that Attorney General William P. Barr failed to adequately portray the findings of their inquiry and that they were more troubling for President Trump than Mr. Barr indicated, according to government officials and others familiar with their simmering frustrations. 

I wonder how much more troubling for Trump the actual Mueller report is.  However "simmering frustrations" kind of speaks for itself.

Back on March 24th, I saw this series of tweets, which I'm now more inclined to take as legitimate:

 

Spoiler

 

The US Attorney General is the people's lawyer, not the president's.  I am so pissed.

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23,367

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12 minutes ago, Horn Dog said:

Que the “I’d like to see Trump get out of this mess unscathed” meme.

They really should make a 80’s style TV series out of the Trump Presidency.  Every week he gets is some kooky mess and then escapes in the nick of time.  Like a modern day Dukes of Hazzard.

While I have no doubt Trump will escape virtually unscathed politically, the Mueller report narrative of the Russian Interference and Trump’s unwitting participation in it should be harsh if a conclusion is made explaining it.  

Trump’s behavior during the 2016 campaign couldn’t have been scripted better by the Kremlin.  Trump running around screaming “Wikileaks! Emails! Wikileaks! Emails!”...also Trump asking Russia to hack Hillary...also Trump saying everything is rigged (like Russia)... also Trump protecting Russia by denying and discrediting those claiming their involvement... also Trump negotiating a secret real estate deal with the Russian government while all this is going on.

That’s just what is publicly known.  I wonder how the Mueller report is going to spin it.  Trump’s behavior was instrumental in the Russian attack, even if unintentionally. 

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triplehorn

triplehorn 2,664

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Posted

oh yeah, about those Mueller prosecutors leaving the team a few weeks ago:

and

 

---> It sounds like Mueller investigators already wrote multiple summaries with the express purpose of having them ready to deliver to Congress sans redactions and other need for formal review before release.  So yes, it's very helpful for House Judiciary to now know those exist and can specifically request them.

 

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ChiTownDoc

ChiTownDoc 21,152

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Horn Dog said:

Que the “I’d like to see Trump get out of this mess unscathed” meme.

They really should make a 80’s style TV series out of the Trump Presidency.  Every week he gets is some kooky mess and then escapes in the nick of time.  Like a modern day Dukes of Hazzard.

Or a scooby doo remake, except every single time they pull the mask off the swamp creature, it’s Trump.   

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31,451

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Posted

Something seems weird about that.  As leak-conscious and controlling as Mueller is, "sub-reports" and "summaries" prepared by someone other than Mueller pose the risk of undermining Mueller"s Report as much as anything else.

Most legal drafters that know their work is going to be scrutinized probably want to destroy drafts and prevent any sort of "subdocument" from being attributed to their team, precisely because it creates a whole other realm of second-guessing and unwanted-inference-drawing, which is going to be bad enough with the main Report itself.

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