The Robert Mueller Investigation

[TornACL 7698]

 

1 minute ago, Incredulity said:

Propose a solution then.  

Anything proposed by anyone even perceived to be a conservative will be followed with the above sanctimonious crap.

 

Indicting "Guccifer" is window dressing at best.  Does nothing to fix the problem. 

 

Why don't we let the investigation play out, genius.

[TornACL 7698]

Just now, Pig Bellmont said:

The Congressional candidate was Nunes. 100%. 

LOL oh god please let that be true.

[Mojo Hand 4580]

Just now, Huckleberry said:

Let's play a game called "How transparent is Incredulity"?

In Act I, he just asks a question on if Voter ID laws would help:

Then multiple point out how stupid that question is for the obvious reason.

 

Incredulity completely ignores his leading question being destroyed by logic and starts calling out EVIL LIBERALS.

Then Incredulity later posts that we can't do anything about election integrity because THE EVIL LIBERALS will start calling names.

In short, he's very transparent.

What's striking to me is how illogical the entire line of attack is.   It's reasonable to say that Dems didn't take Russia seriously enough as a threat in 2012.   It's absurd to argue, as Incredulity and others do, that Dems are as a result unjustified in taking them very seriously now, after they invaded Crimea and attacked us through this intelligence operation on our elections.   And it's even more absurd to argue this in defense of the GOP not only taking Russia less seriously, but completely rolling over for them, after these events. 

It's also absurd to compare the Dems lack of concern over a virtually non-existent problem with people showing up at the polls to vote under someone else's name — particularly given the intended consequences of stringent voter ID laws on legitimate voter turnout — with Dems being concerned over actual evidence that Russia hacked systems that would allow them to unregister voters en masse.   Different concerns, different evidence. 

But it's not about logic.   It's about being happy that Russia has done these things to help their side and helping cover for them. 

[Huckleberry 32859]

1 minute ago, Incredulity said:

Propose a solution then.  

Anything proposed by anyone even perceived to be a conservative will be followed with the above sanctimonious crap.

 

Indicting "Guccifer" is window dressing at best.  Does nothing to fix the problem. 

 

Well I'm a conservative and I know that voter ID laws will do absolutely nothing to help with this issue. The keys to not being followed with sanctimonious crap when proposing a solution as a conservative are:

1. Actually be a conservative, not a mindless (R)bot.
2. Propose a solution that has anything to do with the problem.
3. Propose a solution that isn't mind-numbingly stupid and easily shown to be pointless.

For example, one solution to our voter databases being hacked by foreign operatives is to indict the foreign operatives and then indict and convict any domestic co-conspirators. What is not a solution is saying that the first step in that process is window dressing at best. Such a statement merely reveals one's own prejudices and unwillingness to address the problem.

[4th&Five 41536]

2 minutes ago, Mapache said:

The collusion has been right out front the whole time

 

[GSU&UT 1798]

1 minute ago, TornACL said:

LOL oh god please let that be true.

There's no question he's been into some kind of very dirty shit given how he attempted to undermine the House investigation at every step.

[TwiceHorn 31458]

Like Biff, I'm a little disappointed by the indictment.  It's great that it lays bare a Russian conspiracy to affect the election, but it's a total bummer that this particular indictment will go exactly nowhere.

[Incredulity 11669]

2 minutes ago, TornACL said:

 

Why don't we let the investigation play out, genius.

I haven't said word one that it should stop.

However, firing blanks at foreign nationals with indictments isn't a good look, if the conclusion is taking down the Trump Administration.

[TornACL 7698]

Just now, GSU&UT said:

There's no question he's been into some kind of very dirty shit given how he attempted to undermine the House investigation at every step.

I would think so as well. He's either an incredibly foolish risk-taker or he's got personal skin in the game. He pushed his chips all in from the get go.

[Degenerate Gardner 4085]

4 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

The Congressional candidate was Nunes. 100%. 

Dark horse is Matt Gaetz IMO.

[GSU&UT 1798]

 

[Ghost of LL 15531]

6 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

Propose a solution then.  

Anything proposed by anyone even perceived to be a conservative will be followed with the above sanctimonious crap.

 

Indicting "Guccifer" is window dressing at best.  Does nothing to fix the problem. 

 

Same-day voter registration, by which a voter going to the pools who is not registered can vote if s/he (1) produces a valid id, and (2) signs an affidavit attesting to the fact that s/he lives at the address reflected in the id.  That way, if the Russians have expunged the voter from the registration rolls, that hacking can be undone in a matter of minutes.

Front a voting booth standpoint, there's no reason why each voting booth's metadata can't be preserved.  Or even better--don't hook voting booths up to the internet at all.  Download all votes onto a flash drive that are then hand-delivered to the county clerk for tabulation.

[Mapache 1117]

3 minutes ago, GSU&UT said:

 

 

Hehe Beavis, the indictment said....shit post 

[TwiceHorn 31458]

5 minutes ago, GSU&UT said:

 

That's comical.  Unfortunately, it isn't in the indictment.  Not sure what that's from.

[retread 2951]

Sens. Schiff and Warner calling for the cancellation of the Russia meeting. 

[maninblack 7974]

Have the memes been released? I'm curious if they were any good.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

I love felony Friday 

[TexEx15 17515]

So for all those whom would argue Trump didn’t really mean for Russia to find the emails, when he said as candidate for POTUS, that he hopes they find the missing emails, how do they reconcile those beliefs when they go off about the FBI texts between folks having an affair and how that wasn’t just shitty pillow talk but they really meant to take down Trump. Can’t have it both ways.

[Message Board User 12395]

Is Trump still going to meet with Big Daddy Vlad with nobody else in the room?

 After this?

[deech 2275]

Congressional Candidate is rumored to be Brian Mast from Florida.

[Huckleberry 32859]

23 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Like Biff, I'm a little disappointed by the indictment.  It's great that it lays bare a Russian conspiracy to affect the election, but it's a total bummer that this particular indictment will go exactly nowhere.

Did you miss the part where the indictment details communication and cooperation between the Russians and someone close to Trump as well as a Congressional candidate? Or do you just think that they're done with those strings and won't be unraveling them any further? You're the one with experience in the legal system, explain to me why those mean nothing and will go nowhere.

[27-25 2047]

4 minutes ago, TexEx15 said:

So for all those whom would argue Trump didn’t really mean for Russia to find the emails, when he said as candidate for POTUS, that he hopes they find the missing emails, how do they reconcile those beliefs when they go off about the FBI texts between folks having an affair and how that wasn’t just shitty pillow talk but they really meant to take down Trump. Can’t have it both ways.

Pillow talk?  Is that like locker room talk?  That's only allowed for one side apparently.

[TwiceHorn 31458]

Just now, Huckleberry said:

Did you miss the part where the indictment details communication and cooperation between the Russians and someone close to Trump as well as a Congressional candidate? Or do you just think that they're done with those strings and won't be unraveling them any further? You're the one with experience in the legal system, explain to me why those mean nothing and will go nowhere.

I was speaking in terms of this indictment, not things you might infer from it.  Kind of like it says.

[TornACL 7698]

1 minute ago, Huckleberry said:

Did you miss the part where the indictment details communication and cooperation between the Russians and someone close to Trump as well as a Congressional candidate? Or do you just think that they're done with those strings and won't be unraveling them any further? You're the one with experience in the legal system, explain to me why those mean nothing and will go nowhere.

It's like a "to be continued..." at the end of a particularly good tv episode.

Fuck yeah I can't wait until next week.

[Mapache 1117]

 

[Huckleberry 32859]

1 minute ago, TwiceHorn said:

I was speaking in terms of this indictment, not things you might infer from it.  Kind of like it says.

To be fair, "won't go anywhere" isn't very specific in its scope.

[GSU&UT 1798]

19 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

That's comical.  Unfortunately, it isn't in the indictment.  Not sure what that's from.

International meme community wasn't a dead giveaway? 😆

[TwiceHorn 31458]

2 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

To be fair, "won't go anywhere" isn't very specific in its scope.

"This particular indictment will go exactly nowhere" is pretty specific.

 

It will be interesting to see if the congresscritter gets indicted or Stone or whomever said "pretty standard."

Edited July 13, 2018 by TwiceHorn

[Skyline 325]

26 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

I haven't said word one that it should stop.

However, firing blanks at foreign nationals with indictments isn't a good look, if the conclusion is taking down the Trump Administration.

You’re assuming the conclusion is to take down Trump. It’s to find if there were any links between Russians and Americans when it comes to meddling with our elections. If you think the bar is literally “Trump or bust” then you’re frankly mistaken. 

[Brisketexan 105123]

28 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

I haven't said word one that it should stop.

However, firing blanks at foreign nationals with indictments isn't a good look, if the conclusion is taking down the Trump Administration.

 

4 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Did you miss the part where the indictment details communication and cooperation between the Russians and someone close to Trump as well as a Congressional candidate? Or do you just think that they're done with those strings and won't be unraveling them any further? You're the one with experience in the legal system, explain to me why those mean nothing and will go nowhere.

 

3 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

I was speaking in terms of this indictment, not things you might infer from it.  Kind of like it says.

The indictment isn't an end.  It's a means.  It lets American folks know what Mueller knows....well, SOME of what he knows.  Mueller has pumped some smoke into the structure.  The play is not to get the folks he indicted.  The play is to watch and see what the rats in the building do.  Do they run?  Do they call each other in a panic?  Do they come to him, looking to make a deal?  The indictment isn't a scoring play.  It's a set-up play.

[zork 629]

I haven't read much about the revelations from Rosenstein's press party today but while scanning the posts on this thread today I saw no mention of the quote in the tweet above.  Is that quote significant, is it wrong?  Surely it is just one indictment of an avalanche to follow?

[Huckleberry 32859]

2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

"This particular indictment will go exactly nowhere" is pretty specific.

 

It will be interesting to see if the congresscritter gets indicted or Stone or whomever said "pretty standard."

If you want to get in a pedantic semantics argument, I'm your man.

And again, no, it's not specific. "This particular indictment will yield zero convictions" is specific. "(W)ill go exactly nowhere" is not specific at all. Because leading to further investigation, indictments, etc. is going somewhere. 

[TornACL 7698]

As before, the use of "in this indictment" is the key.

[Mojo Hand 4580]

Just now, zork said:

I haven't read much about the revelations from Rosenstein's press party today but while scanning the posts on this thread today I saw no mention of the quote in the tweet above.  Is that quote significant, is it wrong?  Surely it is just one indictment of an avalanche to follow?

The key words are "in this indictment."

[TwiceHorn 31458]

1 minute ago, Brisketexan said:

 

 

The indictment isn't an end.  It's a means.  It lets American folks know what Mueller knows....well, SOME of what he knows.  Mueller has pumped some smoke into the structure.  The play is not to get the folks he indicted.  The play is to watch and see what the rats in the building do.  Do they run?  Do they call each other in a panic?  Do they come to him, looking to make a deal?  The indictment isn't a scoring play.  It's a set-up play.

I understand that.  Rather than a set-up, I think it's more of a public service.  File a nearly useless indictment to let the public know what is/was going on.  Also to deflect some heat from the Office of Special Counsel.

[TwiceHorn 31458]

1 minute ago, Huckleberry said:

If you want to get in a pedantic semantics argument, I'm your man.

And again, no, it's not specific. "This particular indictment will yield zero convictions" is specific. "(W)ill go exactly nowhere" is not specific at all. Because leading to further investigation, indictments, etc. is going somewhere. 

To me, an indictment means an arrest, an arraignment, a trial or plea bargain on the charges set forth in the indictment.  It is the initiation of the criminal process.  None of that will happen here.  Which is what I meant about "this particular indictment."  Is it a sign of progress or action, sure, but this particular indictment is going exactly nowhere.

[ShaggyBevo RIP 3868]

2 hours ago, Biff Tannen said:

If that's true and that's what today is about, I honestly don't give a fuck.  We know Russia fucked with us.  Indicting them doesn't make a shit.  It's not like they are going to be extradited.  Start fucking indicting the American players.  We can actually do something about that.

They can never go to any non Russia controlled/friendly country the rest of their lives as they'd be extradited to the U.S. Plus they likely get 'erased' for expediency. But being publicly named makes that a bit stickier for Putin.

Edited July 13, 2018 by ShaggyBevo RIP

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

6 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

 

 

The indictment isn't an end.  It's a means.  It lets American folks know what Mueller knows....well, SOME of what he knows.  Mueller has pumped some smoke into the structure.  The play is not to get the folks he indicted.  The play is to watch and see what the rats in the building do.  Do they run?  Do they call each other in a panic?  Do they come to him, looking to make a deal?  The indictment isn't a scoring play.  It's a set-up play.

This. 

It’s putting the confederates on fucking notice.

[Pig Bellmont 8717]

2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

I understand that.  Rather than a set-up, I think it's more of a public service.  File a nearly useless indictment to let the public know what is/was going on.  Also to deflect some heat from the Office of Special Counsel.

lol naming the 12 Russian military intelligence officers who were directly involved in this scandal is just a “nearly useless indictment”. Ok buddy. 

[TwiceHorn 31458]

Just now, ShaggyBevo RIP said:

They can never go to any non Russia controlled/friendly country the rest of their lives as they'd be arrested.

They can't while the indictment is pending or an international arrest warrant is pending.  That won't go on forever.

[Post Oak 20213]

4 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

The key words are "in this indictment."

She should be smarter than that.  Of course shes probably just playing to the Incredulity crowd

[zork 629]

5 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

The key words are "in this indictment."

What does that mean in the overall context of the investigation that is public?

[TwiceHorn 31458]

Just now, Pig Bellmont said:

lol naming the 12 Russian military intelligence officers who were directly involved in this scandal is just a “nearly useless indictment”. Ok buddy. 

Are you retarded?  I acknowledged the public effect of it.  To think that those military intelligence officers will ever stand trial or have evidence offered against them is dumb.  One could issue a public interim report to the same effect.

[qwertyu1234 496]

This investigation is taking forever. What's the endgame here?

[Incredulity 11669]

2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

I understand that.  Rather than a set-up, I think it's more of a public service.  File a nearly useless indictment to let the public know what is/was going on.  Also to deflect some heat from the Office of Special Counsel.

This.

He might as well indict Sasquatch and The Tooth Fairy.  Does anyone believe that VIKTOR BORISKOVICH NETYKSHO is actually someones real identity that could ever be found.

[Pig Bellmont 8717]

Just now, TwiceHorn said:

Are you retarded?  I acknowledged the public effect of it.  To think that those military intelligence officers will ever stand trial or have evidence offered against them is dumb.  One could issue a public interim report to the same effect.

You don’t think a criminal indictment from the federal government carries more weight than a public statement? “Are you retarded?”

[Mr. Drummond 2199]

Both sides are reading into it what they want.   Rinse and repeat.

 

He said no american's did anything wrong, that means Trump is innocent !!!!- Rs

He said YET, i bet next time is really when he nails them - He just HAS to be guilty of something bad, i just know it.-  Ds

 

[VRHorn 718]

Oh boy, the "just asking questions" brigade is out in full force this afternoon.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

18 USC 371 

Everyone not cooperating is getting charged with this. 

[Mojo Hand 4580]

2 minutes ago, zork said:

What does that mean in the overall context of the investigation that is public?

It means that no Americans are accused of a crime in today's indictment, and does not address one way or the other whether Americans will be at another time in the future.