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The Robert Mueller Investigation

Hugo Stiglitz

By Hugo Stiglitz
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Goredho
Goredho

Just to make sure I have the alternative facts straight...  Our government -- but I'm guessing only the deep state part of it --- is now guilty of torturing a poor, naive Russian exchange student who

Incredulity
Incredulity

liberals suddenly being terrified of Russia and manic for election integrity is just pure comedy gold.

Chooky
Chooky

I don't believe for a moment that any of this is entertaining to you.  I think it gives you a bit of anxiety knowing that your best weapon against a group who you despise is a bumbling fraud as a busi

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23367

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5 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

So.... Cohen is pleading and getting fined, going to prison, etc, but no cooperation deal?  What are the implications?

 

There still might be a cooperation deal.  We will have to look at the documents when produced. 

A coorperation deal would look like Rick Gates plea agreement.

https://www.justice.gov/file/1038801/download

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31514

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14 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

There still might be a cooperation deal.  We will have to look at the documents when produced. 

A coorperation deal would look like Rick Gates plea agreement.

https://www.justice.gov/file/1038801/download

I had missed that first time around.  That cooperation language is what I thought was curiously missing from the Georgie Porgie docs, and Flynn too (but I'm less certain of that).

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pyrohornIII

pyrohornIII 4817

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I'm thinking Cohen has more to worry about than going to prison if he flips.  Prison is probably his safest place right now.  But his family and vengeful Russians are still out there.    He might be hoping that not talking will squelch any retaliation and Mueller can still use all the evidence gathered off of Cohen without Cohen collaborating. 

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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3918

Posted
Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

There still might be a cooperation deal.  We will have to look at the documents when produced. 

A coorperation deal would look like Rick Gates plea agreement.

https://www.justice.gov/file/1038801/download

It's being reported as a straight guilty plea with no cooperation language in the plea with 3-5 years in prison..... So let's assume he's not cooperating.  Implications?  Obviously, Cohen's been told he'll be pardoned but what's in it for the Mueller team?  Just a skin on the wall?

 

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David Dennison

David Dennison 18940

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3 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

It's being reported as a straight guilty plea with no cooperation language in the plea with 3-5 years in prison..... So let's assume he's not cooperating.  Implications?  Obviously, Cohen's been told he'll be pardoned but what's in it for the Mueller team?  Just a skin on the wall?

 

If he's pardoned, he has to talk. No more Fifth Amendment protection.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31514

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8 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

It’s more complicated than that.  Depends on subject matter.

Yeah, it would only extend to the matter for which he was pardoned, not other federal or state crimes and not overlapping state crimes.  There really shouldn't be overlapping state crimes, but the unfortunate reality is that there are a shit ton of them.

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Nice Guy Eddie

Nice Guy Eddie 13515

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I know that Trump and some legal experts have said that the presidential pardon has no limits including that a president can pardon himself.  However I think pardoning himself or pardoning someone to protect himself, is potentially up for judicial review.     Not the pardon of the person itself but rather is there a limit.    The courts have previously limited other constitution powers while not pardons.

The most similar situation that I can think of is when Clinton pardoned Susan McDougal as he was leaving office.  However by then, she had already served her contempt of court charge, and everyone was sick of Whitewater.  And just because no one challenged it, doesn't mean that it couldn't have been challenged by the incoming Bush admin.

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triplehorn

triplehorn 2664

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Something to keep in mind - all of these non-cooperating individuals under indictment/pleading guilty vying for a Trump pardon for their known crimes in most cases likely have additional charges that remain under seal or are being withheld.  Potential Trump pardons in the service of self preservation and obstruction of justice are something that has been under open consideration and is undoubtedly being gamed by Mueller wrt to timing and types of charges brought.  But as we wait for Trump to play his hand to inform Mueller's next response, the list of Trump's inner circle that will be watching and waiting from prison grows.

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Ghost of LL

Ghost of LL 15539

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4 minutes ago, Bevo VIII said:


I’m going to go with he didn’t bring enough to the table to get a plea

I don't think they needed him to bring anything to the table.  They went and got it.  Why do they need him to cooperate after they already obtained all of his documents, including tapes of discussions.

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Bozo_Casanova

Bozo_Casanova 26511

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From the really serious news outlet Fox News:

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Jury announces guilty verdict on some charges in Manafort trial; mistrial declared on other counts

 

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Bozo_Casanova

Bozo_Casanova 26511

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Meanwhile, on Texags

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How many of Obama's cohorts could face this level of scrutiny? We no many didn't pay taxes and almost certianly broke laws and lied about income.

Besides it has nothing to do with Trump or the Special Prosecutors mission.

You people are pathetic.

 

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FWD

FWD 297

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1 hour ago, Patrick Bateman said:

It's being reported as a straight guilty plea with no cooperation language in the plea with 3-5 years in prison..... So let's assume he's not cooperating.  Implications?  Obviously, Cohen's been told he'll be pardoned but what's in it for the Mueller team?  Just a skin on the wall?

 

Cohen charges aren't being brought by Mueller. They handed off the current set of Cohen crimes to NY because it isn't directly related to the Russia investigation. 

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triplehorn

triplehorn 2664

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"Cohen’s allocution is done under OATH There’s no way Trump can distance himself. Let me repeat Cohen’s allocution admits in Court that the @POTUS violated federal laws."

Cohen 3D chess - setting himself up for a pardon from someone other than Trump.  😂

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Lurch

Lurch 5931

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Posted
So to connect the dots Cohen paid Stormy.  Did Trump pay Cohen back or did the campaign pay Cohen back.  I thought the campaign did in a convoluted way.


Cohen submitted an invoice to Trump business for services rendered, and the invoice was paid.
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