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The Robert Mueller Investigation

Hugo Stiglitz

By Hugo Stiglitz
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Goredho
Goredho

Just to make sure I have the alternative facts straight...  Our government -- but I'm guessing only the deep state part of it --- is now guilty of torturing a poor, naive Russian exchange student who

Incredulity
Incredulity

liberals suddenly being terrified of Russia and manic for election integrity is just pure comedy gold.

Chooky
Chooky

I don't believe for a moment that any of this is entertaining to you.  I think it gives you a bit of anxiety knowing that your best weapon against a group who you despise is a bumbling fraud as a busi

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23356

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13 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

edward ii's nobles were his nobles. 

they still revolted against him and had him (probably, most likely) murdered after he abdicated.

Was he a career KGB agent skilled in bribery and blackmail? 

11 minutes ago, kevwun said:

Right, they are his oligarchs right up until Putin being in power is no longer in their best interests.

Putin’s oligarchs are only oligarchs because Putin allows them to be oligarchs.  Without Putin, their entire lifestyles and families are in jeopardy.  Putin has arranged it so the oligarchs need Putin more than he needs them.  He jailed the wealthiest one just before he shook down the others. If they didn’t turn on him then, they never will.

Mikhail-Khodorkovs_2231054b.jpg

Edited by Hugo Stiglitz
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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 89409

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2 hours ago, retread said:

I feel like Trump and the GOP are going to have to amp things up in order for Trump and Trumpism to survive. I wonder what crises they'll create?

It’s like the GOP/Trump was suspected of banging the 60 year-old mom of their girlfriend (and we’re the girlfriend).  Their response is not to deny it, but to admit to having video evidence of it and saying it’s no big deal because it was consensual and not against the law. 

When the girlfriend and family flip out and lose their shit, in order to distract them, the GOP/Trump claim they banged their girlfriend’s best friend as well and have the video to prove it, while claiming it was perfectly legal.  

When the girlfriend loses what little shit she has left, the GOP/Trump tries to distract her again and claim they banged the girlfriend’s 18 year-old daughter.  Rudy goes out on CNN and says it’s perefectly fine because she’s over the age of consent and the video time stamps prove it.  .  

Mission accomplished: the girlfriend has forgotten they were banging her mom.  

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Bozo_Casanova

Bozo_Casanova 26277

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His "strapping young buck" racist dog whistle was too subtle to fly in today's era of explicit Trumpian racism.
Yeah, a lot of us were fooled by his rah rah rhetoric. We had falling gas prices when we partnered with the Saudis after losing Iran and the OPEC oil embargo ended, he cut taxes and engaged in massive deficit spending sacrificing long term security for short term gain, we hosted the Olympics and dominated them because of the Russian boycott. He gave a good speech and made us feel good for a little bit. But it was all a lie. That's not leadership. That's a con. Just like "trickle down economics."
How many lives have been devestated by his ill-conceived War on Drugs? How many were lost because he refused to acknowledge the AIDS crisis? How much money was wasted on a Star Wars program that the scientific community correctly assessed as fantasy? How many lives were lost in South America because he'd support any death squad if they claimed to be fighting communism?
He wasn't smart. Smart people don't consult astrologers. He was a fucking actor who suckered us with charm and bullshit. Just because it worked doesn't make it less than totally irresponsible. 

Wow, did you ever miss the point
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Jack Straw

Jack Straw 2953

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3 hours ago, kevwun said:

Innocent people don't usually have to change their story multiple times.  At some point, Trump will try to claim that coordinating with Putin on when to release the emails was actually ok.

You can bank on it.  And the fact that the Republicans will accept that.  

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horn4life

horn4life 3755

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I wonder how many links it is going to take to finally make the Elected Senators and House Representatives start putting country before party and power?  Perhaps actually taking an interest in the 2016 election tampering by the Russians would be a good start.  It's never to olate to do the right thing.  Call back donald Junior, make the hearings public and watch him take the 5th repetitively. We all know that will not happen until the "democratic witch hunt" starts in January, but it's fun to pretend that there is some small faction of the GOP with a sense of moral principle...

Thank God for Mueller! German's just raided Deutsche Bank, the only back that would lend the bankrupt Trump any money.

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Homercles

Homercles 10205

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There is zero word on it from foxnews.com. Headline for everyone else including the BBC. 


I checked out T_D on reddit *shudders*...only dozens of threads about the border/caravan, and one about how “oh NOW it’s illegal to lie to congress? What about Hillary, etc”.
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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23356

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27 minutes ago, Bevo VIII said:

Imo Oligarchs are more important to the people and Putin.

Why?  The Oligarchs are Putin’s foot soldiers. They hold Putin’s money and rob their wealth from the Russian people.  They do this because Putin allows them to do it.  

Putin also spies on his oligarchs very closely.

If there was going to be an internal insurrection within Putin’s power structure, it’s more likely to come from his intelligence operations and even that is far fetched because it’s literally treason.

Edited by Hugo Stiglitz
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ShaggyBevo RIP

ShaggyBevo RIP 3868

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1 hour ago, hayden_horn said:

did anyone connect this dot?

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-46382722

so, the panama papers?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-35954224

that last sentence, i added the emphasis.

Which would explain why Putin recently said no worries with $50/bbl oil as the whole Russian oil industry is a money laundering front.

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Gil Bang

Gil Bang 25897

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  • Nov. 29, 2018
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President Trump’s recollection of discussions about building a Trump Tower in Moscow aligned with those of his longtime fixer Michael D. Cohen, the president’s lawyers said on Thursday after Mr. Cohen admitted in court that he had pursued the project as Mr. Trump secured the Republican nomination for president.

The president knew about the deal and discussed it with Mr. Cohen before it fell apart, Mr. Trump’s lawyers said. Mr. Trump detailed those conversations last week in written responses to investigators for the special counsel investigating Russia’s 2016 election interference, Robert S. Mueller III. Prosecutors had sought to question Mr. Trump for months and eventually agreed to accept written answers for some queries.

“The president said there was a proposal, it was discussed with Cohen, there was a nonbinding letter of intent and it didn’t go beyond that,” said one of Mr. Trump’s lawyers, Rudolph W. Giuliani.

Mr. Cohen admitted in court on Thursday that he had lied to congressional investigators about the length of the negotiations over the Trump Tower Moscow project and the extent of Mr. Trump’s involvement. He said that he discussed the deal with Mr. Trump several times and that Mr. Cohen continued to work on a potential deal until at least June 2016, court documents showed — months later than Mr. Cohen had told Congress that the deal fell apart.

 

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Mr. Giuliani said that Mr. Mueller’s office did not ask the president about the timing of his discussions with Mr. Cohen about the project.

The fact that Mr. Cohen’s admission in a deal with prosecutors came so soon after Mr. Trump returned his responses to Mr. Mueller’s questions raised concerns among the president’s legal team that Mr. Mueller was laying a perjury trap — waiting for the president to explain his understanding of events before presenting evidence to the contrary to show that he lied, according to people close to the president’s legal team.

 

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Mr. Giuliani said that the president and the Trump Organization, the umbrella company for his family’s businesses, have been forthcoming with Mr. Mueller’s investigators for months about the deal. The company, he added, voluntarily provided investigators with documents related to the Moscow deal.

 

“We have provided them with every document about this from the beginning — that’s the only reason they know about it,” Mr. Giuliani said.

 

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Mr. Giuliani declined to provide the wording of Mr. Mueller’s questions about the deal or Mr. Trump’s answers. Mr. Mueller’s investigators told Mr. Trump’s lawyers earlier this year that they had several questions for the president about the deal.

“What interaction and communication did you have with Michael Cohen, Felix Sater and others, including foreign nationals, regarding real estate developments in Russia during the period of the campaign?” the investigators wanted to ask the president, according to notes Mr. Trump’s lawyers took during a meeting with Mr. Mueller’s prosecutors.

Though his lawyers said his statements to Mr. Mueller lined up with Mr. Cohen’s, the president attacked Mr. Cohen’s credibility on Thursday. The president called Mr. Cohen “weak” and accused him of lying to investigators to reduce his prison sentence.

“So he’s lying very simply in order to get a reduced sentence, O.K.?” Mr. Trump said while leaving the White House for the Group of 20 meeting in Buenos Aires.

Mr. Giuliani sought to explain why Mr. Trump would attack Mr. Cohen even if they had the same understanding of the facts.

“He has so many different versions of the same stories, so by definition he is a liar and we can’t trust him,” Mr. Giuliani said of Mr. Cohen. “He has lied, so how can we believe him?”

He added: “Cohen has just told us he’s a liar. Given the fact that he’s a liar, I can’t tell you what he’s lying about.”

 

 
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Ted Lange

Ted Lange 16041

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On 11/23/2018 at 11:57 PM, Thetexashammer said:

Hold on. You think that the special counsel, whose office was created to investigate Trump's "collusion with Russia" because Trump could not reasonably be expected to investigate himself, is finding great success by prosecuting random people who lied to the special counsel during the investigation? This is, in actual fact, the definition of a nothingburger.

In any case it's odd that you're picking a fight with Van Jones. Isn't he also a Trump hater? Regardless, he isn't here to refute your accusation.

Michael Cohen, another completely random person, Trump doesn’t even know him! Just some random guy Mueller picked up off the street and charged him with crimes...

 

 

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23356

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The big takeaway:  Cohen got the deal he was looking for from Mueller.

After the SDNY conviction, Cohen knew Mueller was going to nail him to the cross in the grand conspiracy/obstruction/conspiracy to obstruct. 

Lanny Davis was going on CNN almost begging Mueller to give Cohen a plea deal in exchange for information and testimony. 

 

On the Manafort front, Trump lucked out by Manafort not only blowing up his plea deal but they avoided that very damning second trial for Manafort.  They wanted a way out of that 2nd trial without Manafort flipping and they got it. So, mission accomplished there for team traitors. 

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Francisco 2.0

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If this has already been posted; eh, I can't keep up.

 

https://www.rawstory.com/2018/11/federal-agents-raid-office-attorney-handled-trump-organization-taxes-12-years-report/

 

Quote

The Chicago Sun-Times reports that “federal agents showed up unannounced at the City Hall office of Finance Committee Chairman Ed Burke, kicked everyone out and papered over the windows Thursday morning.”

Although it is unclear whether the raid was related to President Donald Trump, the raid on Burke’s office is sure to raise eyebrows given that it came on the same day that Trump “fixer” Michael Cohen pleaded guilty to lying to Congress about Trump Tower Moscow.

Quote

According to the Sun-Times, Burke did tax-related work for the Trump Organization for the past twelve years before the two parties severed their business relationship earlier this year.

 

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texastough

texastough 1128

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10 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

On the Manafort front, Trump lucked out by Manafort not only blowing up his plea deal but they avoided that very damning second trial for Manafort.  They wanted a way out of that 2nd trial without Manafort flipping and they got it. So, mission accomplished there for team traitors. 

Could you explain this a bit? What changed from yesterday when Mueller was going to try to rescind Manafort's plea deal, which would have happened on the public record, detailing Manafort's (and Trump's) lies?

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ChiTownDoc

ChiTownDoc 21098

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt said:

how many more tweets like this can that fat fuck's heart take?

They say only the good die young...I know several old out of shape pieces of shit that refuse to kill over...so?

But I've got a war chest full of the world's best bourbon that I'm going to tear into the minute this asshole dies.  As I've said before, any Surly comrades are invited over.

I don't encourage anyone to kill him... well I take that back.  God, please kill this worthless son of a bitch.  

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Tuco

Tuco 5076

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 On the Manafort front, Trump lucked out by Manafort not only blowing up his plea deal but they avoided that very damning second trial for Manafort.  They wanted a way out of that 2nd trial without Manafort flipping and they got it. So, mission accomplished there for team traitors. 


Manafort is proper fucked, and can still deal to improve his situation. I think Team Trump still has every reason to be concerned about Manafort.
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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23356

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9 minutes ago, texastough said:

Could you explain this a bit? What changed from yesterday when Mueller was going to try to rescind Manafort's plea deal, which would have happened on the public record, detailing Manafort's (and Trump's) lies?

Nothing changed from yesterday to today.  Mueller is still going to detail all of Manafort’s lies.  

While we will never know for sure, there were plenty of reasons that second trial scared the shit out of Trump.   For one, the charges were for money laundering, conspiracy, obstruction, and being an unregistered foreign agent.  Those charges probably hit very close to home for Trump and could have been politically crippling, especially if the trial dragged on into the midterm campaign season.  

 

50C7779A-8B84-44E2-8844-7AE200EFF167_zps

 

The strangest thing about the Manafort trials is Manafort requested the trials be separated.  That is incredibly unusual considering how expensive trials can be.

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Goredho

Goredho 17345

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You guys have posted a lot of disparate news items covering recent events — the Deutchebank raid, alderman Burke law office raid, Cohen’s guilty plea, Manafort deal collapse, etc...  It s pretty easy to connect the dots following this thread, but  is there any singular item from a mainstream news source documenting the convergence of all of this?

I have some bible-thumping, Fox News watching, MAGAing relatives that are going to need an easily consumable form of reality that’s going to be painful for them to swallow.

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Francisco 2.0

Francisco 2.0 32318

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1 minute ago, Goredho said:

You guys have posted a lot of disparate news items covering recent events — the Deutchebank raid, alderman Burke law office raid, Cohen’s guilty plea, Manafort deal collapse, etc...  Ot is pretty easy to connect the dots following this thread, but  is there any singular item from a mainstream news source documenting the convergence of all these events?

I have some bible-thumping, Fox News watching, MAGAing relatives that are going to need an easily consumable form of reality that’s going to be painful for them to swallow.

Nothing will sway those folks.  Trump marched out of the White House in cuffs would be something they would discount because of the "deep state".

Trump dying in office either by natural causes or a hit would be something the "deep state" ordered up.

Face it, he's on a pedestal that will never topple over for some people.  If anything, his incarceration or death would only martyr him in the eyes of many.

 

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 89409

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7 minutes ago, Goredho said:

I have some bible-thumping, Fox News watching, MAGAing relatives that are going to need an easily consumable form of reality that’s going to be painful for them to swallow.

Ask them how many good Christians have children by three different women, how many good Christians dodged the draft during Vietnam, and how many good Christians are allowed to grab married women by the pussy.  And how many good Christians have never asked for forgiveness.

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Goredho

Goredho 17345

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Thanks for the advice, but still would like any meta article covering the big picture suggested by recent events from a mainstream news source if someone has one.  

We may just not quite be there yet from a MSM perspective?  For all the calls of TDS from Shaggy/Surly’s conservative denizens, this thread has been pretty solid at forecasting what’s coming down the pipe.

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23356

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2 minutes ago, Goredho said:

Thanks for the advice, but still would like any meta article covering the big picture suggested by recent events from a mainstream news source if someone has one.  

We may just not quite be there yet from a MSM perspective?  For all the calls of TDS from Shaggy/Surly’s conservative denizens, this thread has been pretty solid at forecasting what’s coming down the pipe.

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/3259984-Trump-Intelligence-Allegations.html

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Asithappens

Asithappens 974

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11 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Ask them how many good Christians have children by three different women, how many good Christians dodged the draft during Vietnam, and how many good Christians are allowed to grab married women by the pussy.  And how many good Christians have never asked for forgiveness.

Then ask them how many good Christians voted for him?

Eff the modern-day hypocrites. 

Jesus despises them. 

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SquishMitten

SquishMitten 10398

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So if Trump's team is telling the truth about their answer on that deal... that could mean Mueller used Trump's answers against Cohen to prove he had lied to Congress, thus forcing him to accept the most recent plea deal. Which then results in Cohen being even more cooperative in the case. So, it's quite possible that Trump's "honest" answer may be equally as damaging in the big picture. 

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