The Robert Mueller Investigation

[Lurch 5931]

I got jury duty to be on a grand jury.  They told us it would be a 6 month assignment, 2 days a week all day and 1 day a week half day.  They were a lot more lenient about excuses to get out, though.  I was number 12, so I was for sure going to be on it, but the judge let me off because I told him I did a fair bit of work travel.  

We had our lead sales guy get on one. He enjoyed the shit out of it.

His sales plummeted and it killed our year.

[Biff Tannen 45692]

5 hours ago, Anastasis said:

FUCK.THAT.SHIT

Agree.  People need to be smacked in the face with the truth.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

Mueller will eventually have to testify so I’m sure we’ll get the important stuff. 

[Thetexashammer 1062]

If one were to discover credible information that our president is an agent of a foreign power, that he's being run by the other country, that's he's really a traitor, would it be ethical to sit on that information for a year or two? Would you not be ethically obligated to disclose such a thing immediately? Even if it were just material, but ongoing, criminal behavior, isn't there an obligation to mitigate the injury?

[jimmyjazz 45990]

6 hours ago, Biff Tannen said:

If he doesn't release the hounds within 2 months of the Dems taking over the House, I don't think he has anything.  And then I have to move.

Why would you link the timeline of Mueller's investigation to the results of the midterms?  They are completely unrelated.

I keep seeing this kind of argument and frankly it baffles me.  "There is no evidence."  "If he had something we'd have seen it by now."  WTF?  Mueller has no obligation to release any information until he's good and ready to do so.

[Captainant 27682]

27 minutes ago, Thetexashammer said:

If one were to discover credible information that our president is an agent of a foreign power, that he's being run by the other country, that's he's really a traitor, would it be ethical to sit on that information for a year or two? Would you not be ethically obligated to disclose such a thing immediately? Even if it were just material, but ongoing, criminal behavior, isn't there an obligation to mitigate the injury?

That's a great question for McConnell and Ryan to answer

[deech 2291]

The Democrats need to shut the fuck up about investigating anything Mueller/Russia/Collusion related.  They should let Mueller do his job.  Investigate Trumps' taxes.  Investigate the emoluments issue.  They need to be quiet until Mueller releases his report and then go buck wild.

[deech 2291]

1 minute ago, Captainant said:

That's a great question for McConnell and Ryarn to answer

You heard what the House leadership thinks - they were caught on tape saying:

There are only two people they are confident are paid by Russia.  Rohrabacher and Trump.  They've already answered it not that anyone gives a shit.

[triplehorn 2664]

20 minutes ago, Thetexashammer said:

If one were to discover credible information that our president is an agent of a foreign power, that he's being run by the other country, that's he's really a traitor, would it be ethical to sit on that information for a year or two? Would you not be ethically obligated to disclose such a thing immediately? Even if it were just material, but ongoing, criminal behavior, isn't there an obligation to mitigate the injury?

Yes and no.  There are routine examples of people being watched closely by law enforcement/intelligence agencies for prolonged periods while crimes or espionage are occurring without the whistle being blown or apprehension.  In complex matters, where understanding can go a lot deeper, with time and thoroughness ultimately there will be a more complete takedown.  I think that's what going on here.  And if you've paid attention to what Mueller has keyed on going back to 2000, it's been TCO's (transnational criminal organizations).  What we're witnessing with Trump is a unique opportunity to go deep into TCO's with a heavy emphasis on Russian mob, but not exclusively so.  In order to succeed, it demands patience and a strict adherence to procedure and rule of law.  Hence Rudy with all his panicked 'put up or shut up' nonsense.  The longer this goes, the better.  Silence and a new 6 month extension for Mueller's GJ is good news.

I think Mueller has had TrumpCo bagged on initial sealed indictments since 2017.  I think Mueller is ploughing well beyond DJ Trump for awhile.

 

[triplehorn 2664]

17 minutes ago, deech said:

The Democrats need to shut the fuck up about investigating anything Mueller/Russia/Collusion related.  They should let Mueller do his job.  Investigate Trumps' taxes.  Investigate the emoluments issue.  They need to be quiet until Mueller releases his report and then go buck wild.

That's ridiculous.

I'll be pissed if they fuck it up for Mueller or blatant bias manifests.  But that's what House R's attempted and demonstrated for two solid years.  House D's have repeatedly expressed an understanding of how to stay in their lane wrt handling witnesses, how to divulge evidence appropriately, and to not pose obstacles for Mueller.

The work Congress does feeds public understanding a lot more than leak proof investigators.  That's important.

[deech 2291]

5 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

That's ridiculous.

I'll be pissed if they fuck it up for Mueller or blatant bias manifests.  But that's what House R's attempted and demonstrated for two solid years.  House D's have repeatedly expressed an understanding of how to stay in their lane wrt handling witnesses, how to divulge evidence appropriately, and to not pose obstacles for Mueller.

The work Congress does feeds public understanding a lot more than leak proof investigators.  That's important.

Anything that they do is going to be seen through a political lens of the highest magnitude by the right.  Assuming Mueller has the goods (which I think he does), that is going to be a nearly impossible pill for the other 40% of the country to swallow.  I don't think any hearing that Congress holds in the next six months will impact public understanding one way or the other.   Hold non-public hearings if you have to, but nothing public and I think they come across much stronger when Mueller drops the bombs.

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13585]

Fuck that noise. Dems need to do their goddamn jobs and tell the entire concept of "political lens" to go fuck itself. They need to stop giving a fuck what the right is going to think because they're going to think that way regardless.

Edited January 5, 2019 by Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand

[WhatTheBuck 28790]

Adam Schiff made repeated complaints about people the HIC should interview as part of their investigation into Russian collusion but who the Republicans refused to call. Those people are going to get called in. I also expect that one of the first things Schiff does as chair is to subpoena the phone company and find out who was at the other end of the blocked number Don Jr. called immediately before and after the Trump Tower collusion meeting with the Russians. I'd put the chances of that being anyone other than Don Sr. at right around 0%. 

[Biff Tannen 45692]

8 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

Why would you link the timeline of Mueller's investigation to the results of the midterms?  They are completely unrelated.

I keep seeing this kind of argument and frankly it baffles me.  "There is no evidence."  "If he had something we'd have seen it by now."  WTF?  Mueller has no obligation to release any information until he's good and ready to do so.

 

8 hours ago, deech said:

The Democrats need to shut the fuck up about investigating anything Mueller/Russia/Collusion related.  They should let Mueller do his job.  Investigate Trumps' taxes.  Investigate the emoluments issue.  They need to be quiet until Mueller releases his report and then go buck wild.

That's all well and good, but if it takes until dotus is out of office then who gives a flying fuck?  Yay?  We got him after he already fucked up the entire country?  Good work.  All around.  Glad we got to the bottom of that one AFTER IT DOESN'T FUCKING MATTER ANYMORE.

[yaqdum 182]

9 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

dotus

biff, trump isn't even a pimple on the ass of this thing.

[ndawg 1242]

10 hours ago, Biff Tannen said:

Agree.  People need to be smacked in the face with the truth.

I tend to agree, too, but I'm going to wager that there are a whole lot of considerations we haven't thought of that pertain to telling both the American public and the rest of the world that one of our major parties -- and thus our democracy itself -- has been infiltrated by foreign governments.

If you're in the position to disclose (or not disclose), do you take the "rip the bandaid off" road, or do you take the "resolve the crisis, restore order, and slow drip the nastier parts of the truth" approach? It's easy to say, "yeah, I would totally just rip that bandaid off." Now imagine the whole world is listening simultaneously, and that each and everything you reveal has grave potential consequences. It's frankly terrifying for me to even ponder it.

Outside of Trumpkins, everyone and their mother realizes Trump is compromised, that won't come as a surprise. But I doubt the government will make public the full extent of the corruption of the GOP (and thus half our democratic government). At least not right away. I'm thinking about what would happen if just 30% of the Republicans in Congress were ousted because they were either on the take or complicit.

I was too hyperbolic when I said "decades," but it still seems likely that great care and patience will be taken when revealing the aspects of this conspiracy that go beyond Trump's bunch.

Edited January 5, 2019 by ndawg

[Biff Tannen 45692]

12 minutes ago, yaqdum said:

biff, trump isn't even a pimple on the ass of this thing.

I'm well aware of the depth of this shit show, but he is the pimple on the fucking nose of it right now and is causing fucking mayhem. 

[jimmyjazz 45990]

23 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

 

That's all well and good, but if it takes until dotus is out of office then who gives a flying fuck?  Yay?  We got him after he already fucked up the entire country?  Good work.  All around.  Glad we got to the bottom of that one AFTER IT DOESN'T FUCKING MATTER ANYMORE.

I agree that there is an everpresent risk to the country the longer he stays in the Oval Office, but that has to be balanced with the need to build a strong case.  Ultimately, Trump is probably going to be the canary in the coalmine that let us know shit was more broken than we ever realized, and that's where the greater good lies . . . in fixing the system that allowed him to take office in the first place.

[Mdhorn 5974]

People will also have to eventually equate corporate donations as that of foreign interference.  That's one of the Trojan horses in our elections.  

[Doc Reeves 6434]

11 hours ago, Thetexashammer said:

If one were to discover credible information that our president is an agent of a foreign power, that he's being run by the other country, that's he's really a traitor, would it be ethical to sit on that information for a year or two? Would you not be ethically obligated to disclose such a thing immediately? Even if it were just material, but ongoing, criminal behavior, isn't there an obligation to mitigate the injury?

[David Dennison 18935]

11 hours ago, Thetexashammer said:

If one were to discover credible information that our president is an agent of a foreign power, that he's being run by the other country, that's he's really a traitor, would it be ethical to sit on that information for a year or two? Would you not be ethically obligated to disclose such a thing immediately? Even if it were just material, but ongoing, criminal behavior, isn't there an obligation to mitigate the injury?

Prior to Jeff Sessions's firing, you would tell Rod Rosenstein. Now you would tell Matt Whittaker.

[triplehorn 2664]

1 hour ago, Mdhorn said:

People will also have to eventually equate corporate donations as that of foreign interference.  That's one of the Trojan horses in our elections.  

Yesterday, lost in the noise over cuss words and a breasted Alexandria O-C dancing in college and was this:

 

 

This happens in the first few days of a Dem controlled House after nearly a decade of GOP control.  That's a good sign both that it's out there and that it's got bipartisan support.  It's also smart to get your name behind this before the bad news breaks.

[triplehorn 2664]

12 hours ago, deech said:

The Democrats need to shut the fuck up about investigating anything Mueller/Russia/Collusion related.  They should let Mueller do his job.  Investigate Trumps' taxes.  Investigate the emoluments issue.  They need to be quiet until Mueller releases his report and then go buck wild.

Look ---> They can actually complement each other.  Surprised ?

 

 

 

6 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

Adam Schiff made repeated complaints about people the HIC should interview as part of their investigation into Russian collusion but who the Republicans refused to call. Those people are going to get called in. I also expect that one of the first things Schiff does as chair is to subpoena the phone company and find out who was at the other end of the blocked number Don Jr. called immediately before and after the Trump Tower collusion meeting with the Russians. I'd put the chances of that being anyone other than Don Sr. at right around 0%. 

 

It's already news.  Schiff will subpoena phone records to ID the blocked numbers involved in calls inside DonJr's Trump Tower Russia campaign meeting.  It's very significant for the public to not have to wait for that little bit of evidence during a separate criminal counterintelligence investigation.

 

 

[SubliminalHorn 6808]

I can’t imagine if the GOP had held on to the House. I would be distraught at the future of the Republic. I’m currently very worried, but at least hopeful with the Dems in charge now. If they had lost, that would have been game over for sure. 

[Doc Reeves 6434]

10 minutes ago, SubliminalHorn said:

I can’t imagine if the GOP had held on to the House. I would be distraught at the future of the Republic. I’m currently very worried, but at least hopeful with the Dems in charge now. If they had lost, that would have been game over for sure. 

 

Yes, but then i remember that regardless of impeachment/resignation our foreign policy is fucked for at least 10 years, probably 15+.

[SubliminalHorn 6808]

1 minute ago, Doc Reeves said:

 

Yes, but then i remember that regardless of impeachment/resignation our foreign policy is fucked for at least 10 years, probably 15+.

Oh I know we have a lot unfucking to do once the piece of shit is no longer in the White House. But at least there’s hope of actual oversight now. 

[ndawg 1242]

4 minutes ago, SubliminalHorn said:

Oh I know we have a lot unfucking to do once the piece of shit is no longer in the White House. But at least there’s hope of actual oversight now. 

Let's not forget that the United States is not the only victim of Active Measures. I think there's at least a possibility of a stronger NATO coming out of this.

[JimmyJames 12271]

15 minutes ago, ndawg said:

Let's not forget that the United States is not the only victim of Active Measures. I think there's at least a possibility of a stronger NATO coming out of this.

This. Our allies currently can’t openly talk to us because there’s a traitor in the White House and they know it’s a waste of time. Once this shitstain is removed whether by impeachment or being voted out it’s going to be time for open counter measures against Russia. Right now anything being done is not out in the open because, as stated earlier, there’s an active traitor in the White House. 

[ShaggyBevo RIP 3868]

On 1/4/2019 at 5:45 PM, Biff Tannen said:

If he doesn't release the hounds within 2 months of the Dems taking over the House, I don't think he has anything.  And then I have to move.

Then why did he just ask for a 6 month continuation of the grand jury?

[Bullneck 19182]

OK, we have a new Congress.  How much longer do I have for Mueller to roast Ivanka and her douche husband and Eric and Don, Jr.?  Well, that's too long.

[WhatTheBuck 28790]

2 hours ago, ShaggyBevo RIP said:

Then why did he just ask for a 6 month continuation of the grand jury?

Because whatever the original authorization, whatever period of time that was for (18 months?) was about to expire and it needed an extension. I don't think the six month extension means that they think they'll need the whole six months. I don't know but I think that's just a standard extension. 

Edited January 6, 2019 by WhatTheBuck

[SquishMitten 10419]

Because whatever the original authorization, whatever period of time that was for (18 months?) was about to expire and it needed an extension. I don't think the six month extension means that they think they'll need the whole six months. I don't know but I think that's just a standard extension. 

Pretty standard, at least in my world. Just had a default case this week where the defendant showed up unexpectedly, asked for a 90 day reset, and the judge gave him 180 against every other party’s objection. Shit happens all the time. In my case, it was because that was the next available docket. I would think Mueller’s stuff gets priority, but I honestly have no idea.

[HenryJames 66133]

 

[Pig Bellmont 8719]

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

So Erik Prince is on CNN right now pimping his Middle East security ideas.  FML

[Brisketexan 105161]

So, a lawyer for a Russian company got rebuked by a federal judge for citing the Animal House “you fucked up, you trusted us” defense.

Now, the predicate is that you GOTTA read the room, and know your Judge, and of course, only use it if it actually helps persuade the court....but I’ve actually cited that scene twice in my career (I didn’t use the profanity in the quote - I just do it in oral argument, and say “you messed up, you trusted us.”)

Of course, I’ve also used the term “intergoogles” in argument at a court of appeals.

[Party_Taco 3742]

So Erik Prince is on CNN right now pimping his Middle East security ideas.  FML

Yeah wtf was that all about? Dude is dirty af and is of interest in the investigation... how is he the one you call to the stage?!

[NameAlreadyInUse 5114]

14 hours ago, Pig Bellmont said:

 

So the 7rh is already over on the east coast. What happened?

[JohnnyRage 1617]

35 minutes ago, Party_Taco said:

Yeah wtf was that all about? Dude is dirty af and is of interest in the investigation... how is he the one you call to the stage?!

Because it seems that Trump is ready to privatize the conflicts in the Middle East. This allows him to say that he got the U.S. and its troops out.

[Gatorubet 30254]

2 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

So, a lawyer for a Russian company got rebuked by a federal judge for citing the Animal House “you fucked up, you trusted us” defense.

Now, the predicate is that you GOTTA read the room, and know your Judge, and of course, only use it if it actually helps persuade the court....but I’ve actually cited that scene twice in my career (I didn’t use the profanity in the quote - I just do it in oral argument, and say “you messed up, you trusted us.”)

Of course, I’ve also used the term “intergoogles” in argument at a court of appeals.

"Res mulo coles" will find a home somewhere.

[Junior Miller 1502]

2 hours ago, JohnnyRage said:

Because it seems that Trump is ready to privatize the conflicts in the Middle East. This allows him to say that he got the U.S. and its troops out.

It worked so well with prisons making the US the most heavily incarcerated nation and all so what can go wrong?

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

8 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

So, a lawyer for a Russian company got rebuked by a federal judge for citing the Animal House “you fucked up, you trusted us” defense.

Now, the predicate is that you GOTTA read the room, and know your Judge, and of course, only use it if it actually helps persuade the court....but I’ve actually cited that scene twice in my career (I didn’t use the profanity in the quote - I just do it in oral argument, and say “you messed up, you trusted us.”)

Of course, I’ve also used the term “intergoogles” in argument at a court of appeals.

The lawyers for the troll army operation were just trolling.  American judges just can’t take a joke.

[atomheartbevo 89735]

8 hours ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

So the 7rh is already over on the east coast. What happened?

https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/08/politics/manafort-russia-court-deadline/index.html

Quote

Lawyers for Paul Manafort appear to have missed a significant court filing deadline of midnight Tuesday to respond to the special counsel's office's accusationthat he lied about five topics during his post-guilty-plea cooperation sessions.

It's possible Manafort's legal team filed the entire document under seal, though with that approach they'd normally announce their intention to keep secret the filing in the case docket. Despite the deadline, the public record of Manafort's criminal case in DC District Court has not been updated since mid-December.

Manafort's legal team did not respond to an inquiry after midnight Tuesday about whether the document was filed, nor did a spokesperson for the special counsel's office. The judge overseeing the case has not yet weighed in as of Tuesday morning.

 

[Chad Fuck 17687]

A newb associate and perhaps a paralegal are getting fired today.

[shnsajax 3591]

They all have the worst fucking lawyers.

[hayden_horn 11362]

so this natalia veselnitskaya lady is now charged with obstruction of justice, though seemingly unrelated to the collusion thing?

i'm confused.

but there are SO MANY RUSSIANS

[shnsajax 3591]

so this natalia veselnitskaya lady is now charged with obstruction of justice, though seemingly unrelated to the collusion thing?
i'm confused.
but there are SO MANY RUSSIANS

It just confirms that she is dirty, which we already knew.

[HenryJames 66133]

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

8 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

 

There is a whole lot more to this story.