The Robert Mueller Investigation

[jimmyjazz 45538]

19 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

There are over 1,000 current and former prosecutors out there who have very publicly disagreed.

Doesn't count, Deep State, Hannity out front shoulda told you.

Seriously, GRHorn.  Does it never occur to you that when the overwhelming percentage of professionals who have served under Presidents from both sides of the aisle agree on something, then maybe your two dumbshits who offer up shoddy outlying opinions might be . . . wrong?  WTF is it with Trumpkins -- you'll go down with the ship in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.  It's stunning.  

[GRHorn 105]

1 minute ago, jimmyjazz said:

Doesn't count, Deep State, Hannity out front shoulda told you.

Seriously, GRHorn.  Does it never occur to you that when the overwhelming percentage of professionals who have served under Presidents from both sides of the aisle agree on something, then maybe your two dumbshits who offer up shoddy outlying opinions might be . . . wrong?  WTF is it with Trumpkins -- you'll go down with the ship in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.  It's stunning.  

“Overwhelming percentage”?  How many living attorneys have ever shuttled through the Dept of Justice?  I don’t know the numbers.  

My point is reasonable people who have actively worked against Trump vastly more than anybody on this board, disagree with CR consensus regarding his guilt on obstruction of justice. You’re free to call them, and me, idiots. I’d expect nothing less. 

I try to offer dissenting opinions sometimes here because y’all need them. 

[jimmyjazz 45538]

8 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

“Overwhelming percentage”?  How many living attorneys have ever shuttled through the Dept of Justice?  I don’t know the numbers.  

Make sure you reference that signed letter by about 1,000 Federal prosecutors who think obstruction is a non-issue.  You know, when it happens.  Crimony.

[Blotto 23424]

2 hours ago, GRHorn said:

Besides both of them being civil libertarians, they differ vastly on their political stances. Left vs right.  Both come to same conclusion, that it’s not a solid case of obstruction of justice. 

 

1 hour ago, GRHorn said:

My point is reasonable people who have actively worked against Trump vastly more than anybody on this board, disagree with CR consensus regarding his guilt on obstruction of justice.

I'll admit I dont know much about David French other than he writes for a conservative site, but I sure hope you dont include Dershowitz in your list of people who have actively worked against Trump. Whenever I see that dude on TV, he's chugging Trump's cock like it's a full time job.

[David Dennison 18646]

2 hours ago, GRHorn said:

“Overwhelming percentage”?  How many living attorneys have ever shuttled through the Dept of Justice?  I don’t know the numbers.  

My point is reasonable people who have actively worked against Trump vastly more than anybody on this board, disagree with CR consensus regarding his guilt on obstruction of justice. You’re free to call them, and me, idiots. I’d expect nothing less. 

I try to offer dissenting opinions sometimes here because y’all need them. 

It's not just obstruction of justice that he has to worry about.

[Zavala 1384]

On 6/8/2019 at 9:16 PM, David Dennison said:

It's not just obstruction of justice that he has to worry about.

This chicken is going to be so fucked by 2024 it's hilarious. Please keep it up!

Edited June 10, 2019 by Zavala

[RomaVicta 29769]

I like how the smug tone has remained all the way from "It's been 6 weeks and Mueller hasn't found anything" to "a couple of guys disagree with a thousand former US Attorneys, but Shaggy CR won't hear the truth."

There's some chicken fucking going on alright, comrades.

[zork 629]

9 hours ago, RomaVicta said:

I like how the smug tone has remained all the way from "It's been 6 weeks and Mueller hasn't found anything" to "a couple of guys disagree with a thousand former US Attorneys, but Shaggy CR won't hear the truth."

There's some chicken fucking going on alright, comrades.

So Pelosi is just waiting for the right moment, then, to impeach?  Perhaps timed to affect the election season perhaps?  Or, if not, why wait?

[RomaVicta 29769]

16 minutes ago, zork said:

So Pelosi is just waiting for the right moment, then, to impeach?  Perhaps timed to affect the election season perhaps?  Or, if not, why wait?

I think a reason to wait is to have public support catch up.  I don't know what Pelosi's reasons are exactly.

I don't really see what you question has to do with my post.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

3 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

I think a reason to wait is to have public support catch up.  I don't know what Pelosi's reasons are exactly.

I don't really see what you question has to do with my post.

Public support to catch up ?  The publics attention span is 15 minutes, so they'll need to announce additional charges or new findings or something else to allow public support to catch up.

[jimmyjazz 45538]

Nancy Pelosi's "strategy" (or lack thereof) does not in any way diminish the voiced opinion of roughly a thousand highly experienced Federal prosecutors who served Presidents from both sides of the aisle.  There is  zero -- ZERO -- doubt that Trump would be prosecuted for obstruction of justice were he not occupying the Oval Office.  The usual suspects are trying to cast shade on that fact by using what might be questionable political tactics as chaff.  It's not working.  

I remain incredulous that seemingly intelligent people who proclaim to be patriots willingly support a rogue President.  It's shameful.

[RomaVicta 29769]

I heard on NPR driving into work that a slight majority of Americans favor impeachment. That's up since Mueller's public statement. Public opinion is changing. And there are revelations still emerging every week. Foreign money connections. Funneling funds to select companies in the US while in office. Other stuff.

 

[HenryJames 65884]

 

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

6 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

 

well, the baseline laziness that every house member seems to have is another explanation.

[Red Five 40626]

I was watching that interview live last night. It was infuriating.
“Do you think Trump’s behavior on the 75th anniversary of D-Day was appropriate?”
“Well, words matter. That’s why Pelosi and Schumer should really be more careful with their words.”

[wildcat09 29213]

1 hour ago, zork said:

So Pelosi is just waiting for the right moment, then, to impeach?  Perhaps timed to affect the election season perhaps?  Or, if not, why wait?

No, Pelosi is being a political coward. That doesn't mean Trump didn't commit crimes.

Edited June 10, 2019 by wildcat09

[wildcat09 29213]

46 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Nancy Pelosi's "strategy" (or lack thereof) does not in any way diminish the voiced opinion of roughly a thousand highly experienced Federal prosecutors who served Presidents from both sides of the aisle.  There is  zero -- ZERO -- doubt that Trump would be prosecuted for obstruction of justice were he not occupying the Oval Office.  The usual suspects are trying to cast shade on that fact by using what might be questionable political tactics as chaff.  It's not working.  

I remain incredulous that seemingly intelligent people who proclaim to be patriots willingly support a rogue President.  It's shameful.

psst. it was always and only ever about hating liberals.  Everything else is merely a tool to be used when it can be conveniently used to justify hating liberals. You think the same people who wave the rebel flag give a fuck about patriotism?

[jimmyjazz 45538]

28 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

You think the same people who wave the rebel flag give a fuck about patriotism?

I think they give a fuck about their twisted definition of patriotism, which essentially defines America as "white, straight and Christian" (but not really the latter because their version is  the worst example of Christianity one can espouse).

[jimmyjazz 45538]

Jerry Nadler is now saying he has struck a deal with the DOJ to obtain "some" documents related to obstruction.  I'm not holding my breath, but this could be significant.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

Both sides trying so hard to avoid impeachment but maintain their appearances for the political base energy is fascinating to observe. 

[retread 2951]

Kicking the can down the road is SOP at this point.

[David Dennison 18646]

17 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Both sides trying so hard to avoid impeachment but maintain their appearances for the political base energy is fascinating to observe. 

It's obvious at this point that the Democrats do not have a favorable whip count. 

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

4 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

It's obvious at this point that the Democrats do not have a favorable whip count. 

The votes are whatever Pelosi wants them to be.  She can persuade the caucus in either direction.

[David Dennison 18646]

Just now, Hugo Stiglitz said:

The votes are whatever Pelosi wants them to be.  She can persuade the caucus in either direction.

True, but the votes could be there without her support.

They are not there yet.

[Brian Fantana 6666]

On 6/8/2019 at 6:38 PM, GRHorn said:

“Overwhelming percentage”?  How many living attorneys have ever shuttled through the Dept of Justice?  I don’t know the numbers.  

My point is reasonable people who have actively worked against Trump vastly more than anybody on this board, disagree with CR consensus regarding his guilt on obstruction of justice. You’re free to call them, and me, idiots. I’d expect nothing less. 

I try to offer dissenting opinions sometimes here because y’all need them. 

What, in your dissenting opinion, should be done with Trump officials, both current and former, ignoring Congressional subpoenas? 

[GRHorn 105]

13 hours ago, RomaVicta said:

I like how the smug tone has remained all the way from "It's been 6 weeks and Mueller hasn't found anything" to "a couple of guys disagree with a thousand former US Attorneys, but Shaggy CR won't hear the truth."

There's some chicken fucking going on alright, comrades.

When your side is in power and does something you agree with, you don’t need to amass and exhibit extra public support, for starters. Their signed statement is akin to all those pointless fucking White House petitions signed by angry Republicans during Obama’s terms. 

Then you add the vitriol thrown at anyone even slightly sympathetic to Trump in any fashion, and you get nobody bothering to sign some counter petition or register their opinion in another way. 

[GRHorn 105]

12 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

What, in your dissenting opinion, should be done with Trump officials, both current and former, ignoring Congressional subpoenas? 

I think Congress should take steps to punish people that ignore subpoenas. They can be held in contempt, correct?

Overall, I’d prefer Congress re-establish their oversight role and peel back executive power. I fucking hate the pen and a phone bullshit. 

But, I don’t see how we make that happen. 

[Captainant 27400]

6 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

When your side is in power and does something you agree with, you don’t need to amass and exhibit extra public support, for starters.

Ah, so you support:

1. selling nuclear secrets and billions of dollars of weapons to the saudis after they dismember a journalist
2. child concentration camps
3. holding the domestic economy hostage via tariffs to leverage foreign diplomatic efforts
4. increasing the deficit by 70+% in just over 2 years of office

?

[GRHorn 105]

12 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Ah, so you support:

1. selling nuclear secrets and billions of dollars of weapons to the saudis after they dismember a journalist
2. child concentration camps
3. holding the domestic economy hostage via tariffs to leverage foreign diplomatic efforts
4. increasing the deficit by 70+% in just over 2 years of office

?

1) no

2) no

3) yes (“hostage” 🙄 the economy must have Stockholm syndrome)

4) no 

[Captainant 27400]

4 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

3) yes (“hostage” 🙄 the economy must have Stockholm syndrome)

The economy is more than just the fucking stock market. Savings are down, industries have been laying people off due to the tariffs (and the threat of them), pay is flat, and the last few months of RECORD JOB GROWTH have all been corrected down by 70,000 jobs. 

By what metric do you consider the economy to be sound and healthy? Because it more resembles a meth addict midway through a bender who's about to crash. If it wasn't for the stock buybacks last year from the tax cuts for the wealthy, the stock market wouldn't be doing well. 

[GRHorn 105]

Wasn’t it 3% GDP last year?  3% first quarter of this year? Solid wage growth, job numbers.  Not using hyperbole and saying it’s “the best ever”, but very solid. And this is all well into the “Trade War”.  

Actually the stock market is the one thing being “held hostage” by trade war. It’s subject to unexpected headline risk that hurts it for a brief time then it passes and recovers. 

[David Dennison 18646]

1 hour ago, GRHorn said:

Wasn’t it 3% GDP last year?  3% first quarter of this year? Solid wage growth, job numbers.  Not using hyperbole and saying it’s “the best ever”, but very solid. And this is all well into the “Trade War”.  

Actually the stock market is the one thing being “held hostage” by trade war. It’s subject to unexpected headline risk that hurts it for a brief time then it passes and recovers. 

It's been "solid" for over a decade now.

[GRHorn 105]

5 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

It's been "solid" for over a decade now.

Great. Thanks for the useful input as always. Had nothing to do with what I was addressing. 

[Zavala 1384]

19 hours ago, Captainant said:

The economy is more than just the fucking stock market. Savings are down, industries have been laying people off due to the tariffs (and the threat of them), pay is flat, and the last few months of RECORD JOB GROWTH have all been corrected down by 70,000 jobs. 

By what metric do you consider the economy to be sound and healthy? Because it more resembles a meth addict midway through a bender who's about to crash. If it wasn't for the stock buybacks last year from the tax cuts for the wealthy, the stock market wouldn't be doing well. 

What does Trump have to do with this? What part of his policy did he cause all of the economic problems?

The economy isn't a meth addict from Orange Man. It's been a fucked up scheme for quite a while now. 

[DDD Dad 14239]

16 minutes ago, Zavala said:

What does Trump have to do with this? What part of his policy did he cause all of the economic problems?

The economy isn't a meth addict from Orange Man. It's been a fucked up scheme for quite a while now. 

So is this the new talking point?

[Anastasis 23390]

Patientbear.gif

[Chuckie Finster 22597]

1 minute ago, DDD Dad said:

So is this the new talking point?

Give Trump all of the credit and none of the blame.  Trump's life strategy has now been passed along to his brainless minions across the country.

[David Dennison 18646]

1 hour ago, GRHorn said:

Great. Thanks for the useful input as always. Had nothing to do with what I was addressing. 

Don't be butthurt.

[GRHorn 105]

2 hours ago, David Dennison said:

Don't be butthurt.

It’s not butthurt. I’m glad the economy has been solid for so long.

I don’t understand your need to post on every thread.  

I guess you were trolling? Well done. 

[David Dennison 18646]

8 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

It’s not butthurt. I’m glad the economy has been solid for so long.

I don’t understand your need to post on every thread.  

I guess you were trolling? Well done. 

A Trump supporter griping about trolling will never not be funny.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

I can’t get over how “meh” Republicans are about the five alarm national security disaster the Mueller Report is.   Any Republican going forward (not named Justin Amash) claiming some sort of national security high ground is full of shit.  Just like they were on the rule of law and fiscal conservatism. 

Fucking frauds. 

[Brian Fantana 6666]

Amash voted against the contempt resolution so fuck him too.

Edited June 12, 2019 by Brian Fantana

[Bama Chick 28596]

I’ll quote myself from May 19th in regards to Amash -

I’ll give Amash some credit when he does something more than tweet about this.

Like signing on to the impeachment resolution some of the New Democrats are pushing or withholds his votes on Trump policies in protest or changes to independent.

If all he’s going to do is tweet and talk but still vote to advance Trump’s agenda then he’s as useless as Susan Collins and Jeff Flake.

Talk is fucking cheap at this point. And same goes for the democrats in the house.

DO SOMETHING.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

7 hours ago, Brian Fantana said:

Amash voted against the contempt resolution so fuck him too.

 

Just now, Bama Chick said:

I’ll quote myself from May 19th in regards to Amash -
 

I feel like a broken record but powerful rhetoric from voices like Justin Amash are among the most power weapons in our current environment of political warfare.  

There are plenty of reason to not like Justin Amash and throw him under the bus for not doing exactly what you want but now is not the time.  Unfortunately we need more Justin Amashes .  We need Republicans to speak up and signal to the other GOP members that it’s okay to do the right thing without fear of the political backlash.  

Which would be more influential:

 Justin Amash saying nothing at all but going along with impeachment when the time comes

OR

Justin Amash leading the charge for impeachment via tweets and town halls with more clarity than any democrat?

[jimmyjazz 45538]

I'd like to hear his explanation for voting against the contempt resolution.  He doesn't seem the type to duck and run -- has he said anything?

[Brian Fantana 6666]

He's just another canary like Flake who will say big words and then vote along party lines. I have no idea why Hugo is so enamoured with him and have no use for paper tigers.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

Just now, jimmyjazz said:

I'd like to hear his explanation for voting against the contempt resolution.  He doesn't seem the type to duck and run -- has he said anything?

He explained it on twitter.  I don’t agree with him but he did try to justify it.

 

[jimmyjazz 45538]

Well, it's a reasonable position, whether one agrees with it or not.  I doubt it's a smokescreen.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

Just now, Brian Fantana said:

He's just another canary like Flake who will say big words and then vote along party lines. I have no idea why Hugo is so enamoured with him and have no use for paper tigers.

How political warfare works:

What is the objective?  What do you need to happen to achieve that objective?  Does Justin Amash’s rhetoric bring you closer or further away from that objective?  

If closer, then encourage.  If further away, then attack.  

Because this is warfare, if he is trying to persuade your opposition to your side, it doesn’t make a shit of difference what Justin Amash’s motivations are.  Discrediting him only serves your enemy because you are diminishing the influence he can wield.  

[Jack Straw 2953]

11 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I can’t get over how “meh” Republicans are about the five alarm national security disaster the Mueller Report is.   Any Republican going forward (not named Justin Amash) claiming some sort of national security high ground is full of shit.  Just like they were on the rule of law and fiscal conservatism. 

Fucking frauds. 

100% of Republicans act in bad faith and against the country’s interests, 100% of the time.