2020-21 Big XII Basketball Thread

[Braff Zacklin 13618]

Seems like a good hire. Well done, Land Thieves.

[El Diablo 4232]

Sister Jean okay? 

[El Diablo 4232]

Sister Jean okay? 

[Machinator 32099]

 

[Machinator 32099]

 

[Braff Zacklin 13618]

He stood out enough for me to remember the name. Definitely made some plays.

Good for Kansas, I guess. #therichgetricher

[El Diablo 4232]

Mitchell proved himself on the court for Baylor at the college level, I hope he can do the same for whatever NBA team lands him at the next step in his career. 

[Napoleon 8688]

2 hours ago, El Diablo said:

Mitchell proved himself on the court for Baylor at the college level, I hope he can do the same for whatever NBA team lands him at the next step in his career. 

I’m just glad that he’ll be gone. 

And Yesufu has decided to take money under the table through Christ. 👍

The Easter story of sacrifice has really hit home with him. 🙄

[Machinator 32099]

 

[Js1 85391]

Omg no wai 

 

[Go Pokes 979]

13 hours ago, Js1 said:

Omg no wai 

 

What do you think of this whole situation?   I tried having a discussion on Twitter with an OU fan, but it was pretty pointless since his bias wouldn't let him actually be honest.  The only people on Twitter that seem to have a problem with it are Kentucky fans and OU fans and it's not exactly a fruitful exercise to engage with them on it.  I thought I'd try with someone who I have confirmed actually has a brain.  My opinion is, multiple teams have hired a dad or AAU coach to land a recruit and I never had a problem with it then.  It seemed smart to hire Danny Manning or Mario Chalmer's dad to make sure you get them to play for you.  Worked out pretty well for KU twice.  Is it shady at all?  I just don't see it and since I didn't have a problem with two schools hiring Michael Porter Jrs. dad, I don't think I'm being biased here.  

[Js1 85391]

I just laughed whenever ESPN would show Cannen and act like this 27 year old assistant coach, who was video operations at Tulane prior to OK State, was some hidden gem or future up and comer assistant that Boynton found and hired and not because it was solely to land Cade and now that Cade is gone, Ok State parts ways with Cannen. 

Like, don't blow smoke up my ass, Fran Fraschilla, we all know why Cannen was hired and that OK State would kick him to the curb when Cade left. 

Just kind of thought Ok State would make it somehow less obvious and not wait until like, a few weeks after the season ended. I have no issue with hiring AAU coaches or family members who are coach - hell, I hope Beard finds an off-the-court role for Micah Peavy's dad so he transfers.  But I also hope they don't try to tell me Peavy would be some hiring coup and not just to land his son. 

Hell, Texas WBB hired Lashann Higgs' stepdad when Aston was hired.  But he was here for 8 years and his daughter was only on campus for 5 years.  He likely would still have had a job after she graduated if the whole staff didn't get canned. 

Edited April 9, 2021 by Js1

[Go Pokes 979]

27 minutes ago, Js1 said:

I just laughed whenever ESPN would show Cannen and act like this 27 year old assistant coach, who was video operations at Tulane prior to OK State, was some hidden gem or future up and comer assistant that Boynton found and hired and not because it was solely to land Cade and now that Cade is gone, Ok State parts ways with Cannen. 

Like, don't blow smoke up my ass, Fran Fraschilla, we all know why Cannen was hired and that OK State would kick him to the curb when Cade left. 

Just kind of thought Ok State would make it somehow less obvious and not wait until like, a few weeks after the season ended. I have no issue with hiring AAU coaches or family members who are coach - hell, I hope Beard finds an off-the-court role for Micah Peavy's dad so he transfers.  But I also hope they don't try to tell me Peavy would be some hiring coup and not just to land his son. 

Hell, Texas WBB hired Lashann Higgs' stepdad when Aston was hired.  But he was here for 8 years and his daughter was only on campus for 5 years.  He likely would still have had a job after she graduated if the whole staff didn't get canned. 

I don't know anything about the first two paragraphs.  I watched every game we played and never heard him referred to as anything other than what we was.  The lowest level and lowest paid coach on our team who was hired solely to get his brother and make his short stay in Stillwater a little more comfortable.  Now your 3rd paragraph, I have a bit of trouble with.  Maybe you didn't read the article, but we did not kick him to the curb.  This was his decision and we would have welcomed him back, but he's going to make a lot more money helping his brother manage his multi-million dollar career than he will working with our bigs.  I always kind of assumed he'd go with Cade after one year and I imagine HCMB knew that all along.  Now if you did read it and are just taking the cynical "everybody is a liar" approach and think we just pulled the rug out from under him and canned him, we'll just have to agree to disagree.  I believe our coach and he does not have a reputation for being a liar.   Other than that, it sound like we agree on the practice, which is what I was curious about.  I'll take all the 5 star recruit's dads we can get.  

[Braff Zacklin 13618]

I don't like the practice and consider it a "pay to play" loophole, but it's virtually impossible to regulate and there's no way to put that genie back in its bottle.

[Go Pokes 979]

25 minutes ago, Braff Zacklin said:

I don't like the practice and consider it a "pay to play" loophole, but it's virtually impossible to regulate and there's no way to put that genie back in its bottle.

I don't really understand that view.  It's a "pay to coach" arrangement with the added benefit of getting a great player.   The guy has to show up to work and coach guys.  It's not like a no-show job or an invented, overpaid position.  I imagine within the scope of things schools do to make a star athlete more comfortable, it probably is fairly low down the list of transgressions.  

[Braff Zacklin 13618]

It's a bribe. The player and/or the player's family is being compensated outside of the standard scholarship and all that that entails to get the athlete on campus. 

Whether the friend or family member actually has to show up and work is irrelevant. He or she wouldn't have the position and associated income without his or her direct (and literal) relation to the athlete.

Not saying Okie Lite is dirty or unique. These sort of arrangements have been going on for quite some time, and in more sports than just hoops. But let's not pretend they are anything else than what they are: a loophole payout to get highly touted recruits on campus.

[Go Pokes 979]

4 minutes ago, Braff Zacklin said:

It's a bribe. The player and/or the player's family is being compensated outside of the standard scholarship and all that that entails to get the athlete on campus. 

Whether the friend or family member actually has to show up and work is irrelevant. He or she wouldn't have the position and associated income without his or her direct (and literal) relation to the athlete.

Not saying Okie Lite is dirty or unique. These sort of arrangements have been going on for quite some time, and in more sports than just hoops. But let's not pretend they are anything else than what they are: a loophole payout to get highly touted recruits on campus.

Good points.  I definitely see that side of it, it just seems too cynical for me.  Him showing up to work is not irrelevant.  It's the most important part of the entire thing.  If he isn't showing up for work, then it is literally a pay out and illegal.  You are correct about the person not having the position without his relation to the athlete, but isn't that kind of the way the world works?  The White House was full of those people.  A shitload of coaches seem to have their sons as an assistant coach.  To me, not using your connections to get ahead in the world seems dumb.  Cannen used us and we used him.  Both parties were aware of it and were both pretty happy with that arrangement.  I imagine the same goes for most of the guys who have done this in the past.  

It's definitely a ploy to get the recruit, but I don't really see it as much of an enticement.   He could have gotten a lot more in the G-League.   So I am going to pretend it's more than a loophole payout to get highly touted recruits on campus.  Even if OU does it.  

[Guest]

Going to see it in play with Peavy... maybe.

[Go Pokes 979]

1 minute ago, slorch said:

Going to see it in play with Peavy... maybe.

We have an opening for an assistant is Stillwater if he's interested.  

[Doyle Hargreaves 301]

6 minutes ago, slorch said:

Going to see it in play with Peavy... maybe.

Micah was showing some improvement offensively. Great get wherever he goes because he can D up. 

[Guest]

31 minutes ago, Doyle Hargreaves said:

Micah was showing some improvement offensively. Great get wherever he goes because he can D up. 

his biggest opportunity, IMHO was giving 1-2 fouls per game that were not remotely close calls.  Needs a little more control on that front.

[SimonBolivar 10958]

55 minutes ago, Go Pokes said:

Good points.  I definitely see that side of it, it just seems too cynical for me.  Him showing up to work is not irrelevant.  It's the most important part of the entire thing.  If he isn't showing up for work, then it is literally a pay out and illegal.  You are correct about the person not having the position without his relation to the athlete, but isn't that kind of the way the world works?  The White House was full of those people.  A shitload of coaches seem to have their sons as an assistant coach.  To me, not using your connections to get ahead in the world seems dumb.  Cannen used us and we used him.  Both parties were aware of it and were both pretty happy with that arrangement.  I imagine the same goes for most of the guys who have done this in the past.  

It's definitely a ploy to get the recruit, but I don't really see it as much of an enticement.   He could have gotten a lot more in the G-League.   So I am going to pretend it's more than a loophole payout to get highly touted recruits on campus.  Even if OU does it.  

Is there a rule that says that the "assistant coach" has to show up and participate? I know he did in oSu's case, but I wonder how far schools could go with that one. I'm all for paying players market value anyway so it doesn't really bother me one way or the other.

[Doyle Hargreaves 301]

1 hour ago, slorch said:

his biggest opportunity, IMHO was giving 1-2 fouls per game that were not remotely close calls.  Needs a little more control on that front.

Yep. You think Shannon goes Rd2 NBA or naw? 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Doyle Hargreaves said:

Yep. You think Shannon goes Rd2 NBA or naw? 

Rd2 at best.  he has talent.  Still raw.

[Go Pokes 979]

Is there a rule that says that the "assistant coach" has to show up and participate? I know he did in oSu's case, but I wonder how far schools could go with that one. I'm all for paying players market value anyway so it doesn't really bother me one way or the other.

I’m making an assumption or two here so let me know if I’m wrong. I think the problem there would be schools can’t have unlimited coaches. I also assume those jobs come with work. So if you hire somebody to do no work, someone has to pick up the slack and do it. So I guess you can go as far as whoever is picking up the slack allows it. Of course, with player movement these days, it’s a big gamble that one of those guys doesn’t rat you out.

[Doyle Hargreaves 301]

20 hours ago, slorch said:

Rd2 at best.  he has talent.  Still raw.

Agree. His financial situation is tough. Hope he gets paid. 

[Teryor 4476]

I am shocked he wasn't in Lubbock to play for Mark Adams. I was told Mark Adams was the shadow head coach was bringing everyone back and had control over the program.

Edited April 11, 2021 by Teryor

[Dr. Teeth 5845]

That first sentence could use a comma. 

[Guest]

McClung ain't getting drafted. Big XII defenses beat the shit out of him.

Thoughts and prayers.

 

and WTF does the transfer portal have to do with the draft? You transferring to the Hornets?

Edited April 11, 2021 by slorch

[Teryor 4476]

1 hour ago, slorch said:

McClung ain't getting drafted. Big XII defenses beat the shit out of him.

Thoughts and prayers.

 

and WTF does the transfer portal have to do with the draft? You transferring to the Hornets?

Basically just keeping options open to see what his draft stock (none) is while he looks for a different school. Darryl Morsell out of Maryland has done this and has said he's also open to returning to UMD so literally listening to everyone.

[Al_4_ISU 12464]

I have zero issue with what OK State did, but there’s no reason we can’t just be blunt about it either.

[cochamps 1879]

FTR, David Peavy is different from Danny Manning's dad, who was at least a part-time truck driver.  In three years at Duncanville, he won state in years 1 & 3.  The team had reached the semi-finals in year two, until the state tournament was canceled due to COVID.  Year one was J'Maius Ramsey and Micah, year two was Micah, and year 3 was a new cast altogether.

Not trying to make him out to be John Wooden, but if you win 19 straight 6A playoff games, you can probably coach some.  Don't know what kind of a role he would be qualified for, but I think he would do more than collect a check wherever he goes.  

 

[Brian Fantana 6689]

As far as I know, McClung can't transfer so I guess he really wants to go pro

[Horn Dog 9875]

5 hours ago, slorch said:

McClung ain't getting drafted. Big XII defenses beat the shit out of him.

Thoughts and prayers.

 

and WTF does the transfer portal have to do with the draft? You transferring to the Hornets?

Summary:

 I have enjoyed dating you but am planning on asking another for a long-term commitment.   Until she responds, I will be looking to date others

Edited April 12, 2021 by Horn Dog

[Guest]

9 hours ago, cochamps said:

FTR, David Peavy is different from Danny Manning's dad, who was at least a part-time truck driver.  In three years at Duncanville, he won state in years 1 & 3.  The team had reached the semi-finals in year two, until the state tournament was canceled due to COVID.  Year one was J'Maius Ramsey and Micah, year two was Micah, and year 3 was a new cast altogether.

Not trying to make him out to be John Wooden, but if you win 19 straight 6A playoff games, you can probably coach some.  Don't know what kind of a role he would be qualified for, but I think he would do more than collect a check wherever he goes.  

 

the role would be talent acquisition...it's done all the time.  No shame, really.  Just call it what it is.

[texasstrong12 4668]

9 hours ago, cochamps said:

FTR, David Peavy is different from Danny Manning's dad, who was at least a part-time truck driver.  In three years at Duncanville, he won state in years 1 & 3.  The team had reached the semi-finals in year two, until the state tournament was canceled due to COVID.  Year one was J'Maius Ramsey and Micah, year two was Micah, and year 3 was a new cast altogether.

Not trying to make him out to be John Wooden, but if you win 19 straight 6A playoff games, you can probably coach some.  Don't know what kind of a role he would be qualified for, but I think he would do more than collect a check wherever he goes.  

 

Peavy is one of the best HS coaches in the country. Texas should be trying to hire him in some role. 

Dekaney has regressed big time since Peavy left for Duncanville. 

[texasstrong12 4668]

24 minutes ago, slorch said:

the role would be talent acquisition...it's done all the time.  No shame, really.  Just call it what it is.

Peavy is more than just a "talent acquisition" type coach. 

He's a legit coach. Some college program will hire him soon and it won't be because of recruiting. 

[Guest]

38 minutes ago, texasstrong12 said:

Peavy is more than just a "talent acquisition" type coach. 

He's a legit coach. Some college program will hire him soon and it won't be because of recruiting. 

Agreed, but his ties in DFW are significant.  He is absolutely an accomplished coach, but the hire isnt just because of X.s and O’s.  Not-by a long shot.oh, and his son is a halfway decent basketball player too.

[texasstrong12 4668]

14 hours ago, Teryor said:

I am shocked he wasn't in Lubbock to play for Mark Adams. I was told Mark Adams was the shadow head coach was bringing everyone back and had control over the program.

Tech fans better hope Adams has better "control" as a head coach this time around. It's funny his history at Texas Pan American hasn't been brought up at all. Adams got that program on NCAA probation for years when he was the head coach there. 

['stache 21819]

18 hours ago, slorch said:

McClung ain't getting drafted. Big XII defenses beat the shit out of him.

Thoughts and prayers.

 

and WTF does the transfer portal have to do with the draft? You transferring to the Hornets?

If he doesn't get drafted he will be playing for a different college next season. If you were being sarcastic, sorry for not catching it.

['stache 21819]

On 4/9/2021 at 2:58 PM, Braff Zacklin said:

It's a bribe. The player and/or the player's family is being compensated outside of the standard scholarship and all that that entails to get the athlete on campus. 

Whether the friend or family member actually has to show up and work is irrelevant. He or she wouldn't have the position and associated income without his or her direct (and literal) relation to the athlete.

Not saying Okie Lite is dirty or unique. These sort of arrangements have been going on for quite some time, and in more sports than just hoops. But let's not pretend they are anything else than what they are: a loophole payout to get highly touted recruits on campus.

It makes a ton of difference if they "show up to work," or more importantly if they were actually working when there. It matters that he was already involved in the coaching business. It's not like he was sacking groceries before we paid him $200K to be an assistant coach. Moving from a videographer to the lowest paid assistant coach is a natural progression for a young guy in the business. And by all accounts, he was a good coach. Coaching bigs was a major part of his job and we had some really good play from them, including Kalib Boone who showed enormous improvement from last year to this year. 

Sure, its true, the chances of him coaching here are zero if we hadn't been recruiting his brother. But in the realm of these types of schemes, it stinks far less than others, and is just part of the game now. I expect he will either go into agent work full time or eventually return to coaching. Again, he's not some deadbeat brother who we paid to show up, he was already involved in a coaching career and by all accounts is more than competent. And he will almost certainly make a lot more money right away working with his brother than continuing the assistant coach route, and he stays involved, and will make relationships. It seems like a decent move if you can get it. 

Also, what society are you living in that people don't often succeed based on family relationships? It happens all the effing time. Like every minute of every day someone is offered a job they don't qualify for because their father/aunt/cousin is a big wig. Are you under some illusion that we live in any form of true meritocracy?

Edited April 12, 2021 by 'stache

[Braff Zacklin 13618]

LoL OK.

[El Diablo 4232]

20 hours ago, Dr. Teeth said:

That first sentence could use a comma. 

No shit... I'm thinking... "Although things have changed my love and appreciation for you, guys, remain the same."

[Napoleon 8688]

21 hours ago, Dr. Teeth said:

That first sentence could use a comma. 

 

1 hour ago, El Diablo said:

No shit... I'm thinking... "Although things have changed my love and appreciation for you, guys, remain the same."

I also was thinking the same thing, but then thought "Maybe he left out the comma because he needed to eliminate one letter/space/punctuation.

But when I saw: "up-and-coming" draft, I thought.

"Bitch! That could be 'up coming', you could add that comma to the first sentence and you would still have characters to spare!"

Yes, I said.... "Biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiitch".. um-hmm, I said that. 

 

 

[Machinator 32099]

 

['stache 21819]

I get that losing your coach sucks, but it's pretty unusual for this many people to bail, right? Is it because the new guy sucks? (the players already know him). Or is it that Lubbock sucks that much and Beard was somehow able to convince them so long as he was their coach? If so, goddamn that's some big time recruiting prowess.

['stache 21819]

3 minutes ago, longhornmatt said:

Beard and Maligi punched above their weight in recruiting more than just about anyone I can remember.  Tech's entire history of big recruits prior to Chris Beard is basically just Jason Sasser.

Scott Drew says hi, but we know part of his strategy is shitty as fuck.

[Brian Fantana 6689]

45 minutes ago, 'stache said:

I get that losing your coach sucks, but it's pretty unusual for this many people to bail, right? Is it because the new guy sucks? (the players already know him). Or is it that Lubbock sucks that much and Beard was somehow able to convince them so long as he was their coach? If so, goddamn that's some big time recruiting prowess.

I think making the NC game had a little bit to do with it. We got there with mostly 3-star recruits. His big recruiting hits (as far as star ratings go) didn't start until after that. Also, bruh, let's not pretend Stillwater is some glorious mecca where everyone wants to live lol. If you're winning, you can get good players.

[ChiTownDoc 21154]

5 hours ago, 'stache said:

It makes a ton of difference if they "show up to work," or more importantly if they were actually working when there. It matters that he was already involved in the coaching business. It's not like he was sacking groceries before we paid him $200K to be an assistant coach. Moving from a videographer to the lowest paid assistant coach is a natural progression for a young guy in the business. And by all accounts, he was a good coach. Coaching bigs was a major part of his job and we had some really good play from them, including Kalib Boone who showed enormous improvement from last year to this year. 

Sure, its true, the chances of him coaching here are zero if we hadn't been recruiting his brother. But in the realm of these types of schemes, it stinks far less than others, and is just part of the game now. I expect he will either go into agent work full time or eventually return to coaching. Again, he's not some deadbeat brother who we paid to show up, he was already involved in a coaching career and by all accounts is more than competent. And he will almost certainly make a lot more money right away working with his brother than continuing the assistant coach route, and he stays involved, and will make relationships. It seems like a decent move if you can get it. 

Also, what society are you living in that people don't often succeed based on family relationships? It happens all the effing time. Like every minute of every day someone is offered a job they don't qualify for because their father/aunt/cousin is a big wig. Are you under some illusion that we live in any form of true meritocracy?

So are you saying Adrian Peterson did deserve that job at Big Red Auto?

 

I Keed, I keed!

[HookEm 2467]

I wouldn't freak out too much about losing players and recruits if I were Tech.  There are currently 1,905 players in the transfer portal across all levels of college basketball.  Just about every team in the nation is undergoing huge turnover.  Our own team could see just about a full reboot.