The Democratic Party

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

It’s crazy the $15 minimum wage has overwhelming public support, passed through the house with no problem only to have a parliamentarian, Dems in the White House and Senate effectively veto it for no political reason.

Edited March 6, 2021 by Hugo Stiglitz

[pacman 7359]

Honestly, they did this to Obama routinely his first two years. Not surprised they would quickly forget where their games landed us 4 years ago.

Edited March 6, 2021 by pacman

[washparkhorn 9939]

34 minutes ago, cactusflinthead said:

 

damn

 

[David Dennison 18935]

35 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

It’s crazy the $15 minimum wage has overwhelming public support, passed through the house with no problem only to have a parliamentarian, Dems in the White House and Senate effectively veto it for no political reason.

They couldn't whip 50 votes for a bill that included the $15 minimum wage by March 14. 

 

[Hank Scorpio 17729]

 

 

[washparkhorn 9939]

58 minutes ago, Hank Scorpio said:

 

 

On brand for that ilk.

[bad_teammate 13218]

It's almost like she is begging to get cancelled so she can say something else.
Attn gamers:

 

That's fine I can put my toxic misogyny hat back on, no problem.

[cactusflinthead 27601]

 

[cactusflinthead 27601]

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

1 hour ago, cactusflinthead said:

 

This is not saying a lot.  We’ve lived in Ronald Reagan’s America for 40 fucking years.  This package is nothing compared to the New Deal which is what this moment calls for IMO.  

Edited March 6, 2021 by Hugo Stiglitz

[cactusflinthead 27601]

That was how many years ago? Things have changed man. 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

3 minutes ago, cactusflinthead said:

That was how many years ago? Things have changed man. 

80 years? And the conservatives have been chipping away at it since. 

Edited March 6, 2021 by Hugo Stiglitz

[Js1 85439]

9 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

It’s crazy the $15 minimum wage has overwhelming public support, passed through the house with no problem only to have a parliamentarian, Dems in the White House and Senate effectively veto it for no political reason.

No it doesn’t. It’s in the mid-50s for popularity.  In fact, a recent poll said only 29% who support an increase (83%) supported $15. $12/$13 was way more popular.

The Democrats will likely end up going to war over this later and an increase will happen. Just won’t be $15 yet. Likely $11-$12. 

[Js1 85439]

2 hours ago, cactusflinthead said:

 

This is so correct. Money and vaccines is what voters will remember. 

[immamac 42872]

This is insane. 

[David Dennison 18935]

2 minutes ago, Js1 said:

No it doesn’t. It’s in the mid-50s for popularity.  In fact, a recent poll said only 29% who support an increase (83%) supported $15. $12/$13 was way more popular.

The Democrats will likely end up going to war over this later and an increase will happen. Just won’t be $15 yet. Likely $11-$12. 

War should be over the voting rights bill. That has to get passed or Democrats are screwed for the foreseeable future.

[Beantown Express 2.0 6559]

Can someone honestly explain to me the debate over the $15 minimum wage.  Is it that it will crush small businesses?  Large corporations can’t afford to pay their employees $15 an hour?  I mean, when I do the math it seems like a person making $15 an hour isn’t really making that much money at the end of the year.  Not enough to pay rent in an apartment, feed their family of say 3 kids, pay for college, save money for a rainy day, etc...  I think this amount is even low in the middle of nowhere rural America. It’s just not that much money to be able to live your life with similar to the phrase the “working poor”.  So what is the argument against it?  It will be bad for the economy?  Cause employers to hire less people so it hurts the employment/jobs numbers?  I know I am doing a asking questions post but I am really trying to see how people are opposed to this and I don’t mean just Senators or Republicans but 50% of the population in this country.  

[bad_teammate 13218]

9 minutes ago, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

Can someone honestly explain to me the debate over the $15 minimum wage.  Is it that it will crush small businesses?

This + a rise in unemployment.

(It's horseshit.)

2 hours ago, cactusflinthead said:

 

Every night, your father beats you with the buckle end of the belt. One night he decides to use the strap end.

"This is the most caring and loving I have been in years!" he says.

Edited March 6, 2021 by bad_teammate

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

13 minutes ago, Js1 said:

it doesn’t. It’s in the mid-50s for popularity.  In fact, a recent poll said only 29% who support an increase (83%) supported $15. $12/$13 was way more popular.

Excuse me as I cherry pick my own polling data.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/07/30/two-thirds-of-americans-favor-raising-federal-minimum-wage-to-15-an-hour/%3famp=1

[bad_teammate 13218]

5 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Excuse me as I cherry pick my own polling data.1

Literally the worst possible poll.

Pew: 67%
Morning Consult: 60%
IPSOS/Reuters: 59%
Monmouth: 53%
Harris: 29%???

Is that real, or is Js1 just mischaracterizing the results of the Harris poll.

@Js1 says, "In fact, a recent poll said only 29% who support an increase (83%) supported $15. $12/$13 was way more popular."

False

That is not how the question was worded at all.

QS1Q3: What is the highest amount you would support raising the federal minimum wage rate to? If entering both dollars and cents, please use a decimal point.

$12 (and lower): 35%  ($10-12 alone: 29%)
$13-15 (and higher):  48% ($13-15 alone: 35%)

Now I'm not a math genius, but it looks like you're absolutely dead fucking wrong.

[Bama Chick 28596]

It was a stupid procedural vote and Bernie offered it up knowing it would fail and was posturing and got exactly what he wanted. 
Adding minimum wage to this bill would have put passage in jeopardy. 

Yeah, when I saw damn Angus King voted “No”, I knew that was some kind of weird arcane “only in the senate” vote.

[Bama Chick 28596]

Bitch, fuck you.
White feminism is a god damned plague.
 

Yep.

I officially hate her bewigged attention seeking ass.

Fuck her. She deliberately marched up there intending to be all cutesy and mimic John McCain’s thumbs down when he voted no on repealing Obamacare. Hoping to get a viral moment comparing the two “Arizona Mavericks”. ALL WHILE WEARING SCHOOLGIRL COSPLAY AND A $4,000 LV BACKPACK.

But it backfired.

So now it’s “sexist” to mock her stupid stunt. Nah.

Expect her to show up on the floor next week in a dumb message t-shirt with “Thumbs Down To The Patriarchy” written across her chest.

[Js1 85439]

3 minutes ago, Bama Chick said:

Yeah, when I saw damn Angus King voted “No”, I knew that was some kind of weird arcane “only in the senate” vote.

Yep. It was a vote to put it in the bill after the parliamentarian said it can’t be added. It was not an up or down “do you support $15 min wage” vote but the outrage Twitter from the usual folks are spinning it that way. 

Once Manchin said no, the vote shouldn’t have happened bc it was always going to fail. Saint Bernard did it anyways. Easily now deflecting the blame on the 8 senators and Harris and off of him, the Budget Chair, after he said it would pass muster with the parliamentarian and it did not. 

[bad_teammate 13218]

1 minute ago, Js1 said:

Once Manchin said no, the vote shouldn’t have happened bc it was always going to fail. 

Is there only one chance to vote on the COVID package? If it fails the first time it's over?

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

Joe Biden explains to underpaid essential worker that Senate parliamentarian is to blame for not getting $15 minimum wage put in the recovery bill.  

Also blames Bernie for attempting to overrule senate parliamentarian by forcing Senators to vote.

Edited March 6, 2021 by Hugo Stiglitz

[David Dennison 18935]

The minimum wage is in the recovery bill because that bill will not pass. If they had 50 votes or thought they could get them by March 14, they would overrule the parliamentarian.

 

Edited March 6, 2021 by David Dennison

[HenryJames 66133]

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

It’s because Joe Biden didn’t want to fight for a $15 minimum wage and if you can’t see that I don’t know what to tell you. The House got it done and Biden let the Senate kill it.  It is not complicated. 

[David Dennison 18935]

Just now, Hugo Stiglitz said:

It’s because Joe Biden didn’t want to fight for a $15 minimum wage and if you can’t see that I don’t know what to tell you. The House got it done and Biden let the Senate kill it.  It is not complicated. 

Any bill with the minimum wage in it was DOA in the Senate. That wasn't going to change by March 14. 

 

[FondrenRoad 4378]

3 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

It’s because Joe Biden didn’t want to fight for a $15 minimum wage and if you can’t see that I don’t know what to tell you. The House got it done and Biden let the Senate kill it.  It is not complicated. 

The Senate should not be able to modify bills passed by the House at all. Vote yes or no. If no, send it back to the House. The Senate has too much power as it is. They dont need to steal additional power. 

[Beantown Express 2.0 6559]

2 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

It’s because Joe Biden didn’t want to fight for a $15 minimum wage and if you can’t see that I don’t know what to tell you. The House got it done and Biden let the Senate kill it.  It is not complicated. 

What is not complicated is they can pass the $15 minimum wage at a later date in a different bill.  I don’t understand why the Dems in the House don’t do a bill that is literally one item/one sentence that says the new Federal Minimum Wage will be $15.  Don’t add any pork into it.  Don’t make it about infrastructure or jobs or anything else.   Just one simple law and then make everybody in the House and Senate vote yes or no on that.  I wonder how many would vote “no” if the bill is was just one singular item and they had zero cover to bitch about other shit in a bill and say that is why they are saying no.  A honest but dumb question by me but is it illegal to do a bill/law like this where it literally only contains one thing in it?  

[CooterBrown 18015]

Minimum wage should be the hourly rate that puts a full time worker just above the poverty line. Give a living wage to earners and save tax payer money on welfare benefits.

[Js1 85439]

2 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

The Senate should not be able to modify bills passed by the House at all. Vote yes or no. If no, send it back to the House. The Senate has too much power as it is. They dont need to steal additional power. 

They aren’t modifying the house bill. They are passing their own bill. Then the 2 have to meet to hammer out the differences. It’s the legislative process. 

[Js1 85439]

9 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

 

Dan Sullivan had to fly back to Alaska for an emergency. So the bill can pass 50-49 without Harris 

[David Dennison 18935]

1 minute ago, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

What is not complicated is they can pass the $15 minimum wage at a later date in a different bill.  I don’t understand why the Dems in the House don’t do a bill that is literally one item/one sentence that says the new Federal Minimum Wage will be $15.  Don’t add any pork into it.  Don’t make it about infrastructure or jobs or anything else.   Just one simple law and then make everybody in the House and Senate vote yes or no on that.  I wonder how many would vote “no” if the bill is was just one singular item and they had zero cover to bitch about other shit in a bill and say that is why they are saying no.  A honest but dumb question by me but is it illegal to do a bill/law like this where it literally only contains one thing in it?  

No, but unless they change Senate rules, that stand alone bill will need 60 votes to proceed. That's why proponents wanted to include it in the relief bill, which under the rules of reconciliation, only needs a majority vote. 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

2 minutes ago, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

What is not complicated is they can pass the $15 minimum wage at a later date in a different bill.

Not without filibuster reform or putting it in the next reconciliation. Both look like long shots from where I’m sitting. 

[FondrenRoad 4378]

2 minutes ago, Js1 said:

They aren’t modifying the house bill. They are passing their own bill. Then the 2 have to meet to hammer out the differences. It’s the legislative process. 

Is it getting a full house vote?

[David Dennison 18935]

13 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

Is it getting a full house vote?

Only if any of the amendments get included in the bill.

EDIT: My bad. I forgot the House version included the minimum wage. Derp. 

Edited March 6, 2021 by David Dennison

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

1 minute ago, FondrenRoad said:

Is it getting a full house vote?

Yes.  The House must approve this Senate version before it goes to Biden’s desk.

[FondrenRoad 4378]

Just now, David Dennison said:

Only if any of the amendments get included in the bill.

So if min wage is removed, it will get a full house revote?

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

Yes

[Beantown Express 2.0 6559]

5 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

No, but unless they change Senate rules, that stand alone bill will need 60 votes to proceed. That's why proponents wanted to include it in the relief bill, which under the rules of reconciliation, only needs a majority vote. 

Do you think the entire Republican Party would put a no on a single issue bill like that?  I would think the commercials would write themselves for ripping into any politician that refused to vote yes for a minimum wage increase.

[FondrenRoad 4378]

Just now, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Yes

In that case, they should reject it and send the same one back to the Senate. Don't bend. 

[HenryJames 66133]

 

[Js1 85439]

2 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

In that case, they should reject it and send the same one back to the Senate. Don't bend. 

So they should play hardball with COVID relief and let benefits lapse and be destroyed by everyone for failing to pass a relief bill with 70%+ approval?

Take up the fucking minimum wage later and get this bill on Biden’s desk 

[FondrenRoad 4378]

Just now, Js1 said:

So they should play hardball with COVID relief and let benefits lapse and be destroyed by everyone for failing to pass a relief bill with 70%+ approval?

Take up the fucking minimum wage later and get this bill on Biden’s desk 

Interesting that you believe the House would be playing hardball when it is the Senate who is actually doing that right now. Maybe there is a post from you somewhere here complaining about Senate hardball tactics. Not gonna go back and look. But if one team plays hardball, the other team has to as well. 

If a minimum wage increase is ever going to happen, it has to be part of a bill like this, and pressure needs to be placed on the Senate to pass it. And blame needs to also be placed squarely on the Senate if it doesn't pass. The house already passed this bill. The Senate could have already done so as well. It could be already signed, but for Senate hardball. 

[Bama Chick 28596]

Do you think the entire Republican Party would put a no on a single issue bill like that?  I would think the commercials would write themselves for ripping into any politician that refused to vote yes for a minimum wage increase.

Uhhh yes.

Their voters DO NOT CARE about real issues any longer.

These assholes have been denying a legitimate election for months and encouraged a literal insurrection and riot and their base does not care.

Republicans have given up going after persuadable voters. Their strategy now is to dismantle voting rights and secure victory with the 40% of the people who only care about fucking Dr. Seuss and sticking it to the evil libs.

[David Dennison 18935]

7 minutes ago, Js1 said:

So they should play hardball with COVID relief and let benefits lapse and be destroyed by everyone for failing to pass a relief bill with 70%+ approval?

Take up the fucking minimum wage later and get this bill on Biden’s desk 

That's exactly what they are doing and it's good politics.

[David Dennison 18935]

Just now, FondrenRoad said:

Interesting that you believe the House would be playing hardball when it is the Senate who is actually doing that right now. Maybe there is a post from you somewhere here complaining about Senate hardball tactics. Not gonna go back and look. But if one team plays hardball, the other team has to as well. 

If a minimum wage increase is ever going to happen, it has to be part of a bill like this, and pressure needs to be placed on the Senate to pass it. And blame needs to also be placed squarely on the Senate if it doesn't pass. The house already passed this bill. The Senate could have already done so as well. It could be already signed, but for Senate hardball. 

And when the bill fails in the Senate, then what? Start over on a $1.9 trillion bill? 

OK.

[Burt 4086]

19 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

I’m usually in this camp - and I do think this holds truer for Sinema.

But Manchin wil 100% lose his seat in his next election.

He rode a special appointment to an incumbency and barely hung on to his seat in a Blue Wave in 2018 when the primary motivation for Democratic turnout was “Fuck Trump!”.

Manchin is LOOKING for a reason to jump parties to save his political ass. He'll be a republican before 2022 rolls around.