Low T

[dcbc 14464]

20 hours ago, Sandman said:

I've been on TRT for a few years now. My initial test results were around 250. My Dr at the time put me on 0.5 ml, then increased to 0.75 after a while. Then he went up to 1.0 and man, I was rock hard pretty much 24/7 and I wasn't having ED before I started this. This just turned it up to 11. My wife was not amused. Then my Dr quit and I got a new one, he had me do bloodwork and I was at 1100. He dialed my dose back to 0.5 and now I'm running smoothly, wife is happy. 

I'm on 0.75.  Appointment today, and my doc is shooting for top of the range.  Don't know if I'll get the green light for 1.0ml, but 0.75 definitely boosted the frisky factor.  I'm up for being a lab rabbit.

[Sandman 3403]

31 minutes ago, dcbc said:

I'm on 0.75.  Appointment today, and my doc is shooting for top of the range.  Don't know if I'll get the green light for 1.0ml, but 0.75 definitely boosted the frisky factor.  I'm up for being a lab rabbit.

You may laugh at this but I'm serious: When I was on 1.0, all I could think about was fucking. I couldn't concentrate on almost anything else. I was DTF at the drop of a hat. If I didn't get off at least twice a day, it was awful. My wife wasn't rude about it but she let me know that she could not keep up with that pace. We'd have sex and then 2 hours later, I'm rubbing one out because she wasn't going to do it again (I'm 47, she's 41 FWIW).  If you're single, that's awesome and I hope you'll share your stories. If you're married, make sure you give the wife a heads-up that she needs to start taking her vitamins.

[dcbc 14464]

1 hour ago, Sandman said:

You may laugh at this but I'm serious: When I was on 1.0, all I could think about was fucking. I couldn't concentrate on almost anything else. I was DTF at the drop of a hat. If I didn't get off at least twice a day, it was awful. My wife wasn't rude about it but she let me know that she could not keep up with that pace. We'd have sex and then 2 hours later, I'm rubbing one out because she wasn't going to do it again (I'm 47, she's 41 FWIW).  If you're single, that's awesome and I hope you'll share your stories. If you're married, make sure you give the wife a heads-up that she needs to start taking her vitamins.

Also 47.  Doc is keeping me at 0.75 and getting me on the estrodial 3x per week.  Wife (no pics) seems pleased with my current level of output.

[Herbie Hancock 7342]

Be sure you are taking a baby aspirin daily and donate blood regularly.

[C-Man 27182]

Haven't seen this thread until now. Doc has been asking over the years during annual physical about libido. All seemed fine, I thought. The last couple of years I've felt a little sluggish maybe but didn't say anything until this last August. I asked PCP to include it in my bloodwork last August. My level was 313 so PCP sent me to my urologist. He said go get another test in a few months and I was even lower at 219 in October. I was below the range and eligible for testosterone treatment and it would be covered by insurance with another test that showed it below the range. FF to December and it was down to 176. I started weekly injections (0.5ml) just after the new year.

I'm two weeks shy of six months and the levels are ticking up nicely. Much more proactive in initiating bedroom time with Mrs. C-Man than I have been the last couple of years. Haven't seen much of a pickup in other areas I was told might happen. Only side effect is the occasional leg pain at the injection spot if I maybe stick myself in a less-than-ideal location on my thigh (or have an air bubble). Hair might be thinning a bit on my burgeoning bald spot in back but that's it.

One thing to note is after I got the first low readings my wife ran across a story that was saying one of the early COVID findings was that they were finding decreased T levels in males who had COVID. I had it back in early March 2020 and it bothered me for 3+ weeks. Not sure that had much to do with it but I definitely found it interesting.

Oh, I'll be 49 this fall.

Edited June 24, 2021 by C-Man
including 2020 for clarity

[Herbie Hancock 7342]

Covid had nothing to do with your low levels. Hypogonadism is all but a guaranteed at your age. Sleep cycle and increased body fat % are the next two biggest contributors of low levels besides hypogonadism.

[dcbc 14464]

21 hours ago, Herbie Hancock said:

Be sure you are taking a baby aspirin daily and donate blood regularly.

I'm doing labs every three months with my PCP to monitor any indication of potential clotting.  I can donate blood on site there if necessary.  He did not mention the need for daily baby aspirin.

[dcbc 14464]

17 hours ago, C-Man said:

Hair might be thinning a bit on my burgeoning bald spot in back

Is your doc checking your estradiol levels?  Testosterone breaks down into estrogen in part (or some such).  Mine were off the charts after just three months at 0.75 ml/week.  Started a blocker 3x per week yesterday. 

[Herbie Hancock 7342]

I'm doing labs every three months with my PCP to monitor any indication of potential clotting.  I can donate blood on site there if necessary.  He did not mention the need for daily baby aspirin.

The addition of an AI without the consideration for an increase in possible blood clots is concerning. At your age a daily baby aspirin is recommended anyways. Combine those two and its...interesting that it wouldn’t at least be a topic of discussion with your HRT doc. Talk to your doctor about it

[dcbc 14464]

22 minutes ago, Herbie Hancock said:

The addition of an AI without the consideration for an increase in possible blood clots is concerning. At your age a daily baby aspirin is recommended anyways. Combine those two and its...interesting that it wouldn’t at least be a topic of discussion with your HRT doc. Talk to your doctor about it

Thanks.  I messaged my doc.  I didn't see increased clot risk associated with Anastrozole in a quick search (as opposed to Tamoxofin).  My wife took blockers for five years post cancer and never was on a baby aspirin regimen, even for the short period she took Tamoxofin.  But I appreciate the advice and am looking into it.  

[Herbie Hancock 7342]

Thanks.  I messaged my doc.  I didn't see increased clot risk associated with Anastrozole in a quick search (as opposed to Tamoxofin).  My wife took blockers for five years post cancer and never was on a baby aspirin regimen, even for the short period she took Tamoxofin.  But I appreciate the advice and am looking into it.  

That tamoxifen can get fucked. That shit altered my mood and behavior like nothing I’ve ever experienced.

There are different opinions on AI’s and whether there is an associated risk of thrombocytosis. However there is a proven correlation between polycythemia and testosterone use, to what degree will vary from person to person based on their chemistry.

If your doctor is ordering regular CBC’s and monitoring your H&H that’s great. Just remember to be your own advocate as well is all I’m getting at.

[dcbc 14464]

1 hour ago, Herbie Hancock said:

That tamoxifen can get fucked. That shit altered my mood and behavior like nothing I’ve ever experienced.

There are different opinions on AI’s and whether there is an associated risk of thrombocytosis. However there is a proven correlation between polycythemia and testosterone use, to what degree will vary from person to person based on their chemistry.

If your doctor is ordering regular CBC’s and monitoring your H&H that’s great. Just remember to be your own advocate as well is all I’m getting at.

My wife only was on it for about a month or two, but the joint pain she experienced was terrible.  Exemestane (sp) was much better for her. 

Good advice on patient self-advocacy.  My doc is good and with this prescription, I'm doing labs and follow up visits every 3 months.  Just received a message back from him that he is monitoring my CBC labs (specifically H&H), and I am well within the normal range.

Edited June 24, 2021 by dcbc

[XYZ 2154]

On 6/24/2021 at 9:00 AM, dcbc said:

Thanks.  I messaged my doc.  I didn't see increased clot risk associated with Anastrozole in a quick search (as opposed to Tamoxofin).  My wife took blockers for five years post cancer and never was on a baby aspirin regimen, even for the short period she took Tamoxofin.  But I appreciate the advice and am looking into it.  

Y’all lost me there. What is “AI”? What is anastrozole? What is tamoxofin? What do those things have to do with low testosterone?

[Nice Guy Eddie 13506]

Non-medical opinion but I think you need to question therapies that take you down the path of adding more and more drugs to counter side effects of the preceding drug. And just because a doc will prescribe it, it doesn’t mean it’s necessarily good for your long term.

modern pharmaceuticals are fantastic and should be utilized but once you’ve exhausted all non-drug options first. If you’re only getting 5 hours of sleep after you’ve pounded 10 beers, your testosterone is probably lower than it would be with a few less beers and 8 hours. Don’t initially treat the low t with an injection, go to bed at 10.

My opinion doesn’t mean that additional testosterone isn’t right for some men. I think it 100% is the right path for some.

Csb alert. I had a doc tell me that I could control my acid reflux with diet alone. I basically told him to f-off in my head because I wanted my 2am Mexican dinners after the bars, and I was willing to pop nexium every day to enable my bad behavior. But I’ve learned he was 100% right and while my acid reflux/diet is still not perfect, I love that I dropped the daily pill habit. There is no doubt I’m healthier without the prescription from the doctor.

Edited June 26, 2021 by Nice Guy Eddie

[XYZ 2154]

1 hour ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Non-medical opinion but I think you need to question therapies that take you down the path of adding more and more drugs to counter side effects of the preceding drug. And just because a doc will prescribe it, it doesn’t mean it’s necessarily good for your long term.

I gagree with that. I went to the doctor for low testosterone. Chose clomiphene (makes your testicles produce more testosterone). So I start taking that, get tested, my T went up somewhat. We decide to increase the dosage. Go back later, get tested, T went up some more, but the doctor says “now your estrogen is a little high; I’m gonna prescribe you an estrogen blocker”. I was like nope, not gonna start taking meds that are fixes for the side effects of other meds. So I lowered the dosage.

[dcbc 14464]

3 hours ago, XYZ said:

Y’all lost me there. What is “AI”? What is anastrozole? What is tamoxofin? What do those things have to do with low testosterone?

Estradiol blockers.  Testosterone is broken down in part as estrogen or estradiol (I guess).  At higher than normal levels, this can cause hair loss and tig ole bitties.  Not exactly what I'm going for.

Glad to hear some of you guys found a nonpharacological solution.

Edited June 26, 2021 by dcbc

[Herbie Hancock 7342]

AI = Aromatase Inhibitor

[Gladeite 375]

59 years old.  Been on 0.75 weekly injection for 3 years.  Cardio/body weight workouts daily. Lost 4” in waist size and 20 lbs of fat over time.  Eat normally and drink regularly.  I highly recommend for old guys that are slowing down.  

[Slacks 6819]

I'm an old guy who hit a fucking wall about 2 weeks before 50.

I used to say if I felt like this, I'd look into trt...  I need to get my diet together a bit a quick the booze and see if i get energy and clarity back.

[dcbc 14464]

From my perspective, given that low T can result in cardiac issues, if I get on TRT and do regular labs to make sure it isn't affecting my health in a negative way, I also can work on my diet, exercise, and sleep, and if my T goes up naturally, it will show up in labs and I can lower the amount of my prescription to stay in the upper end of the range.

[Nueces River Rat 5537]

Have any of you all used one of these at home testing services to get your T checked?   And then utilized them for their remedies?

I get these paid ads that pop up on my Facebook page from time to time.  I guess they know I'm 49?

 

[dcbc 14464]

On 7/1/2021 at 12:16 PM, Nueces River Rat said:

Have any of you all used one of these at home testing services to get your T checked?   And then utilized them for their remedies?

I get these paid ads that pop up on my Facebook page from time to time.  I guess they know I'm 49?

 

I went through my doctor.  I had labs coming up and just asked them to add a testosterone test to them.

Edited July 3, 2021 by dcbc

[0xdeadbeef 1645]

To complete in the Olympics in the Women's category, based on the latest 2018 IOC rules, a person has to identify as a woman for the purpose of competing in sports and  have total testosterone level below 10 nanomoles per liter for at least 12 months.  No snip-snip required.

10 nmol/l  = 288 ng/dl 

If I hadn't started TRT, I might have had a shot at Olympic glory.  I wonder if there are any sports where my old-man body could still beat Olympic level women. 

[3adays 454]

Anyone have a Dr. or clinic they recommend in Austin for this sort of thing? 

[Bodhi 1123]

On 7/1/2021 at 11:16 AM, Nueces River Rat said:

Have any of you all used one of these at home testing services to get your T checked?   And then utilized them for their remedies?

I get these paid ads that pop up on my Facebook page from time to time.  I guess they know I'm 49?

 

Not on TRT but used Marek Health to get my labs drawn.  They will write a prescription and send to local LabCorp.  When my my PCP didn't want to help me I did a bit of research and figured out what labs I wanted to screen initially.  My free T is lower than I would like so trying to raise naturally.  If that doesn't work plenty of telehealth clinics online to provide good service.  This is of course not covered by insurance.  

[XYZ 2154]

8 hours ago, Bodhi said:

Not on TRT but used Marek Health to get my labs drawn.  They will write a prescription and send to local LabCorp.  When my my PCP didn't want to help me I did a bit of research and figured out what labs I wanted to screen initially.  My free T is lower than I would like so trying to raise naturally.  If that doesn't work plenty of telehealth clinics online to provide good service.  This is of course not covered by insurance.  

How do you raise testosterone naturally? Only way I know is lifting heavy weights.

[Herbie Hancock 7342]

How do you raise testosterone naturally? Only way I know is lifting heavy weights.

If you’re moderately to severely obese losing body fat will decrease estrogen and increase testosterone production naturally and at a a very noticeable rate. Exercise will also increase it but not substantially. Outside of that there isn’t much you can do “naturally”. And just like fat burners, none of the OTC test boosters peddled by the supplement industry work.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13506]

Lack of quality sleep is supposed to lower testosterone. Same with heavy consumption of alcohol. 

[Superhero 8826]

On 6/22/2021 at 5:35 AM, Nivek said:

I thought T levels spiked and fell throughout the day?

Mine must spike around 630 in the morning because that's when I get my erections.

[dcbc 14464]

Had a friend test in September 2020 at about 230. Since then, he lost 30 lbs and always has hit the gym hard. Still, he was exhibiting a lot of symptoms. So he retested and it's only gone up naturally, even with weight loss and good exercise habits, by about 30 pts.

[Dennis Taylor 18807]

On 7/9/2021 at 11:51 PM, Bodhi said:

Not on TRT but used Marek Health to get my labs drawn.  They will write a prescription and send to local LabCorp.  When my my PCP didn't want to help me I did a bit of research and figured out what labs I wanted to screen initially.  My free T is lower than I would like so trying to raise naturally.  If that doesn't work plenty of telehealth clinics online to provide good service.  This is of course not covered by insurance.  

Narrator- it won't 

[bluto 4912]

Reading up on it, is it accurate to say there’s no T booster, it’s only full on replacement correct? That’s the part that trips me up, I wouldn’t be opposed to topping off the tank but outright replacing the source production makes me uneasy.

[Bodhi 1123]

16 hours ago, Dennis Taylor said:

Narrator- it won't 

I suspect that is the case but before shutting down my natural testosterone production and committing to a life of injections I wanted to exhaust my other options. I could drink a lot less, drop 10lbs, exercise differently, and improve my nutrition. Unfortunately, I'm not significantly overweight, eat well, and work out regularly currently. I imagine my efforts will result in slightly improved numbers without making a material impact on the symptoms 

[Bodhi 1123]

3 hours ago, bluto said:

Reading up on it, is it accurate to say there’s no T booster, it’s only full on replacement correct? That’s the part that trips me up, I wouldn’t be opposed to topping off the tank but outright replacing the source production makes me uneasy.

Disclaimer - Not a clinician and relatively new to researching this.  That said my understanding is that by using TRT your body wont produce Testosterone in any significant amount anymore. You become reliant on an external source.  I've heard of some people trying Clomid Monotherapy which is meant to help your body naturally produce more Testosterone (topping off the tank) but the results I've found appear to be pretty mixed.

[Dennis Taylor 18807]

45 minutes ago, Bodhi said:

I suspect that is the case but before shutting down my natural testosterone production and committing to a life of injections I wanted to exhaust my other options. I could drink a lot less, drop 10lbs, exercise differently, and improve my nutrition. Unfortunately, I'm not significantly overweight, eat well, and work out regularly currently. I imagine my efforts will result in slightly improved numbers without making a material impact on the symptoms 

So that isn't you in your avatar?

[Sandman 3403]

1 hour ago, Bodhi said:

I suspect that is the case but before shutting down my natural testosterone production and committing to a life of injections I wanted to exhaust my other options. I could drink a lot less, drop 10lbs, exercise differently, and improve my nutrition. Unfortunately, I'm not significantly overweight, eat well, and work out regularly currently. I imagine my efforts will result in slightly improved numbers without making a material impact on the symptoms 

I asked my Dr about that and he said if I were to stop the injections, my body would eventually start producing on it's own again. 

[Nivek 16916]

On 7/11/2021 at 12:32 AM, Superhero said:

Mine must spike around 630 in the morning because that's when I get my erections.

Yep.  morning wood is caused by this dump of testosterone 

[Bodhi 1123]

58 minutes ago, Sandman said:

I asked my Dr about that and he said if I were to stop the injections, my body would eventually start producing on it's own again. 

I've heard this is the case but no guarantee it will get all the way back to previous levels.  Additionally, the transisition process supposedly is not very fun. 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13506]

2 hours ago, Bodhi said:

I could drink a lot less, drop 10lbs, exercise differently, and improve my nutrition. Unfortunately, I'm not significantly overweight, eat well, and work out regularly currently. I imagine my efforts will result in slightly improved numbers without making a material impact on the symptoms 

Never hurts to try

[XYZ 2154]

5 hours ago, bluto said:

Reading up on it, is it accurate to say there’s no T booster, it’s only full on replacement correct? That’s the part that trips me up, I wouldn’t be opposed to topping off the tank but outright replacing the source production makes me uneasy.

Clomiphene makes your testicles produce more testosterone. I’ve been using it for about two years. Raised my total testosterone from around 300-350 to 700-900. I don’t know about free testosterone as I haven’t been tested for that.

Regarding testosterone replacement, my understanding is that when you increase testosterone with injections or pellets or whatever, your testicles start shutting down production. If you stop the TRT, then supposedly the testicles start producing again.

[Sandman 3403]

40 minutes ago, Bodhi said:

I've heard this is the case but no guarantee it will get all the way back to previous levels.  Additionally, the transisition process supposedly is not very fun. 

 I had a snafu with my insurance earlier this year, I didn't get a shot for 5 weeks or so. I had resigned myself to the idea that I was just never going to get it again. I didn't feel near as blah as I did before I started taking it but I damn sure didn't get hard at the drop of a hat like I had been doing. Glad to be back on the spike again.

[Bodhi 1123]

3 hours ago, Dennis Taylor said:

So that isn't you in your avatar?

Nah, just my spirit animal on cheat days

[dcbc 14464]

7 hours ago, Bodhi said:

Disclaimer - Not a clinician and relatively new to researching this.  That said my understanding is that by using TRT your body wont produce Testosterone in any significant amount anymore. You become reliant on an external source.  I've heard of some people trying Clomid Monotherapy which is meant to help your body naturally produce more Testosterone (topping off the tank) but the results I've found appear to be pretty mixed.

My understanding is that it will slow natural production, but if you later stop TRT, your body will proceed to produce testosterone again, still in low amounts as before.  YMMV, of course.  In my case, my body wasn't doing such a hot job in the first place. 

Edited July 13, 2021 by dcbc

[Bodhi 1123]

47 minutes ago, dcbc said:

My understanding is that it will slow natural production, but if you later stop TRT, your body will proceed to produce testosterone again, still in low amounts as before.  YMMV, of course.  In my case, my body wasn't doing such a hot job in the first place. 

This is correct, sorry my initial post was unclear.

[Herbie Hancock 7342]

 I had a snafu with my insurance earlier this year, I didn't get a shot for 5 weeks or so. I had resigned myself to the idea that I was just never going to get it again. I didn't feel near as blah as I did before I started taking it but I damn sure didn't get hard at the drop of a hat like I had been doing. Glad to be back on the spike again.

Goodrx.com is your friend.

[Dennis Taylor 18807]

So what is the biggest jump in overall T level anyone has experienced? My friend says his went from 298 before to 913 at first lab result 

[dcbc 14464]

8 hours ago, Dennis Taylor said:

So what is the biggest jump in overall T level anyone has experienced? My friend says his went from 298 before to 913 at first lab result 

Bearing in mind that I was tested on the morning of the day I was due for my shot (so in the trough of the weekly cycle), I went from roughly 128 to 728 in the first three months.  So I assume I'm higher than that within an hour after my shot and down to mid 700s by the end of the week.  At that level, I don't feel the wave anymore like I did in the first 3 weeks or so.

[0xdeadbeef 1645]

I've been doing 1ml injections every two weeks for the last year and a half and things are awesome. I feel like it turned back the clock by two decades.  It really is a fountain of youth both physically and mentally.  I was 54 when I started and my T was down in the 200s.  I felt old. I really was at the point where I was thinking I was going to need to retire or change careers because keeping up with the young-guns in the software industry was getting to hard to mentally sustain.   TRT did change that. 

All the tests since I started had been nicely in the mid-range, until the one that came back today. Damn it. Damn it. Damn it. It came back today 1100.

My doc follow up is next week and my guess is he's going to lower my dose.  I don't want to lower my dose.

I feel like I'm about to be sentenced to Beta Force. Fuck me. I don't want to go back.

 

 

Ok, watching that SNL clip again hits uncomfortably close to home:  

• I do work out like a mad-man, and
• I did lose a ton of weight, and
• I did get rid of most of my wardrobe and buy more stylish clothes, and 
• I do have a clean shaven head, and
• I do have a prescription for Viagra, but I don't need it anymore...but I still use it cause god-damn it's good medicine.   

If my docs cuts off my testosterone, I may have to go find some South African Xentrex.  It Works. 

[Sbbruin 21825]

[C-Man 27182]

Following back up on this with my T-levels as per My Quest:

8/11/20 -- 313

10/15/20 -- 219

12/16/20 -- 176

Started TRT

8/4/21 -- 435

9/13/21 -- 452

8/10/22 -- 857