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Official Thread for Abortion Demagoguery

bad_teammate

By bad_teammate
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hookemATL

hookemATL 11754

Posted
Posted
20 minutes ago, Goofyboy said:

Wait - if it’s life and that life threatens the mother, mother can take that life in self defense. Seems pretty clear cut.

“Officer the fetus had an aggressive posture and I believed it meant to consume my bodily fluids for it’s own sustenance. It left me no choice but to defend myself with my trusty Hoover vac and wire hanger.”

gun shoot GIF by South Park

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Bama Chick
Bama Chick

No. Fuck off with that. Not every abortion is about trauma and tragedy and using that framing plays into the christofascist’s hands. Women are humans. Humans have bodily autonomy. Ergo, women have b

Brisketexan
Brisketexan

I do love this argument. I really do. It’s as convenient a way to label yourself a drooling moron as exists, outside of towing around a giant neon “I’M A MORON” sign. No, they didn’t teach us that

hayden_horn
hayden_horn

of course you do. thing is, i would support that. if they choose that. and the real thing is, i'm actually pro life. both my sons were very premature, and had they been born in the 80s, they

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Willfully Horn

Willfully Horn 8027

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21 hours ago, Anastasis said:

This is really great.  This is what happens when you let people skate by through UT with the biology course for non-science majors. 

Never took biology. Though my daughter can make a solid claim to be UT’s top biology undergrad, this , her senior, year.

There are other sciences. I feel no need to toot my horn. But, you fail to impress, as you dodge, hide, and pick and choose in your Surly discussions. As you seek a narrowly focused frame where your self doubt isn’t triggered, and you can escape the self examination of a healthy mind.

Life is not defined as not-dead. Science fails to address all that a fully engaged human brain considers. I’m beginning to understand that you aren’t smart enough to see that which is assumed.

Let’s start with the first definition of life. I shouldn’t have to state that an unviable entity isn’t functional; gullible me to have assumed you would know that. A person whose organs are shutting down isn’t vital. Whether science’s, or a particular religion’s, definition of life differs is immaterial.
 

I have no idea if your ossified thinking is a result of religious bias, or personal blame-casting, but I do know you have no wish to seek common understanding. And that is a failure on your part. Whether you wish to acknowledge it, or not.

Don’t forget, though, it is not too late for you. Be brave. Consider the possibility you might be wrong. 

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23475

Posted
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5 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

I don't know if that's necessarily true (cue your insult about my college biology education).  Show me where there is an absolute consensus on this.  I have read many treatises that try to logically define that bright line, and they don't all agree.  Some argue conception, some argue the transition from cellular life to a more holistic definition that points at the ability for the neural system to control organ and other functions, and some try to create a "symmetry" of sorts that mirrors the definition of death outside the womb (loss of brain activity), thus implying presence of brain activity to define life in the womb.

There is general consensus wrt identifying and defining life, at least in the terms of the biological sciences.  The real challenges are when dealing with things like viruses or prions that clearly meet some criteria but not others. Some of the key criteria are cellular metabolism and reproduction, ability to regulate their internal environment, adapt/grow, and respond to stimuli, etc. If you are looking for bright lines here, there are two that are relevant to the human life cycle. Conception, and the cessation of biological processes at the end of life. If you want bright lines, these are the bounds of the human life cycle. 

22 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

I'm not a medical ethicist, but I can recognize a lack of overwhelming agreement when I see it.  Beyond that, the history of America is rife with difficult tradeoffs between "natural law" (for lack of a better phrase) and individual rights, including Roe V Wade.  To ignore the right to privacy & bodily autonomy elements of the discussion is to deny the value of basic rights most Americans recognize.

WRT weighing the ethics, the principle of autonomy is certainly relevant. As are the other ethical principles (non-maleficence, justice, etc.). And yes, different people can weigh those considerations and come to differing conclusions in specific cases.  

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wildcat09

wildcat09 29355

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On 10/23/2022 at 10:17 PM, Willfully Horn said:

Never took biology. Though my daughter can make a solid claim to be UT’s top biology undergrad, this , her senior, year.

There are other sciences. I feel no need to toot my horn. But, you fail to impress, as you dodge, hide, and pick and choose in your Surly discussions. As you seek a narrowly focused frame where your self doubt isn’t triggered, and you can escape the self examination of a healthy mind.

Life is not defined as not-dead. Science fails to address all that a fully engaged human brain considers. I’m beginning to understand that you aren’t smart enough to see that which is assumed.

Let’s start with the first definition of life. I shouldn’t have to state that an unviable entity isn’t functional; gullible me to have assumed you would know that. A person whose organs are shutting down isn’t vital. Whether science’s, or a particular religion’s, definition of life differs is immaterial.
 

I have no idea if your ossified thinking is a result of religious bias, or personal blame-casting, but I do know you have no wish to seek common understanding. And that is a failure on your part. Whether you wish to acknowledge it, or not.

Don’t forget, though, it is not too late for you. Be brave. Consider the possibility you might be wrong. 

If Ana had lived in Germany in the 1930s, he would've smarmily lectured German Jews that science had proven that the Aryan race was superior and thus the German government needed to adopt policies that promoted Aryans and subjugated other races, but that the Jews could rest assured that they would benefit because the noble Aryan leadership would benefit everyone.

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safe sex

safe sex 11735

Posted
Posted
On 10/23/2022 at 10:17 PM, Willfully Horn said:

Never took biology. Though my daughter can make a solid claim to be UT’s top biology undergrad, this , her senior, year.

There are other sciences. I feel no need to toot my horn. But, you fail to impress, as you dodge, hide, and pick and choose in your Surly discussions. As you seek a narrowly focused frame where your self doubt isn’t triggered, and you can escape the self examination of a healthy mind.

Life is not defined as not-dead. Science fails to address all that a fully engaged human brain considers. I’m beginning to understand that you aren’t smart enough to see that which is assumed.

Let’s start with the first definition of life. I shouldn’t have to state that an unviable entity isn’t functional; gullible me to have assumed you would know that. A person whose organs are shutting down isn’t vital. Whether science’s, or a particular religion’s, definition of life differs is immaterial.
 

I have no idea if your ossified thinking is a result of religious bias, or personal blame-casting, but I do know you have no wish to seek common understanding. And that is a failure on your part. Whether you wish to acknowledge it, or not.

Don’t forget, though, it is not too late for you. Be brave. Consider the possibility you might be wrong. 

He doesn't deserve your graciousness, but perhaps he needs it.

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23475

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9 hours ago, wildcat09 said:

If Ana had lived in Germany in the 1930s, he would've smarmily lectured German Jews that science had proven that the Aryan race was superior and thus the German government needed to adopt policies that promoted Aryans and subjugated other races, but that the Jews could rest assured that they would benefit because the noble Aryan leadership would benefit everyone.

There are certainly some posters whose stated positions reflect some of the same themes of the Social Darwinists of the 1920s and 30s, in particular a functional orientation in their approach to determining the value or moral status of certain human lives. I am not one of them though.  

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Willfully Horn

Willfully Horn 8027

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49 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

There are certainly some posters whose stated positions reflect some of the same themes of the Social Darwinists of the 1920s and 30s, in particular a functional orientation in their approach to determining the value or moral status of certain human lives. I am not one of them though.  

You just support such with your vote.

While I share your disgust at our state’s execution of the mentally challenged who are convicted of capitol crimes, It doesn’t appear to influence your vote, as an example.

The social safety net is yet another.

Pick, choose, compartmentalize.

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PenelopeWitherspoon

PenelopeWitherspoon 19103

Posted
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1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

There are certainly some posters whose stated positions reflect some of the same themes of the Social Darwinists of the 1920s and 30s, in particular a functional orientation in their approach to determining the value or moral status of certain human lives. I am not one of them though.  

You are a real piece of shit, you know that?  A woman deserves bodily autonomy.  Full stop.  No one tells you what to do with your body.  Why the fuck should a women be forced to have to deal with fucksticks like you having any sort of goddamn opinion?  We shouldn't.  Ultimately, men just want to control women.  People like you want to go back to the days where women were no better than property because you are fucking cowards.  

I suggest you stay the fuck out of this thread from now on.  You bring absolutely NOTHING to this discussion at all.  Go both sides somewhere else.

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Willfully Horn

Willfully Horn 8027

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Outlawing alcohol required an Amendment. A right recognizef by the highest court, and therefore explicitly enshrined by the ninth Amendment, is even more fundamental. It became enumerated, or mentioned.

Denying an enumerated right, without an Amendment, is the act of an authoritarian government, not the government of a free people.

Thus GOP Surltites are called fascists. If the jackboot fits, you’re a piece of shit.

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Willfully Horn

Willfully Horn 8027

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Incredulity said:

anyone have a link to Spectrum's response or position.  

 

Or am I just taking the Chinese Honeypot Asset's word for it?

Sealwell is a Chinese Honeypot Asset? Am I supposed to take your word for that? What’s the story here?

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Willfully Horn

Willfully Horn 8027

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4 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

https://www.axios.com/2020/12/08/china-spy-california-politicians

 

**Swalwell

Pos rep for the response. I think your take is more hyperbolic than the ad, though. Swalwell claims he has been proactive in working with the FBi concerning Fang, (who I agree is a honey.) Fang left the country seven years ago, btw.

In keeping with the thread’s subject, what is your take on Swalwell’s ad?

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Incredulity

Incredulity 11675

Posted
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1 minute ago, Willfully Horn said:

Pos rep for the response. I think your take is more hyperbolic than the ad, though. Swalwell claims he has been proactive in working with the FBi concerning Fang, (who I agree is a honey.) Fang left the country seven years ago, btw.

In keeping with the thread’s subject, what is your take on Swalwell’s ad?

I don't think it should be censored. 

My request is legit in regards to any real information on the "refusal"?  or the position of Spectrum.  A quick google was unsuccessful in ascertaining anything meaningful in that regard.  Is it they object to the content?  Or wont run a 1:30 length add?  or ????

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Willfully Horn

Willfully Horn 8027

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14 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

I don't think it should be censored. 

My request is legit in regards to any real information on the "refusal"?  or the position of Spectrum.  A quick google was unsuccessful in ascertaining anything meaningful in that regard.  Is it they object to the content?  Or wont run a 1:30 length add?  or ????

Agreed. And my google skills proved no better than yours.

I occasionally give Spectrum News a few minutes of time. IMO, they  unabashedly broadcast the GOP spin on events of the day.

Edited to add that Swalwell’s ad is effective, and, as I mentioned, not a stretch of imagination.

Edited by Willfully Horn
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Anastasis

Anastasis 23475

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On 10/25/2022 at 10:15 PM, Willfully Horn said:

While I share your disgust at our state’s execution of the mentally challenged who are convicted of capitol crimes

Capital punishment is barbaric and unfitting a modern society. That we execute the mentally challenged people is just one of the most egregious examples of such.

 

On 10/25/2022 at 10:15 PM, Willfully Horn said:

You just support such with your vote.

The rest of your post is just a strawman caricature. Congrats for challenging it head on though. 

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Willfully Horn

Willfully Horn 8027

Posted
Posted (edited)
28 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Capital punishment is barbaric and unfitting a modern society. That we execute the mentally challenged people is just one of the most egregious examples of such.

 

The rest of your post is just a strawman caricature. Congrats for challenging it head on though. 

You must have read about Republican plans to cut Medicare and Social Security. Pointing out that you are voting for the Party with an agenda of social Darwinism is hardly a straw man argument.

Thanks, though, for correcting my spelling.

Edited by Willfully Horn
Claro
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wildcat09

wildcat09 29355

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So Alito has been going around whining about how people are saying mean things about him again because of his Dobbs decision, which prompted this from Jamelle Bouie:

 

For some reason (though I can't quite figure out why), this made me think of our favorite boy Ana.

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Bojack

Bojack 2081

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3 hours ago, Willfully Horn said:

There’s a political Party rife with similar thinkers. But, it isn’t the Republican Party.

One thing he'll never do is admit when Democrats or the left are better about an issue he supposedly cares about. Nope, both sides about Bush's stupid wars, capital punishment, drug legalization, and on and on.  

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Willfully Horn

Willfully Horn 8027

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2 minutes ago, Bojack said:

One thing he'll never do is admit when Democrats or the left are better about an issue he supposedly cares about. Nope, both sides about Bush's stupid wars, capital punishment, drug legalization, and on and on.  

It is telling that @Anastasis attributes Republican policies to “society,” as well, when almost half the country opposes those policies, and, of the states that ban the death penalty, the overwhelming percentage of them are blue states.

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Satchel

Satchel 6938

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Posted
54 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

So Alito has been going around whining about how people are saying mean things about him again because of his Dobbs decision, which prompted this from Jamelle Bouie:

 

For some reason (though I can't quite figure out why), this made me think of our favorite boy Ana.

And how many times was Blaise-Ford forced to move?

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