Joe Biden 2021

[RDCanecutter 26,924]

I want y'all to know before y'all fight that I ain't gonna be able to get off unless y'all are nekkid.

[jimmyjazz 47,334]

30 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

you went from one stupid extreme (I lived in utopia!) to another stupid extreme (those people are pigs).

You should probably return your degree.  I mean, you couldn't take a more ridiculous stance if you tried, and I've seen you take ridiculous stances more often than not.

Wait, you do have a degree, right?  From UT?

[Longhorn_Fan68 34,108]

15 minutes ago, RDCanecutter said:

I want y'all to know before y'all fight that I ain't gonna be able to get off unless y'all are nekkid.

quitter

[bad_teammate 13,568]

18 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

You should probably return your degree.  I mean, you couldn't take a more ridiculous stance if you tried, and I've seen you take ridiculous stances more often than not.

Wait, you do have a degree, right?  From UT?

a couple

What's the ridiculous stance? You're doing the sophomore-in-college bit where you take a few classes and start to "realize" how much better you have always been than the layabouts and laborers that your bourgeois familiars used to smile and wave at on Sundays. It's stupid and annoying.

HOW DID I NOT ALWAYS UNDERSTAND THEY WERE PIGS AND I WAS A GOD AMONG THEM!?

[bad_teammate 13,568]

Everyone was kind, smart, believed scientists, etc.

But I was wrong.

- Kind
- Smart
- Believed scientists

Are they not kind?

Who fucking cares if they're smart or believe scientists (whatever the hell that means)?

[jimmyjazz 47,334]

1 minute ago, bad_teammate said:

a couple

What's the ridiculous stance? You're doing the sophomore-in-college bit where you take a few classes and start to "realize" how much better you have always been than the layabouts and laborers that your bourgeois familiars used to smile and wave at on Sundays. It's stupid and annoying.

HOW DID I NOT ALWAYS UNDERSTAND THEY WERE PIGS AND I WAS A GOD AMONG THEM!?

You should probably go back and re-read what I wrote and then put your big fucking brain to work on assessing my actual verbiage, because you are assuming a shit-ton of hidden context that doesn't exist.

I mean, it doesn't surprise me, you routinely get shit wrong, but for crying out loud try using whatever you were taught in those two degree programs, because right now you are WAY below the Mendoza line.

[DonkeyCigars 143]

6 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Everyone was kind, smart, believed scientists, etc.

But I was wrong.

- Kind
- Smart
- Believed scientists

Are they not kind?

Who fucking cares if they're smart or believe scientists (whatever the hell that means)?

It means they are anti-science or climate change deniers or something about not believing in covid being real, probably I think.

Which makes me think (Insert: "Don't hurt yourself" joke):

If we are to take the angle that higher order thinking and operating humanely is to sympathize and understand that the way a certain culture feels or thinks is because of a larger construct in which they are the victim, like we do with a certain race and their cruel past and the subsequent institutional racism-cum-poverty that followed, then wouldn't the case of rural whites who are not smart and don't believe scientists, to parrot Jimmy, be prosecuted within the same framework, albeit with different variables?

Edited April 1, 2021 by DonkeyCigars

[SydneyCarton 49,534]

I'll cross post this in the turtle thread as well:

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/04/01/mcconnell-says-gop-will-oppose-biden-infrastructure-plan.html

 

Quote

Any hopes that Washington could scrape together a bipartisan infrastructure package took a hit Thursday.

Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-Ky., told reporters the more than $2 trillion plan the White House unveiled Wednesday “is not going to get support from our side.” The proposal would invest in roads, bridges, airports, broadband, water systems, electric vehicles and job training programs, and raise the corporate tax rate to 28% to offset the spending.

 

The Republican also vowed to oppose the broader Democratic agenda under President Joe Biden, who passed his first major initiative last month in the $1.9 trillion coronavirus relief package.

“I’m going to fight them every step of the way, because I think this is the wrong prescription for America,” McConnell said at a news conference in Kentucky.

Unless 10 Republicans break with McConnell or Biden revises the plan to win GOP votes, his comment all but assures Democrats would have to use budget reconciliation to pass the infrastructure bill on their own. Biden has said he wants to win GOP support for the plan. But Republicans have opposed any tax increases, saying they could hinder the U.S. economic recovery.

Responding to McConnell on Thursday, White House press secretary Jen Psaki questioned whether the Republican Senate leader agrees that the U.S. needs to update its infrastructure and expand broadband access. She said Democrats and Republicans need to resolve differences over how to pay for the investments.

“If you don’t want to raise the corporate tax rate — still lower than it’s been over the last 70 years and across decades — if you don’t want to do that, if you don’t want to put in place a global minimum tax, what are the alternatives? We’re happy to hear those proposals,” she said.

 

Even if they use reconciliation, Democrats will have to balance competing interests among themselves to approve a bill. Some progressive lawmakers have called to include more ambitious measures to fight climate change in the plan. Meanwhile, Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer, D-N.Y., and other lawmakers from New York and New Jersey have pushed to include a repeal of the cap on state and local tax deductions in the plan. The change is expected to benefit higher-income taxpayers.

Biden and his advisors got initial Republican input on the Covid relief package, then moved to pass it on their own when they realized the GOP would accept only a much smaller bill than they sought. They appear to be taking a similar approach on infrastructure.

“We’ll have a good-faith negotiation with any Republican who wants to help get this done. But we have to get it done,” Biden said when unveiling the infrastructure plan in Pittsburgh on Wednesday.

No Republicans in Congress voted for Biden’s broadly popular Covid plan. Corralling GOP support for another multitrillion-dollar bill — which includes tax hikes — appears more challenging.

“The odds are longer for Republican support on this,” said Howard Fineman, an MSNBC contributor and a correspondent for RealClearPolitics, in a phone interview.

“The last thing was about fighting a disease, for God’s sake, and they couldn’t get any Republicans to vote for it,” Fineman said. “This has less emotional heft in that sense.”

 

 

 

[SydneyCarton 49,534]

This is also a pretty interesting link I found which I hadn't seen elsewhere. Apparently the bailout in 2008/2009 made a 110 Billion dollar profit. 

https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/

[Biff Tannen 46,205]

1 hour ago, SydneyCarton said:

Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-Ky., told reporters the more than $2 trillion plan the White House unveiled Wednesday “is not going to get support from our side.”

Biden could come out with a plan that includes free blow jobs for all Senate Rs and McConnell would STILL be against it.  All he knows is obstruction.  He uses it to deliberately break government, blame the Dems, and stay in power.  He is pure evil.

[Homercles 10,206]

1 hour ago, SydneyCarton said:

I'll cross post this in the turtle thread as well:

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/04/01/mcconnell-says-gop-will-oppose-biden-infrastructure-plan.html

 

 

 

 

Everytime I hear about this or the covid relief bills on NPR, I openly wonder why we cut taxes for mostly the wealthy + large corporations to the tune of approx (from what I’ve read) $1T cost to the deficit over a decade.  
 

So we can’t afford to provide relief on an unprecedented economic impact from a virus, or invest in our elderly/children/infrastructure...but it was ok to pass a sweeping tax reform that mostly benefited the richest entities?  
 

And what happened during the running joke of infrastructure week?  Looks like the Party Of No is back already...and it pisses me off just like no gun control...”we’ve tried nothing and we are all out of ideas!”

[SydneyCarton 49,534]

16 minutes ago, Homercles said:

Everytime I hear about this or the covid relief bills on NPR, I openly wonder why we cut taxes for mostly the wealthy + large corporations to the tune of approx (from what I’ve read) $1T cost to the deficit over a decade.  
 

So we can’t afford to provide relief on an unprecedented economic impact from a virus, or invest in our elderly/children/infrastructure...but it was ok to pass a sweeping tax reform that mostly benefited the richest entities?  
 

And what happened during the running joke of infrastructure week?  Looks like the Party Of No is back already...and it pisses me off just like no gun control...”we’ve tried nothing and we are all out of ideas!”

Yeah, it's frustrating. The only thing more frustrating is how many stupid people there are who swallow that shit unquestioned. 

[DonkeyCigars 143]

1 hour ago, Homercles said:

Everytime I hear about this or the covid relief bills on NPR, I openly wonder why we cut taxes for mostly the wealthy + large corporations to the tune of approx (from what I’ve read) $1T cost to the deficit over a decade.  
 

So we can’t afford to provide relief on an unprecedented economic impact from a virus, or invest in our elderly/children/infrastructure...but it was ok to pass a sweeping tax reform that mostly benefited the richest entities?  
 

And what happened during the running joke of infrastructure week?  Looks like the Party Of No is back already...and it pisses me off just like no gun control...”we’ve tried nothing and we are all out of ideas!”

Think of it in the same way that companies provide a dividend to their shareholders. The government was providing a dividend to the organizations and people who are most responsible for a lot of the material financial success and growth of American business, which those people love and inspires them (and others who want to be a part of the dividend shareholder community one day) to continue fueling the engine that is human creativity, ingenuity, and innovation for economic growth.

Not saying that is right or wrong, but I think it helps to explain the rationale for those without the same growth mindset and it’s an easy way to digest so we don’t just cling to lazy “government just giving rich business and people more money while people starve in Muncie, Indiana!”. Now before I get chastised, to be fair there is some graft and hand out between rich friends in government and business, but it’s not this systemic corruption and Illuminati conspiracy theory.

If we as a country have a problem with investing that money in our market movers, force multiplier trillion dollar organizations led by celebrity CEO’s and the S&P and NASDAQ composite that is GDP growth engine, then the problem is more with American capitalism than the government. 

Edited April 1, 2021 by DonkeyCigars

[TwiceHorn 32,108]

On 3/31/2021 at 2:35 PM, Hook1997 said:

We have a lot of home healthcare places that do this and for a lot of the patients Medicare foots the bill already.  So what exactly would this money be going to then?

Medicare foots almost no long term care costs.

Medicaid does.

There is a cottage industry in rendering the elderly destitute for purposes of long term care.

Most medicaid facilities you wouldn't want your family in; home care is much preferable.

This could be viewed as an alternative to subsidies to medicaid facilities to bring them closer to decent.

[Biff Tannen 46,205]

3 hours ago, DonkeyCigars said:

Now before I get chastised, to be fair there is some graft and hand out between rich friends in government and business, but it’s not this systemic corruption and Illuminati conspiracy theory.

 

It is though.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/investigations/2019/04/03/alec-american-legislative-exchange-council-model-bills-republican-conservative-devos-gingrich/3162357002/

[Longhorn_Fan68 34,108]

 

[Longhorn_Fan68 34,108]

 

[Fudge Nuggets 19,478]

16 hours ago, DonkeyCigars said:

Think of it in the same way that companies provide a dividend to their shareholders.

This is a complete bullshit comparison.  Corporations hand out dividends when they have excess cash available and do not believe that money can be re-invested in the business in such a way that it will earn a sufficient return.  

The US government first of all does not have excess funds as your lot is quick to point out every time a Democrat is in the White House.  There are also about a million other ways funds could be used in this country to provide a better return than handing it over to the already filthy rich.

[DonkeyCigars 143]

22 minutes ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

This is a complete bullshit comparison.  Corporations hand out dividends when they have excess cash available and do not believe that money can be re-invested in the business in such a way that it will earn a sufficient return.  

The US government first of all does not have excess funds as your lot is quick to point out every time a Democrat is in the White House.  There are also about a million other ways funds could be used in this country to provide a better return than handing it over to the already filthy rich.

Corporations will still pay dividends even when losing money/not having excess and losing market share, as a way to appease and keep happy their investors, shareholders and partners. You don’t even have to look further than 6 months ago with ExxonMobil. Companies, like the government, do this to keep the engine running and growing. Democrats want to curtail the uncapped potential to earn which American Capitalism affords and that’s a bad recipe if you care about innovation is my point of view. This is something that’s been studied in other countries and it seems to hold true that limitations or not being business friendly hamstrings innovation. 

You can disagree with me about the analogy and the reasoning for why tax cuts are not a boogeyman and that’s fine, I’m not a scholar or economist, I’m just offering an opinion to help communicate something that seemed to bewilder another poster, that made sense to me. 

Edited April 2, 2021 by DonkeyCigars

[TwiceHorn 32,108]

16 hours ago, DonkeyCigars said:

the problem is more with American capitalism than the government. 

Well, the problems go hand-in-hand.  Government imposes rules/regulations on the capitalist system all the time when that capitalist system cannot be trusted to operate in beneficial ways, e.g. the FDA prevents capitalism from foisting snake oil on the people, the SEC somewhat prevents the big cigars from going balls deep on the people (they only get to put it about halfway in, currently).  The examples are endless, even in the current state of "deregulation."

Currently, the capitalist part is a bit too unfettered and it is having widespread deleterious effects on the people.  To be sure, it is also having less widespread beneficial effects for certain people, mostly those that own and control the capital, to include those that aren't robber barons, but do have sufficient means to invest (at any meaningful level), and thus are capital owners.

The justification for the current state of affairs is that by making it easier for the "corporate class" to "grow" or generate and accumulate wealth, "all boats will be lifted" by this rising tide. I.e. "trickle down."  Empirically, that has been proven to just be flat untrue.

Also, a lot of this "growth," to use the neutral term, is kind of false and propped up by economic policies (deficit spending and monetary policy) designed to prop up the economy more broadly.

We have learned in the past that certain rules and regulations on capitalism, like price controls, are probably no good, as the dismal science would indicate.

I think there is a "happy medium" somewhere out there, with some carefully crafted regulations, that preserves a healthy profit motive for the "corporate class," while also preventing the absurd concentration of wealth in the upper classes to the detriment of the lower classes.  This is why, even as a conservative, I liked some of Elizabeth Warren's ideas.  They may not be perfect, or even good, but at least she's thinking about them, and is actually qualified to have some good thoughts about them.  If we had a decent conservative political class, which we don't, these ideas could be debated and fleshed out and implemented.

[TwiceHorn 32,108]

Hawaii?  Could she possibly be this stupid?

Rhetorical question.

[DonkeyCigars 143]

1 hour ago, TwiceHorn said:

Well, the problems go hand-in-hand.  Government imposes rules/regulations on the capitalist system all the time when that capitalist system cannot be trusted to operate in beneficial ways, e.g. the FDA prevents capitalism from foisting snake oil on the people, the SEC somewhat prevents the big cigars from going balls deep on the people (they only get to put it about halfway in, currently).  The examples are endless, even in the current state of "deregulation."

Currently, the capitalist part is a bit too unfettered and it is having widespread deleterious effects on the people.  To be sure, it is also having less widespread beneficial effects for certain people, mostly those that own and control the capital, to include those that aren't robber barons, but do have sufficient means to invest (at any meaningful level), and thus are capital owners.

The justification for the current state of affairs is that by making it easier for the "corporate class" to "grow" or generate and accumulate wealth, "all boats will be lifted" by this rising tide. I.e. "trickle down."  Empirically, that has been proven to just be flat untrue.

Also, a lot of this "growth," to use the neutral term, is kind of false and propped up by economic policies (deficit spending and monetary policy) designed to prop up the economy more broadly.

We have learned in the past that certain rules and regulations on capitalism, like price controls, are probably no good, as the dismal science would indicate.

I think there is a "happy medium" somewhere out there, with some carefully crafted regulations, that preserves a healthy profit motive for the "corporate class," while also preventing the absurd concentration of wealth in the upper classes to the detriment of the lower classes.  This is why, even as a conservative, I liked some of Elizabeth Warren's ideas.  They may not be perfect, or even good, but at least she's thinking about them, and is actually qualified to have some good thoughts about them.  If we had a decent conservative political class, which we don't, these ideas could be debated and fleshed out and implemented.

I suppose you are right then in saying the problem is with both American Capitalism as we’ve implemented it and with our government, which is where you landed with your “happy medium” position. At the risk of sounding like a vampire sucking centrist, I completely agree there is a middle, medium or central position that is the best all around answer if the goal is to continue with the model we’ve created.

It’s like one of those test answers where there isn’t a cut-and-dried answer but the prompt asks you for the most right answer.

Anyways, I was offering an explanation for why the tax cuts happened and, while reasonable minds can agree or disagree on whether it was too much or not, there was a theoretical utility and purpose in mind to support the action.

I’m not trying to disagree with you: I thought I’d share an angle of thinking, not to persuade anyone or argue a point I fervently believe in, but because a few folks seemed honesty confused and lost and might appreciate a way to think about it differently.

Edited April 2, 2021 by DonkeyCigars

[horn4life 3,840]

I liked Biden on his quick addressing of Republican "oppose everything" strategy.  He simply called out the last 4 years of "infrastructure weeks" and how nothing came out of it.  He addressed the specific whining on lead in pipes, stating the obvious, that the GOP would have the pipes replaced instantly if it were THEY who were being put at risk.  He also appealed directly to Republican voters.

Joe is never going to light the world on fire.  And with the only thing in the rotation on Fox News being brown people at the border, black people in gangs, and Gov Cuomo... don't expect that many of the low information folks are gonna do anything but do the usual snow flake whining.

 

[Fudge Nuggets 19,478]

4 hours ago, DonkeyCigars said:

Corporations will still pay dividends even when losing money/not having excess and losing market share, as a way to appease and keep happy their investors, shareholders and partners. You don’t even have to look further than 6 months ago with ExxonMobil. Companies, like the government, do this to keep the engine running and growing. Democrats want to curtail the uncapped potential to earn which American Capitalism affords and that’s a bad recipe if you care about innovation is my point of view. This is something that’s been studied in other countries and it seems to hold true that limitations or not being business friendly hamstrings innovation. 

You can disagree with me about the analogy and the reasoning for why tax cuts are not a boogeyman and that’s fine, I’m not a scholar or economist, I’m just offering an opinion to help communicate something that seemed to bewilder another poster, that made sense to me. 

They don't start issuing dividends in those situations.

[UpperWestside 6,285]

3 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Hawaii?  Could she possibly be this stupid?

Rhetorical question.

Can someone that uses Twitter send a reply to Governor Noem and include several of the F around and find out emoji? She seems like she might need some of them.

[UpperWestside 6,285]

2 hours ago, horn4life said:

I liked Biden on his quick addressing of Republican "oppose everything" strategy.  He simply called out the last 4 years of "infrastructure weeks" and how nothing came out of it. 

 

President Biden and the administration seem to be doing this on almost everything that Senator McConnell and Co. opposed for the last umpteen years. 

Progress is a good thing. It'll come at a cost monetarily, but the cost of inaction will be more. Keep the bills coming and keep McConnell on the bench where he belongs at after doing nothing to help anyone in this country during his time as Senate Majority Leader.

[Biff Tannen 46,205]

1 hour ago, UpperWestside said:

Can someone that uses Twitter send a reply to Governor Noem and include several of the F around and find out emoji? She seems like she might need some of them.

Done

[TwiceHorn 32,108]

3 hours ago, DonkeyCigars said:

I suppose you are right then in saying the problem is with both American Capitalism as we’ve implemented it and with our government, which is where you landed with your “happy medium” position. At the risk of sounding like a vampire sucking centrist, I completely agree there is a middle, medium or central position that is the best all around answer if the goal is to continue with the model we’ve created.

It’s like one of those test answers where there isn’t a cut-and-dried answer but the prompt asks you for the most right answer.

Anyways, I was offering an explanation for why the tax cuts happened and, while reasonable minds can agree or disagree on whether it was too much or not, there was a theoretical utility and purpose in mind to support the action.

I’m not trying to disagree with you: I thought I’d share an angle of thinking, not to persuade anyone or argue a point I fervently believe in, but because a few folks seemed honesty confused and lost and might appreciate a way to think about it differently.

Yeah, the whole mess is imprecise.  There's no absolute right answer and political/policy compromise absolutely has to rule the day to get anything done.  About all you can do is look at "trends."  We are trending in a bad way as a result of overly laissez-faire policies, in my opinion.  We may well have been trending in a bad way in the other direction before deregulation mania hit.

I think the best we can hope for is to have low-amplitude trend swings.  We seem to be kind of working on a high-amplitude sawtooth waveform at present.

[DonkeyCigars 143]

2 hours ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

They don't start issuing dividends in those situations.

They continue issuing them. Which was my whole point around resuming confidence and incentivization.

[GRHorn 105]

 

[bluto 5,000]

 

But WaPo is lib fake news!

[Biff Tannen 46,205]

3 minutes ago, bluto said:

But WaPo is lib fake news!

Did you read the article?  It’s a joke. It’s tan suit and spicy mustard level horrors. 

[Brisketexan 107,035]

 

Nope. You forever surrendered any and all rights to call out dishonesty. You don’t get to spend 4 years slavishly worshipping at the high church of lies, and then claim to have a problem with it. You have lost that privilege.

The adults in the room can talk about this. You, however, cannot. Ever.

[dcar00 14,997]

7 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Nope. You forever surrendered any and all rights to call out dishonesty. You don’t get to spend 4 years slavishly worshipping at the high church of lies, and then claim to have a problem with it. You have lost that privilege.

The adults in the room can talk about this. You, however, cannot. Ever.

Ooooh sick burn.  the adult Brisket for Internet Police Chief!  Biden is a liar and grifter at least when he is semi-coherent.

[Biff Tannen 46,205]

Lol. Dipshit sidekick lurkers to the rescue!

[Bruh Man 3,160]

Did Republicans really think people would just forget the last half decade and how your entire party cucked itself for a malignant sociopath? 

Any claims of the moral high ground from you people on virtually any topic will be given the side-eye for the foreseeable. That's the negotiated terms when you dawn that MAGA hat, your credibility goes up in flames in the eyes of sober-minded adults.

Edited April 3, 2021 by Bruh Man

[Longhorn_Fan68 34,108]

Lol @ gr and others trying to pin the same criticisms on Biden that were foisted on the previous guy. For someone incoherent with dementia, the dude gets a lot done. 

[GRHorn 105]

1 hour ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

Lol @ gr and others trying to pin the same criticisms on Biden that were foisted on the previous guy. For someone incoherent with dementia, the dude gets a lot done. 

Weird Response. 
 

2 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

Nope. You forever surrendered any and all rights to call out dishonesty. You don’t get to spend 4 years slavishly worshipping at the high church of lies, and then claim to have a problem with it. You have lost that privilege.

The adults in the room can talk about this. You, however, cannot. Ever.

Your response is instructive. Your first instinct is to explicitly excuse dishonesty when it’s called out. 
 

I never worshiped at any high church of lies. I supported some things, opposed a lot of others from Trump. I’ve never been a partisan, always more of a right leaning both sides person. Your inability to see beyond black and white betrays your mental simplicity. 
 

[DonkeyCigars 143]

1 hour ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

Lol @ gr and others trying to pin the same criticisms on Biden that were foisted on the previous guy. For someone incoherent with dementia, the dude gets a lot done. 

Before we break our hands patting his back it would do well for us to remember, as our good friend bad_teammate reminds us: Proposing historic legislation is not transformative; passing it is.

Moderate Democrats are not sold on the tax increases with which Biden has said he will fund the huge infrastructure bill. Republicans, so far, appear to be largely in lockstep with Mitch McConnell, the Republican Senate leader who declared the Biden plan a “Trojan horse” for a left-wing tax-and-spending spree. “A Senate evenly split between both parties and a bare Democratic House majority are hardly a mandate to ‘go it alone,’ ” Mitt Romney tweeted, on Thursday—and Romney would have to be a target for any Biden bill that is not purely a Democratic affair. Niche issues could also derail Biden’s plans: for example, a restoration of a state and local tax exemption—which Trump had capped, in a punitive measure against blue America—that Democrats from heavy-tax states such as New York and New Jersey are demanding be in the infrastructure bill. Biden, put simply, does not appear to have the votes to be another F.D.R. or another L.B.J. At least, not right now.

Edited April 3, 2021 by DonkeyCigars

[workswithseed 2,205]

1 minute ago, DonkeyCigars said:

Before we break our hands patting his back it would do well for us to remember, as our good friend bad_teammate reminds us: Proposing historic legislation is not transformative; passing it is.

It was made on April 1, so it could be a joke.

[TwiceHorn 32,108]

Politicians as a class are prevaricators, at minimum.

Trump blew so far through those norms that normal politicians are virtually immune from criticism, from anyone, but most especially by Trump supporters, either vocal or passive.

And any attempt to compare Biden's truth record with Trump's is absurd and invidious.

[GRHorn 105]

9 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Politicians as a class are prevaricators, at minimum.

Trump blew so far through those norms that normal politicians are virtually immune from criticism, from anyone, but most especially by Trump supporters, either vocal or passive.

And any attempt to compare Biden's truth record with Trump's is absurd and invidious.

Well, we’re only a couple months in. 

[JimmyJames 12,271]

48 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

Weird Response. 
 

Your response is instructive. Your first instinct is to explicitly excuse dishonesty when it’s called out. 
 

I never worshiped at any high church of lies. I supported some things, opposed a lot of others from Trump. I’ve never been a partisan, always more of a right leaning both sides person. Your inability to see beyond black and white betrays your mental simplicity. 
 

Every thing this guy just said is total bullshit. 

[GRHorn 105]

How many hysterical posters here called this Russian disinformation?  Everyone? 

Of course it was always real. Dumb 

[JimmyJames 12,271]

Just now, GRHorn said:

Well, we’re only a couple months in. 

Stop pretending that we don’t know what you are. It’s insulting.

[JimmyJames 12,271]

51 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

Weird Response. 
 

Your response is instructive. Your first instinct is to explicitly excuse dishonesty when it’s called out. 
 

I never worshiped at any high church of lies. I supported some things, opposed a lot of others from Trump. I’ve never been a partisan, always more of a right leaning both sides person. Your inability to see beyond black and white betrays your mental simplicity. 
 

You supported trump unconditionally. Stop lying like your god trump does.

[GRHorn 105]

3 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

You supported trump unconditionally. Stop lying like your god trump does.

Nope. There’s been multiple things that I’ve said Trump was poor on. Most importantly, terrible messaging especially at the beginning of the Covid pandemic. 
 

You’re so pathetic. 

[JimmyJames 12,271]

2 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

Nope. There’s been multiple things that I’ve said Trump was poor on. Most importantly, terrible messaging especially at the beginning of the Covid pandemic. 
 

You’re so pathetic. 

You do realize that your avatar of your shitty ass meal that you bragged about until called on it gives you away as a troll right?

[GRHorn 105]

8 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

You do realize that your avatar of your shitty ass meal that you bragged about until called on it gives you away as a troll right?

Bob’s Steak and Chop House is awesome. Don’t you have HP connections? You’ve never been to the one on Lemmon?

[JimmyJames 12,271]

1 minute ago, GRHorn said:

Bob’s Steak and Chop House is awesome. Don’t you have HP connections? You’ve never been to the one on Lemmon?

Now I know you’re lying. If I cared enough I’d go find your original post on this but maybe I will later.  Can’t recall the thread. But it’s perfectly obvious anyway that you didn’t get that shitty ass disgusting meal from Bob’s.