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COVID-19 vaccine discussion

Texas Jeff

By Texas Jeff
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Guest Lobo

Guest Lobo

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Posted (edited)

And with more long-haul cases derived from the Delta variant emerging every single week, looks like billions to be made in decades of treatment for millions of Americans long after the hundreds of billions in this current 24 month cycle of urgent & intensive care/treatment & therapeutic research.

But yeah, that sweet $14 vaccine profit-grab...that's where the real evil lies! 

Big Booster is behind all of this!  Big Booster is behind the Urban Meyer scandal as well!  

Edited by Lobo
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Dontshootrude
Dontshootrude

Reading the last couple pages of this thread, I can't help but jump in here.  I'm a molecular biologist.  I'm happy to verify with the mods, just PM me so I don't dox myself.  I have not read most of

EE2B
EE2B

This was posted by an ER doc from a local hospital: I have been mostly silent on the COVID surge but I feel it’s a duty and responsibility for healthcare professionals to report what we are seeing an

Somnio
Somnio

You're a fascist who wishes death and suffering upon people.  You're why genocide has happened throughout history.  I've seen your vile posts before.  You need help.  Seriously, I'll swallow my pride

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midtown

midtown 3346

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Lobo said:

But yeah, that sweet $14 vaccine profit-grab...that's where the real evil lies! 

Is the per shot profit only $14?   Is that a real number?   Per Bloomberg Pfizers vaccine will be the best selling medicine of all time.   As it should be because they are saving hundreds of thousands if not millions of lives.   

And anyone who has done any reading about vaccine and money knows that drug companies would make 100x by letting people get sick.  I think the average profit per vaccine in the US is something like $50 so I wonder about that $14 number especially with something so ground breaking.     It's not even the per shot profit.  It's the perception that boosters are being pushed when you can't even get a consensus from the scientific community or the CDC. an in fact I would say the majority are saying tap the brakes on boosters. 

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Guest Lobo

Guest Lobo

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I picked $14 because Rodney Dangerfield made it sound funny to me in Caddyshack when I was eight.  I have no idea, it was hyperbole for effect.  The idea that vaccines/boosters are just profit ruses from Big Pharma is absurd given how much more they'll make on treatments/therapuetics/long-haul shit.  At this point, people are just looking for rationalizations to not get vaccinated because it's the last thing they can cling to in order to demonstrate ostensible control over their own lives.

But it's like Brad Pitt said in "Fury"...this war is almost over...but before it ends...a whole lot more people gotta die first.  35% of this country were epidemiologists when this started, then actuaries, then they became physicians, then bio-chemists, then pharmacists, then veterinarians, and now they're forensic accountants auditing the books of big pharma corporations.  Next week, they'll all suddenly be versed in the intricacies of Hematology or whatever the fuck their cousin-in-law is posting on facebook or heard at a rally.  

Our trucking company is in the casket business.  And business is good. 

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Captainant

Captainant 27682

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Lobo said:

I picked $14 because Rodney Dangerfield made it sound funny to me in Caddyshack when I was eight.  I have no idea, it was hyperbole for effect.  The idea that vaccines/boosters are just profit ruses from Big Pharma is absurd given how much more they'll make on treatments/therapuetics/long-haul shit.  At this point, people are just looking for rationalizations to not get vaccinated because it's the last thing they can cling to in order to demonstrate ostensible control over their own lives.

But it's like Brad Pitt said in "Fury"...this war is almost over...but before it ends...a whole lot more people gotta die first.  35% of this country were epidemiologists when this started, then actuaries, then they became physicians, then bio-chemists, then pharmacists, then veterinarians, and now they're forensic accountants auditing the books of big pharma corporations.  Next week, they'll all suddenly be versed in the intricacies of Hematology or whatever the fuck their cousin-in-law is posting on facebook or heard at a rally.  

Our trucking company is in the casket business.  And business is good. 

the irony in this whole thing is that the much-vaunted COVID therapeutics preferred by antivaxxers are really the products being marked up 40x

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Dontshootrude

Dontshootrude 374

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7 hours ago, midtown said:

Agreed.   Is there a single trial on boosters?    I'd say the booster is possibly adding to the anti-vax hesitancy where even someone as pro-vax as I am looks at the vaccine now as a constant money maker pushed on a public where scientists and the FDA don't agree about a booster. 

 

There are multiple trials on boosters.  Israel already published a massive one.  UK has released data and I suspect we won't be that far behind.  

By the end of the month we should have safety and efficacy data from mixing different shots as boosters.  That's going to be really interesting.

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Dontshootrude

Dontshootrude 374

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Large study on vaccine efficacy waning out of Qatar published hours ago: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2114114

The bad news: They report only a 20% efficacy against infection 6 months after the second shot, with efficacy against symptomatic infections being slightly higher.

The good news: "Meanwhile, BNT162b2-induced protection against hospitalization and death persisted with hardly any waning for 6 months after the second dose."

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23479

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:


Wut?

Pfizer's CSO indicated that they selected their dose based on the early phase data, trying to thread the needle between efficacy and side effects by choosing the lowest dose necessary to hit their immune response targets. Moderna went with a much larger dose. Point Moderna.

Pfizer ran out a three week interval. Moderna a four week interval. US stuck to the label, UK and Canada and others extended intervals even further. Extended intervals appear superior. Point Moderna, point UK/canada.

Hard to disentangle which (dose or interval) is more important, but Pfizer appears to have come up on the short side of both.  

 

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Buzzrock

Buzzrock 14926

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Posted

It would help if the vaccine was positioned as an option with risks instead of no-cost risk-free panacea. You can’t get through a tv show without a drug ad that includes a laundry list of side effects (my favorite is “do not take Duplexis if you are allergic to Duplexis”), and yet the vaccine risks are rarely acknowledged.

“This is the best info we have, it’s not risk free but no drug is, here are the risks to best of our knowledge and we still think it’s a better option than not getting vaccinated, and here’s why. Talk to your doctor and please get the shot.” Something like that (I’m obviously not a PR pro).

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Neonmoon

Neonmoon 38129

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Buzzrock said:

It would help if the vaccine was positioned as an option with risks instead of no-cost risk-free panacea. You can’t get through a tv show without a drug ad that includes a laundry list of side effects (my favorite is “do not take Duplexis if you are allergic to Duplexis”), and yet the vaccine risks are rarely acknowledged.

“This is the best info we have, it’s not risk free but no drug is, here are the risks to best of our knowledge and we still think it’s a better option than not getting vaccinated, and here’s why. Talk to your doctor and please get the shot.” Something like that (I’m obviously not a PR pro).

It would not help

The vaccine risks are the most scrutinized and widely acknowledged of any drug to hit the market (see multiple times clinics and some country programs were shutdown due to a POSSIBILITY a FEW people out of millions died or had adverse actions.) 

Obviously 

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Satoshi

Satoshi 129

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Neonmoon said:

Why is Moderna only doing a half dose booster trial?

Because you likely don’t need a full dose to boost antibodies and the lower dose could cut down on side effects. Probably a smart move given that restrictions are now being put on their vaccine in some countries. 
 

 

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midtown

midtown 3346

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Posted (edited)

Wonder about the reason for that chart.  Seems to go against every the scientific community tells us.   Or is is that the unvaccinated have all contracted covid and so its more and more break throughs?  Are vaccinated allowed to do more things so they are out and about more?

Edited by midtown
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Neonmoon

Neonmoon 38129

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1 hour ago, Satoshi said:

Weekly Uk survey has some interesting data. Vaccine protects against severe illness as we know, but case rates are higher in vaccinated in most age cohorts. 
 

42593-FD5-4-B4-F-4-C8-F-908-E-48-D3908-C

Source-https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-vaccine-weekly-surveillance-reports

 

What are the vaccination vs non-vaccination percentages in England?

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Satoshi

Satoshi 129

Posted
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25 minutes ago, midtown said:

Wonder about the reason for that chart.  Seems to go against every the scientific community tells us.   Or is is that the unvaccinated have all contracted covid and so its more and more break throughs?

I think they’re just presenting the numbers. They have a lot of centralized data collection there. I would assume the unvaccinated case numbers are lowered some by people with natural immunity but I didn’t see an attempt at quantifying that effect here. 
 

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Satoshi

Satoshi 129

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7 minutes ago, kevwun said:

Oh, look who's giddily spreading bullshit about vaccines again.  Fucking shocking.

These are government numbers. Someone is experiencing cognitive dissonance. 
 

I’m not saying the vaccines don’t work or don’t provide protection because they clearly do.
 

These government collected, population wide numbers do seem to punch a big hole in the argument behind vaccine passes. If you can have more cases per capita, although milder, in vaccinated persons then what is the benefit of restricting the freedoms of a large amount of the population? 
 

 

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bolverk

bolverk 29694

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2 hours ago, Satoshi said:

Weekly Uk survey has some interesting data. Vaccine protects against severe illness as we know, but case rates are higher in vaccinated in most age cohorts. 
 

42593-FD5-4-B4-F-4-C8-F-908-E-48-D3908-C

Source-https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-vaccine-weekly-surveillance-reports

 

 

1 hour ago, Satoshi said:

I think they’re just presenting the numbers. They have a lot of centralized data collection there. I would assume the unvaccinated case numbers are lowered some by people with natural immunity but I didn’t see an attempt at quantifying that effect here. 
 

Bullshit. Here's their analysis from the previous page.

image.png.34dd82d7836a00941e69a2f9061c48f8.png

Edited by bolverk
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Anastasis

Anastasis 23479

Posted
Posted (edited)

 

2 hours ago, Satoshi said:

Weekly Uk survey has some interesting data. Vaccine protects against severe illness as we know, but case rates are higher in vaccinated in most age cohorts. 

 

Who cares about cases that don't result in severe disease or hospitalization?  

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Captainant

Captainant 27682

Posted
Posted

I have no idea why this site tolerates alleged """medical professionals""" that relentlessly repeat misrepresentations of clinical studies and disinformation articles based on pre-print horse shit.

Every single thing that GRUmuySatoshi posts is anti-vaccine and questions the utility and efficacy of COVID vaccination. Can we just fucking scrape this shit off our shoes already??

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HouTex

HouTex 1886

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Posted

Y’all need to read today’s The Morning op-ed in the NYTimes.

https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/pT2bo6XAPjGWyDihe4AYNg~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRjQqBwP0S_aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubnl0aW1lcy5jb20vYnkvZGF2aWQtbGVvbmhhcmR0P2NhbXBhaWduX2lkPTkmZW1jPWVkaXRfbm5fMjAyMTEwMDgmaW5zdGFuY2VfaWQ9NDIzMjcmbmw9dGhlLW1vcm5pbmcmcmVnaV9pZD0xMTM5MTk4OTEmc2VnbWVudF9pZD03MDk4NSZ0ZT0xJnVzZXJfaWQ9YWI3NjAzOTc4ZDBjYTRjMTJhZDI0MWZmNjM4NDYxZjFXA255dEIKYV9wG2BhP70smFIUZGF2aWR6ZHVua0BnbWFpbC5jb21YBAAAAAA~

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bolverk

bolverk 29694

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17 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

The highlighted are total throw away lines, tbh. 

Not sure I agree. The data, as presented, don't take into account which vaccine was used for what percentage of the population in each age cohort. Nor does it break it down further than "second dose greater than 14 days prior to the specimen," which means we're also looking at folks who may have been fully vaccinated 4-6 months prior. And we all know that the effectiveness of the vaccine wanes over time (at least we know that about Pfizer). Moreover, the UK has greatly relied on AstraZenaca, which their data show to be not even as effective as Pfizer. For example, from the same report:

image.png.734279019bb08d462ce5e3fcc9c5198b.png

Again, the table doesn't exhibit nearly the amount of data needed to reach any bold conclusions. You know, nuance.

 

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23479

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Posted
1 minute ago, bolverk said:

Not sure I agree.

You just spent more time and word count describing some potential limitations of the data than the authors did. And you didn't even scrape the surface. The highlighted reflect laziness of the manuscript authors.  Or word count nazi-ism from the editors. Probably both. 

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Buzzrock

Buzzrock 14926

Posted
Posted
Its misinformation that has put an unvaxxed friend of ours in the hospital and on a ventilator.

I’m first off very sorry for you and the friend. That sucks.

But I’m genuinely interested in where the misinformation came from and what it was. Most times when I ask that question I hear “Facebook” but Fb is a platform to host info from other sources.
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texasdago

texasdago 7575

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42 minutes ago, Buzzrock said:


I’m first off very sorry for you and the friend. That sucks.

But I’m genuinely interested in where the misinformation came from and what it was. Most times when I ask that question I hear “Facebook” but Fb is a platform to host info from other sources.

Well, I know this particular person would pass around videos from ministries that talked all about the vaccine being used for control, discussion on technology that could then be used for the mark of the beast, etc.  Lots of "off the rocker" conspiracies. She would pass it on to my SIL who is a teacher and try to convince her not to get vaccinated.  Wish I could find the video.  All you have to do is google Mark of the Beast and vaccine on YouTube and you'll get the general idea.

Edited by texasdago
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Captainant

Captainant 27682

Posted
Posted
50 minutes ago, Buzzrock said:

I’m first off very sorry for you and the friend. That sucks.

But I’m genuinely interested in where the misinformation came from and what it was. Most times when I ask that question I hear “Facebook” but Fb is a platform to host info from other sources.

Serious answer - the majority of FB disinfo originated from just a handful of accounts, per NPR's investigation. A mere dozen FB accounts generate 73% of the shared posts that propagate the disinformation and talking points that satoshi graces us with here.

But wouldn't you know it - whenever platform holders try to remove disinformation that contributes to the deaths of hundreds of thousands from their platforms , they're accused of censorship and only take half measures that fail to actually remove the cancer.

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Buzzrock

Buzzrock 14926

Posted
Posted
Well, I know this particular person would pass around videos from ministries that talked all about the vaccine being used for control, discussion on technology that could then be used for the mark of the beast, etc.  Lots of "off the rocker" conspiracies. She would pass it on to my SIL who is a teacher and try to convince her not to get vaccinated.  Wish I could find the video.  All you have to do is google Mark of the Beast and vaccine on YouTube and you'll get the general idea.

FFS. Ghastly. Once again I’m sorry for your friends. My work buddy is burying his mother today (she was vaccinated though). I hope your friend gets better.
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