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COVID-19 vaccine discussion

Texas Jeff

By Texas Jeff
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Dontshootrude
Dontshootrude

Reading the last couple pages of this thread, I can't help but jump in here.  I'm a molecular biologist.  I'm happy to verify with the mods, just PM me so I don't dox myself.  I have not read most of

EE2B
EE2B

This was posted by an ER doc from a local hospital: I have been mostly silent on the COVID surge but I feel it’s a duty and responsibility for healthcare professionals to report what we are seeing an

Somnio
Somnio

You're a fascist who wishes death and suffering upon people.  You're why genocide has happened throughout history.  I've seen your vile posts before.  You need help.  Seriously, I'll swallow my pride

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washparkhorn

washparkhorn 9973

Posted
Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, XYZ said:

That is the dumbest fucking thing I’ve ever read.

Because . . . you didn't understand it?

It's long?

It includes a reference/analogy you don't understand?

Or the science is wrong? If so, why.

Thanks in advance. It is aimed at learners, not the general public, but personal feelings on its effectiveness can be helpful.  

 

Edited by washparkhorn
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Anastasis

Anastasis 23720

Posted
Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Liquor and Poker said:

So my wife just read a Q&A with a doctor where someone asked “Everyone in my family has had both shots. Can we all get together?”  And the doctor said “no because we just don’t know.” WTF?

Not only just a stupid thing to say, but horrible public health messaging. 

 

"Everyone needs to get the vaccine so that we can get back to normal."

"My whole family has been vaccinated, can we start to get back to normal in a controlled environment."

"NO!  We just don't know!"

Edited by Anastasis
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Anastasis

Anastasis 23720

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, washparkhorn said:

Thanks in advance. It is aimed at learners, not the general public, but personal feelings on its effectiveness can be helpful.  

This is a better one for learners imo, what I have shown my kids.  And bonus, it included the story of the McClellan lab at UT and their involvement. \

 

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texhorn

texhorn 356

Posted
Posted
APH has now said there is no maximum time between first and second doses.  what a cluster.

The CDC guidance page they linked to in this morning’s tweet says this:

The second dose should be administered as close to the recommended interval as possible. However, if it is not feasible to adhere to the recommended interval and a delay in vaccination is unavoidable, the second dose of Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna COVID-19 vaccines may be administered up to 6 weeks (42 days) after the first dose. There are currently limited data on efficacy of mRNA COVID-19 vaccines administered beyond this window. If the second dose is administered beyond these intervals, there is no need to restart the series.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/info-by-product/clinical-considerations.html

I’m not seeing “there is no maximum”. shitshow, indeed.
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dcar00

dcar00 14973

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, texhorn said:


The CDC guidance page they linked to in this morning’s tweet says this:

The second dose should be administered as close to the recommended interval as possible. However, if it is not feasible to adhere to the recommended interval and a delay in vaccination is unavoidable, the second dose of Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna COVID-19 vaccines may be administered up to 6 weeks (42 days) after the first dose. There are currently limited data on efficacy of mRNA COVID-19 vaccines administered beyond this window. If the second dose is administered beyond these intervals, there is no need to restart the series.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/info-by-product/clinical-considerations.html

I’m not seeing “there is no maximum”. shitshow, indeed.

https://austintexas.gov/news/aph-provides-update-covid-19-testing-and-vaccination-sites

 

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23720

Posted
Posted

Looks to me like FDA has green lit an abbreviated authorization process for booster vaccines against variants strains. This goes back to something mentioned up thread.  If we can get comfortable with the mRNA technology, it will allow for rapid response to address variants as they emerge by tweaking the vaccine. Looks like the FDA has arrived at that position given the current situation (sec 3, pg 19, clinical). 

https://www.fda.gov/media/142749/download

 

The effectiveness of a modified COVID-19 vaccine can be evaluated based on the efficacy of the manufacturer’s authorized prototype COVID-19 vaccine made by the same process and for which a clinical disease endpoint efficacy study has been conducted that met FDA pre-specified success criteria. A determination of effectiveness should be supported by conducting clinical immunogenicity studies. These immunogenicity studies should compare immune responses induced by the modified vaccine against the SARSCoV-2 variant(s) of concern with those induced by the prototype vaccine against the virus upon which the prototype vaccine was based. The immunogenicity studies to assess the effectiveness of a primary series and a booster dose of the modified COVID-19 vaccine are described below: 

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

Posted
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, dcar00 said:

nope. they are just incompetent.  but par for the course for Austin

 

Or they're following the science and the new data that shows a longer delay between the first and second shot is at worst the same thing as, and very likely _more protective_ than getting them 3 (or 4) weeks apart. 

Anastasis made a very strong case a week or so ago for why we should only be giving first shots right now and delaying the second until everyone has had their first. Austin probably did a similar analysis and thought exercise and realized the same. They aren't doing anything different than many other countries are already doing based off of the science. 

What about Austin's plan do you disagree with? 

 

PS You should move somewhere else. You clearly hate it there.

Edited by BradInATX
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ABSR

ABSR 5370

Posted
Posted
21 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

 

Or they're following the science and the new data that shows a longer delay between the first and second shot is at worst the same thing as, and very likely _more protective_ than getting them 3 (or 4) weeks apart. 

 

From the APH site.  This is underlined and in BOLD Blue font on their site " There is no maximum time between the first and second doses for either vaccine. "

From the CDC website linked above "The second dose should be administered as close to the recommended interval as possible. However, if it is not feasible to adhere to the recommended interval and a delay in vaccination is unavoidable, the second dose of Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna COVID-19 vaccines may be administered up to 6 weeks (42 days) after the first dose."

So APH is saying the gap can be infinite and the CDC is saying up to 6 weeks.   So they don't seem to be "following the science".  

If you have an amplifying/updated CDC link you can provide that says there is no maximum interval, please share.

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Red Five

Red Five 41738

Posted
Posted
18 minutes ago, CooterBrown said:

In line at Kelly Reeves since 11:30. The entire parking lot is the queue where you wait in your car. I assume they give you the shot through the window. I’m gonna guess it’s a 2-4 hour wait since I have yet to see a line near me move forward.

What time was your appt?

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dcar00

dcar00 14973

Posted
Posted
Just now, ABSR said:

From the APH site.  This is underlined and in BOLD Blue font on their site " There is no maximum time between the first and second doses for either vaccine. "

From the CDC website linked above "The second dose should be administered as close to the recommended interval as possible. However, if it is not feasible to adhere to the recommended interval and a delay in vaccination is unavoidable, the second dose of Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna COVID-19 vaccines may be administered up to 6 weeks (42 days) after the first dose."

So APH is saying the gap can be infinite and the CDC is saying up to 6 weeks.   So they don't seem to be "following the science".  

If you have an amplifying/updated CDC link you can provide that says there is no maximum interval, please share.

exactly. this has nothing to do with science. they are just doing that to try to stop people from signing up for the second dose for now.  how long that will last who knows.

BTW, I am not saying Anastasis isn't correct but APH is just bullshitting at this point.

will be 42 days for my wife on Thursday.  It would be fine if you could actually set an appointment out in time but they won't let you even do that.  they are a clusterfuck.

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, ABSR said:

From the APH site.  This is underlined and in BOLD Blue font on their site " There is no maximum time between the first and second doses for either vaccine. "

From the CDC website linked above "The second dose should be administered as close to the recommended interval as possible. However, if it is not feasible to adhere to the recommended interval and a delay in vaccination is unavoidable, the second dose of Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna COVID-19 vaccines may be administered up to 6 weeks (42 days) after the first dose."

So APH is saying the gap can be infinite and the CDC is saying up to 6 weeks.   So they don't seem to be "following the science".  

If you have an amplifying/updated CDC link you can provide that says there is no maximum interval, please share.

 

The city is saying "no maximum time" because a bunch of triggered retards will throw a tantrum and cry and moan about COA if a plague of locusts or nuclear war delays your second shot until the seventh week.

This gives them time to reassess supply chain and continue to follow the science.

 

AstraZeneca is actually more effective with a longer gap between doses: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/02/03/delaying-second-astrazeneca-vaccine-dose-does-work-study-shows.html

Studies underway for Pfizer and Moderna on the same thing.

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

Posted
Posted

 

Just now, BradInATX said:

a bunch of triggered retards will throw a tantrum and cry and moan about COA if a plague of locusts or nuclear war delays your second shot until the seventh week.

 

 

Quote

exactly. this has nothing to do with science. they are just doing that to try to stop people from signing up for the second dose for now.  how long that will last who knows.

BTW, I am not saying Anastasis isn't correct but APH is just bullshitting at this point.

 

will be 42 days for my wife on Thursday.  It would be fine if you could actually set an appointment out in time but they won't let you even do that.  they are a clusterfuck.

 

 

See?

 

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

Posted
Posted (edited)

*Looks at UK data where they're delaying the second shot indefinitely and they have the sharpest decline in cases in the Western World*

*Looks at Astrazeneca data showing that the vaccine is actually more effective the longer you wait for the second shot*

*Looks at data showing that one shot of Pfizer and Moderna is nearly as effective as two shots*

 

"They're definitely doing it just because they don't like me and reasons and stuff!! Fucking COA.. I need to speak to your manager. It's not fair!"

Edited by BradInATX
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dcar00

dcar00 14973

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

 

The city is saying "no maximum time" because a bunch of triggered retards will throw a tantrum and cry and moan about COA if a plague of locusts or nuclear war delays your second shot until the seventh week.

This gives them time to reassess supply chain and continue to follow the science.

 

AstraZeneca is actually more effective with a longer gap between doses: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/02/03/delaying-second-astrazeneca-vaccine-dose-does-work-study-shows.html

Studies underway for Pfizer and Moderna on the same thing.

see.  its not about science when you claimed it was.  they aren't following the science if they don't agree with the CDC.  quit obfuscating for obvious bullshit.

they won't let you schedule an appointment even in March. its incompetence.

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dcar00

dcar00 14973

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

*Looks at UK data where they're delaying the second shot indefinitely and they have the sharpest decline in cases in the Western World*

*Looks at Astrazeneca data showing that the vaccine is actually more effective the longer you wait for the second shot*

*Looks at data showing that one shot of Pfizer and Moderna is nearly as effective as two shots*

 

"They're definitely doing it just because they don't like me and reasons and stuff!! Fucking COA.. I need to speak to your manager!"

well where is the CDC on this?  you know the smartest guys in the room.

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dcar00

dcar00 14973

Posted
Posted
On 2/20/2021 at 8:08 AM, kevwun said:

My wife's 2nd shot got cancelled for this coming week because the Hub says they aren't going to have new vaccines on Monday.  I hope this gets unfucked fast.  She was supposed to get it this week, but it got moved to next week because of the weather.

you must be triggered per BradinATX.  no one needs the 2nd shot.

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

well where is the CDC on this?  you know the smartest guys in the room.

 

The CDC is one voice of many. What are your thoughts on the rest of the data showing longer waits between shots are more effective and that the fastest path to herd immunity is giving everybody a first shot first?

Do you disagree with any of that? Have any thoughts?

Or did you just need to vent today? It's okay, everyone has emotions.

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smoky

smoky 842

Posted
Posted

I'd wager the "No maximum time between shots 1 and 2" is more to calm the people who were at the four week mark last week and could not get theirs due to the weather.

I don't think it's because APH is trying to get as many 1st shots in arms.  I'm basing that on the fact that APH's vaccine dashboard has not shown that they've administered as many first doses (37K) as they've received through Feb 6th (48k).  

 

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Anastasis

Anastasis 23720

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, smoky said:

I'd wager the "No maximum time between shots 1 and 2" is more to calm the people who were at the four week mark last week and could not get theirs due to the weather.

I don't think it's because APH is trying to get as many 1st shots in arms.  I'm basing that on the fact that APH's vaccine dashboard has not shown that they've administered as many first doses (37K) as they've received through Feb 6th (48k).  

Agree. I don't think this reflects any real change in approach, just trying to clam people that have been delayed on the second shot for either supply or administration delays due to weather. 

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dcar00

dcar00 14973

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, smoky said:

I'd wager the "No maximum time between shots 1 and 2" is more to calm the people who were at the four week mark last week and could not get theirs due to the weather.

I don't think it's because APH is trying to get as many 1st shots in arms.  I'm basing that on the fact that APH's vaccine dashboard has not shown that they've administered as many first doses (37K) as they've received through Feb 6th (48k).  

 

That would be fine if they were letting you schedule a second shot at some point out in time but they arent. That was happening before the weather event as well.

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

Posted
Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

That would be fine if they were letting you schedule a second shot at some point out in time but they arent. That was happening before the weather event as well.

 

You sure are anxious to get your wife the vaccine for a guy who's been downplaying the severity of COVID for the last twelve months.

Edited by BradInATX
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CooterBrown

CooterBrown 18288

Posted
Posted
51 minutes ago, Red Five said:

Huh. Mine is for later this week at 3:30. Wonder when I should get there. 

My wife went with me just in case they would give her one but they weren't giving shots to those without an appointment.

However, we were thinking that if you showed up late in the day, they may let anybody with you get one also just so they don't waste any shots that have to be given that day.

If you have someone without an appointment, I would show up at 3:15 to assure you're in line to get yours but they may be able to get one also.

If it's just you, I'd go whenever it's convenient. 

 

 

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Murfdogg21

Murfdogg21 4563

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, BradInATX said:

*Looks at UK data where they're delaying the second shot indefinitely and they have the sharpest decline in cases in the Western World*

*Looks at Astrazeneca data showing that the vaccine is actually more effective the longer you wait for the second shot*

*Looks at data showing that one shot of Pfizer and Moderna is nearly as effective as two shots*

 

"They're definitely doing it just because they don't like me and reasons and stuff!! Fucking COA.. I need to speak to your manager. It's not fair!"

So APH should go rogue and deviate from FDA and CDC guidance? I don’t refute the potential benefit of a delayed second dose, but I thought the narrative was to listen to our federal overlords on all things Covid? It seems like a huge liability to intentionally schedule second round shots against federal and manufacturers’ instructions because your own boys in the lab have a theory and it may help your supply chain issues or allow you get more first round shots administered to others. 

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Murfdogg21 said:

So APH should go rogue and deviate from FDA and CDC guidance? I don’t refute the potential benefit of a delayed second dose, but I thought the narrative was to listen to our federal overlords on all things Covid? It seems like a huge liability to intentionally schedule second round shots against federal and manufacturers’ instructions because your own boys in the lab have a theory and it may help your supply chain issues or allow you get more first round shots administered to others. 

 

Yes, doing what the third largest country in the Western world has done the entire time, with more success than we've had with our two dose program, is following the theory of "your own boys in the lab".

What a dishonest, shitty post. Trying to get more doses to more people in a way that's proven to bend the curve faster is "helping your supply chain issues". Following the plan the UK has been doing the whole time is flying by the seat of your pants with your "boys in the lab".

 

Question for you. Do you know why the 21 and 28 day plans were implemented by Pfizer and Moderna? 

Edited by BradInATX
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Armybrat

Armybrat 41408

Posted
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, CooterBrown said:

In line at Kelly Reeves since 11:30. The entire parking lot is the queue where you wait in your car. I assume they give you the shot through the window. I’m gonna guess it’s a 2-4 hour wait since I have yet to see a line near me move forward.

When we were there 2 weeks ago, after we checked in it took about 5 minutes to get the shot, then the 15 minute wait to see if we would go tits up.... or belly up in my case.

I imagine they are trying to accommodate last week’s postponed appointments too, hence the jammed crowd. And yes, you don’t have to get out of your car.

 

252B284C-8CB5-4FC8-B2E2-D43D5AED82D5.jpeg

Edited by Armybrat
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CooterBrown

CooterBrown 18288

Posted
Posted
Just now, Armybrat said:

When we were there 2 weeks ago, after we checked in it took about 5 minutes to get the shot, then the 15 minute wait to see if we would go tits up.... or belly up in my case.

I'm gonna guess it was due to all the rescheduled appointments from the past week. My appointment was supposed to be on FRI and it was pushed to today.

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Murfdogg21

Murfdogg21 4563

Posted
Posted
Just now, BradInATX said:

Question for you. Do you know why the 21 and 28 day plans were implemented by Pfizer and Moderna? 

Based on my personal experience negotiating trials and testing requirements with FDA, probably some bullshit schedule matrix that was created by a PhD that just started working at FDA 18 months ago. 

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