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This seems just a little illegal. Company mandates prayer

crash_davis

By crash_davis
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Js1

Js1 85110

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Just now, Neonmoon said:

Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 prohibits employers from discriminating against individuals because of their religion (or lack of religious belief) in hiring, firing, or any other terms and conditions of employment.

https://www.eeoc.gov/laws/guidance/fact-sheet-religious-discrimination
 

 

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crash_davis

crash_davis 23084

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https://www.eeoc.gov/statutes/title-vii-civil-rights-act-1964

There are many clauses relating to religion. I assume the below applies in this case.

UNLAWFUL EMPLOYMENT PRACTICES

SEC. 2000e-2. [Section 703]

(a) Employer practices

It shall be an unlawful employment practice for an employer -

(1) to fail or refuse to hire or to discharge any individual, or otherwise to discriminate against any individual with respect to his compensation, terms, conditions, or privileges of employment, because of such individual's race, color, religion, sex, or national origin; or

(2) to limit, segregate, or classify his employees or applicants for employment in any way which would deprive or tend to deprive any individual of employment opportunities or otherwise adversely affect his status as an employee, because of such individual's race, color, religion, sex, or national origin.

(b) Employment agency practices

It shall be an unlawful employment practice for an employment agency to fail or refuse to refer for employment, or otherwise to discriminate against, any individual because of his race, color, religion, sex, or national origin, or to classify or refer for employment any individual on the basis of his race, color, religion, sex, or national origin.

(c) Labor organization practices

It shall be an unlawful employment practice for a labor organization-

(1) to exclude or to expel from its membership, or otherwise to discriminate against, any individual because of his race, color, religion, sex, or national origin;

(2) to limit, segregate, or classify its membership or applicants for membership, or to classify or fail or refuse to refer for employment any individual, in any way which would deprive or tend to deprive any individual of employment opportunities, or would limit such employment opportunities or otherwise adversely affect his status as an employee or as an applicant for employment, because of such individual's race, color, religion, sex, or national origin; or

(3) to cause or attempt to cause an employer to discriminate against an individual in violation of this section.

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crash_davis

crash_davis 23084

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Js1 brings up a good point. Will those asshats find a way to allow companies and private entities to "discriminate" based on religion because not allowing them to do so would be to discriminate against the companies because of their religions beliefs? I can't believe I just typed up that circular logic sentence and it may be a possibility.

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Neonmoon

Neonmoon 38127

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5 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Company has to have at least 15 employees. Otherwise they can discriminate to their hearts content. Have no idea how many employees this company has. 

http://www.thebluebook.com/iProView/1598457/aurora-pro-services/subcontractors/
 

Correct. says 10-19 employees but also says this 

Quote

Licensed General Contractor and HVAC Contractor out of Greensboro, NC.  Our niche project is under 10K SF.  Our company specializes in HVAC Installs and Service, Renovations, Carpentry, Non Structural Metal and Wood Framing, Drywall, Painting and Ceiling systems.  The success of everyone of our projects is our teams belief and fulfillment of our core values which we embed into our team every single day. 

Our Core Values

1. Serve God in everything that we do.

2. Safety: Only work in a safe manner and leave our job sites safe for the public.

3. Integrity: Always perform our duties to the best of our abilities and ask for help when needed. 

4. Customer Care: Provide our customers with solutions that benefits them most. 

I’m guessing if their core value is serve God, then it’s less than 15 employees 

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crash_davis

crash_davis 23084

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Just now, JimmyJames said:

To clarify you need 15 employees to be actionable for discrimination against your own employees.  Customers are a different issue. 

I believe in the reddit comments, the company has/had 17 employees. Not sure how anyone not directly related to the company would know.

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South Austin

South Austin 52144

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6 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 prohibits employers from discriminating against individuals because of their religion (or lack of religious belief) in hiring, firing, or any other terms and conditions of employment.

https://www.eeoc.gov/laws/guidance/fact-sheet-religious-discrimination
 

 

Got it. Never dabbled in 1983 litigation. I just generally know I can’t grab tits in the workplace.

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Js1

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3 minutes ago, crash_davis said:

Js1 brings up a good point. Will those asshats find a way to allow companies and private entities to "discriminate" based on religion because not allowing them to do so would be to discriminate against the companies because of their religions beliefs? I can't believe I just typed up that circular logic sentence and it may be a possibility.

This is the moment they've been waiting for. 

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JimmyJames

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1 minute ago, crash_davis said:

I believe in the reddit comments, the company has/had 17 employees. Not sure how anyone not directly related to the company would know.

Looked at their website photo and 17 people are pictured on it. But who knows. It also depends on how long in the past year they have had that many. 

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Nice Guy Eddie

Nice Guy Eddie 13414

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smh at people that constantly try to convert others to their religious beliefs.

Do Texas schools still have prayer or silent meditation moments? I had basketball for home room all 4 years in high school. When I was a senior, I discovered the rest of the school had daily prayer time and sung the pledge of allegiance at least once per week. Our coach opted to have us play full-court instead. We got more out of that time.

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gyroprotagonist

gyroprotagonist 2591

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9 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Then when they ask for help, tell them to pull themselves up by their bootstraps. 

They could have at least waited until the Lord's work was done in striking down Obamacare before firing him.

If I worked for a zealot that threatened to fire people who did not pray I would ask to lead and then...

tenor.gif?itemid=12664915

 

 

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 104624

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49 minutes ago, crash_davis said:

Js1 brings up a good point. Will those asshats find a way to allow companies and private entities to "discriminate" based on religion because not allowing them to do so would be to discriminate against the companies because of their religions beliefs? I can't believe I just typed up that circular logic sentence and it may be a possibility.

That's exactly their end game, and they're not particularly shy about saying so.  It's really sad, and pathetic.  When racism and other discrimination were cracked down on in general, they moved on from being just plain-old racist and judgmental assholes to being FAITH-BASED discriminatory assholes -- and if you do it in the name of religion, it's ALL okay.

Legally, it's shit.

Theologically, it's even shittier.

They manage to be a layer cake of shittiness.

48 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

To clarify you need 15 employees to be actionable for discrimination against your own employees.  Customers are a different issue. 

Yeah, need more definitive info about the employer to see if there's an actionable claim.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 104624

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3 minutes ago, RDCanecutter said:

I mean, suppose they say you gotta pray to keep your job.

So you go pray. Who's to say the Spirit won't come over you, and make you speak in tongues? In a sort of high-pitched Donald Duck voice?

Or. how about this: "I pray that the owner's wife stops getting ass-fucked by the pool boy.  I pray that the owner gets over his erectile dysfunction.  I pray that Clem over there stops looking at gay porn on his phone while we're driving to a job.  I pray that Earl stops destroying the company shitter after all of our project meetings.  In the name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, this I pray.  Amen."

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Ghost of LL

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1 hour ago, crash_davis said:

Js1 brings up a good point. Will those asshats find a way to allow companies and private entities to "discriminate" based on religion because not allowing them to do so would be to discriminate against the companies because of their religions beliefs? I can't believe I just typed up that circular logic sentence and it may be a possibility.

There is something singularly bizarre about claiming that a corporate entity has a right to freedom of religion.  I get freedom of speech.  Corporate entities have interests, and I think it makes sense that they have freedom to speak on behalf of those interests?

But freedom of religion?  Can a corporate entity get baptized?  Does it take communion?  Does it somehow have to fast during Ramadan?  When it does, does it go to Valhalla?

The entire purpose of the corporate entity is that it is separate from its ownership.  Hobby Lobby may be owned by David Green.  But it is not David Green.  David Green can go to church on Sunday.  And when David Green dies, he may go to Heaven.  But Hobby Lobby does not die--it remains an existing corporate entity.  That is the entire reason why the English created the joint stock company 400 years ago.

The Supreme Court really fucked up in Burwell.  Don't give me this "originalism" nonsense when it trashes corporate law as the Founders would have understood it (and as all of Anglo-American jurisprudence would've understood it since the creation of the goddamned East India Company (which, goddamned though it may have been, could never die and be consigned to the fires of Hell)).

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RDCanecutter

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14 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Or. how about this: "I pray that the owner's wife stops getting ass-fucked by the pool boy.  I pray that the owner gets over his erectile dysfunction.  I pray that Clem over there stops looking at gay porn on his phone while we're driving to a job.  I pray that Earl stops destroying the company shitter after all of our project meetings.  In the name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, this I pray.  Amen."

I don't pray by talking. I pray by banging on this tambourine.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 104624

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4 hours ago, Neonmoon said:

Our Core Values

1. Serve God in everything that we do.

2. Safety: Only work in a safe manner and leave our job sites safe for the public.

3. Integrity: Always perform our duties to the best of our abilities and ask for help when needed. 

4. Customer Care: Provide our customers with solutions that benefits them most. 

Oh, and FYI, if you are ever contemplating doing business with an outfit, and see something like this -- where their #1 "core value" is "serve God," or they have plastered on their materials "Christian-owned business" -- run - don't walk, RUN - far away.  Odds are quite high that they will rip you off like a motherfucker.

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Nolacycling

Nolacycling 893

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Had a principal that prayed to start faculty meetings. What really bothered me was his sect believed one had to be baptized in their church to go to heaven. I have lost a child.

Secondly, I never use businesses that advertise their Christianity. Seems as if it could be a negotiating tactic for shoddy work.

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ShaggyBevo RIP

ShaggyBevo RIP 3868

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2 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

Oh, and FYI, if you are ever contemplating doing business with an outfit, and see something like this -- where their #1 "core value" is "serve God," or they have plastered on their materials "Christian-owned business" -- run - don't walk, RUN - far away.  Odds are quite high that they will rip you off like a motherfucker.

I always assume it will be at least 10% over market to cover their tithe.

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Helobious

Helobious 9481

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6 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

smh at people that constantly try to convert others to their religious beliefs.

Do Texas schools still have prayer or silent meditation moments? I had basketball for home room all 4 years in high school. When I was a senior, I discovered the rest of the school had daily prayer time and sung the pledge of allegiance at least once per week. Our coach opted to have us play full-court instead. We got more out of that time.

Pledge of allegiance just once a week? It was an every morning thing when I was in Texas public high school less than a decade ago. No explicit prayer time but there is a “moment of silence” after the pledge. 

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Mole

Mole 4320

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2 hours ago, Nolacycling said:

Had a principal that prayed to start faculty meetings. What really bothered me was his sect believed one had to be baptized in their church to go to heaven. I have lost a child.

Secondly, I never use businesses that advertise their Christianity. Seems as if it could be a negotiating tactic for shoddy work.

 

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