Dave Chappelle

[BHMCruiser 1814]

1 hour ago, troph said:

Enough to turn it off. He doesn’t deserve my time - just like this guy says, I don’t owe chappelle shit. 

from that link:

“It’s convenient for Black cishet male comedians to talk about LGBTQ+ folks as if our group is only or even predominantly white. With that frame, they don’t have to contend with how Black cishet folks often enact (physical and psychological) violence on Black LGBTQ+ folks.”

By the time Chappelle declares that “gender is a fact” and that he’s “Team TERF” in solidarity with J.K. Rowling, I turned my television off because I wasn’t having fun anymore. And part of freedom as I experience it is that I don’t owe Dave Chappelle any of my time.”

 

exactly. 

How much did you watch? Five minutes? Twenty minutes?

[troph 24905]

4 minutes ago, Deej said:

You're mad and hurt by his words. How many times have you laughed at a comedians words that probably made someone else mad and hurt them? 

Just shut it all down, I guess.

I’m not hurt, he’s not funny, he can say what he wants to say and so can I and other LGBTQ folks.  He’s telling jokes about people the overwhelming percentage of whom find his humor not funny at best and insulting at worst.  You can think it’s funny, we don’t think it is. You can do whatever you want with that, I really don’t give a fuck. 

[Gourmand 7774]

14 minutes ago, Deej said:

You're mad and hurt by his words. How many times have you laughed at a comedians words that probably made someone else mad and hurt them? 

Just shut it all down, I guess.

I'm a bald middle-aged white cis man who enjoys sex with my wife and internet pornography and beer and baseball and I found The Closer to be just as unfunny as troph. Am I also mad and hurt by his words? No, he is just a fucking idiot on this issue and he (and you) should listen to his critics in the trans community

[4th&Five 41586]

Anything CAN be funny. Jeselnik is my favorite comedian so I can laugh at anything. This special wasn’t funny though. There were barely any jokes. Give a Ted talk instead, Dave. 

[Deej 76897]

Never mind. You obviously think you should be immune from being offended. Enjoy that. 

Edited October 14, 2021 by Deej

[Gourmand 7774]

2 minutes ago, 4th&Five said:

Anything CAN be funny. Jeselnik is my favorite comedian so I can laugh at anything. This special wasn’t funny though. There were barely any jokes. Give a Ted talk instead, Dave. 

Yep, I had the same thought. I chuckled at the joke about a lot of courage on both sides of that glory hole but that was about it. He seemed like he was more motivated to score points on trans folk and cancel culture more than he was motivated to write a good comedy special.

 

[BHMCruiser 1814]

I didn’t think this was his funniest special. I thought he said a lot of thought-provoking things. Anybody who claims his comedy is encouraging violence against the trans community either did not watch the special or is an idiot. 
 

I don’t pretend that there will be an honest discussion here. There are too many competing agendas and preconceived taking points for that. Watch the special and then decide what you think. 

[troph 24905]

30 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

How much did you watch? Five minutes? Twenty minutes?

The bathroom piece - the meaty dick comment. I’ve since read the transcript. his social commentary via humor doesn’t advance the convo the way he seems to want. 

[troph 24905]

3 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

I didn’t think this was his funniest special. I thought he said a lot of thought-provoking things. Anybody who claims his comedy is encouraging violence against the trans community either did not watch the special or is an idiot. 
 

I don’t pretend that there will be an honest discussion here. There are too many competing agendas and preconceived taking points for that. Watch the special and then decide what you think. 

YOU might not hurt a trans person but people are emboldened by what celebs say - and not the underneath nuance intention of what the celeb claims to mean - Jan 6 shoulda taught you that.  The Adam’s apple, trap, that’s a man, gender is a fact, all that crap is what people who hate hear and act on. 

[BHMCruiser 1814]

1 minute ago, troph said:

The bathroom piece - the meaty dick comment. I’ve since read the transcript. his social commentary via humor doesn’t advance the convo the way he seems to want. 

In your opinion. To which you are obviously entitled. But didn’t you say it encouraged violence? Putting aside the fact that a transcript loses body language, etc., and doesn’t do the situation justice, do you still think his special will promote violence?

[BHMCruiser 1814]

1 minute ago, troph said:

YOU might not hurt a trans person but people are emboldened by what celebs say - and not the underneath nuance intention of what the celeb claims to mean - Jan 6 shoulda taught you that.  The Adam’s apple, trap, that’s a man, gender is a fact, all that crap is what people who hate hear and act on. 

So if a person says “gender is a fact,” then they are encouraging violence the same way that Chuck Schumer did in January 6?

[troph 24905]

1 minute ago, BHMCruiser said:

In your opinion. To which you are obviously entitled. But didn’t you say it encouraged violence? Putting aside the fact that a transcript loses body language, etc., and doesn’t do the situation justice, do you still think his special will promote violence?

It absolutely uses language that promotes violence yes. Especially in the black community where black trans women are at the highest risk. Combine Dave’s language and bullshit misunderstandings about sex, gender, masculinity, yes.  Meaty dicks and fear of being called gay, and not a pussy comment, and not being man enough, it’s not like this shit doesn’t already happen. 
 

I don’t even want to get into him trading on a trans woman who committed suicide days later as proof he’s a friend to trans people. 
 

Edited October 14, 2021 by troph

[BHMCruiser 1814]

And the new standard for everything is whether some idiot uses it as encouragement to do something wrong or cruel? Can I say I disagree with MAGA people because some left wing lunatic may attack one of them? Can I say I send my kid to private school because I don’t like public school agendas even though some clown may decide that means it’s okay to attack a school board member? Where are the lines? What’s the limiting principle on your “words that may lead to violence are bad” theory?

[BHMCruiser 1814]

2 minutes ago, troph said:

It absolutely uses language that promotes violence yes. Especially in the black community where black trans women are at the highest risk. Combine Dave’s language and bullshit misunderstandings about sex, gender, masculinity, yes. 

This is so overwrought with special interest dogma it’s hard for me to unpack. 

[BHMCruiser 1814]

3 minutes ago, troph said:

It absolutely uses language that promotes violence yes. Especially in the black community where black trans women are at the highest risk. Combine Dave’s language and bullshit misunderstandings about sex, gender, masculinity, yes. 

So “show some empathy,” “we are all human,” and “she was my friend” are all terms that promote violence against black trans women?

[BHMCruiser 1814]

I thought his point was very simple. He’s confused about the trans issue. He doesn’t like being bullied by people telling him it’s settled. He personally likes all people on a personal individual level. He thinks the pronouns and made-up words are bullshit and sidestep the discussion. 

[Gourmand 7774]

13 minutes ago, Deej said:

Naybe it wasn't funny, but shit misses the mark. Sorry your opinion is the only one that matters. 

None of us are saying our opinion is the only one that matters. You're free to think it's funny but the reason you think it's funny is because you think he's coming from a place of truth whereas I know he is not.

That "Stonewall gays" bit is a perfect example:

 

"I don't hate gay people at all, I respect the shit out of you. Well, not all of you. I'm not that fond of these newer gays. Too sensitive, too brittle. Those aren't the gays I grew up with, I miss them old school gays, nigga. Them Stonewall niggas, them the that ones I respect. The didn't take shit from anybody, they fought for their freedom. I respect that shit, I'm not even gay and I wanna be like a Stonewall nigga!"

 

I'm sure some of y'all were yukking it up at home along with the audience in Detroit, but if you knew that the activist leaders behind the Stonewall riots were POC trans then that whole joke rings a little different eh? 

Comedy starts from truth. Maybe Dave should've started there as well. 

 

[troph 24905]

Just now, BHMCruiser said:

This is so overwrought with special interest dogma it’s hard for me to unpack. 

That doesn’t even make sense. What makes sense is 2021 is on pace to be the most deadly year since tracking trans murders which began about 10 years ago. Looking at one per week for a population including white trans women and all trans men of about 0.06% of the population.  Reduce that by race and it’s much more appalling.
 

With visibility comes danger and violence and almost all of it is trans women of color.  And these numbers are widely believed to be way under reported. 

so no Dave Chapelle isn’t funny when he trades on a deceased trans woman’s story to prove he’s an alright guy. 

[Gourmand 7774]

10 minutes ago, troph said:

I don’t even want to get into him trading on a trans woman who committed suicide days later as proof he’s a friend to trans people. 
 

The good friend that he didn't even know had a kid?

[Chuckie Finster 22724]

Haven’t seen it, but the list of people who REALLY liked it seems like a giant fucking red flag.

[BHMCruiser 1814]

Did you learn this from your conversation with your wife?

[troph 24905]

6 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

So “show some empathy,” “we are all human,” and “she was my friend” are all terms that promote violence against black trans women?

I explained haters don’t listen to that. They don’t hear it. Meaty dick, not a pussy, that’s a man, blah blah blah. This isn’t hard dude. He’s an asshole. Sometimes funny always an asshole. 

[BHMCruiser 1814]

1 minute ago, troph said:

That doesn’t even make sense. What makes sense is 2021 is on pace to be the most deadly year since tracking trans murders which began about 10 years ago. Looking at one per week for a population including white trans women and all trans men of about 0.06% of the population.  Reduce that by race and it’s much more appalling.
 

With visibility comes danger and violence and almost all of it is trans women of color.  And these numbers are widely believed to be way under reported. 

so no Dave Chapelle isn’t funny when he trades on a deceased trans woman’s story to prove he’s an alright guy. 

Were the perpetrators found still wearing their “Dave Chappelle Fan Club” jackets?

[BHMCruiser 1814]

3 minutes ago, troph said:

That doesn’t even make sense. What makes sense is 2021 is on pace to be the most deadly year since tracking trans murders which began about 10 years ago. Looking at one per week for a population including white trans women and all trans men of about 0.06% of the population.  Reduce that by race and it’s much more appalling.
 

With visibility comes danger and violence and almost all of it is trans women of color.  And these numbers are widely believed to be way under reported. 

so no Dave Chapelle isn’t funny when he trades on a deceased trans woman’s story to prove he’s an alright guy. 

To me it just sounded like a story about a person he knew. 

[troph 24905]

1 minute ago, BHMCruiser said:

Were the perpetrators found still wearing their “Dave Chappelle Fan Club” jackets?

 That’s dumb and disingenuous.  

[BHMCruiser 1814]

6 minutes ago, Gourmand said:

None of us are saying our opinion is the only one that matters. You're free to think it's funny but the reason you think it's funny is because you think he's coming from a place of truth whereas I know he is not.

That "Stonewall gays" bit is a perfect example:

 

"I don't hate gay people at all, I respect the shit out of you. Well, not all of you. I'm not that fond of these newer gays. Too sensitive, too brittle. Those aren't the gays I grew up with, I miss them old school gays, nigga. Them Stonewall niggas, them the that ones I respect. The didn't take shit from anybody, they fought for their freedom. I respect that shit, I'm not even gay and I wanna be like a Stonewall nigga!"

 

I'm sure some of y'all were yukking it up at home along with the audience in Detroit, but if you knew that the activist leaders behind the Stonewall riots were POC trans then that whole joke rings a little different eh? 

Comedy starts from truth. Maybe Dave should've started there as well. 

 

No the joke is exactly the same. He respects people who really fight, not people who get mad about pronouns and make up new words because they cannot believe anybody disagrees with them. That was the point of his joke. 

[BHMCruiser 1814]

Just now, troph said:

 That’s dumb and disingenuous.  

I’m not being disingenuous. 

[BHMCruiser 1814]

I am mocking your nonsensical position that things that you speculate may contribute to violence can never be funny because your definition of comedy does not allow for potential compromisation of the political/sociological issue most personal to you. 

[Gourmand 7774]

3 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

No the joke is exactly the same. He respects people who really fight, not people who get mad about pronouns and make up new words because they cannot believe anybody disagrees with them. That was the point of his joke. 

No, he's erasing intersectionality on purpose so that he can frame injustice against black people vs injustice against "people who get mad about pronouns."

You miss the point entirely and should listen to the trans community and not Chappelle.

[troph 24905]

5 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

I am mocking your nonsensical position that things that you speculate may contribute to violence can never be funny because your definition of comedy does not allow for potential compromisation of the political/sociological issue most personal to you. 

If he’s funny he’s funny. He’s not funny. He ended that whole routine saying “I have one trans friend she’s cool - I mean was cool - she didn’t call me on my bullshit, so I’m not transphobic” which is like the white guy saying he’s got one black friend so he’s not racist. 

Edited October 14, 2021 by troph

[BHMCruiser 1814]

2 minutes ago, Gourmand said:

No, he's erasing intersectionality on purpose so that he can frame injustice against black people vs injustice against "people who get mad about pronouns."

You miss the point entirely and should listen to the trans community and not Chappelle.

When does their comedy special air?

[BHMCruiser 1814]

1 minute ago, troph said:

If he’s funny he’s funny. He’s not funny. He ended that whole routine saying “I have one trans friend she’s cool - I mean was cool - she didn’t call me on my bullshit, so I’m not transphobic” which is like the white guy saying he’s got one black friend so he’s not racist. 

It is way more complicated than that tired trope but whatever. 

[BHMCruiser 1814]

4 minutes ago, Gourmand said:

No, he's erasing intersectionality on purpose so that he can frame injustice against black people vs injustice against "people who get mad about pronouns."

 

His joke about the Stonewall riots did all that? I must be dumber than I thought!

[troph 24905]

2 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

It is way more complicated than that tired trope but whatever. 

You haven’t added once ounce of substance. I think you’ve said trope like 4 times though so I’ll give you that. 
 

 

[Gourmand 7774]

5 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

His joke about the Stonewall riots did all that? I must be dumber than I thought!

It's not that you are dumb, but you're probably just as uninformed as the rest of the audience about the Stonewall riots. Don't you think it's odd that he didn't weave a brief history lesson about an event from 1969 into that sketch? I mean, he sure was happy to inform his audience about DaBaby, but not Marsha P Johnson?

Why is that?

Edited October 14, 2021 by Gourmand

[BHMCruiser 1814]

1 minute ago, troph said:

You haven’t added once ounce of substance. I think you’ve said trope like 4 times though so I’ll give you that. 
 

 

Nope. I only said that once. My other big kid words in this thread have been “dogma,” “overwrought,” and “preconceived.” 
 

I don’t know what substance you want me to bring. Anybody who disagrees with you and Mr. Wifeversation will conveniently either be ignorant or a bigot. 

[Pato del Muerto 52568]

14 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

No the joke is exactly the same. He respects people who really fight, not people who get mad about pronouns and make up new words because they cannot believe anybody disagrees with them. That was the point of his joke. 

That’s what I got out of it. Not that they were a “better kind of queer” but that they took action, in the way he advocated for black people to take action over racism. 
 

and the meaty dick comment was part of his reasoning that the assigned gender bathroom law is silly. It was a crude way to make the point, but it was still the point. But it was about him being uncomfortable and had zero consideration for the trans perspective even though the final conclusion is the same. 

[troph 24905]

3 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

His joke about the Stonewall riots did all that? I must be dumber than I thought!

Right he didn’t mean it, he didn’t know, but he’s a good guy so he should get a pass. 
 

the irony of it all is he could have knocked it out of the park comparing the stonewall bitches to today’s pronoun warriors. But he didn’t. Why? Because he really doesn’t give a shit while saying he does. 

[BHMCruiser 1814]

1 minute ago, Gourmand said:

It's not that you are dumb, but you're probably just as uninformed as the rest of the audience about the Stonewall riots. Don't you think it's odd that he didn't weave a brief history lesson about an event from 1969 into that sketch? I mean, he sure  was happy to inform his audience at DaBaby, but not Marsha P Johnson?

Why is that?

Because “Marsha P Johnson” isn’t a funny name?

And I’m plenty dumb thank you very much. 

[troph 24905]

Just now, Pato del Muerto said:

That’s what I got out of it. Not that they were a “better kind of queer” but that they took action, in the way he advocated for black people to take action over racism. 
 

and the meaty dick comment was part of his reasoning that the assigned gender bathroom law is silly. It was a crude way to make the point, but it was still the point. But it was about him being uncomfortable and had zero consideration for the trans perspective even though the final conclusion is the same. 

And that’s why I turned it off and that’s why it is still dangerous. 

[Gourmand 7774]

Why does Dave go out of his way to encourage his audience to google DaBaby and Walmart but not Stonewall and Marsha P Johnson?

[BHMCruiser 1814]

1 minute ago, Pato del Muerto said:

That’s what I got out of it. Not that they were a “better kind of queer” but that they took action, in the way he advocated for black people to take action over racism. 
 

and the meaty dick comment was part of his reasoning that the assigned gender bathroom law is silly. It was a crude way to make the point, but it was still the point. But it was about him being uncomfortable and had zero consideration for the trans perspective even though the final conclusion is the same. 

He was mocking the law from multiple perspectives because the usual objection to trans bathroom intersectionality (Gourmand am I using that right?) is that dude women will fuck your little girl kids. And he’s saying “I don’t give a shit about that! What about me?” Which is absurd. 
 

But again please don’t construe what I am saying to mean that I think the trans movement is relatively humorless. 

[BHMCruiser 1814]

1 minute ago, Gourmand said:

Why does Dave go out of his way to encourage his audience to google DaBaby and Walmart but not Stonewall and Marsha P Johnson?

Because Marsha P Johnson didn’t shoot somebody at a Wal-Mart. It’s like you didn’t even listen to what he was saying. 

[troph 24905]

3 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

Because “Marsha P Johnson” isn’t a funny name?

And I’m plenty dumb thank you very much. 

You’d think he woulda swung at that hanging curveball. 

[BHMCruiser 1814]

5 minutes ago, troph said:

Right he didn’t mean it, he didn’t know, but he’s a good guy so he should get a pass. 
 

the irony of it all is he could have knocked it out of the park comparing the stonewall bitches to today’s pronoun warriors. But he didn’t. Why? Because he really doesn’t give a shit while saying he does. 

Or maybe he’s just one dude with his perspective and can’t tell every joke the way every other person in the world may subjectively want him to. 

[troph 24905]

2 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

Or maybe he’s just one dude with his perspective and can’t tell every joke the way every other person in the world may subjectively want him to. 

He can say whatever he wants but if he wants the subjects of his joke to believe he’s a good guy he’s got a lot of work to do, and that’s on top of trying to be funny again. I’m out, it’s been funny the laughs just keep coming. Belly hurts gotta go. Can’t wait to hear joe rogan tell us how misunderstood Dave is. Peace.

Edited October 14, 2021 by troph

[BHMCruiser 1814]

Just now, troph said:

He can say whatever he wants but if he wants the subjects of his joke to believe he’s a good guy he’s got a lot of work to do, and that’s on top of trying to be funny again. 

I can’t argue with that. That’s a pretty fair take. 

[Tommy Shelby 188]

1 hour ago, troph said:

I’m not hurt, he’s not funny, he can say what he wants to say and so can I and other LGBTQ folks.  He’s telling jokes about people the overwhelming percentage of whom find his humor not funny at best and insulting at worst.  You can think it’s funny, we don’t think it is. You can do whatever you want with that, I really don’t give a fuck. 

For someone who doesn’t give a fuck you’ve sure spent a lot of time and mental energy posting on this thread 

[Gourmand 7774]

15 minutes ago, BHMCruiser said:

Because Marsha P Johnson didn’t shoot somebody at a Wal-Mart. It’s like you didn’t even listen to what he was saying. 

It's like you really are as dumb as advertised.

No, he intentionally erases intersectionality from his entire schtick because if he acknowledges its existence, then he has to acknowledge his silent implication that all trans people are white, which proves the argument that he is a transphobe. 

 

Edited October 14, 2021 by Gourmand

[Gourmand 7774]

That Caitlyn Jenner line also flopped because it doesn't have contemporary truth behind it.

"Why is it easier for Bruce Jenner to change his gender than it is for Cassius Clay to change his name?”

Really, Dave???? You're comparing 1964 to 2021? jfc.