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The Surly Official 2020 Corching Search Thread of DOOM and DESPAIR

closetohumping

By closetohumping
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If it ain't Urban, who do you want?  

283 members have voted

  1. 1. Speaking of polls, I had sex with South_Austin's mom

    • Fickell
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    • Franklin
      8
    • Fuente
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    • Cristobal
      29
    • Allen
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    • Some NFL assistant ....name him
      10
    • Some college assistant.....name him
      3
    • Harbaugh
      11
    • Other....name him
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closetojumping
closetojumping

I am looking at things like this: Tier 1 - The Job Is Yours If You Change Your Mind & We Haven't Filled It Urban Meyer - dude is a flake. Crazier shit has happened, but folks I trust thi

closetojumping
closetojumping

I'm of the opinion that anyone mentioning rehiring Mack Brown in this thread should be neg-bombed into the abyss or outright IP banned from this site. 

closetojumping
closetojumping

In a text string with my buddies, including @SydneyCarton and @HenryJames , during & after the TCU game, we started talking seriously about getting Urban Meyer. Maybe more like fantasizing about i

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

Posted
Posted
If we're looking at NFL OC's - how about Pete Carmichael.  He spent a short time in the college game (as Tim Rattay's QB coach) before getting hired on to Sean Payton's staff at New Orleans and OC'ing the Saints for the last decade.  As a bonus he's also the guy who hired Joe Brady.
Carmichael is only OC by name. Payton runs the Saints offense. Carmichael calls plays sometimes but make no mistake as to who the architect of the NO offense is. Not saying he wouldn't be worth a look, just throwing that out there.
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DanTheHorn

DanTheHorn 4902

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, orangebird said:

So, how do you identify that coach ahead of time?  I think there are only a handful of people in the world that could fit your definition of a "great coach."  We might be able to pull off hiring Urban Meyer, but if not, then what?  Saban has already proven that he isn't willing to leave Alabama for any amount of money.  I suspect the same is probably also true of Dabo.  So now we have to move to a tier of coaches that have potential, but are not yet proven to be in that elite category, should Urban not work out.  And even at that, Urban is not necessarily guaranteed to be the guy.  There are plenty of examples in history of formerly great coaches who stayed around too long, past the height of their career arc.  Suppose Urban doesn't turn our hot mess around in three years - are you going to bail on him, then?

I'm all for no excuses, but at the same time, coaches are human beings and not God.  At some point, you have to be realistic about what they can accomplish.

So lets take a look at the list of coaches with a national championship since 2000.

The crap shoot coaches (No prior experience or very mediocre before unexpected success)

Bob Stoops
Dabo Swinney
Larry Coker
Gene Chizik
Ed Orgeron
Les Miles
Pete Carrol

The sure things (Lots of success shortly before taking their NC job)

Nick Saban
Built a 10-2 team by his 5 year at Michigan State and beat #24, #3, #20, #13 and #10 on the way to that record. He only lost to #17 Wisconsin and #20 Purdue with a guy by the name of Drew Brees.

Urban Meyer
Had gone 10-2 and 12-0 at Utah and had 4 years of experience. He took 2-9 Bowling Green team and turned them into a 8-3 team in year one (i.e. taking crap and turning it into gold).

Mack Brown
Mack had a 10-2 and 10-1 in the two previous years prior to being hired at Texas. In his last year he only lost to #3 Florida State and made a basketball school relevant.

Jim Tressel
In a seven year span he Won four national championships in division D1-AA. He was 47 years old at the time he achieved such a feet.

So what we need is a coach that meets the following criteria:

1) Has at least 4 years experience as a head coach.
2) Has won at least 83% of his games in his final full season.
3) If he is from a lower division he has either gone undefeated or won a national championship.

Edited by DanTheHorn
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DanTheHorn

DanTheHorn 4902

Posted
Posted

Luke may be the only guy out there that meets the criteria based on Saban, Meyer, Brown and Tressel records prior to getting their big chance and doing something with it.

1) Has at least 4 years experience as a head coach. (check)
2) Has won at least 83% of his games in his final full season. (check)
3) If he is from a lower division he has either gone undefeated or won a national championship. (undefeated season possible)
4) Win at least 10 games in last season (very likely)

I change my vote from my semi-sarcastic Kalen DeBoer choice to Luke Fickell even if he does not beat Tulsa since he would be announced next week. Even with the worrisome bad record in his only year at Ohio State.

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gmr548

gmr548 16518

Posted
Posted
Luke may be the only guy out there that meets the criteria based on Saban, Meyer, Brown and Tressel records prior to getting their big chance and doing something with it.
1) Has at least 4 years experience as a head coach. (check)
2) Has won at least 83% of his games in his final full season. (check)
3) If he is from a lower division he has either gone undefeated or won a national championship. (undefeated season possible)
4) Win at least 10 games in last season (very likely)
I change my vote from my semi-sarcastic Kalen DeBoer choice to Luke Fickell even if he does not beat Tulsa since he would be announced next week. Even with the worrisome bad record in his only year at Ohio State.

That year at Ohio State warrants consideration of the circumstances too when it comes to attrition/sanctions. Also it was 10 years ago.
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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

Posted
Posted
Luke may be the only guy out there that meets the criteria based on Saban, Meyer, Brown and Tressel records prior to getting their big chance and doing something with it.
1) Has at least 4 years experience as a head coach. (check)
2) Has won at least 83% of his games in his final full season. (check)
3) If he is from a lower division he has either gone undefeated or won a national championship. (undefeated season possible)
4) Win at least 10 games in last season (very likely)
I change my vote from my semi-sarcastic Kalen DeBoer choice to Luke Fickell even if he does not beat Tulsa since he would be announced next week. Even with the worrisome bad record in his only year at Ohio State.
I'm not sure Mack Brown falls into your "was a sure fire hire" category. There was another guy who lost 2 and 1 games his final year in the ACC before coming to Texas. He lost to Kansas. Picking nits, but Mack was by no means seen as a slam dunk when we hired him.
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DanTheHorn

DanTheHorn 4902

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, pops said:

If you can't get urban then just keep herman. Everyone else is basically the same. Urban Saban and Dabo are so much better than the field it's ridiculous. 

 

 

This is the new HC if not Urban thread. Another name for this thread could be "Hope Alternative vs Known Dead End".

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DanTheHorn

DanTheHorn 4902

Posted
Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, BradInATX said:
13 minutes ago, DanTheHorn said:
Luke may be the only guy out there that meets the criteria based on Saban, Meyer, Brown and Tressel records prior to getting their big chance and doing something with it.
1) Has at least 4 years experience as a head coach. (check)
2) Has won at least 83% of his games in his final full season. (check)
3) If he is from a lower division he has either gone undefeated or won a national championship. (undefeated season possible)
4) Win at least 10 games in last season (very likely)
I change my vote from my semi-sarcastic Kalen DeBoer choice to Luke Fickell even if he does not beat Tulsa since he would be announced next week. Even with the worrisome bad record in his only year at Ohio State.

I'm not sure Mack Brown falls into your "was a sure fire hire" category. There was another guy who lost 2 and 1 games his final year in the ACC before coming to Texas. He lost to Kansas. Picking nits, but Mack was by no means seen as a slam dunk when we hired him.

They proved to be slam dunks because none were slam dunks when they were hired. That is what I mean by sure things. Mack could have had 3 MNC appearances and 2 championships in a 9 year span had it not been for some bad luck. That is pretty slam dunk.

Edited by DanTheHorn
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Texas Wahoo

Texas Wahoo 3383

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, BradInATX said:
15 minutes ago, DanTheHorn said:
Luke may be the only guy out there that meets the criteria based on Saban, Meyer, Brown and Tressel records prior to getting their big chance and doing something with it.
1) Has at least 4 years experience as a head coach. (check)
2) Has won at least 83% of his games in his final full season. (check)
3) If he is from a lower division he has either gone undefeated or won a national championship. (undefeated season possible)
4) Win at least 10 games in last season (very likely)
I change my vote from my semi-sarcastic Kalen DeBoer choice to Luke Fickell even if he does not beat Tulsa since he would be announced next week. Even with the worrisome bad record in his only year at Ohio State.

Read more  

I'm not sure Mack Brown falls into your "was a sure fire hire" category. There was another guy who lost 2 and 1 games his final year in the ACC before coming to Texas. He lost to Kansas. Picking nits, but Mack was by no means seen as a slam dunk when we hired him.

If you’re talking about Charlie Strong, he never coached in the ACC. Louisville joined the ACC after he left. 

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soonernado

soonernado 32

Posted
Posted
21 hours ago, DanTheHorn said:

So lets take a look at the list of coaches with a national championship since 2000.

The crap shoot coaches (No prior experience or very mediocre before unexpected success)

Bob Stoops
Dabo Swinney
Larry Coker
Gene Chizik
Ed Orgeron
Les Miles
Pete Carrol

The sure things (Lots of success shortly before taking their NC job)

Nick Saban
Built a 10-2 team by his 5 year at Michigan State and beat #24, #3, #20, #13 and #10 on the way to that record. He only lost to #17 Wisconsin and #20 Purdue with a guy by the name of Drew Brees.

Urban Meyer
Had gone 10-2 and 12-0 at Utah and had 4 years of experience. He took 2-9 Bowling Green team and turned them into a 8-3 team in year one (i.e. taking crap and turning it into gold).

Mack Brown
Mack had a 10-2 and 10-1 in the two previous years prior to being hired at Texas. In his last year he only lost to #3 Florida State and made a basketball school relevant.

Jim Tressel
In a seven year span he Won four national championships in division D1-AA. He was 47 years old at the time he achieved such a feet.

So what we need is a coach that meets the following criteria:

1) Has at least 4 years experience as a head coach.
2) Has won at least 83% of his games in his final full season.
3) If he is from a lower division he has either gone undefeated or won a national championship.

I mean, Ed Orgeron didn't win a natty so much as he kept things quiet long enough for Joe Brady to win a natty and run for the hills.

What this group shows me is that there is not a surefire winning formula unless you can money-whip one of the top active coaches into your program.  (Hate to say it, but even aTm is proving that can work.)  You have the proven hires but they're outnumbered by an assortment of outside non-HC hires, internal promotions, former interims, etc.  The right guy is hard to find.  Especially in a place where coaching football games is only a small part of the job.

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Tex-19

Tex-19 2869

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Posted

I'm warming to Campbell. Iowa State has historically been like Kansas or pre-Briles Baylor, so what he's done really is amazing. And it's been in the same conference so a lot less risk there. He could literally just run the same stuff against the same teams, but with far superior talent. 

Wish we could see him without Purdy but at least they're a very balanced team 

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Blotto

Blotto 23434

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I'm still trying to figure out why everyone is sold on Bienemy. His two claims to fame are running backs coach at Minn when he had Adrian Peterson, and OC with Mahomes in Andy Reid's offense. How do we know he wouldnt suck ass like Charlie Weiss, who looked fantastic with Brady/Belichick?

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IDIOTsavant

IDIOTsavant 8456

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Posted

Alright guys, I'll fucking do it. I downloaded Urban's playbook when it hit the interwebs during the Zach Smith shenanigans. Give me a couple of weeks to upload it to Madden for PS5 and another couple of weeks of practice. I'll be ready around the first of the year....make it first of February. I forgot I have a couple of other things on my list first.

 

LIST

1. Get PS5

2. Learn how to use it

3. Become Urban Meyer

4. Replace the ringmaster of the shitshow

5. Profit

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horn_of_the_morning

horn_of_the_morning 978

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https://mobile.twitter.com/CycloneFB/status/1333784635961085966?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1333784635961085966%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Ffootballscoop.com%2Fnews%2Fvideo-before-beating-the-longhorns-listen-to-matt-campbells-message-to-iowa-state-about-loyalty%2F

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Hiphopopotamos

Hiphopopotamos 20865

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11 minutes ago, horn_of_the_morning said:

https://mobile.twitter.com/CycloneFB/status/1333784635961085966?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1333784635961085966%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Ffootballscoop.com%2Fnews%2Fvideo-before-beating-the-longhorns-listen-to-matt-campbells-message-to-iowa-state-about-loyalty%2F

Let me help you out:

 

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Gigglebush

Gigglebush 107

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 11/29/2020 at 4:14 PM, longhornmatt said:

Looking at NFL coordinators other than Joe Brady, I know Bieniemy is the hot name because of Kansas City’s success, but I can’t take him seriously.   He was the biggest assclown imaginable as a player and then again as a position coach at Colorado under Gary Barnett, and then he was CU’s offensive coordinator in 2011-2012 when they were about the worst team in college football.   His career is nothing but being a clown and a failure except for the years he latched on to Andy Reid and Patrick Mahomes.

What is the story on Greg Roman?  He doesn’t seem to get any NFL head coach offers, so maybe there’s an issue.  But on paper he looks interesting.  He has some limited college experience with Harbaugh at Stanford.   He’s been OC for SF with Kaepernick, Buffalo with Tyrod Taylor, and Baltimore with Lamar Jackson.  He’s produced decent to good offenses adapting his offense to ground based spread option systems for those guys, whereas most NFL coordinators probably would have just forced them into the typical NFL offense and failed miserably. 

I do like the idea of getting someone with NFL experience vs. a lot of our other options.   NFL coaches at least know what talent is supposed to look like.  They usually recruit and evaluate well like Herm is doing at ASU, and they don’t make personnel decisions like playing Garrett Gray and Cade Brewer at slot WR for 4 years in a row.   

Greg Roman's deal is he creates a fantastic offense year 1. Year 2 it gets figured out and he refuses to change it. He gets fired shortly after.

If it isn't Urban I'm fine staying with our current staff, all these other guys blow. I like Yurich's offense and want to see what it would look like with competent QB play.

Edited by Gigglebush
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Hiphopopotamos

Hiphopopotamos 20865

Posted
Posted
11 hours ago, RGBIII said:

Are these numbers still current? Cause I wouldn’t be opposed to Mullen as long as he brought in a solid DC like Coach Boom

2 things:

1. What are you going to pay Mullen?  Are you going to pay him more than Saban or Dabo?  Nothing in his resume says he deserves that.  What offer wouldn't Florida match?

2. Why would Mullen leave if not for overwhelming amounts of money?  He's got a good situation at Florida - a school you can definitely win titles at.  He's only been there a short time - so its not as though he's looking for a 'new challenge'. 

 

He'd certainly be my top choice after Urban - I just don't think he's very realistic.

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RGBIII

RGBIII 22798

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Hiphopopotamos said:

2 things:

1. What are you going to pay Mullen?  Are you going to pay him more than Saban or Dabo?  Nothing in his resume says he deserves that.  What offer wouldn't Florida match?

2. Why would Mullen leave if not for overwhelming amounts of money?  He's got a good situation at Florida - a school you can definitely win titles at.  He's only been there a short time - so its not as though he's looking for a 'new challenge'. 

 

He'd certainly be my top choice after Urban - I just don't think he's very realistic.

Maybe. But if you offer Mullen 9+ (which is crazy money) it probably means we also talked to others like Dabo and they get raises out of their perspective schools. I think his buyout makes the most sense at 2 mill and we can easily beat 6. I don’t think it’s likely but if we are big game hunting it seems logical that he would be a big target that would at least satiate some folks

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Butch Had Not

Butch Had Not 2940

Posted
Posted

If no urban:

Mullen- he can coach a team. Has assembled talent at Florida. Isn't afraid to take on transfers for immediate help. Can evaluate the qb position and get the best out of the qbs he has. I heard that he isn't the best recruiter but if he can get a solid staff that won't matter. If he is listening we take the chance. 

Campbell- ugh I'm torn here. Guy is a fantastic coach but seems to lose more than he should. That's frustrating.. but then i remember that it's isu.

Cristobal- if he does it his way we will have more talent in 4 years than we would have since the mack days or at worst on par with herms top two classes. The OL will improve and God knows we need that.  Not confident that we won't have a stinker in there every year but it would be fewer than herm.

Fickell- I really really really don't want to go down the group 5 route again. He might be amazing but I don't want to chance it. Could be the next great power 5 coach or he could be turner gill.

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C-Man

C-Man 27068

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, satyanash said:

 

I have to say he intrigues me. I know next-to-nothing about him other than he's winning at fucking Indiana. Somebody who knows more, tell me more because I hate Franklin and I'm only mildly interested in Campbell, Cristobal, Fickell and some of the other names thrown out. I don't think we can poach Mullen without resetting the coaching salary scales and I don't believe he's worth that. And I'm not very confident we could even do that.

All that said, I still think we've got Urban coming.

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The Ace of Aces

The Ace of Aces 5106

Posted
Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, C-Man said:

I have to say he intrigues me. I know next-to-nothing about him other than he's winning at fucking Indiana. Somebody who knows more, tell me more because I hate Franklin and I'm only mildly interested in Campbell, Cristobal, Fickell and some of the other names thrown out. I don't think we can poach Mullen without resetting the coaching salary scales and I don't believe he's worth that. And I'm not very confident we could even do that.

All that said, I still think we've got Urban coming.

Kane Wommack is the reason Indiana is relevant. 

Edited by The Ace of Aces
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Tex Pete

Tex Pete 20183

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Posted
40 minutes ago, C-Man said:

I have to say he intrigues me. I know next-to-nothing about him other than he's winning at fucking Indiana. Somebody who knows more, tell me more because I hate Franklin and I'm only mildly interested in Campbell, Cristobal, Fickell and some of the other names thrown out. I don't think we can poach Mullen without resetting the coaching salary scales and I don't believe he's worth that. And I'm not very confident we could even do that.

All that said, I still think we've got Urban coming.

Tom Allen is very intense. An emotional guy. 

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clapclapclap

clapclapclap 9000

Posted
Posted (edited)

Several of the Plan B's would be better coaches than Herman and successful here (win conference within 3 years.)  But much of the degree of success depends on the staff they can actually bring.  Gotta get it right from the start.  I can't vet that and will just trust CDC.  Franklin, Fickell, Christobal, Freeze, Campbell, maybe Allen, etc. all have the potential to get us into the B12 champ game 2 of the next 3 years, winning at least 1 of those.

My primary point being that the claim that we can only improve to the next level if we hire Urban or the lateral move coaches is bunk.  (And a lateral move ain't happening, we go through this every coaching search (dammit), where Florida and other top tier coaches get raises and we get temporarily embarrassed.)  We might not get the instant mega boost in recruiting and be an annual playoff favorite, but we can still step up a level from where the program is now.  Just like Herman stepped us up a level from the CS bottom.

Edited by clapclapclap
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