Desantis is a POS and needs his own thread

[TXSooner518 2438]

24 minutes ago, fattyflattie said:

No I’m completely against it, and absolutely believe it’s a stunt. At the same time, I don’t want the subject breached with my 4yo. I saw your examples upthread you asked sack about. I don’t have any problems with those, outside maybe the same sex book, because I know my 4yo doesn’t understand that yet.  10 yo kids, I don’t have much issue with any of it.  I think the 4-7 age this “law” speaks to, these subjects should be sent to the house.  That doesn’t mean people hate alphabet kids, or adults. It means the VAST majority of 4 yos don’t know what it all means.   

The VAST majority of 4 yos if they hear "some boys like girls and some boys like boys and when people really like each other sometimes they get married" will shrug and think "OK sure cool whatever."  It's the parents' projections, biases, and fears that are the issue. 

[fattyflattie 4638]

3 minutes ago, Poe It Up said:

Why would this guy run for president? He can do whatever the fuck he wants to right now. 

He can’t make a few hundred mil in Fla. 

7 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

Because for some kids for some topics, they DESPERATELY need a trusted adult and it can't be a parent. 

So could there be a compromise that someone qualified, such as the counselor handle it?  I know there are good teachers out there, great ones, but there are also ones that aren’t qualified for this, imo. 
 

10 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

I also think "existence of gay people" such as a book with same-sex relationship characters shouldn't be a controversial subject needing a parent involvement, any more than "why does Steve have brown skin?" or a book with Black characters should be controversial even in an all-white area or school. Obviously getting deep into the weeds on these topics isn't appropriate for K-3 and no one is pushing to do that. 

I’m not certain I agree. I’m know for sure I’ve met gay folks (that weren't advertising it) throughout my life. But it was post college before I ever had any actual interaction. I don’t hate, or fear, then. There just weren’t many in my circles. Of those few I did meet, all were women.   99.99% of the interactions I’ve had with trans folks have been 2 people, on this website. I think very highly of one of them.  Like it or not, there’s much more explanation with sexuality/gender/sex than there is pigment and your genealogical relation to the equator.  I’m an educated person and I’m still working on learning all the pronouns (the extra 20 that exploded recently) as to not accidentally offend people on this site.  My kids are smart. They are considerably smarter than I was at their age, but I know the younger ones aren't ready for this.  I hope they learn properly. Not like many in our generation did, where we had to do some back tracking on it to get it right.  But I’m not certain that’s supposed to happen under 9-10yo.  Especially by someone who’s got 1/4 the amount of education of their parents. 

[Sawbonz 27584]

23 minutes ago, fattyflattie said:

You’ll have to connect the dots on how this saves kids from their non-understanding parents. 

Just how sheltered a life did you have growing up?

[fattyflattie 4638]

3 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

Just how sheltered a life did you have growing up?

I dunno. I grew in a very poor Hispanic area, then a middle class strong mixed area. No major religion or anything.  Just a steady ho-hum household. I’m sure some kids went to our counselors for things but I wouldn’t know that if it wasn’t me, or advertised (which it shouldn’t be). 

[TXSooner518 2438]

3 minutes ago, fattyflattie said:

So could there be a compromise that someone qualified, such as the counselor handle it?  I know there are good teachers out there, great ones, but there are also ones that aren’t qualified for this, imo. 
 

I’m not certain I agree. I’m know for sure I’ve met gay folks (that weren't advertising it) throughout my life. But it was post college before I ever had any actual interaction. I don’t hate, or fear, then. There just weren’t many in my circles. Of those few I did meet, all were women.   99.99% of the interactions I’ve had with trans folks have been 2 people, on this website. I think very highly of one of them.  Like it or not, there’s much more explanation with sexuality/gender/sex than there is pigment and your genealogical relation to the equator.  I’m an educated person and I’m still working on learning all the pronouns (the extra 20 that exploded recently) as to not accidentally offend people on this site.  My kids are smart. They are considerably smarter than I was at their age, but I know the younger ones aren't ready for this.  I hope they learn properly. Not like many in our generation did, where we had to do some back tracking on it to get it right.  But I’m not certain that’s supposed to happen under 9-10yo.  Especially by someone who’s got 1/4 the amount of education of their parents. 

As to the first part, not according to the Repubs who pushed this bill. They also pushed for a law that if the kid talks to anyone at school about gender issues, including a counselor, that person would face criminal charges if they didn't notify parents. That got removed, for now, but that's the mentality we are dealing with.

For the second part, again we aren't talking about a kindergarten test being "1. Which is a triangle?  2. Which is red?  3. Compare and contrast pansexuality and bisexuality."  No one is saying make sure every kindergartener gets all the terms and pronouns. All we are saying is that "some boys like boys and some like girls and some like both" is not a super confusing concept. I wouldn't put it on the lesson plan in a kindergarten class. If it comes up though, it comes up. A book shouldn't be illegal b/c it has a gay character. 

[Brisketexan 105298]

One of my daughters good friends from junior high came out as trans. She killed herself sophomore year. Her parents and close friends were all very supportive and she was in individual and family therapy. Her father found her hanging. 

When you understand that miserable, despairing, and dead gay and trans kids is a feature of their plan and approach, and not a bug, it all makes sense.
As always, the cruelty - to score political points - is the point. The dead kids is how you know it’s working.

[Sawbonz 27584]

8 minutes ago, fattyflattie said:

I dunno. I grew in a very poor Hispanic area, then a middle class strong mixed area. No major religion or anything.  Just a steady ho-hum household. I’m sure some kids went to our counselors for things but I wouldn’t know that if it wasn’t me, or advertised (which it shouldn’t be). 

You grew up where everyone was closeted and deathly afraid of being outed. How do you think a preK to 3rd grader will fare psychologically in such an environment? Do you think society should make it easier for them to live a normal healthy childhood or cater to the feelings of closed minded adults?

[Satchel 6948]

21 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

Because he’s a toxic narcissist

Well, that too.

[fattyflattie 4638]

2 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

You grew up where everyone was closeted and deathly afraid of being outed. How do you think a preK to 3rd grader will fare psychologically in such an environment? Do you think society should make it easier for them to live a normal healthy childhood or cater to the feelings of closed minded adults?

Maybe, I think only 1 dude I graduated with came out gay later. 525 students (there were some girls I think, for sure).  I didn’t grow up in the sticks, 45 mins from Houston. 

I can only use my kids as reference. I think maybe by 3rd there was a whisper of a crush or a friend with a crush. Definitely nothing in Pre or K though.  I’ll ask the oldest tonight, but I’m not sure they’ve been exposed to any of it yet (aside from the trans woman shopping once). 

[Captainant 27752]

15 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

As to the first part, not according to the Repubs who pushed this bill. They also pushed for a law that if the kid talks to anyone at school about gender issues, including a counselor, that person would face criminal charges if they didn't notify parents. That got removed, for now, but that's the mentality we are dealing with.

For the second part, again we aren't talking about a kindergarten test being "1. Which is a triangle?  2. Which is red?  3. Compare and contrast pansexuality and bisexuality."  No one is saying make sure every kindergartener gets all the terms and pronouns. All we are saying is that "some boys like boys and some like girls and some like both" is not a super confusing concept. I wouldn't put it on the lesson plan in a kindergarten class. If it comes up though, it comes up. A book shouldn't be illegal b/c it has a gay character. 

Fatty and sack and all these people cheering on desantis do so because to them, sexuality is equal to religion. They think it's a choice, and under that framing they worry their kids may choose to be sinful because they see it at school. 

[Sawbonz 27584]

12 minutes ago, fattyflattie said:

Maybe, I think only 1 dude I graduated with came out gay later. 525 students (there were some girls I think, for sure).  I didn’t grow up in the sticks, 45 mins from Houston. 

I can only use my kids as reference. I think maybe by 3rd there was a whisper of a crush or a friend with a crush. Definitely nothing in Pre or K though.  I’ll ask the oldest tonight, but I’m not sure they’ve been exposed to any of it yet (aside from the trans woman shopping once). 

My kids have had friends since kindergarten with same sex parents. They all had had teachers they knew were gay by 6th grade. It’s close to impossible that a class of 500+ would have one homosexual student

[Sawbonz 27584]

13 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Fatty and sack and all these people cheering on desantis do so because to them, sexuality is equal to religion. They think it's a choice, and under that framing they worry their kids may choose to be sinful because they see it at school. 

Sack’s kids will be doing lines off somebody’s ass by summer after 10th grade. He’ll only be upset if it’s same sex though

[Immaculate Vibes 114]

21 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

When you understand that miserable, despairing, and dead gay and trans kids is a feature of their plan and approach, and not a bug, it all makes sense.
As always, the cruelty - to score political points - is the point. The dead kids is how you know it’s working.

Wait, how are we killing gay and trans kids with this bill again? By not discussing sexuality or gender in early elementary? Hyperbolic even for you. 
 

The tens of thousands of small children in Florida that are emotionally mature enough to confidently and definitively declare they are gay or trans are miserable and/or despairing because Mrs Krabapple glossed over an obvious opportunity to fully delve into sexuality and gender differences? I just don’t see it. Like you don’t think it should be a big deal. We’re just too far apart on this one I think. 

[fattyflattie 4638]

2 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

My kids have had friends since kindergarten with same sex parents. They all had had teachers they knew were gay by 6th grade. It’s close to impossible that a class of 500+ would have one homosexual student

I pretty clearly said the only one I knew, that came out later. I know there was some girls but didn’t know them. I’m not sure if my kids classmates have same sex parents. If they do I haven’t met them. I live in fucking aggyland lite, so I’m not all that surprised.  I’m sure if I was raising them in the loop, our experience would be much different. 
 

18 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Fatty and sack and all these people cheering on desantis do so because to them, sexuality is equal to religion. They think it's a choice, and under that framing they worry their kids may choose to be sinful because they see it at school. 

Go fuck yourself. I’ve very clearly not cheered on Desantis.  And I make exactly 0 of my decisions off of religion.  I’m exactly 0% concerned if my children decided to be lesbians.  We disagree on politics, but you can go fuck your self with this post. 
 

[ChuckNorrisActionJeans 2682]

Once again. If a kid talks about their mom and dad, no one will think twice. Do you think otherwise? But if a kid mentions their mom and other mom and any questions or comments arise, you're square in the target zone of this law. It's about setting heteronormative people as the default, the "normal" ones, for whom talking about their family is acceptable, and sending the message that anyone not within the norm creates a "sexuality" discussion that can't be had. It's purposely vague and purposely insidious. 

Edited April 22, 2022 by ChuckNorrisActionJeans
Replying to I.V.

[UrbanAchiever 278]

I have a 5 year-old daughter. She refers to people as he/she/they if she doesn't know their preferred pronoun. She knows what it means to be trans. She understands that boys can marry boys, and girls can marry girls. We talk about these topics as well as race and privilege because I want her to be a good, caring and decent human later in life. I would want her teachers to be able to discuss these topics as well in a respectful manner, because I want her to have confidence that her teachers are a trusted source and are free to explain concepts she inquires about.

There's zero discussion of sexuality ever, because when we talk about her friend's parents that are gay, we talk about the content of their character and not their lifestyle. For the life of me, I can't understand how the right is hell bent on sexualizing this topic. It's a perverse fascination that occupies an unhealthy amount of their headspace. 

[WhatTheBuck 28797]

3 hours ago, TXSooner518 said:

Vibes and Johnny,

No more deflecting, no more bullshit. I want answers directly from each of you on whether these examples are OK or not OK.

Lulz. Good luck with that. 

[TXSooner518 2438]

27 minutes ago, ChuckNorrisActionJeans said:

Once again. If a kid talks about their mom and dad, no one will think twice. Do you think otherwise? But if a kid mentions their mom and other mom and any questions or comments arise, you're square in the target zone of this law. It's about setting heteronormative people as the default, the "normal" ones, for whom talking about their family is acceptable, and sending the message that anyone not within the norm creates a "sexuality" discussion that can't be had. It's purposely vague and purposely insidious. 

This is such a critical thing. It isn't that Ms. Krabappel didn't specifically tell Susie about transgender. It's the overarching effort to make some kids normal and others "others" and it's really tough to measure that impact. Imagine again the standard "talk about your family vacation and draw a scene" elementary assignment.  Jimmy talks about his moms. Teresa says "you have two moms? that's weird!"  Ideally, the teacher can say something like "Actually, lots of kids have two moms, some moms like other girls, and some like boys, so it's really not weird." Here to avoid getting sued or fired, the teacher does what exactly? Just silently moves on, and Jimmy internalizes how he's weird and his family is weird and why can't they just be normal. It's overwhelming the cruelty that is inherent in shit like this that just gets glossed over. 

[TXSooner518 2438]

38 minutes ago, Immaculate Vibes said:

Wait, how are we killing gay and trans kids with this bill again? By not discussing sexuality or gender in early elementary? Hyperbolic even for you. 
 

The tens of thousands of small children in Florida that are emotionally mature enough to confidently and definitively declare they are gay or trans are miserable and/or despairing because Mrs Krabapple glossed over an obvious opportunity to fully delve into sexuality and gender differences? I just don’t see it. Like you don’t think it should be a big deal. We’re just too far apart on this one I think. 

Most of those kids are not confidently and definitively anything, and often are wondering if what they feel is OK, or if something is wrong with them. Often their parents are implying that there is in fact something wrong with them. 

[Sawbonz 27584]

42 minutes ago, Immaculate Vibes said:

The tens of thousands of small children in Florida that are emotionally mature enough to confidently and definitively declare they are gay or trans

This is a moronic statement even for you

[Sawbonz 27584]

4 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

Often their parents are implying that there is in fact something wrong with them. 

Or beating the shit out of them. Or if they’re in seventh grade or older literally putting them on the street

[Satchel 6948]

I’d like to ask those of you with 3-5 year old children or grandchildren, how well they’re doing in the CRT classes and if you’re able to sense the self hatred setting in yet?

[workswithseed 2110]

6 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

Most of those kids are not confidently and definitively anything, and often are wondering if what they feel is OK, or if something is wrong with them. Often their parents are implying that there is in fact something wrong with them. 

https://meaww.com/florida-teen-gender-crisis-hang-herself-twice-parents-slam-school-negligence

Because teachers know, and try to keep it secret. Also the suicide attempts.

[NameAlreadyInUse 5114]

1 hour ago, fattyflattie said:

I’m not certain I agree. I’m know for sure I’ve met gay folks (that weren't advertising it) throughout my life. But it was post college before I ever had any actual interaction. I don’t hate, or fear, then. There just weren’t many in my circles. Of those few I did meet, all were women.   99.99% of the interactions I’ve had with trans folks have been 2 people, on this website. I think very highly of one of them.  Like it or not, there’s much more explanation with sexuality/gender/sex than there is pigment and your genealogical relation to the equator.  I’m an educated person and I’m still working on learning all the pronouns (the extra 20 that exploded recently) as to not accidentally offend people on this site.  My kids are smart. They are considerably smarter than I was at their age, but I know the younger ones aren't ready for this.  I hope they learn properly. Not like many in our generation did, where we had to do some back tracking on it to get it right.  But I’m not certain that’s supposed to happen under 9-10yo.  Especially by someone who’s got 1/4 the amount of education of their parents. 

What exactly do you not think they are ready for?  And what exactly does "advertising it" mean?

I can tell you that the law is written in a way so that technically, your children's teachers wouldn't be able to talk about mommies and mommies or daddies and daddies at all.  It also wouldn't allow them to talk about mommies and daddies.  But let's hold our breaths and see which of those three groups actually get talked about every day in school and which ones cause an uproar.

1 hour ago, fattyflattie said:

Maybe, I think only 1 dude I graduated with came out gay later. 525 students (there were some girls I think, for sure).  I didn’t grow up in the sticks, 45 mins from Houston. 

I can only use my kids as reference. I think maybe by 3rd there was a whisper of a crush or a friend with a crush. Definitely nothing in Pre or K though.  I’ll ask the oldest tonight, but I’m not sure they’ve been exposed to any of it yet (aside from the trans woman shopping once). 

I suspect that number is a lot higher.  But most people who didn't grow up in cities graduated from high school, got the fuck away from that town, and dropped their old friends who they had already figured out would not be supportive.  So it's not surprising that the fact they were gay would never get back to you, because they don't talk to their high school friends anymore and chances are, their parents are at the very least private, but more likely have either cut ties with their kid or are very very embarrassed that they have a gay kid, so they aren't going to tell anyone either.  

[Sawbonz 27584]

13 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

https://meaww.com/florida-teen-gender-crisis-hang-herself-twice-parents-slam-school-negligence

Because teachers know, and try to keep it secret. Also the suicide attempts.

That article describes the crisis as “supposed” and “purported”. What do you think that type of language says about what this child’s parents think about their problem? Do you think they are supportive or condemning? Note the school admin can’t give their side.

Quote

It's still unknown why the 12-year-old went to visit the counsellor 

Just a wild stab in the dark but maybe because the parents are “devout Catholics”

Edited April 22, 2022 by Sawbonz

[Horn Dog 9904]

1 hour ago, fattyflattie said:

Maybe, I think only 1 dude I graduated with came out gay later. 525 students (there were some girls I think, for sure).  I didn’t grow up in the sticks, 45 mins from Houston. 

I can only use my kids as reference. I think maybe by 3rd there was a whisper of a crush or a friend with a crush. Definitely nothing in Pre or K though.  I’ll ask the oldest tonight, but I’m not sure they’ve been exposed to any of it yet (aside from the trans woman shopping once). 

In case you are wondering, the estimated frequency of LGB is US is estimated at 3.5% of population.  For perspective the frequency of natural redheads is 1-2% of population.   If you are meeting only 1 gay person and have ever seen a natural redhead that gives you some idea of how much is being left in the closet.

https://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/publications/how-many-people-lgbt/

https://www.healthline.com/health/red-hair-blue-eyes

 

 

Edited April 22, 2022 by Horn Dog

[Serak The Preparer 3431]

I have two kids. A couple of years ago, when they were 7 and 9, we were watching a movie, I forget which, and one of the female characters was pregnant. Now we have straight friends, we have gay friends, my kids knew of trans people but we hadn't really talked about it at the time, but I realized just how much of a bubble they were in when one asked confusedly "How can she be pregnant if she's not married?". Their knowledge of sexuality went so far as to know that some people have two mommies / daddies and some people have one mommy and one daddy. But clearly this had nothing to do whatsoever with knowledge / explanation of sex.

It really isn't a big thing like some people make it out to be. @fattyflattie - I really don't mean this at all a harsh way but I think you're doing your kids a disservice if you think this will confuse them all that much. It's adults and teens who start getting baggage about sex, not kids.

[Sawbonz 27584]

4 hours ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

In 2018 there were approximately 3.5MM public school teachers.  You found six of them to support your point of view.  Good job, dipshit.

Why they’re oughtta be a law!!

[TXSooner518 2438]

29 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

https://meaww.com/florida-teen-gender-crisis-hang-herself-twice-parents-slam-school-negligence

Because teachers know, and try to keep it secret. Also the suicide attempts.

Like Sawbonz said, the language used, the "devout Catholic", and the part about the kid not wanting the parents to know. I dunno what to tell you if you feel like involving these parents would have prevented this suicide. I can promise that in many cases, involving the parents is going to dramatically increase the chances of suicide. 

[Sawbonz 27584]

10 minutes ago, Horn Dog said:

In case you are wondering, the estimated frequency of LGB is US is estimated at 3.5% of population.  For perspective the frequency of natural redheads is 1-2% of population.   If you are meeting only 1 gay person and have ever seen a natural redhead that gives you some idea of how much is being left in the closet.

https://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/publications/how-many-people-lgbt/

https://www.healthline.com/health/red-hair-blue-eyes

 

 

I feel like this post would be more impactful with some photographs

[NameAlreadyInUse 5114]

2 hours ago, fattyflattie said:

You’ll have to connect the dots on how this saves kids from their non-understanding parents. 

To answer, I was pretty blissfully not self aware about why I didn't like my hometown.  I was also an athletic kid who played football, soccer, basketball, baseball and swimming so I wasn't a target of bullies. 

I had no real idea that I was gay, even though I managed to find several other boys that were willing to trade blowjobs from junior high til graduation.  I didn't truly understand that I was gay until I saw 2 guys kissing on the front page of the Daily Texan my first week at UT.  So, when my tennis coach called me a queer, I didn't see it as an assault on my identity.  When my preacher talked about the homosexuals going to hell, I didn't think he was talking about me.  But had I been a bit more self aware I might've.  And there wasn't a single soul in my hometown I knew of that I could have gone and talked to about that, who would've supported me through that, and who would've done anything at all to reassure me that things would be ok. 

I can easily imagine a world where I was less athletic and more self aware, where not only was it harder to make friends, but I was getting a barrage of negative actions and words thrown at me by society, by my teachers, by my church, by my friends who don't know about me, by the bullies that have figured out I'm an easy target, by my parents.  Imagine all those people just cutting you to pieces over and over again.  And there is NO ONE you can go to about it.  There is nothing you can do except keep taking it.  I can absolutely see where kids can see this as a ride they do not want to be on.

So yes, representation matters.  Hearing about Tommy's 2 dads or Billy's 2 moms or the teacher's brother marrying another boy are all little toe holds in life that self aware gay kids can use to help them get to the next day and the next until they are in a place where they can actually stand on their own two feet, where they can finally get out of that toxic environment and they can make a new family of friends who can help them overcome the years and years of casual abuse that was heaped on them while they sat in silence.  

And by the way I call it casual abuse because most people have no idea it was abuse.  I'm pretty certain that tennis coach never would've called me a queer if he thought I actually was, but that type of casual name calling, which is a good gotcha for straight kids, is psychologically devastating to the gay ones.  

And finally, I say all this because every kid needs someone they can trust.  And this is true for every gay person I've ever known. At some point they reach an inflection point where it is no longer possible for them to keep this to themselves.  In the environment I grew up in, there was no one.  I went to an anti-gay church, so I knew my parents agreed with the church and I was an abomination.  I had friends and teachers that had no compunction around calling people fags and queers.  18 years of that environment took its toll, and it wasn't until ~10 years later that I finally talked to another person about what I knew about myself my first week at UT.  It was another 2 years after that before I told someone that I actually cared if they rejected me.  Thinking I would have non-supportive parents delayed my ability to grow up and start being an adult and fully living my life for 10 years, at this point fully 1/5 of my life.  And that's someone that didn't have to suffer the slings and arrows as personal attacks.  Imagine how much worse it would've been if I had?  Would I still be here today?  I actually don't know.

Sorry to go on about this, I'm late to this thread.

Edited April 22, 2022 by NameAlreadyInUse

[workswithseed 2110]

31 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

That article describes the crisis as “supposed” and “purported”. What do you think that type of language says about what this child’s parents think about their problem? Do you think they are supportive or condemning? Note the school admin can’t give their side.

Just a wild stab in the dark but maybe because the parents are “devout Catholics”

They didn't know about it, so that doesn't help with this.

 

14 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

Like Sawbonz said, the language used, the "devout Catholic", and the part about the kid not wanting the parents to know. I dunno what to tell you if you feel like involving these parents would have prevented this suicide. I can promise that in many cases, involving the parents is going to dramatically increase the chances of suicide. 

The state can just keep secrets if they think things might happen. Seems not vague at all.

[tx 3 putt 77367]

How can a state government regulate corporate training ?

[Sawbonz 27584]

18 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

They didn't know about it, so that doesn't help with this.

 

The state can just keep secrets if they think things might happen. Seems not vague at all.

They didn’t know about it because the child was afraid to talk to them about it. If you can’t see that, I don’t know how to help you understand

[fattyflattie 4638]

54 minutes ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

And what exactly does "advertising it" mean?

I meant openly gay. Out of the closet, or well known.    Also, appreciate your personal input.  

34 minutes ago, Serak The Preparer said:

I really don't mean this at all a harsh way but I think you're doing your kids a disservice if you think this will confuse them all that much. It's adults and teens who start getting baggage about sex, not kids.

I get what you are saying, but literally last week I took them to see the Dumbledore movie as the oldest is big HP fan.  Not to spoiler, but it turns out he was gay.  They don't use the word, but several times he speaks of being in love with the villain, that his brother doesn't approve of his "lifestyle", etc.  My first reaction was to look over at the kids, and I could see the wheels turning in the oldest ones head, but with an actual look of confusion on her face.  I mentioned upthread the one interaction we had when she was about 6 with a trans woman, and that completely mind fucked her at the moment.  Please note, I did my best to explain but I'm certain it wasn't 100%.  Hell, I could probably count on one hand at that point how many interactions I had had myself.  But I did my best because I want them to love everyone equally.  Maybe she understands all of it and I'm assuming she doesn't.  Wife is out of town but when she returns maybe we'll sit with her and see what she does know.  

 

 

[Nivek 16982]

3 hours ago, fattyflattie said:

 It means the VAST majority of 4 yos don’t know what it all means.  

I know lesbian couples with kids (our kids play) and it is a non-issue.   I think the idea of normalizing the diversity of lifestyles is a good thing even as you seek to help your children find their own identity just as it is with normalizing the diversity of cultures.   I doubt those same 3-7 yr olds are asking what a virgin is while at Church.   

[fattyflattie 4638]

10 minutes ago, Nivek said:

I know lesbian couples with kids (our kids play) and it is a non-issue.   I think the idea of normalizing the diversity of lifestyles is a good thing even as you seek to help your children find their own identity just as it is with normalizing the diversity of cultures.   I doubt those same 3-7 yr olds are asking what a virgin is while at Church.   

Of course it is.  Maybe that's the hump I haven't encountered.  I don't have any alphabet/pronoun people in my circle outside of a couple of the wifes coworkers she hasnt physically seen since Mar of '20.  It should be normalized, and will obviously be a large part of this generations lives.   I'd be more concerned if they were asking how the Virgin became pregnant.  

[TXSooner518 2438]

42 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

They didn't know about it, so that doesn't help with this.

 

The state can just keep secrets if they think things might happen. Seems not vague at all.

What is the list of things you think the state, through public schools, should be mandated to dislcose to parents?  What if they see Mary Lou holding hands with Stevie?  Must disclose?  What if instead she's holding hands with Tammi Jo?  What if a teacher is in a bathroom and hears a kid say she heard Mary Lou blew Stevie?  Obligation to call Mary Lou's parents?  Stevie's?   

What if the student in your article specifically told the counselor that her parents hate gay people and she feels worthless because she thinks she is gay?

Ludicrous how you are framing this. Truly ludicrous.

[atomheartbevo 89783]

2 hours ago, fattyflattie said:

Maybe, I think only 1 dude I graduated with came out gay later. 525 students (there were some girls I think, for sure).  I didn’t grow up in the sticks, 45 mins from Houston. 

I went to high school in Fort Bend County that was a lot larger than 500+ students, and that area was extremely conservative back in the late 80s into the 90s, and I had a few friends who definitely had certain traits that we associated with homosexuality back then, and we teased them about it a bit (because we were fucking stupid and uneducated when it came to such things), but thankfully they've forgiven us for it, and we are all good friends now.  Ironically, they were in JROTC with us (which is how we became friends in the first place), because they had been treated like utter shit over the years in various PE classes by coaches/jocks/classmates (JROTC took the place of PE in high school).

A lot more folks I knew from high school came out over the years as well, that were a surprise to me. 

Edited April 22, 2022 by atomheartbevo

[atomheartbevo 89783]

2 hours ago, fattyflattie said:

I can only use my kids as reference. I think maybe by 3rd there was a whisper of a crush or a friend with a crush. Definitely nothing in Pre or K though.  I’ll ask the oldest tonight, but I’m not sure they’ve been exposed to any of it yet (aside from the trans woman shopping once). 

How the fuck did your kids get through kindergarten without going through the whole phase of who was going to marry who?  Most of the girls in my daughters class have been working out who is going to get married, and they even have some same-sex couples (now that I think about it, there's an uneven number of girls v boys).  There are some same-sex parents, but our kids haven't asked us about it, they just accept it.

 

Edited April 22, 2022 by atomheartbevo

[fattyflattie 4638]

6 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

How the fuck did your kids get through kindergarten without going through the whole phase of who was going to marry who?

iirc, the girls all still wanted to marry me at that point  

[atomheartbevo 89783]

2 hours ago, UrbanAchiever said:

For the life of me, I can't understand how the right is hell bent on sexualizing this topic. It's a perverse fascination that occupies an unhealthy amount of their headspace. 

Because it's forbidden and naughty for them to think about such things, and just like a child that's been denied a toy or a treat or whatever, they will obsess over it.

It's unhealthy as hell the way many on the right fixate on peoples' sex lives.

It's not even close to being a reason why I bailed on the GOP in the early/mid-2000s, but if the fixation the GOP has on peoples' sex lives these days was on the same level back then that it is now, it could have easily been a top three.  I know the party hated the gays/etc. back then (boy did I know), but from my perspective, there were a lot of other things that were taking up a lot of the air in the room back then.

[scottsins 1969]

Go fuck yourself. ….I’m exactly 0% concerned if my children decided to be lesbians.  We disagree on politics, but you can go fuck your self with this post. 
 

And you can go fuck your self with your ignorant “decide to be lesbians” ignorant bullshit.

[NameAlreadyInUse 5114]

1 hour ago, fattyflattie said:

I meant openly gay. Out of the closet, or well known.    Also, appreciate your personal input.  

Anytime. 
 

Would you call me talking about my husband at work “advertising it”?

By the way, I’m doing my best to temper my words to not seem leading or cruel or anything.  I’m asking these questions for clarity and to learn, not to play gotcha.

 

[fattyflattie 4638]

4 minutes ago, scottsins said:

 

And you can go fuck your self with your ignorant “decide to be lesbians” ignorant bullshit.

 

Go rub your pussy elsewhere, bitch. 

3 minutes ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

Anytime. 
 

Would you call me talking about my husband at work “advertising it”?

By the way, I’m doing my best to temper my words to not seem leading or cruel or anything.  I’m asking these questions for clarity and to learn, not to play gotcha.

 

I guess, although that's not the context I meant.  I just meant "openly gay", or out of the closet, or some other term I may not be familiar with that will hurt @scottsins pussy some more.   I appreciate that, don't need any gotcha, nothing was meant in malice.  I've literally "known" more LGBTQ folks on Shag/Surl that in real life.  By a factor of several times.  So please give me the benefit of the doubt if I fuck up a pronoun or something of that sort. 

[Immaculate Vibes 114]

3 hours ago, Sawbonz said:

This is a moronic statement even for you

Exactly. 
 

2 hours ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

.

So yes, representation matters.  Hearing about Tommy's 2 dads or Billy's 2 moms or the teacher's brother marrying another boy are all little toe holds in life that self aware gay kids can use to help them get to the next day and the next until they are in a place where they can actually stand on their own two feet, where they can finally get out of that toxic environment and they can make a new family of friends who can help them overcome the years and years of casual abuse that was heaped on them while they sat in silence.  

.

How many self aware gay kids are there that are 9 and under? I’d venture to say almost zero. That’s why fighting over this is stupid. Kids aren’t being offended by these things not being discussed. Who is offended by it being off the table? Adults that want it to be discussed.
 

It should be in the parents’ hands.  Not a single person here has objected to it being discussed in elementary. At our school in a deep red district this stuff was discussed to some extent in 5th grade I believe. It’s about the age. That’s it. It’s weird to demand it be allowed at those young ages. 
 

[safe sex 11746]

You are such a piece of shit. It's simply staggering.

[TXSooner518 2438]

For one you are wrong that it’s almost zero.

For two, you are ignoring kids who are being raised by LGBTQ families.

For three, even if a kid doesn’t know they are gay by 3rd grade, when they do know, the environment will be much healthier for them if “gay people exist” is as normal as “redheads exist”, “black people exist”, “vegetarians exist” instead of something so apparently shameful that laws must be passed to avoid discussing it.

For four, tons of examples have been given in this thread that you ignore. In first grade, we held marriage ceremonies on the playground. Kids are aware relationships exist. This shouldn’t be controversial.

For five, if fighting over this is stupid the blame is wholly on DeSantis and Florida Republicans.

[aggie08 21527]

21 minutes ago, Immaculate Vibes said:

Not a single person here has objected to it being discussed in elementary.

Honestly dude, what do you get out of lying at every possible turn?

[Cousin Strawberry 1261]

6 hours ago, Johnny Sack said:

Videos definitely fake.  Likely sandy hook crisis actors

I don't think they are fake but I definitely think you have purchased a Baker Bucket.  How often do you and that schizo TTom trade texts?