Desantis is a POS and needs his own thread

[WhatTheBuck 28798]

5 minutes ago, Poe It Up said:

Ok, so now we’re going to be disingenuous pricks. Ok, cool. 

‘I can’t tell they’re gay’ is a pretty fucking stupid basis for claiming that there aren’t many gay people around you.

[Sawbonz 27586]

2 minutes ago, Poe It Up said:

Not yet professor. I’ve already answered that question by another poster, you were slow to the trigger my man. 

No you didn’t. 5 years ago? 10?  It’s a super weird position 

[UDontKnow 10447]

Just now, Poe It Up said:

I think they do in private, with the parent’s approval. You wouldn’t discuss that with other children that aren’t experiencing it. This is common sense. You’re entitled to your opinion as well, and I similarly think that you’re nuts. 

Wrong yet again.

You know how many times children get sent for psychiatric evaluation WITHOUT parent/guardian approval? 

And if this were common sense, it would simply be an issue of, "Young child, there are people who are different from you and me in this world and we should accept them for who they are. Treat everyone the same way you would like to be treated." But no, the stance you're taking leads to people having to live hidden lives because they are being persecuted. 

Man up and teach your child about the world if you don't trust someone else to do it and better yet, home school your child because you're afraid they will encounter something you or the child is unsure of or not comfortable with - you know what Republicans like to call "indoctrination."

[Poe It Up 126]

1 minute ago, WhatTheBuck said:

‘I can’t tell they’re gay’ is a pretty fucking stupid basis for claiming that there aren’t many gay people around you.

You’re weird. The point was that I don’t discuss gay marriage with my children because it never comes up. They don’t know anyone with two Dad’s. 

Just now, Sawbonz said:

No you didn’t. 5 years ago? 10?  It’s a super weird position 

I said it’s ok to be mentioned, a discussion would be very strange. 

[TXSooner518 2438]

9 minutes ago, Poe It Up said:

That was in the context of why the issue never is brought up with my children. We simply don’t interact with openly gay individuals.

So if you lived in an all-white neighborhood, your kids wouldn't know that racism is bad and that Blacks should be treated just like anyone else? 

[Poe It Up 126]

1 minute ago, UDontKnow said:

Wrong yet again.

You know how many times children get sent for psychiatric evaluation WITHOUT parent/guardian approval? 

And if this were common sense, it would simply be an issue of, "Young child, there are people who are different from you and me in this world and we should accept them for who they are. Treat everyone the same way you would like to be treated." But no, the stance you're taking leads to people having to live hidden lives because they are being persecuted. 

Man up and teach your child about the world if you don't trust someone else to do it and better yet, home school your child because you're afraid they will encounter something you or the child is unsure of or not comfortable with - you know what Republicans like to call "indoctrination."

“They get sent” is right. You don’t diagnose and discuss in a classroom, that would be very bizarre. But we both know that. Now it’s a question of my manhood, holy shit this is hilarious. 

[UDontKnow 10447]

5 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

Homosexual is a word, it has a meaning, and I’ll continue to use it appropriately. It literally means “same sex” so I don’t see any reason to change. 

I don't give a fuck what you say or do and I don't recall telling you what you should do as I was talking to Poe. But you calling me out, trying to educate me (a clinician) on what is clinical, and then proceeding to attack Poe for his intolerance is really fresh (and simultaneously hypocritical). 

[WhatTheBuck 28798]

6 minutes ago, Poe It Up said:

That was in the context of why the issue never is brought up with my children. We simply don’t interact with openly gay individuals.

Why not? Are you afraid of openly gay people? Do you think that hanging out with them will turn your children gay? Do you think it will stir latent homosexual urges in yourself? What’s the problem?

 

[UDontKnow 10447]

1 minute ago, Poe It Up said:

“They get sent” is right. You don’t diagnose and discuss in a classroom, that would be very bizarre. But we both know that. Now it’s a question of my manhood, holy shit this is hilarious. 

Sure "they get sent", but there is discussion and action with the child that is occurring without explicit parental consent. 

Apologies for using the term "man up". I was using the expression colloquially. I'll rephrase it to, "Take the lead and initiative as a concerned parent and caretaker." There, problem solved.

[Sawbonz 27586]

2 minutes ago, Poe It Up said:

You’re weird. The point was that I don’t discuss gay marriage with my children because it never comes up. They don’t know anyone with two Dad’s. 

I said it’s ok to be mentioned, a discussion would be very strange. 

That’s a really weird topic to form a position on.  When would you say you first weighed the pros and cons of an elementary school teacher “mentioning” vs “discussing”  weddings and marriage, and what level of detail moves it into discussion?

[Poe It Up 126]

1 minute ago, TXSooner518 said:

So if you lived in an all-white neighborhood, your kids wouldn't know that racism is bad and that Blacks should be treated just like anyone else? 

Oh my god, your hypothetical backed me into a corner and I have nowhere to go. What do I do? Good lord, where is the teacher in this scenario again? 
 

Total side note, but I do remember the first time my kids saw a black child. They sat wide eyed for a second or two and then played with them, it’s just a different situation all together. 

[TXSooner518 2438]

2 minutes ago, Poe It Up said:

Oh my god, your hypothetical backed me into a corner and I have nowhere to go. What do I do? Good lord, where is the teacher in this scenario again? 
 

Total side note, but I do remember the first time my kids saw a black child. They sat wide eyed for a second or two and then played with them, it’s just a different situation all together. 

It's not different at all. If your kids were told "some boys like girls and some boys like boys and some boys like both and sometimes when people like each other a lot they get married" they would sit and then nod and say cool and go on doing what they are doing and now magically wouldn't be confused whenever they actually encounter same-sex relationships!  

[Poe It Up 126]

4 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

Why not? Are you afraid of openly gay people? Do you think that hanging out with them will turn your children gay? Do you think it will stir latent homosexual urges in yourself? What’s the problem?

 

They’re not where I go, it’s not more complicated than that. My wife would probably worry if I told her I’m off to search for some gay people. 

[WhatTheBuck 28798]

1 minute ago, UDontKnow said:

I don't give a fuck what you say or do and I don't recall telling you what you should do as I was talking to Poe. But you calling me out, trying to educate me (a clinician) on what is clinical, and then proceeding to attack Poe for his intolerance is really fresh (and simultaneously hypocritical). 

You’re the one who said, “Oh and it's 2022, the term homosexual is no longer used.” And you say you’re a clinician? You’re wrong. Don’t get defensive. There’s nothing hypocritical about my pointing out Poe’s fear of acknowledging the existence of homosexuality with his kids and pointing out to you that homosexuality is a word that we still use. Let’s leave it at that.

[Sawbonz 27586]

1 minute ago, Poe It Up said:

They’re not where I go, it’s not more complicated than that. My wife would probably worry if I told her I’m off to search for some gay people. 

You choose not to discuss anything with your children they don’t physically encounter?

[Poe It Up 126]

1 minute ago, TXSooner518 said:

It's not different at all. If your kids were told "some boys like girls and some boys like boys and some boys like both and sometimes when people like each other a lot they get married" they would sit and then nod and say cool and go on doing what they are doing and now magically wouldn't be confused whenever they actually encounter same-sex relationships!  

At the right age, sure. As long as some teacher doesn’t butt in, we’re good. 

[Poe It Up 126]

1 minute ago, Sawbonz said:

You choose not to discuss anything with your children they don’t physically encounter?

I prefer not to discuss sex with my little children, but to each their own I suppose. 

[Sawbonz 27586]

1 minute ago, Poe It Up said:

I prefer not to discuss sex with my little children, but to each their own I suppose. 

There’s that sophistry again. You don’t have to discuss sex to discuss marriage. Creepy

Edited April 23, 2022 by Sawbonz

[Satchel 6949]

Desantis is a racist demon:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/apr/23/new-florida-electoral-map-ron-desantis-black-voters-republicans

The governor has openly talked about his desire to get rid of the fifth congressional district, which is 46% Black and stretches from Jacksonville to Tallahassee.

The governor has said the district, currently represented by a Black Democrat, is an illegal racial gerrymander because it was drawn to preserve the ability of Black voters to elect the candidate of their choice. DeSantis’s plan chops the district into four Republican districts where Black voters would comprise a much smaller share of the population.

DeSantis’s plan appears to have “all the hallmarks of intentional discrimination”, said Stuart Naifeh, an attorney at the NAACP Legal Defense and Educational Fund who works on redistricting cases.

“He wants to dismantle a Democratic district. And in this case a Democratic district that’s been held by a Black person for a long time. And it’s a majority-minority district, so it’s concerning that he is diluting minority voting strength with the pretext being that he’s got constitutional concerns about it.”

The protest started on Thursday after Yvonne Hinson, a Democrat from Gainesville, was speaking about her work during the civil rights era only to have her mic cut off when her time expired.

“I’ve been kicked. I’ve been talked about and I have been called names you don’t even put in the dictionary any more,” she said. “The Voting Rights Act of 1965, I fought for that. I’ve met Martin Luther King, I don’t just talk about him. He taught me peaceful protests, and here we are in 2022, rolling back the tide.”

Two Black lawmakers, Tray McCurdy of Orlando and Angie Nixon of Jacksonville, wore T-shirts that said “Stop the Black attack” as they protested on the House floor.

[aggie08 21529]

3 minutes ago, Poe It Up said:

At the right age, sure. As long as some teacher doesn’t butt in, we’re good. 

[TXSooner518 2438]

3 minutes ago, Poe It Up said:

At the right age, sure. As long as some teacher doesn’t butt in, we’re good. 

So your kids have never seen a movie or been read a book with a wedding or characters who are married?

[Poe It Up 126]

Just now, Sawbonz said:

There’s that sophistry again. You don’t have to discuss sex to discuss marriage 

You asked if there were things I discussed with my children that they haven’t encountered. Clearly, there are some things we don’t. 

[Sawbonz 27586]

Just now, Poe It Up said:

You asked if there were things I discussed with my children that they haven’t encountered. Clearly, there are some things we don’t. 

I didn’t ask about sex. You brought that into the conversation. Weird when we are discussing elementary school age kids. 

[WhatTheBuck 28798]

19 minutes ago, Poe It Up said:

They don’t know anyone with two Dad’s.

Two Dad’s what?

[Poe It Up 126]

Just now, TXSooner518 said:

So your kids have never seen a movie or been read a book with a wedding or characters who are married?

At home? Of course, and they don’t mention it. I think you guys really overestimate how much kids talk about marriage. 

[UDontKnow 10447]

Just now, WhatTheBuck said:

You’re the one who said, “Oh and it's 2022, the term homosexual is no longer used.” And you say you’re a clinician? You’re wrong. Don’t get defensive. There’s nothing hypocritical about my pointing out Poe’s fear of acknowledging the existence of homosexuality with his kids and pointing out to you that homosexuality is a word that we still use. Let’s leave it at that.

No I won't leave it at that. In addition to being defensive, you're being disingenuous and pedantic at this point. Referring to people as homosexuals or their relations or marriages as homosexual is no longer the norm. You can continue to use the term how you like because I frankly don't care how bigoted you come off. It took me a while to change the habit as I had to be educated that asking patients if they engaged in homosexual relations is stigmatizing and I observed in my clinical experience how forthcoming certain patients are/were when I changed my approach. 

[Poe It Up 126]

1 minute ago, Sawbonz said:

I didn’t ask about sex. You brought that into the conversation. Weird when we are discussing elementary school age kids. 

You may need to read your question again. You goofed and it’s ok. 

[Sawbonz 27586]

1 minute ago, Poe It Up said:

At home? Of course, and they don’t mention it. I think you guys really overestimate how much kids talk about marriage. 

We’re not the ones who think a law is needed to prevent it from being mentioned

[TXSooner518 2438]

Just now, Poe It Up said:

At home? Of course, and they don’t mention it. I think you guys really overestimate how much kids talk about marriage. 

We had wedding ceremonies on the playground in 1st grade.  And so you do acknowledge that there is nothing at all odd about kids being exposed to the concept of marriage at that age. However, you have expressed opposition to them being exposed to the concept of "gay marriage" at this age. So your previously-stated position of "I don't think teachers should discuss relationships or marriage at all" is really a pretext so you don't have to admit the bigotry of you're totally fine with hetero marriage but not gay marriage. 

[Sawbonz 27586]

Just now, Poe It Up said:

You may need to read your question again. You goofed and it’s ok. 

Weird how your mind went to sex. 

[Poe It Up 126]

2 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

Weird how your mind went to sex. 

Maybe you discuss it with your kids, I’m not judging. 
 

Ok boys, almost time to start pre-gaming. Pop a top if you got ‘em. 

4 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

We had wedding ceremonies on the playground in 1st grade.  And so you do acknowledge that there is nothing at all odd about kids being exposed to the concept of marriage at that age. However, you have expressed opposition to them being exposed to the concept of "gay marriage" at this age. So your previously-stated position of "I don't think teachers should discuss relationships or marriage at all" is really a pretext so you don't have to admit the bigotry of you're totally fine with hetero marriage but not gay marriage. 

I’d prefer the teachers stick to coloring and ABC’s, maybe Where the Red Fern Grows if they’re feeling crazy. 

[TXSooner518 2438]

Just now, Poe It Up said:

Maybe you discuss it with your kids, I’m not judging. 
 

Ok boys, almost time to start pre-gaming. Pop a top if you got ‘em. 

I’d prefer the teachers stick to coloring and ABC’s, maybe Where the Red Fern Grows if they’re feeling crazy. 

Oh, and also Six Flags, or camping trips, all that is cool too as you agreed earlier. 

Also this book is no good, it features married characters, too confusing for kids!  Not to mention "As he returns with the dogs, he sees a heart carved on a tree with the names "Dan + Ann" "  OH MY DEAR GOD HOW CAN THIS BE EXPLAINED TO CHILDREN?????

The sick and truly truly sad part is that you would be totally fine with this book unless the above was "Dan + Dave" and then you would be pushing to ban it right along with the other banned books. 

[aggie08 21529]

5 minutes ago, Poe It Up said:

At home? Of course, and they don’t mention it. I think you guys really overestimate how much kids talk about marriage. 

That's literally been most of our points the entire time. It's never been an issue until Republicans decided to make it an issue. It happens so infrequently at that age that most of us would have absolutely no issue with a teacher generally stating "sometimes a woman and another woman love each other" and moving on. You feel different for whatever reason, that's fine. But having a law to prohibit it--especially one that specifically targets the LGBT aspects--is nothing but culture war bullshit from a governor looking to plant his flag.

[Sawbonz 27586]

3 minutes ago, Poe It Up said:

Maybe you discuss it with your kids, I’m not judging. 

I didn’t at that age and nothing I have mentioned states or implies I did.  What a strange comment. Why are you focused on sex discussions with young children?

[TXSooner518 2438]

1 minute ago, aggie08 said:

That's literally been most of our points the entire time. It's never been an issue until Republicans decided to make it an issue. It happens so infrequently at that age that most of us would have absolutely no issue with a teacher generally stating "sometimes a woman and another woman love each other" and moving on. You feel different for whatever reason, that's fine. But having a law to prohibit it--especially one that specifically targets the LGBT aspects--is nothing but culture war bullshit from a governor looking to plant his flag.

And is RIDICULOUSLY unfair to teachers, as in my earlier example of "we went to Six Flags", "I went camping", "I went to a wedding" for the teacher to be expected to immediately halt discussion without hurting the 3rd kid's feelings, lest the teacher be fired, sued, and/or prosecuted because Lisa wanted to tell a story about her fucking dad's wedding. Ghouls and monsters. Look at the history books at the ugly hateful faces behind those firehoses and ask why you want to be seen exactly the same in the future. 

[Poe It Up 126]

18 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

That's literally been most of our points the entire time. It's never been an issue until Republicans decided to make it an issue. It happens so infrequently at that age that most of us would have absolutely no issue with a teacher generally stating "sometimes a woman and another woman love each other" and moving on. You feel different for whatever reason, that's fine. But having a law to prohibit it--especially one that specifically targets the LGBT aspects--is nothing but culture war bullshit from a governor looking to plant his flag.

Both sides are making an issue because it’s part of the culture war. That’s politics. I’ve tried to find an issue with the law, but it just makes too much sense. 

[aggie08 21529]

1 minute ago, Poe It Up said:

Both sides are making an issue because it’s part of the culture war. That’s politics. I’ve tried to find an issue with the law, but it just makes too much sense. 

Please revisit this thread in a year when they've found ways to ban more books and even further ostracize the gay community using the ambiguous language of the bill.

[Poe It Up 126]

2 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Please revisit this thread in a year when they've found ways to ban more books and even further ostracize the gay community using the ambiguous language of the bill.

I will, and hopefully you do as well when the slippery slope stuff never happens. 

[TXSooner518 2438]

Both sides are making an issue because it’s part of the culture war. That’s politics. I’ve tried to find an issue with the law, but it just makes too much sense. 

One side passing a horseshit law and the other objecting isn’t “both sides making an issue”. It isn’t an issue until the law is proposed and passed, which was done by one side.

[Poe It Up 126]

3 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

One side passing a horseshit law and the other objecting isn’t “both sides making an issue”. It isn’t an issue until the law is proposed and passed, which was done by one side.

Oh please. Research who dubbed it “don’t say gay.” That’s politics, same as it ever was. 

[Satchel 6949]

I don’t think we have to do a deeper dive to recognize that we’re actually banning books in this country for flimsiest of reasons.

[Sawbonz 27586]

2 minutes ago, Satchel said:

I don’t think we have to do a deeper dive to recognize that we’re actually banning books in this country for flimsiest of reasons.

No no according to Sack if you can carry your own copy of a book *into* a library it’s not banned. 

[ChuckNorrisActionJeans 2682]

Kids have families. This fact happens to come up at school. It doesn't have to even be about marriage. And marriage doesn't equal "sex." As some well know.

So no one should be mentioning their parents I guess, since some kids have same-sex parents? Or are just the kids in an LGBT family not ok for the teacher to engage with t on these topics that casually come up all the time?

Public schools are for everyone. Every kid. Every family. Every student should feel safe and welcome. Private school or home is the place to indoctrinate kids otherwise.

My son has two moms. Ever since he's been of school age, I have never wanted him to feel shamed, singled out, stigmatized, less than, or othered due to that fact.

Imagine that. 

 

[TXSooner518 2438]

Oh please. Research who dubbed it “don’t say gay.” That’s politics, same as it ever was. 

Because that’s the fucking effect of the law as you illustrate by recommending books that discuss straight marriage while supporting termination, prosecution, and civil liability for teachers who mention same sex marriage. It’s not a fucking tough concept. Or are you going to argue this law was passed bc there were discussion of hetero marriage so problematic that they needed to be outlawed?

[TXSooner518 2438]

Kids have families. This fact happens to come up at school. It doesn't have to even be about marriage. And marriage doesn't equal "sex." As some well know.
So no one should be mentioning their parents I guess, since some kids have same-sex parents? Or are just the kids in an LGBT family not ok for the teacher to engage with t on these topics that casually come up all the time?
Public schools are for everyone. Every kid. Every family. Every student should feel safe and welcome. Private school or home is the place to indoctrinate kids otherwise.
My son has two moms. Ever since he's been of school age, I have never wanted him to feel shamed, singled out, stigmatized, less than, or othered due to that fact.
Imagine that. 
 

Yes yes that’s all well and good but you see your child simply must feel ostracized and weird and less than because if not than some people might have to explain weird concepts like “different people are attracted to different people” to their kids and reducing depression and suicide in children just isn’t worth that!

[Satchel 6949]

11 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

No no according to Sack if you can carry your own copy of a book *into* a library it’s not banned. 

I think we’re sleepwalking through history. Book banning should concern all of us.

[Poe It Up 126]

19 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

Because that’s the fucking effect of the law as you illustrate by recommending books that discuss straight marriage while supporting termination, prosecution, and civil liability for teachers who mention same sex marriage. It’s not a fucking tough concept. Or are you going to argue this law was passed bc there were discussion of hetero marriage so problematic that they needed to be outlawed?

Renaming it was part of their political calculations, which I’m not upset with, that’s the name of the game. Like I said, I hope they have time to teach in between all the marriage talk. 

[TXSooner518 2438]

Renaming it was part of their political calculations, which I’m not upset with, that’s the name of the game. Like I said, I hope they have time to teach in between all the marriage talk. 

So if they come up with a law that says if your skin is darker than a certain level your bail is doubled, and people call that the Bigger Bail for Blacks Bill, is that political calculations or just a descriptor of what ignorant bigots have done yet again?

[Willfully Horn 8049]

1 hour ago, Poe It Up said:

They’re not where I go, it’s not more complicated than that.

Statistically improbable. To the point of absurdity.

[aggie08 21529]

(Republicans create a frivolous law out of thin air to satisfy their latest outrage bogeymen, almost specifically to piss off all those "woke" liberals.)

(Liberals and others get pissed, and purposely focus on the most latently homophobic and ostracizing aspects of the bill to garner attention to it.)

"Both sides, guys! They're both equally guilty of culture wars."