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China Sucks

Hugo Stiglitz

By Hugo Stiglitz
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FondrenRoad

FondrenRoad 4378

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5 minutes ago, Rougarou said:

Sure. But my point to the blurb you responded to was more, the minds in bleeding edge of tech (Stanford, MIT, etc.) who live and breathe the Silicon Valley ecosystem, can figure out the China problem (by and large winning the cyber war) for those of us rubes and Luddites outside of the coasts.

To your point, I agree with you and I am also encouraged that remote jobs seem to be trending and normalizing. I've worked from home/remote for most of my career and have done my job in a variety of states and countries, and just as long as I'm on my calls nobody cares. Scaling that out, hopefully you see a dissemination or diaspora of Bay Area tech geniuses (genuii?). Savvy ones will for sure leave just to make their money stretch further via lower taxes and cost of living/real estate/rent, but I've already heard some companies are mulling fighting back with paying the same people/roles different pay grades depending on their location and the fair market value/rate, which would be a bummer.

 

 

I already see remote working getting stale for many.  I think everything will consolidate back in SV when covid is fully over.  It isn't just the "job" that causes people to aggregate.  Its the networking that allows them to get poached by other employers, or start their own company.  Plus the majority of tech people enjoy the lifestyle there. 

Wall Street is the same way.  It has been capable of fully remote work for decades.  Yet a significant share of people won't even live in New Jersey and work there.  They choose the most expensive part of one of the most expensive cities to live in intentionally.

I've done a couple of zoom networking events since covid started.  They suck and you don't really make the personal connections that are needed.

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China can be contained. It can be punished without resulting in pushing them into a full warrior setting.  1- Food is a problem for them. Stop letting them purchase US food producers. Pork indust

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InkaUtexas

InkaUtexas 26018

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I think we will see a hybrid of the two. Smaller offices, etc. I work with companies that must maintain a physical location due to clearances, but we don't need to be paying office space for a payroll department that needs to meet up once or twice a week to get the job done. Some very large firms (Siemens) is already moving to that model. 

One client in Northern Virginia already scaled back their footprint and gave their core team a home office budget. One dude moved into a new apartment in order to have a room just for that. Smart move by the boss in these times. 

 

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F250

F250 28802

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3 hours ago, Rougarou said:

Scaling that out, hopefully you see a dissemination or diaspora of Bay Area tech geniuses (genuii?). Savvy ones will for sure leave just to make their money stretch further via lower taxes and cost of living/real estate/rent, but I've already heard some companies are mulling fighting back with paying the same people/roles different pay grades depending on their location and the fair market value/rate, which would be a bummer.

Silicon Valley is a magnet because of the large concentration of VC money. Austin is very tech oriented city but if you compare the availability of investors in Austin to Silicon Valley it isn't in the same ballpark. The talent follows the money and the money is in the Bay Area.

By the way, Cyberwars are not won or lost. There is nothing to win. Its just digital exploitation.

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Rougarou

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, F250 said:

Silicon Valley is a magnet because of the large concentration of VC money. Austin is very tech oriented city but if you compare the availability of investors in Austin to Silicon Valley it isn't in the same ballpark. The talent follows the money and the money is in the Bay Area.

By the way, Cyberwars are not won or lost. There is nothing to win. Its just digital exploitation.

The money is in the Bay Area because the talent (Stanford) is in the Bay Area and the culture and best-practices/COE for innovation and the start-up playbook for America is ingrained in those folks. Just like, secondarily, the money is in NYC/Boston, because the talent is in NYC/Boston. What I'm saying is the money follows the talent, not the other way around. You can argue Chicken or egg, but I think it's pretty clear.

Anyways, this conversation got derailed because homeboy misunderstood/misread my original comment-- so back to the topic at hand-- China sucks (but they do have some strong tech)

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F250

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2 minutes ago, Rougarou said:

The money is in the Bay Area because the talent (Stanford) is in the Bay Area and the culture and best-practices/COE for innovation and the start-up playbook for America is ingrained by those folks. Just like, secondarily, the money is in NYC/Boston, because the talent is in NYC/Boston. What I'm saying is the money follows the talent, not the other way around. You can argue Chicken or egg, but I think it's pretty clear.

Anyways, this conversation got derailed because homeboy misunderstood/misread my original comment-- so back to the topic at hand-- China sucks (but they do have some strong tech)

Yes, that is how it started but now the talent follows the money which is why it's a magnet. The best and brightest will just continue to migrate to Silicon Valley expecting to be the next tech billionaire. The best thing other cities can do is foster talent and encourage partnerships and build a satellite community like Austin and Dallas have done. I agree that the money will seek out a talented community but Silicon Valley will remain the mothership.

Yeah this is way off topic but it's an important discussion for the future of the U.S. economy and how we will compete with China.

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Rougarou

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On 7/22/2020 at 10:10 AM, Rougarou said:

This is why the only way to deal with China is to actually have a war. I think this could be accomplished with a type of Cold War with a smattering of skirmishes, but there is always the risk of full-out, mutually assured destruction type war which would cripple the US in the short-term. But at least you have your unification and alignment on bringing things back.

Just follow what is going on with semiconductors the past 3 months. Intel has fallen so far behind Taiwan (which means China, due to their nefarious geopolitical relationship) that America has had to get Taiwan Semiconductors (TSMC, which you may recognize is now the world's largest semiconductor manufacturer) to build a chip factory in Arizona because our homegrown chip companies suck and we can't even de-risk and try to separate our growing dependence on China/Taiwan without having them involved domestically. This will be a second-generation chip by the time the fab is finished with construction in 2024 which highlights just how far behind Intel is (by the way Nvidia passed Intel this past week, as a topical aside).

 

 

“Yesterday, Intel's stock slid more than 16% after it said it would delay the rollout of its 7-nanometer chip technology by a year. Intel is moving forward with its 10-nanometer process...but in this highly competitive industry, tens of billions in market value go to those who can make the next generation of smaller and more efficient transistors. 

That’s where AMD comes in. Shares of the Intel rival gained nearly 15% yesterday, pushed along by Intel’s sour announcement. It’s already making 7nm chips for laptops, and eclipsed more than 17% market share in personal computer CPUs in Q1, per Mercury Research.”

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31512

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That story doesn't indicate that the American semiconductor industry sucks, just that Intel does.  And that has always been true, in relation to semiconductor technology.  They're obviously pretty good at processors.

It's a slightly different game, but TI led the world for decades in semiconductor production, but mostly for DRAM.  They learned that being the industry leader was expensive and not profitable because the smallest dies and the most transistors were not the most profitable products, rather the just-behind-the-state-of-the-art technology was where the sales were.

So they licensed Japan, Inc. and made their money that way.

Intel has also sucked at IP strategy.  Granted, China, Inc. is a different beast.

That is where the story lies, mostly.  Japan, Inc. took a while, but mostly fell in with global business norms. Korea, Inc. mostly fell right in line.  China, Inc. is being obstreperous.

 

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PenelopeWitherspoon

PenelopeWitherspoon 19129

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https://apnews.com/article/pandemics-coronavirus-vaccine-media-coronavirus-pandemic-wuhan-65c6958bb2d8d22d811bb3d0c90f7418

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/25/business/china-covid-19-vaccine-backlash.html?searchResultPosition=9

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/20/opinion/china-covid-who.html?searchResultPosition=1

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WhatTheBuck

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On 1/25/2021 at 11:54 AM, BrazilHorn said:

I really do hope Biden is tough on China as how they hid data & suppressed the truth is bad enough add the shit they are doing now re: virus origin & vaccine efficacy and it is just bullshit.

China is an authoritarian country. Their suppression of truth is to be expected. That’s why we have intelligence services. Trump didn’t listen to ours at first and later he suppressed the truth to the American people. That’s a lot worse because we’re not supposed to operate like that. The worst that China did took place over a couple of months a year ago. Trump’s failings occurred over the course of four years and we’re still suffering because of them. 400,000 Americans dead in a year and were only now trying to formulate a national strategy to combat the pandemic. Who fucking cares if China tries to deny that the virus originated there? Again, that’s to be expected. That’s how authoritarian propaganda works. We’ve known how they operate for 70 years. We need to focus first on getting our own house in order. 

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Neonmoon

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Yikes 

Quote

The Chinese government use Uyghurs as test subjects for various experiments just like rats are used in laboratories," he said.

 

And he outlined his role in installing the cameras in police stations in the province: "We placed the emotion detection camera 3m from the subject. It is similar to a lie detector but far more advanced technology."

 

He said officers used "restraint chairs" which are widely installed in police stations across China.

 

"Your wrists are locked in place by metal restraints, and [the] same applies to your ankles."

 

He provided evidence of how the AI system is trained to detect and analyse even minute changes in facial expressions and skin pores.

 

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washparkhorn

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The coming war is being pitched as:

China (free market with authoritarian government) v. the Washington Consensus (free market with limited government regulation of business).

There are, of course, alternative to both, but that's not how we roll. 

What will International Capital trust more:

  • a system where the trains run on time thanks to authoritarianism, or,
  • a system where fuckups are always in the mix (Trump/Wall Street Masters of the Universe/Neoliberals)

TLDR: I am betting we (Western democracies and allies) can shape the battlefield to show China fuckedupism > Washington Consensus fuckedupedness. 

It shouldn't be that difficult of a question, but we have not helped ourselves. There is a concern our fuckedupedness is here for the long haul. 

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InkaUtexas

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Correct, we did not help ourselves, but neither did china. The developing world is starting to be wary of Silk Road and more of them are watching what happened to Sri Lanka's port and what China tried to do in Mombassa. Key is make sure the media covers it. Looking at you VOA. 

 

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washparkhorn

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We do not live in a world with such binary choices as Soros v. China. Soros likes to smell his own farts. A familiar trait of this set. 
 

But he is correct that China's long ambitions (as currently represented) include economic domination of Europe and Africa. That’s no state secret of the CCP. 
 

The pivot of the US under Obama, Trump and Biden to counter China’s growing ambitions was well timed. 
 

after all - we created this libertarian neoliberal strategy in the US and then sold China the rope to hang ourselves. State capitalism has worked well for the authoritarian CCP  

Soros is sounding the alarm to remind international capital of the China trajectory.

He should have addressed this directly to them privately. Horrible messaging. 

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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9083

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1 hour ago, washparkhorn said:

We do not live in a world with such binary choices as Soros v. China. Soros likes to smell his own farts. A familiar trait of this set. 
 

But he is correct that China's long ambitions (as currently represented) include economic domination of Europe and Africa. That’s no state secret of the CCP. 
 

The pivot of the US under Obama, Trump and Biden to counter China’s growing ambitions was well timed. 
 

after all - we created this libertarian neoliberal strategy in the US and then sold China the rope to hang ourselves. State capitalism has worked well for the authoritarian CCP  

Soros is sounding the alarm to remind international capital of the China trajectory.

He should have addressed this directly to them privately. Horrible messaging. 

A pox on Nixons soul for ever going there, and "opening" them to the west.  Nixon just gave them the international fanfare to wave their friendly little flag to the rest of the world, laughing all the time.

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TwiceHorn

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Here's a fairly astonishing bit of Chinese suckitude.  https://www.reuters.com/business/eu-challenges-china-wto-over-telecom-patent-protection-2022-02-18/

As many know, a number of companies worldwide hold what are called "Standards Essential Patents" or SEP that cover technology that is necessary to meet industry standards for things like 4G or 5G cell phones.  These are "blocking patents," meaning no one can build a phone that works with current technology without infringing them.

These patents, which standards setting committees were aware of when establishing standards, must be licensed to all comers on "FRAND" terms, fair, reasonable, and non-discriminatory terms. And that basically means just about everyone gets the same deal and it's reasonable enough not to put anyone out of business.

Unless their business model is to undercut everyone else in the business with possibly predatory pricing.

So now, apparently, if one of these patent holders goes to a Chinese court to enforce the Chinese version of its SEP against a manufacturer that won't pay the FRAND license, the Chinese court will enjoin them from filing suit in any other country, with hefty fines for doing so. 

So the EU is starting a WTO complaint against them and this practice.  Curious if the US will follow or it's somehow limited to EU "players."

Weird, wild, wacky stuff.  Especially because China has been making a big show of granting and enforcing patents of western origin in the last couple of decades.

 

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Onboard 2.0

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22 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Here's a fairly astonishing bit of Chinese suckitude.  https://www.reuters.com/business/eu-challenges-china-wto-over-telecom-patent-protection-2022-02-18/

As many know, a number of companies worldwide hold what are called "Standards Essential Patents" or SEP that cover technology that is necessary to meet industry standards for things like 4G or 5G cell phones.  These are "blocking patents," meaning no one can build a phone that works with current technology without infringing them.

These patents, which standards setting committees were aware of when establishing standards, must be licensed to all comers on "FRAND" terms, fair, reasonable, and non-discriminatory terms. And that basically means just about everyone gets the same deal and it's reasonable enough not to put anyone out of business.

Unless their business model is to undercut everyone else in the business with possibly predatory pricing.

So now, apparently, if one of these patent holders goes to a Chinese court to enforce the Chinese version of its SEP against a manufacturer that won't pay the FRAND license, the Chinese court will enjoin them from filing suit in any other country, with hefty fines for doing so. 

So the EU is starting a WTO complaint against them and this practice.  Curious if the US will follow or it's somehow limited to EU "players."

Weird, wild, wacky stuff.  Especially because China has been making a big show of granting and enforcing patents of western origin in the last couple of decades.

 

All you had to say was China sucks.  They're the worst thing to hit the civilized world since the USSR.  

A little thread drift, but I listened to part of "The Great Wager" on NPR yesterday. It's a multi part podcast about Nixon, and his plans to open up China to the west.  China, and the Russians hated each other in the 70's, and all kinds of behind the scenes, cloak and dagger, fuckery was going on.

Mao's China was a third world country when Nixon made his historic trip, and created the path we're now treading.  From a Chinese woman who grew up in Beijing:  she, and her sister would count cars in Beijing for fun (early 70's). If they saw more than about 10 cars in a single day that would be a huge deal. China was an impoverished nation, no universities, no middle class, no progress, factories, if they were even open produced almost nothing. No capitalism per Maos blood stained orders.

Before Nixons grand plan had really been developed, a Russian spy set a "chit chat" lunch date with one of Nixons ambassadors.  In one of those power broker, Washington haunts, the Russian asked the American, what would America think of Russia removing all of Chinas nuclear capabilities ? 

The American froze in mid bite, and made an immediate bee line for the Oval Office with the news that Russia was signaling they were cool with a nuclear war with China.  That apparently caused an immediate defcon alert, and the US made ready for a possible war. From the little bit of the teaser they presented, they seem to be positing Nixons plan was then to cozy up to the Chinese to keep the Russians from carrying out that plan.  I'd never read anything about that encounter or the results,  but it seems it had the effect of pushing our diplomatic advances to China into overdrive.  Thanks Brezhnev.

It's always been hailed as a hugely successful, diplomatic event, but in reality may have just been the opening of Pandas box or Pandoras box... whichever...  Who that success benefitted seems to be on Chinas' side based on what they've now become.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105180

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Posted
All you had to say was China sucks.  They're the worst thing to hit the civilized world since the USSR.  
A little thread drift, but I listened to part of "The Great Wager" on NPR yesterday. It's a multi part podcast about Nixon, and his plans to open up China to the west.  China, and the Russians hated each other in the 70's, and all kinds of behind the scenes, cloak and dagger, fuckery was going on.
Mao's China was a third world country when Nixon made his historic trip, and created the path we're now treading.  From a Chinese woman who grew up in Beijing:  she, and her sister would count cars in Beijing for fun (early 70's). If they saw more than about 10 cars in a single day that would be a huge deal. China was an impoverished nation, no universities, no middle class, no progress, factories, if they were even open produced almost nothing. No capitalism per Maos blood stained orders.
Before Nixons grand plan had really been developed, a Russian spy set a "chit chat" lunch date with one of Nixons ambassadors.  In one of those power broker, Washington haunts, the Russian asked the American, what would America think of Russia removing all of Chinas nuclear capabilities ? 
The American froze in mid bite, and made an immediate bee line for the Oval Office with the news that Russia was signaling they were cool with a nuclear war with China.  That apparently caused an immediate defcon alert, and the US made ready for a possible war. From the little bit of the teaser they presented, they seem to be positing Nixons plan was then to cozy up to the Chinese to keep the Russians from carrying out that plan.  I'd never read anything about that encounter or the results,  but it seems it had the effect of pushing our diplomatic advances to China into overdrive.  Thanks Brezhnev.
It's always been hailed as a hugely successful, diplomatic event, but in reality may have just been the opening of Pandas box or Pandoras box... whichever...  Who that success benefitted seems to be on Chinas' side based on what they've now become.

Counterpoint…a country of a billion plus people, with a history of empires and commerce, was gonna figure this shit out sooner or later.
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Onboard 2.0

Onboard 2.0 9083

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1 minute ago, Brisketexan said:


Counterpoint…a country of a billion plus people, with a history of empires and commerce, was gonna figure this shit out sooner or later.

Counterpoint: True, but not until Mao was dead, and his virulent anti capitalism dogma was erased (sort of) were they gonna embark on that of course.  

They finally figured out they had to join the 20th c. and create wealth to project power.  We sped up that time line. We embraced the flow of manufacturing to their corner of the planet.  They're now a bit of a genie out of the bottle.

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Brisketexan

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Counterpoint: True, but not until Mao was dead, and his virulent anti capitalism dogma was erased (sort of) were they gonna embark on that of course.  
They finally figured out they had to join the 20th c. and create wealth to project power.  We sped up that time line. We embraced the flow of manufacturing to their corner of the planet.  They're now a bit of a genie out of the bottle.

No argument there. Post WWII, the cheap manufacturing timeline, as told by the “made in” stamp on the bottom of plastic toy soldiers:

Taiwan, ROC
Japan
China
Vietnam?

Each one began by making the cheapest shit possible, then advanced to making high end products (electronics, cars). China is a bit of an odd case, because it’s still making the cheap shit, and its high end stuff isn’t really homegrown yet - it’s largely making components for other companies and such.

What I still don’t get is why we haven’t turned to Central America for the cheap shit. There’s no reason that there aren’t plastic molding factories, and textile mills, in Honduras. Shipping costs are less, and the added bonus of providing stabilizing revenue to those countries. We have fucked up our relationship and opportunities with Central America at every turn for 200 years. We could turn to them now, and reduce our dependence on China. But we don’t. All it takes is some bribes to the right people, and we get it done.
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Onboard 2.0

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1 minute ago, Brisketexan said:


No argument there. Post WWII, the cheap manufacturing timeline, as told by the “made in” stamp on the bottom of plastic toy soldiers:

Taiwan, ROC
Japan
China
Vietnam?

Each one began by making the cheapest shit possible, then advanced to making high end products (electronics, cars). China is a bit of an odd case, because it’s still making the cheap shit, and its high end stuff isn’t really homegrown yet - it’s largely making components for other companies and such.

What I still don’t get is why we haven’t turned to Central America for the cheap shit. There’s no reason that there aren’t plastic molding factories, and textile mills, in Honduras. Shipping costs are less, and the added bonus of providing stabilizing revenue to those countries. We have fucked up our relationship and opportunities with Central America at every turn for 200 years. We could turn to them now, and reduce our dependence on China. But we don’t. All it takes is some bribes to the right people, and we get it done.

 

 

I'm always puzzled by Chinas inability to really innovate. I imagine there's a theory they have on that.  I think some of it comes from if you stick your neck out and fail it's usually death or long term stays in a re-education camp.   They are such a nation of easily cowed people, so similar to the Russians in many ways.

I definitely agree with the bolded part. Short sighted ignorance would be one explanation.  We should be making our neighbors to the south strong, reliable allies, and not just a potential, cheap vacation destination.  

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workswithseed

workswithseed 2109

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2 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

All you had to say was China sucks.  They're the worst thing to hit the civilized world since the USSR.  

A little thread drift, but I listened to part of "The Great Wager" on NPR yesterday. It's a multi part podcast about Nixon, and his plans to open up China to the west.  China, and the Russians hated each other in the 70's, and all kinds of behind the scenes, cloak and dagger, fuckery was going on.

Mao's China was a third world country when Nixon made his historic trip, and created the path we're now treading.  From a Chinese woman who grew up in Beijing:  she, and her sister would count cars in Beijing for fun (early 70's). If they saw more than about 10 cars in a single day that would be a huge deal. China was an impoverished nation, no universities, no middle class, no progress, factories, if they were even open produced almost nothing. No capitalism per Maos blood stained orders.

Before Nixons grand plan had really been developed, a Russian spy set a "chit chat" lunch date with one of Nixons ambassadors.  In one of those power broker, Washington haunts, the Russian asked the American, what would America think of Russia removing all of Chinas nuclear capabilities ? 

The American froze in mid bite, and made an immediate bee line for the Oval Office with the news that Russia was signaling they were cool with a nuclear war with China.  That apparently caused an immediate defcon alert, and the US made ready for a possible war. From the little bit of the teaser they presented, they seem to be positing Nixons plan was then to cozy up to the Chinese to keep the Russians from carrying out that plan.  I'd never read anything about that encounter or the results,  but it seems it had the effect of pushing our diplomatic advances to China into overdrive.  Thanks Brezhnev.

It's always been hailed as a hugely successful, diplomatic event, but in reality may have just been the opening of Pandas box or Pandoras box... whichever...  Who that success benefitted seems to be on Chinas' side based on what they've now become.

 

On 4/19/2020 at 5:16 PM, Ghost of LL said:

It's not that conservatives "got tired of" "policing the world."  It's that the Trumpublican Party completely abandoned the internationalism that was one of the cornerstones of the conservative movement.

And Nixon wasn't wrong about China.  Nixon opening China was part of what cause of the USSR to fall.  Exploiting the wedge between China and the Soviet Union was one of the great victories of American diplomacy.

Finally--you have a real limited understanding of history if you don't appreciate the role anti-corruption used to have in the conservative movement.  Large city machine politics--e.g., Tammany Hall, the Daley machine in Chicago--were generally creatures of the Democratic Party.  Part of what underpinned the conservative movement was a drive toward transparency and government accountability.  And now that's completely gone.  The Trumpublicans have embraced corruption on a scale that would've caused Boss Tweed to blush in embarrassment.  

As I said, it was a mistake by Nixon to open up China 

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Cacti

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3 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

What I still don’t get is why we haven’t turned to Central America for the cheap shit... We could turn to them now, and reduce our dependence on China. But we don’t. All it takes is some bribes to the right people, and we get it done.

Agree 100%. It would be a win for us and for our neighbors to the South. And a minor defeat for China.

Now, which of our elected officials can be bribed to make this happen?

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F250

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5 hours ago, Brisketexan said:


Counterpoint…a country of a billion plus people, with a history of empires and commerce, was gonna figure this shit out sooner or later.

This and they figured it out fast. Actually it was Deng Xiaoping that figured it out and then he began reforming China in the late 70's. The dude was purged multiple times during Mao's regime and had plenty of enemies after Mao's death but some how managed to assume leadership in China then initiate massive reforms that lead to China's rise.

I don't see how this happens with anyone other than him running China. The political maneuvering, national economic, technical and military strategies not bound by ideology were pretty fucking impressive considering it was Communist China.

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Onboard 2.0

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13 minutes ago, F250 said:

This and they figured it out fast. Actually it was Deng Xiaoping that figured it out and then he began reforming China in the late 70's. The dude was purged multiple times during Mao's regime and had plenty of enemies after Mao's death but some how managed to assume leadership in China then initiate massive reforms that lead to China's rise.

I don't see how this happens with anyone other than him running China. The political maneuvering, national economic, technical and military strategies not bound by ideology were pretty fucking impressive considering it was Communist China.

Good 'ol Dung................ errrrrrr Deng....

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Hate

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Posted
 
 
I'm always puzzled by Chinas inability to really innovate. I imagine there's a theory they have on that.  I think some of it comes from if you stick your neck out and fail it's usually death or long term stays in a re-education camp.   They are such a nation of easily cowed people, so similar to the Russians in many ways.
I definitely agree with the bolded part. Short sighted ignorance would be one explanation.  We should be making our neighbors to the south strong, reliable allies, and not just a potential, cheap vacation destination.  

I’ve mentioned it before, but I would love for the US to embrace what I call a manufacturing Monroe Doctrine and bring all of those factories back to the Western Hemisphere.

Edit: I meant to quote Brisket’s post that spoke to Central America.
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Ghost of LL

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7 hours ago, workswithseed said:

 

As I said, it was a mistake by Nixon to open up China 

After what I laid out, this is...and I am going to try to say this delicately...

...taking a breath so I don't overstate...

 

 

 

...one of the stupidest motherfucking things I've ever read.  And I'm a lawyer in Texas.  Part of my job is reading the stupid shit that comes out of the Fifth Circuit.  And yet, this tops it.  

After read thing the indisputable fact that opening China was a big part of the split in Sino-Soviet relations, which lead, in turn, by to the collapse of Soviet Communism, you conclude that "it was a mistake by Nixon to open up China"?  I mean, seriously?  I suppose Vladimir Putin would hold that view.  But if you're an American, what kind of moron in America would reach that conclusion?

I mean, . . . fuck man--there are some stupid takes on here.  And then there's . . . you.  I mean . . . fuck.

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staboner

staboner 4984

Posted
Posted
44 minutes ago, Hate said:


I’ve mentioned it before, but I would love for the US to embrace what I call a manufacturing Monroe Doctrine and bring all of those factories back to the Western Hemisphere.

Edit: I meant to quote Brisket’s post that spoke to Central America.

a hugely successful economy thinking short term while the underachieving society with absolute control measures in place thinks long term. the shit is written. match made in heaven. 

absolutely agree, if we had any mid to long term brains at all we would have worked to stabilize Mexico and CA and get more of our shit made there. drugs, people, ideologies, location, whatever. 

we took the best bid on the market at the time. it is what it is. 

 

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workswithseed

workswithseed 2109

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Ghost of LL said:

After what I laid out, this is...and I am going to try to say this delicately...

...taking a breath so I don't overstate...

 

 

 

...one of the stupidest motherfucking things I've ever read.  And I'm a lawyer in Texas.  Part of my job is reading the stupid shit that comes out of the Fifth Circuit.  And yet, this tops it.  

After read thing the indisputable fact that opening China was a big part of the split in Sino-Soviet relations, which lead, in turn, by to the collapse of Soviet Communism, you conclude that "it was a mistake by Nixon to open up China"?  I mean, seriously?  I suppose Vladimir Putin would hold that view.  But if you're an American, what kind of moron in America would reach that conclusion?

I mean, . . . fuck man--there are some stupid takes on here.  And then there's . . . you.  I mean . . . fuck.

Fuck.... I just don't agree. I didn't know Putin cared about the opening of China up to the West. 

I mean as we can see, Opening up China up has been so good, and Russia isn't attacking our allies still. 

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washparkhorn

washparkhorn 9939

Posted
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Good read on long term strategic goals of the Chinese “Communist Party” (CCP) on “The World Island” - China and Russia long term ambitions - from Tufts with a link to Bloomberg. https://fletcher.tufts.edu/news-events/news/china-and-russia-want-control-world-island
 

Sir Halford Mackinder identified the bottle neck in 1907. The “World Island” in this context is Europe, Asia and Africa.  Link is the US Army War College - official link.

https://press.armywarcollege.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1974&context=parameters 

China can avert war with the Western Democracies at any time.
 

Russia would crumble under CCP economic domination (and crushed by the CCP war machine).

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F250

F250 28802

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, workswithseed said:

Fuck.... I just don't agree. I didn't know Putin cared about the opening of China up to the West. 

I mean as we can see, Opening up China up has been so good, and Russia isn't attacking our allies still. 

It dealt a severe blow to the Soviet Union and put the Soviets against the Chinese as well as the U.S. Putin cares about the collapse of the Soviet empire hence the comment about Putin. It also explains why Putin has been trying to reassert control over former Soviet satellite states.

China was going to liberalize their markets with or without the U.S. Xiaoping was committed to this aspect and it wasn't contingent on Nixon opening up relations with China.

As mentioned by Brisket, China has historically been a major power the current rise of China isn't an anomaly, it would have happened either way.

 

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Zeus

Zeus 6108

Posted
Posted

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-10577513/China-pull-coverage-weekends-fixtures-Premier-League-amid-Ukraine-support.html#comments

Quote

The Premier League showed solidarity with Ukraine last weekend following Russia's invasion of the country

There are plans for all 20 sides to take part in similar gestures when they take to the field for this weekend's games

China are therefore considering not showing any of the games from the English top flight

Beijing has denounced sanctions that have been imposed by the UK and the EU against Russia and blamed the US and its allies for provoking Moscow

 

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