Help me come up with the all-time UT hoops roster

[bluto 4934]

Even though ivey is the D guy, mason and boobie were both strong defenders. Any room for Chris Owens off the bench?

[shadow_operative 15932]

Doj > Mason and Boobie defensively, athletically, and in terms of running the break. 

[Ignatius 4017]

My five if you can’t substitute at all:

TJ

Travis Mays

KD

LMA

Bamba

[pyrohornIII 4817]

Since Mays is playing, can we let Wacker coach?   

[HookEm 2467]

I’m wondering y’all’s thoughts on the best defense focused lineup. I would go with this:

Royale Ivey - All Big 12 Def x2
Daniel Gibson - All Big 12 Def
PJ Tucker - All Big 12 Def
Lamarcus Aldridge - Big 12 DPOY
Mo Bamba - All Big 12 Def

Damn that would be a sick defensive lineup.

Bench:
Avery Bradley
Dogus Balbay - Big 12 DPOY
Justin Mason - 2x All Big 12 Def
Tristan Thompson - All Big 12 Def
Prince Ibeh - Big 12 DPOY (often overlooked)

Lot of other great defenders like Durant, Mimh, Turner, D James, James Thomas. The list goes on and on.

[shadow_operative 15932]

5 hours ago, Dr. Beeper said:

That’s not a good list Derka. Will respond more later. 

🙄 

[shadow_operative 15932]

ok, cool. 

[Harrison Stafford 3335]

There can be no list without Larry Robinson who paved the way for other African-Americans.  He was the SWC MVP in 1972 & 1974, UT's leading rebounder in '72 and '74, led UT to the sweet sixteen in '72 (beating UH with a 23 pt./14reb. performance), and had a career average of 21.5 ppg.  Robinson accomplished this when freshman weren't allowed to play varsity and UT was, predominantly, a football school...and that's putting it mildly. 

 

 

Edited December 20, 2020 by Harrison Stafford

[orangecat92 306]

Just saw this.  I saw you put LaSalle Thompson as a forward? Huh? Nope.   He was a center and his stats reflected that.  Without looking up stats, LaSalle came from Cincinatti, OH, I think, was an All-American McDonald's high-school player who came to Texas and developed into a rebounding machine.  One year he led the country in rebounding, with either 13.6 or 13.8 per game.  Dominating player, held his own against Akeem, Koncak, etc.  If you start a center, which I am not certain you are, LaSalle is the number one center in Texas history.  He easily beats Chris Mihm.  not close.  

 

Coach? Do you want a tactician or someone to keep the players ready to play and loose?  If you want the former, Barnes, the latter, Abe Lemons. 

 

 

 

 

[hobbes2702 13049]

20 hours ago, tx ind said:

No spot for a Klotz or Atchley?

No

[hobbes2702 13049]

19 minutes ago, Dr. Beeper said:

Thread title: Help me come up with the all-time UT hoops roster

I don’t wanna argue with this guy. I don’t wanna discuss. Hes right about a lot (obvious stuff) but wrong about a lot and just makes up criteria as he goes along that sounds good to him. Replacing an All-American and top 7 pick (shouldn’t matter) with a one and done single digit scorer, and then not even having the AA as a backup instead of Mo Fucking Bamba, and then omitting Mays initially. You really purport to be some sort of Texas hoops expert and it’s laughable. 

Great contribution to the thread

[hobbes2702 13049]

6 minutes ago, Dr. Beeper said:

Cincinnati, 13.5, yes he should be a center, and Barnes over Abe all day. 

I don’t mind LaSalle over Mihm. Both should be centers over Tristan and Bamba. 

Not if your goal is protecting the rim

[shadow_operative 15932]

15 minutes ago, hobbes2702 said:

Not if your goal is protecting the rim

...and not if you want to run at all, which is what this all-time roster is specifically built for. Anyone who can't understand why players like Bamba and T Thompson are starting/on rosters while guys like Mihm and L Thompson are coming off the bench/not making the roster shouldn't even be attempting to take part in this discussion. to have that very person then add a childish belligerence and argumentative nature to his aforementioned lack of knowldge/basketball acumen is just a treat. /Rex Kramer'd.

edited to add: everything that rex was whining about/trying to start a fight over had already been addressed throughout the thread, but does he actually read any of that and then respond to it, or even issue a mea culpa? nope. he literally says, "this is a dumb post derka. i'll tell you more about it later". then he gets uset when that post gets a middle finger. like hobbes said, great contribution rex, thanks for showing up to this thread.

double edit: oh yeah and hey, why don't you find another excuse to mention for the 10,000th time that you went to Westlake with Axtell and Mihm. we all just can't get enough of you mentioning that, it's just so badass.

Edited December 20, 2020 by shadow_operative

[realgreggym 837]

2 hours ago, Harrison Stafford said:

There can be no list without Larry Robinson who paved the way for other African-Americans.  He was the SWC MVP in 1972 & 1974, UT's leading rebounder in '72 and '74, led UT to the sweet sixteen in '72 (beating UH with a 23 pt./14reb. performance), and had a career average of 21.5 ppg.  Robinson accomplished this when freshman weren't allowed to play varsity and UT was, predominantly, a football school...and that's putting it mildly. 

 

 

Great post. Thats why he is in my starting lineup. I believe that he was the third black student athlete to earn a scholarship bball at UT.

Sam Bradley was the first around 1968 or so, Jimmy Blacklock was the second in 1969 I think and he was a JC transfer from Tyler JC 

and Larry was the third. I think that Spider Johnson was also in Larry's class but he left for some reason after his freshman year. Larry was

injured right before conference started his junior year so he was out or he would have won MVP again..

You're right about being a football school. DKR was a great coach

but he sucked as an AD. I don't remember what year it was but I believe that we started my black kids.3 than the football team did,2. Thanks 

for mentioning Larry. He was the best player in the SWC in the 70s and that includes when UH came in.

 

[shadow_operative 15932]

if any player who's older than LaSalle should make the team it should be Krivacs imo. 

[HookEm 2467]

It’s funny you built your team to run, but Barnes isn’t the coach you want then. Seems like they were always more of a half court ugly the game up type of teams. That is where Barnes is in his wheelhouse.

[shadow_operative 15932]

Just now, HookEm said:

It’s funny you built your team to run, but Barnes isn’t the coach you want then. Seems like they were always more of a half court ugly the game up type of teams. That is where Barnes is in his wheelhouse.

this is a widely held misconception about Rick Barnes. there are two basic types of CBB head coaches- system guys, eg Roy, Huggins, Bennett, etc, and then "mold my style around my personnel" guys; Rick Barnes is the latter. when Barnes had the personnel to get up and down he did it and he did it very well. from TJ, to DJ, to Doj'Covan, his best teams were teams that had elite PG play and who liked to run. 

I believe it was either longhornmatt or catdaddy who said that in his opinion, the best basketball team/play we ever had at Texas was our 2009-10 team, before the collapse, and I agree with that take. Doj Balbay was that team's starter and we played fast as shit, sprinting up the court even after opponent's made baskets, with Damion James often grabbing the ball out of the net and then hurling it 35 feet to an already-sprinting Balbay. even after the epic collapse that team finished 6th in the country averaging 81.2 ppg. Make no mistake about it, Barnes not only likes to run, he's very good at it when he has the right personnel. TJ + KD + the rest of my chosen roster is absolutely the right personnel. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

More pertinent info re: Barnes' teams running and scoring:

 

2000-01, pre-TJ: 70.5 ppg, 179th nationally

2001-02, with TJ Ford: 78.1 ppg, 35th nationally

2002-03: 79.3 ppg, 18th nationally 

 

even after TJ left we continued to play at a decent pace while scoring plenty of points:

 

2003-04: 76.6 ppg, 32nd nationally 

2004-05: 76.9, 23rd nationally

2005-06: 75.2 ppg, 41st nationally

 

you can see that our lowest ppg/respective ranking from this period came when the strength of our team was playing half court ball with PJ Tucker and LaMarcus Aldridge. 

 

Then comes 2006-07. We're small, were young, we're not great defensively, so despite being a very thin team, we ran:

 

2006-07: 81.7 ppg, 6th nationally 

 

after that we lose KD and our offense changes more to a pick and pop half court offense with guys like DJ, Atchley, and Damion James, and we slowed our pace down for a few seasons. fast forward to 2009-10:

 

I already posted our 81.2 ppg average, but beyond that we were 8th in the country in average possession length coming in at a blazing fast 15.2 seconds/possession (during the 35 second shot clock era). we scored 85+ 13 times; 90+ nine times; 100+ four times. This team at its best is probably the best team Rick Barnes has ever been in charge of, and that includes TJ's 2003 team. 

 

All of this is to say that Rick Barnes has an excellent track record at playing a fast paced, up-and-down style when he has the proper personnel, so let's not go crazy thinking that Tom Penders or someone else would be better equipped to coach a team that wants to run. 

[Had Enough 2083]

Albert Burditt. I wanna see a high flyer.

[shadow_operative 15932]

Kris Clack, Tremaine Wingfield, Tony Watson, Kerwin Roach, Jaxson Hayes, Greg Brown, Kai Jones, DaMarcus Croaker, Doj Balbay, Chris Owens, Jericho Sims, and Damion James say, "pick me!"

[orangecat92 306]

1 hour ago, shadow_operative said:

if any player who's older than LaSalle should make the team it should be Krivacs imo. 

Don’t forget Ron Baxter.  Shorter version of Barkley..shortest power forward I ever saw, 6 4. 

[orangecat92 306]

1 hour ago, shadow_operative said:

this is a widely held misconception about Rick Barnes. there are two basic types of CBB head coaches- system guys, eg Roy, Huggins, Bennett, etc, and then "mold my style around my personnel" guys; Rick Barnes is the latter. when Barnes had the personnel to get up and down he did it and he did it very well. from TJ, to DJ, to Doj'Covan, his best teams were teams that had elite PG play and who liked to run. 

I believe it was either longhornmatt or catdaddy who said that in his opinion, the best basketball team/play we ever had at Texas was our 2009-10 team, before the collapse, and I agree with that take. Doj Balbay was that team's starter and we played fast as shit, sprinting up the court even after opponent's made baskets, with Damion James often grabbing the ball out of the net and then hurling it 35 feet to an already-sprinting Balbay. even after the epic collapse that team finished 6th in the country averaging 81.2 ppg. Make no mistake about it, Barnes not only likes to run, he's very good at it when he has the right personnel. TJ + KD + the rest of my chosen roster is absolutely the right personnel. 

 Best team play before the collapse ever?  You are obviously younger than me.  The 81-82 squad was to many people in Austin the best ever before the collapse, and the collapse was REAL! 14 and 0, number 4 in the country, and only 2 all SWC talents, Walker and Thompson.  Could have easily made final four.

Btw, what was the collapse in 09-10?  Did someone get injured, or did the team mysteriously stop playing as a team, or what?

[orangecat92 306]

Oops, don’t see edit function...mike wacker. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

16 minutes ago, orangecat92 said:

Don’t forget Ron Baxter.  Shorter version of Barkley..shortest power forward I ever saw, 6 4. 

i've got mad love for Ron Baxter. quintessential guy who played well above what his size and athleticism said he should. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

6 minutes ago, orangecat92 said:

Oops, don’t see edit function...mike wacker. 

it's moved. check the upper right of your post. 👌🏼 

[shadow_operative 15932]

9 minutes ago, orangecat92 said:

 Best team play before the collapse ever?  You are obviously younger than me.  The 81-82 squad was to many people in Austin the best ever before the collapse, and the collapse was REAL! 14 and 0, number 4 in the country, and only 2 all SWC talents, Walker and Thompson.  Could have easily made final four.

Btw, what was the collapse in 09-10?  Did someone get injured, or did the team mysteriously stop playing as a team, or what?

re: Wacker's team, my dad has regaled me with countless stories of that team and especially Wacker. it really does sound like that team was Final 4 caliber before one of the craziest freak injuries i've ever heard of.

re: 2009-10: we were the best team in the country at Christmas, coming off two major wins in a span of three days: first, out-sprinting UNC at Jerryworld, and then out-slugging Sparty a couple of days later. We were the no.1 team in the country for two weeks in January before the bottom completely fell out. Apparently Rick held some practices over Christmas break where he mentally fucked the entire team, and everything unraveled in what is still to this day  a nearly impossible to believe collapse. It's probably the biggest bummer of my sports lifetime. 

[realgreggym 837]

1 hour ago, longhornmatt said:

Sidney Moncrief at Arkansas was the best SWC player in the 1970s. Maybe Otis Birdsong at Houston.  Both of those guys were top 10 picks and multiple time NBA All Stars.

Those Eddie Sutton Arkansas teams in the late 70s/80s and then the Guy V Houston teams in the early 80s were also way, way better than the SWC teams of the early 1970s.  In Larry Robinson’s senior year, Texas won the SWC with an 11-3 conference record, but had a 12-15 record overall.   It was not a good basketball conference in those days, to put it mildly.  Our own teams under Abe were also a lot better in the late 70s than our early 70s teams.

Wrong. Larry could do it all. Sidney could jump out of the gym. That was his main strength. As far as Larry's senior year, go and look at the records of the teams we played and their records.  Larry would have been drafted higher but had 2 bad knees. And several of Abe's players were recruited before he got there. He also had the advantage of a new gym Also, DKR when he retired as head football coach was more open to basketball then when he was also football coach. In the 71-72 March Madness, Larry single handed beat Dwight Jones and Dwight Davis by scoring 23 points and getting 14 rebounds against UH in Las Cruces. UH was about a 20 point favorite.. Both of them if I remember correctly were NBA lottery picks.  We also beat Memphis State at Mid South when they got into the finals against UCLA.I was comparing Larry as an individual player. Of course teams in the later years were better. 

[Amos Moses 795]

Chi-co Vas-quez

 

clap clap clap clap clap 

[Amos Moses 795]

1 hour ago, Dr. Beeper said:

He doesn’t belong on this list. 

Yeah well ... ya know. That’s just like, your opinion, man.

[Tyrone Krivacs 50]

14 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

if any player who's older than LaSalle should make the team it should be Krivacs imo. 

I agree

[Harrison Stafford 3335]

13 hours ago, realgreggym said:

Wrong. Larry could do it all. Sidney could jump out of the gym. That was his main strength. As far as Larry's senior year, go and look at the records of the teams we played and their records.  Larry would have been drafted higher but had 2 bad knees. And several of Abe's players were recruited before he got there. He also had the advantage of a new gym Also, DKR when he retired as head football coach was more open to basketball then when he was also football coach. In the 71-72 March Madness, Larry single handed beat Dwight Jones and Dwight Davis by scoring 23 points and getting 14 rebounds against UH in Las Cruces. UH was about a 20 point favorite.. Both of them if I remember correctly were NBA lottery picks.  We also beat Memphis State at Mid South when they got into the finals against UCLA.I was comparing Larry as an individual player. Of course teams in the later years were better. 

I watched that UT-UH NCAA tournament game and Larry Robinson was dominant against Dwight Davis (the 3rd pick in the '72 NBA draft) and Dwight Jones (the 9th pick in the '73 NBA draft).  No one could believe we beat the Coogs.  No.  One.  You were correct in an earlier post that Larry would have won the SWC MVP in '73 (as he did in '72 & '74) had he not been injured.  As a sophomore, I interviewed Larry for a journalism paper.  He was about as unassuming and low-key as it comes.  Just a super nice human being who kicked ass when hooping it up.  As you said, his knees prevented an NBA career.  Like you, I watched Larry Robinson play and he should be on this list.

[HookEm 2467]

Not gonna get into a big argument regarding Barnes style. I watched him for years. Just because he had a few teams that scored well doesn’t mean that his preference is playing at a high tempo. I agree that he will adjust based on personnel (to SOME degree), but the players he has are there because he recruited them. He definitely has a bias toward recruiting and then coaching players to play hard nosed half court offense basketball.

Here is his team’s pace over the last 20+ years:
Average: 150+

Tennessee
2021 - 295
2020 - 294
2019 - 134
2018 - 273
2017 - 85
2016 - 91

Texas
2015 - 252
2014 - 74
2013 - 101
2012 - 136
2011 - 106
2010 - 7
2009 - 126
2008 - 244
2007 - 47
2006 - 217
2005 - 104
2004 - 162
2003 - 84
2002 - 106
2001 - 146

He definitely has had more teams >200 than he has had

[shadow_operative 15932]

16 minutes ago, HookEm said:

Not gonna get into a big argument regarding Barnes style. I watched him for years. Just because he had a few teams that scored well doesn’t mean that his preference is playing at a high tempo. I agree that he will adjust based on personnel (to SOME degree), but the players he has are there because he recruited them. He definitely has a bias toward recruiting and then coaching players to play hard nosed half court offense basketball.

Here is his team’s pace over the last 20+ years:
Average: 150+

Tennessee
2021 - 295
2020 - 294
2019 - 134
2018 - 273
2017 - 85
2016 - 91

Texas
2015 - 252
2014 - 74
2013 - 101
2012 - 136
2011 - 106
2010 - 7
2009 - 126
2008 - 244
2007 - 47
2006 - 217
2005 - 104
2004 - 162
2003 - 84
2002 - 106
2001 - 146

He definitely has had more teams >200 than he has had

the fact that most of his teams historically don't run up and down changes nothing about this conversation. when Barnes has had the personnel to run he has done so, and he has done so very very well. nothing you're posting here disproves that.

you said that it was stupid to have Barnes as the coach of a team that wants to run; history proves otherwise when he has the proper personnel. my all-time team that i've chosen is a who's who of his best running teams- TJ, DJ, KD, AJ, Damion James, Tristan Thompson, et al. it doesn't matter if Barnes historically chooses not to run when he doesn't have a roster that's built for it. that's tangential to this conversation. your assertion that he can't coach a team that's designed to run was just plain wrong, and the arguments you're making now don't support your contention in the first place. 

Edited December 21, 2020 by shadow_operative

[realgreggym 837]

40 minutes ago, Harrison Stafford said:

I watched that UT-UH NCAA tournament game and Larry Robinson was dominant against Dwight Davis (the 3rd pick in the '72 NBA draft) and Dwight Jones (the 9th pick in the '73 NBA draft).  No one could believe we beat the Coogs.  No.  One.  You were correct in an earlier post that Larry would have won the SWC MVP in '73 (as he did in '72 & '74) had he not been injured.  As a sophomore, I interviewed Larry for a journalism paper.  He was about as unassuming and low-key as it comes.  Just a super nice human being who kicked ass when hooping it up.  As you said, his knees prevented an NBA career.  Like you, I watched Larry Robinson play and he should be on this list.

We were told by the Houston media that if we didn't show up, it would be a 2-0 forfeit instead of getting whipped by 20. Here is a quick recruiting story. When Larry

played at Hobbs, they were a national power like Wheatley in Houston. They probably averaged close to 100 points a game with the old rules. On Larry's team, the starting center was a 6'9 center whose name I think was Kyle Williams. Every coach in the country including us wanted Kyle. While our coaches were watching him play one game. they kept noticing some skinny black kid. They did some homework and offered Larry and he was the third black hoops student athlete to come to Texas. Kyle would up going to Kansas State when the great Jack Hartman was their coach. You are right about the kind of young man Larry was.

[HookEm 2467]

I never said it would be “stupid” and I never said Barnes “can’t coach” fast paced teams. I said it isn’t in his wheelhouse. And it isn’t. His preference is pretty evident in the stats I posted. If you disagree, that is fine.

Pretty typical argument tactic to reframe the other party’s statement into a polarizing view. It is annoying AF and why we can’t have a nice conversation around here.

[DanTheHorn 4939]

I really don't watch pro-basketball so my only recollection of Texas players is from them playing for Texas. So I am surprised PJ Tucker is so far up the list. The way I remember it is that PJ Tucker was just starting to come into his own and he could really help his draft position if he stayed and played an extra year. It was surprise to many he felt he was ready for the NBA. How can a guy who's reputation was what it was at Texas at the time rise to an undisputed top 5.

So I went and looked to see if I remembered things correctly. Even Tucker did not hire an agent because all he was doing was testing the waters.

https://texassports.com/news/2006/4/24/042406aaa_930.aspx?path=mbball

https://www.espn.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/1876/2006-draft-profile-p-j-tucker

Now I know the man has been playing for years in the pros so is his lofty position on this list a result from what he has done in the pros?

Quote

PJ Tucker is 6-5. That's great if you're a point guard, tolerable if you're a shooting guard, and regrettable if you're a small forward....................

Poor Man's Charles Barkley?
So, P.J. Tucker has to hope for lots of things: that GMs are looking closely for intangibles like attitude and grit, that long arms count for something, and that everyone remembers Charles Barkley (who, despite his listed playing height of 6-6, says in his own book that he is really a half-inch shorter than Tucker's reported 6-5).

https://www.espn.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/1876/2006-draft-profile-p-j-tucker

 

 

[shadow_operative 15932]

ok, you didn't say it was stupid, you said it was "funny" to choose Barnes to coach a team that wants to run. tomato/tomato. why you're so upset about my responses to this point i have no idea. you're the only one here getting defensive, referring to this discussion as "an argument" and then getting upset about it. that's all you buddy.

as for your second paragraph, well that's just rich enough to eat, isn't it? after all its you who continues to move the goal posts over and over as each of your points gets shot down. my only assertion from the beginning has been that Barnes has always preferred to run when he has the personnel to do so, and that he's been successful at it, which actually isn't an assertion at all, it's just a fact. 

3 hours ago, HookEm said:

His preference is pretty evident in the stats I posted. If you disagree, that is fine.

this is the last thing you said before your whiny final paragraph about "argument tactics" involving reframing someone else's argument. how tone deaf is that? you refuse to address the only point i've made (because it refutes your original point), you continue to reframe it into your own twisted words, and then you whine about me supposedly doing that to you. how Barnes chooses to coach when he doesn't have a roster suited to run isn't relevant to this discussion at all, is it? and yet instead of just conceding that your original assertion that it was "funny" to have Barnes coach a team that wants to run was wrong, you've gotten yourself all wound up and upset and over this "argument" that you find yourself in. well, good luck with that. 

Edited December 22, 2020 by shadow_operative

[shadow_operative 15932]

9 minutes ago, DanTheHorn said:

I really don't watch pro-basketball so my only recollection of Texas players is from them playing for Texas. So I am surprised PJ Tucker is so far up the list. The way I remember it is that PJ Tucker was just starting to come into his own and he could really help his draft position if he stayed and played an extra year. It was surprise to many he felt he was ready for the NBA. How can a guy who's reputation was what it was at Texas at the time rise to an undisputed top 5.

So I went and looked to see if I remembered things correctly. Even Tucker did not hire an agent because all he was doing was testing the waters.

https://texassports.com/news/2006/4/24/042406aaa_930.aspx?path=mbball

https://www.espn.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/1876/2006-draft-profile-p-j-tucker

Now I know the man has been playing for years in the pros so is his lofty position on this list a result from what he has done in the pros?

https://www.espn.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/1876/2006-draft-profile-p-j-tucker

 

 

PJ Tucker was the Big XII POY. his draft position has nothing to do with anything here. or would Iowa fans be stupid to consider Luka Garza really good because he's not a top pro prospect? 

[hobbes2702 13049]

12 minutes ago, DanTheHorn said:

I really don't watch pro-basketball so my only recollection of Texas players is from them playing for Texas. So I am surprised PJ Tucker is so far up the list. The way I remember it is that PJ Tucker was just starting to come into his own and he could really help his draft position if he stayed and played an extra year. It was surprise to many he felt he was ready for the NBA. How can a guy who's reputation was what it was at Texas at the time rise to an undisputed top 5.

So I went and looked to see if I remembered things correctly. Even Tucker did not hire an agent because all he was doing was testing the waters.

https://texassports.com/news/2006/4/24/042406aaa_930.aspx?path=mbball

https://www.espn.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/1876/2006-draft-profile-p-j-tucker

Now I know the man has been playing for years in the pros so is his lofty position on this list a result from what he has done in the pros?

https://www.espn.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/1876/2006-draft-profile-p-j-tucker

 

 

PJ Tucker was the Big 12 player of the year on a team that had LMA and Boogie. He was second team AA with guys like Rudy Gay, Tyler Hansborough. His draft status has zero to do with his dominance at the college level. He’s one of the five best guys ever to play at Texas.

[DanTheHorn 4939]

8 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

PJ Tucker was the Big XII POY. his draft position has nothing to do with anything here. or would Iowa fans be stupid to consider Luka Garza really good because he's not a top pro prospect? 

So you are saying my recollection of him just starting to come into his own was an under-appreciation by me since that coming into his own was worthy of a Big 12 Player of the Year award. Well, I was going by memory.

[shadow_operative 15932]

36 minutes ago, DanTheHorn said:

So you are saying my recollection of him just starting to come into his own was an under-appreciation by me since that coming into his own was worthy of a Big 12 Player of the Year award. Well, I was going by memory.

to be fair 2006 was a lot longer ago than i'd like to admit, so i can understand that going off memory. but yeah, 2006 PJ Tucker is definitely one of the most well rounded and best players in UT history. his averages that year come out to 16 pts, 10 reb, 3 ast, 2 stl per game on a team that had plenty of offensive options (Aldridge, Boobie, Abrams, Paulino). the fact that he can legit guard 4 positions is maybe unparalleled among UT basketball players in my lifetime, and for me it's exactly that- his versatility -that makes him such an important part of my theoretical team. the talent and production are evident, but the different roles he can play makes him unique. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

more pertinent stats and rankings:

 

[Knighthawk 284]

On 12/19/2020 at 10:44 AM, MirrOlure said:

Can’t believe it too 32 posts before someone mentioned Travis Mays. Unquestionably the first elite guard of the UT modern era.

Used to play pick up games with mays back in the day at Gregory.   He was my size but damn that dude was a strong mfer.   

[shadow_operative 15932]

5 minutes ago, Knighthawk said:

Used to play pick up games with mays back in the day at Gregory.   He was my size but damn that dude was a strong mfer.   

Travis was like a mix between Isaiah Taylor and DJ Augustin, with the hops of Doj Balbay or TJ Ford.

 

^^^ pay close attention starting at 00:57 to see Travis's ridiculous athleticism. 

Edited December 22, 2020 by shadow_operative

[kingkoopa6 8377]

Balbay

Kabongo

I. Taylor

KD

LMA

 

 

[ztejas 43526]

On 12/21/2020 at 9:51 PM, shadow_operative said:

more pertinent stats and rankings:

 

And that team made the elite eight and won the regular season B12 title. They were one point in regulation against LSU away from going to the FF.

You could honestly make the argument that PJ is the best player Texas has ever had at the college level. I wouldn't agree with you, but you could certainly fashion an argument worth listening to.