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Formula 1 2021

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Atxracer

Atxracer 797

Posted
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3 hours ago, FirstTimeCaller said:

Meh. From this thread I'm 100% convinced no matter how Max won, people would be salty about it for one reason or another. May as well enjoy it for now. Figure out how to fix the mess regarding the rules starting tomorrow. 

I am a pretty big Hamilton fan and one of my best friends, who I race with, hates him and is a huge Verstappen fan.  That said, I would have been fine if this was a straight up win by Max and even my good friend said, Hamilton got fucked, he won this race. I don’t think this is how any real fan wanted this season to end. I think FIA, due to DTS, tried to make this ending more dramatic intentionally.  It actually tainted my view of F1.  

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Atxracer

Atxracer 797

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2 hours ago, McCroskey said:

Lewis and Merc are such whiny bitches. They fucked up their pit strategies, twice, and it cost them both the race and the championship.

This comment leads me to believe you know actually nothing about racing. We are now all dumber for reading your post and I award you a 0.0.  Please read here, and a lot of other places, and learn before “contributing.”   

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Slacks

Slacks 6819

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9 hours ago, G650 said:

Upon reflection, the best face saving move by the FIA may be striking the race. They look like fools either with Max winning like this or booting him and putting Lewis in front. If they bin the race, Max still WDC and they are off the hook for fuckery.

 

Doubt it happens though.

I think this is the answer, but doesn't it also change the standings down the line? I have to go back to see where Sainz was before the race. He came out 5th.

What FIA should do is say, "the race should have finished under yellow, but we screwed up. Good day, sir."

That's what they should do. 

Watching Max race reminds me of some of my son's kart races.  There are some guys who will never back out. Unfortunately, other guys are starting to see there are no penalties for driving over the edge, so wrecks are getting worse. 

 

Next F1 season, I expect some dudes to be a bit more dangerous.

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Roger Kint

Roger Kint 19

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Merc was way too conservative with their tactics. They had the faster car so take a pit and pass the RB like you know you can.  It took Max a solid effort to get pass LH who was on old tires whereas Max had both fresh and an ideal compound at the end of the race.  Take Masi and his dumb decisions out of the equation, Merc dropped the ball. 

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Atxracer

Atxracer 797

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2 minutes ago, Roger Kint said:

Merc was way too conservative with their tactics. They had the faster car so take a pit and pass the RB like you know you can.  It took Max a solid effort to get pass LH who was on old tires whereas Max had both fresh and an ideal compound at the end of the race.  Take Masi and his dumb decisions out of the equation, Merc dropped the ball. 

You need to go talk to McCroskey.  

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wood

wood 11225

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1 minute ago, Roger Kint said:

Been watching F1 since 2010.  Has their been a teammate do anything close to that before with so much on the line?

Someone else might be able to remember an example, but I sure can't think of one off the top of my head. The way he just came back at Lewis over and over ... just fucking outstanding. I really think he spent most of the season coming to grips with that car. He really came on toward the end.

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elfenix

elfenix 34223

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Didn't watch live as it was 7:14 when I woke up and I'd already missed the first lap +. Then went to wait in line at Truth and was right behind a dude in a Checo hat. Told him no spoilers and we proceeded to shoot the shit for 30 minutes. Had and S30 with an L28ET. Good dude. All he told me was the race was exciting to the end.

As to the race, when it happened I questioned why they didn't pit Lewis on the second VSC lap to cover off Max's pit. Yes, you risked the VSC ending while in the pits (and it would have), but it's not like a regular safety car where you're fucked if you don't pit immediately. And ham was fast enough that he'd have gotten it back. And no way did ham give the advantage back after going off thru turn 6.

No way F1 wanted its biggest season ever to end under yellow. I thought they might red flag the race immediately (iirc indycar would have). Obviously you can't tack on laps like NASCAR (anyone else watch the Busch race Villeneuve lost in Montreal when they kept adding laps under yellow?). I was kinda shocked they did the wave around and safety car in nearly simultaneously - I always feel like it takes them several extra laps to decide to do the wave around.

Thought Lewis might get max back on the second straight. Really wish I'd been watching with a lot of race fans live rather than late and essentially by myself. And that I'd been able to discuss with dude in the BBQ line.

F1 needs to reform the red flag repair/work rules, I also think they need to figure out the corner passing rules better - you want wheel to wheel action then you can't say whoever is marginally ahead at some point has the absolute right to the corner and everyone else needs to back the fuck off. It's almost as big a mess as the NFL not knowing what a completion is. And it'll only be worse with cars that can closely follow next year if the new aero actually works out.

I've been watching this since 94 or 95 and this ain't near as bad as Scummy dive bombing his opposition. It was also more entertaining than ham winning with 6 races left or trying to back Nico into the Ferraris.


Anyway, 7 weeks until the next big race at Daytona!







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wood

wood 11225

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43 minutes ago, Goofyboy said:


I’ve been watching since 2014 and don’t remember anything of that level. Maybe Alonso earlier this year helping Ocon win.

Yeah my kid & I were watching, & he said "Can you imagine that kind of thing coming from Bottas?" 

No. I can't.

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XYZ

XYZ 2154

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I’m sure this is an unpopular opinion, but I think that playing things that the drivers say during the race is a detriment to the spectacle. They always seem to be saying whiny bullshit. Like after Hamilton had finally dispatched Pérez and he goes “he’s doing some dangerous driving”. Really, you fucking asshole? So anybody who doesn’t get out of your way is dangerous?

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wood

wood 11225

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9 minutes ago, XYZ said:

I’m sure this is an unpopular opinion, but I think that playing things that the drivers say during the race is a detriment to the spectacle. They always seem to be saying whiny bullshit. Like after Hamilton had finally dispatched Pérez and he goes “he’s doing some dangerous driving”. Really, you fucking asshole? So anybody who doesn’t get out of your way is dangerous?

That's Lewis's go-to line anytime anyone races him hard, no matter how cleanly they do it. There was nothing even close to dangerous or unfair about the way Checo raced Lewis. DOTD imho. "Checo is a Legend", as Max put it.

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Chewbacca

Chewbacca 7766

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Didn't watch live as it was 7:14 when I woke up and I'd already missed the first lap +. Then went to wait in line at Truth and was right behind a dude in a Checo hat. Told him no spoilers and we proceeded to shoot the shit for 30 minutes. Had and S30 with an L28ET. Good dude. All he told me was the race was exciting to the end.

As to the race, when it happened I questioned why they didn't pit Lewis on the second VSC lap to cover off Max's pit. Yes, you risked the VSC ending while in the pits (and it would have), but it's not like a regular safety car where you're fucked if you don't pit immediately. And ham was fast enough that he'd have gotten it back. And no way did ham give the advantage back after going off thru turn 6.

No way F1 wanted its biggest season ever to end under yellow. I thought they might red flag the race immediately (iirc indycar would have). Obviously you can't tack on laps like NASCAR (anyone else watch the Busch race Villeneuve lost in Montreal when they kept adding laps under yellow?). I was kinda shocked they did the wave around and safety car in nearly simultaneously - I always feel like it takes them several extra laps to decide to do the wave around.

Thought Lewis might get max back on the second straight. Really wish I'd been watching with a lot of race fans live rather than late and essentially by myself. And that I'd been able to discuss with dude in the BBQ line.

F1 needs to reform the red flag repair/work rules, I also think they need to figure out the corner passing rules better - you want wheel to wheel action then you can't say whoever is marginally ahead at some point has the absolute right to the corner and everyone else needs to back the fuck off. It's almost as big a mess as the NFL not knowing what a completion is. And it'll only be worse with cars that can closely follow next year if the new aero actually works out.

I've been watching this since 94 or 95 and this ain't near as bad as Scummy dive bombing his opposition. It was also more entertaining than ham winning with 6 races left or trying to back Nico into the Ferraris.


Anyway, 7 weeks until the next big race at Daytona!








They couldn't pit Lewis on the second VSC lap. It ended just as he was coming up on the pit entry.
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wood

wood 11225

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3 hours ago, Roger Kint said:

Been watching F1 since 2010.  Has their been a teammate do anything close to that before with so much on the line?

Upon further review of my old-ass memory ... there wasn't nearly as much on the line, but Alonso in Hungary put on a similarly brilliant defense against Lewis to secure the win for Ocon & Alpine. 

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wood

wood 11225

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10 minutes ago, elfenix said:
16 minutes ago, Chewbacca said:
They couldn't pit Lewis on the second VSC lap. It ended just as he was coming up on the pit entry.

I thought it ended as he was passing start/finish (bugs me that those are not the same line)

Yeah that always fucks with me, too. 

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wood

wood 11225

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15 minutes ago, Chewbacca said:
1 hour ago, wood said:
That's Lewis's go-to line anytime anyone races him hard, no matter how cleanly they do it. There was nothing even close to dangerous or unfair about the way Checo raced Lewis. DOTD imho. "Checo is a Legend", as Max put it.

Any thoughts on Masi re-writing the rules?

Which ones? He's done it all season, on many fronts. 

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Goofyboy

Goofyboy 3269

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Which ones? He's done it all season, on many fronts. 

Point out a rule he’s re-written - a procedure rule, not a judgement call on who was in a corner first or giving back an advantage. A procedure of “lapped cars unlap and then on the next lap safety car pits” rule. One that doesn’t hand a race and a championship to one driver, doesn’t give the opportunity to a third driver to also fight for a win, and doesn’t allow other cars to unlap and fight for last points.
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ConferenceRoom

ConferenceRoom 6141

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7 hours ago, XYZ said:

I’m sure this is an unpopular opinion, but I think that playing things that the drivers say during the race is a detriment to the spectacle. They always seem to be saying whiny bullshit. Like after Hamilton had finally dispatched Pérez and he goes “he’s doing some dangerous driving”. Really, you fucking asshole? So anybody who doesn’t get out of your way is dangerous?

Uh yeah. Unpopular would be an understatement. 

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Betty Blackwell

Betty Blackwell 144

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4 minutes ago, Goofyboy said:


Which rules were re-written or ignored? The decision to run laps behind a safety car and call it half points was not a re-writing or ignoring of rules. It was a shit show, sure.

https://www.racefans.net/2021/08/30/f1-to-discuss-rules-changes-in-response-to-belgian-gp-controversy/

They went over the 2 hour limit, and then there was that whole thing whether they’d actually run enough laps for it to count, the specifics of which elude me at the moment. 
 

For me, choosing to award points without an actual race being run was a far more farcical event than what happened this week. 

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ConferenceRoom

ConferenceRoom 6141

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6 minutes ago, Betty Blackwell said:

They went over the 2 hour limit, and then there was that whole thing whether they’d actually run enough laps for it to count, the specifics of which elude me at the moment. 
 

For me, choosing to award points without an actual race being run was a far more farcical event than what happened this week. 

The two hour limit is for a green flagged race. If a red flag occurs, they have to complete the race within three hours, but the FIA sporting code gives the stewards latitude to pause the three hours, which they did, citing force majeure. 

As far as awarding points, I agree. I wonder who got the race win that weekend. Oh. Huh. Weird. 

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NoName

NoName 16350

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all of these things are true:

  • Lewis should have won under SC (which to be fair no one actually wants)
  • MB played it conservative strategy wise and under normal times would have won
  • Masi stretched the rules to make it happen
  • Everyone wants' consistency moving forward with the rules and with enforcement

Personally, I think how the pass on Lap 1 was handled was wrong but that's me. Personally, I feel that FIA should change the rules specifically to make sure something like this doesn't happen again, if it's the first race of the year or the last.

For most of what happened, if the tables had been turned people would have lost their MINDS (Max cutting THAT much of the turn when LH went in and made the pass, the shitshow at the end)

ALL OF THAT SAID - the last lap was one of the most incredible and batshit crazy things I have ever seen in sports.

 

 

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aggie08

aggie08 21482

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11 hours ago, Roger Kint said:

Been watching F1 since 2010.  Has their been a teammate do anything close to that before with so much on the line?

Undoubtedly the most job securing DNF in F1 history. If they can figure out Saturdays next year, Checo is going to make some noise.

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ConferenceRoom

ConferenceRoom 6141

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4 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Undoubtedly the most job securing DNF in F1 history. If they can figure out Saturdays next year, Checo is going to make some noise.

Well, that's the flip side to his driving like a demon on Sundays - he sort of has to because he's a poor qualifier. Even if he wasn't, Max is always going to get preferential treatment and he's a better all around driver anyway. 

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