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Formula 1 2021

wood

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McCroskey
McCroskey

Took the plunge today and put a deposit down on a Monaco package for next year. I feel like a little kid. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Levi
Levi

let’s go!!!!!

Huckleberry
Huckleberry

Hope this helps clarify a bit.

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wood

wood 11230

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7 hours ago, Goofyboy said:


He’s not good enough to beat Hamilton. He just fucks up once and Hamilton attacks. Bottas is good, but not good enough.

Yep. Bottas is quick, but when it comes to racecraft, he's behind half or more of the guys on the grid. He's never been and never will even remotely be a challenge for Lewis, which is why he's in that seat. 

And I have to laugh every time I hear someone say Max is in the fastest car now. LOL. No. He isn't. IF RBR were quicker in testing or in Bahrain, that's ended,. Merc has passed them up and will pull away again now, imho.

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wood

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7 hours ago, 52-80 said:

Bottas' pit crew does him no favor, race after race lol

Pretty consistent in their inconsistency. Remarkable how they're always slow with the 2nd car, isn't it?

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wood

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7 hours ago, PittsburghTiger said:

The French should be pretty happy today. Alpine looks good

They've definitely made a significant improvement and really loved those hard tires today. Nice to see, after all the time they lost with the wind tunnel issues over the winter.

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wood

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13 hours ago, PittsburghTiger said:

The French should be pretty happy today. Alpine looks good

Oh, and btw, the more I think about and read about what Alonso did today after saying himself that he couldn't feel the grip in Qualifying, the more impressive it is. He's starting to feel this car & understand it, and figure out the new tires. He was one of the quickest guys out there at the end. More good things to come from him imho. 

IMHO the 2022 reset is coming at the perfect time for Alonso. Everyone will start from scratch and Alonso's adaptability - his biggest strength imho -  will show up in a big  way.

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utee94

utee94 15835

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3 minutes ago, VABuckeye said:

I'm of the view that the track is the track and unless you lose control or forced off of the track you should remain on the track.

Yup.

I'm in favor of eliminating all paved runoff and replacing it with magma.  That'll keep the drivers on course.

 

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TonyTexas

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2 minutes ago, VABuckeye said:

I'm of the view that the track is the track and unless you lose control or forced off of the track you should remain on the track.

I think most agree with you. What Wood is referring to is the random enforcement of track limits. The optic is that they are enforced/not enforced depending on what’s best for Mercedes. 

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VABuckeye

VABuckeye 2472

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4 minutes ago, TonyTexas said:

I think most agree with you. What Wood is referring to is the random enforcement of track limits. The optic is that they are enforced/not enforced depending on what’s best for Mercedes. 

Agreed on all counts.

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wood

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56 minutes ago, TonyTexas said:

I think most agree with you. What Wood is referring to is the random enforcement of track limits. The optic is that they are enforced/not enforced depending on what’s best for Mercedes. 

It's not just Merc. I've been on this for several seasons. I just want the rulebook enforced properly and consistently.

I agree with Buckeye that the track is the track, and is well and simply defined in the rules. They need to keep it simple. Anything outside the white line is not the track. Period. And the RD should not be allowed to run roughshod over the rulebook, redefining already-defined limits, enforcing one limit at one corner and another at another corner, none at the next, penalizing one off and not another at the same spot, penalizing it in one session and not the next, not penalizing it when one car has set the fastest lap and then doing so when another has set the fastest lap, and so on.

It is a complete and utter mess of inconsistency, to the point where even knowledgeable fans cannot know what's going on from one race to the next or indeed even one session to the next without having read the event notes, and the updated event notes (ie in-season and in-event unilateral rule changes) for FP2, and FP3, and Q, and the GP. It's like a case model for "How NOT to officiate a sporting contest". Frankly, it's like we're being trolled at this point.

Even if you do read all the notes, it's still pretty damn tough to tell in real time if the off-track excursion you just saw that car take is supposed to result in a penalty or not, or whether it was outside the limit set for that turn, in that session, etc.

No wonder they can't get it right, given all these caveats and varying limits, etc. What a fucking clusterfuck.

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ChickenSandwich

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2 hours ago, wood said:

It's not just Merc. I've been on this for several seasons. I just want the rulebook enforced properly and consistently.

I agree with Buckeye that the track is the track, and is well and simply defined in the rules. They need to keep it simple. Anything outside the white line is not the track. Period. And the RD should not be allowed to run roughshod over the rulebook, redefining already-defined limits, enforcing one limit at one corner and another at another corner, none at the next, penalizing one off and not another at the same spot, penalizing it in one session and not the next, not penalizing it when one car has set the fastest lap and then doing so when another has set the fastest lap, and so on.

It is a complete and utter mess of inconsistency, to the point where even knowledgeable fans cannot know what's going on from one race to the next or indeed even one session to the next without having read the event notes, and the updated event notes (ie in-season and in-event unilateral rule changes) for FP2, and FP3, and Q, and the GP. It's like a case model for "How NOT to officiate a sporting contest". Frankly, it's like we're being trolled at this point.

Even if you do read all the notes, it's still pretty damn tough to tell in real time if the off-track excursion you just saw that car take is supposed to result in a penalty or not, or whether it was outside the limit set for that turn, in that session, etc.

No wonder they can't get it right, given all these caveats and varying limits, etc. What a fucking clusterfuck.

 I could add some variety to the race. 2 warnings and then +1 second for each infraction. Would definitely shake up the grid. 

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wood

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8 minutes ago, Goofyboy said:

So, no curbs or just on the curbs?

Not sure I understand the question, but I'm assuming you're asking what the limit should be? I defer to the rulebook. The rulebook states that the white line is the track limit and that if a car puts all 4 wheels outside it at the same time, then it has exceeded track limits. The kerbs are outside the white line, and are not part of the track. Using a kerb as the track limit is nonsense.

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wood

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20 minutes ago, Goofyboy said:

That’s what I was asking. Seems like the curbs are part of the track on all tracks and they use the outside the line on the outside of the curb. emoji16.png

They aren't. Kerbs originated as a way to preserve the grounds near the track where drivers would tend to hang a wheel off. If someone put a kerb inside the white line, it would be part of the track, but according to the rules anything outside the white line is excluded. That's not to say that you can't still go out there with parts of the car, but according to the rule, 1 wheel must always be in contact with the actual track surface (ie it must at least be touching the white line). What's happening is that Masi sees people pushing outside the line, and says "OK then. Let's just move the limit out there". Of course then they're just going to push that limit as well...

It didn't used to be a problem, because the areas off track weren't paved, so even hanging a wheel off usually meant a time loss and meant risking your race weekend, your car, and even life and limb. IE, the tracks penalized automatically anyone who exceeded their limits. When the FIA mandated paved runoffs, that flipped everything 180 deg. Suddenly it actually became faster in many places to exceed the limit.

Baseball, cricket, tennis, and other sports that are older and far less technologically-driven than motorsport are improving the consistency and accuracy of their respective sports' officiating by using technology. Some motorsports are doing it, too, like MotoGP.

I'm all for just reverting to the old way in F1, with the track features keeping everyone in check automatically. That seems unlikely though, and failing such changes across the board, I see zero reason F1 can't drag itself kicking and screaming out of the dark ages and into the 21st century. There are multiple good ways to monitor the problem, and multiple good consequences applicable for transgressions. That makes it all that much more ridiculous and annoying that nobody who matters has the will to do anything about it.

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wood

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15 minutes ago, PittsburghTiger said:

And after fifth infraction a drive through penalty 

Or go with a long lap like MotoGP has done. It's great because you can serve the penalty right on the track. Then you're done with it and everyone immediately knows where everyone stands. And don't give them 4 free ones, either. Get tough and you'll soon find that they can keep the car on the track just fine. They're only going wide now because they're being allowed to. They know Masi is clueless and spineless, and they'll get away with it. They're supposed to be the best drivers in the world. They know exactly where they're putting the car. If they don't, then replace them with someone who does. 

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PittsburghTiger

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On 5/3/2021 at 12:31 AM, wood said:

Oh, and btw, the more I think about and read about what Alonso did today after saying himself that he couldn't feel the grip in Qualifying, the more impressive it is. He's starting to feel this car & understand it, and figure out the new tires. He was one of the quickest guys out there at the end. More good things to come from him imho. 

IMHO the 2022 reset is coming at the perfect time for Alonso. Everyone will start from scratch and Alonso's adaptability - his biggest strength imho -  will show up in a big  way.

Makes some sense for sure.

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PittsburghTiger

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10 hours ago, wood said:

Or go with a long lap like MotoGP has done. It's great because you can serve the penalty right on the track. Then you're done with it and everyone immediately knows where everyone stands. And don't give them 4 free ones, either. Get tough and you'll soon find that they can keep the car on the track just fine. They're only going wide now because they're being allowed to. They know Masi is clueless and spineless, and they'll get away with it. They're supposed to be the best drivers in the world. They know exactly where they're putting the car. If they don't, then replace them with someone who does. 

I have been on the record here as saying I want track limits enforced, from the get go. Right from the first lap. And they need to make the detriment something that will hurt the drivers in the race. 

Stay. On. The. Track.

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Longhorn Fever

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Bottas actually had the fastest Mercedes stops in both Bahrain and Imola. Both 2.24s, good for 9th and 10th fastest so far.

It’s something they still definitely need to work on, though, and it benefits both cars (pit crews are the same).

Is there somewhere to look up every actual pit stop time and not the entire time in the lane? So, Bottas had a 2.24 in Bahrain? Didn’t he have 3 pits in that race with one being 10+ seconds. From this inexperienced viewer, most of VB’s pit stops seem to be training sessions for Hamilton’s stops. Granted, his third stop was in attempt to get him fastest lap, right?
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Anton Chigurh

Anton Chigurh 3319

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Is there somewhere to look up every actual pit stop time and not the entire time in the lane? So, Bottas had a 2.24 in Bahrain? Didn’t he have 3 pits in that race with one being 10+ seconds. From this inexperienced viewer, most of VB’s pit stops seem to be training sessions for Hamilton’s stops. Granted, his third stop was in attempt to get him fastest lap, right?

I could have sworn there was but I cannot find one. DHL does have the fastest ones for different races but I couldn’t find all of the stops anywhere.

I did find that Bottas’ second stop in Bahrain was the slow one where they had an issue with the RF tire. Outside of this, time spent in the pit lane was roughly the same for both on the other stops.

In Imola, Bottas only did one stop before the crash, but he spent 30s in the pit lane, compared to 32s for Hamilton (I don’t have the time spent stationary). Hamilton’s second stop was obviously much longer because he had just gone off and broke the wing.

In Portimao, weirdly enough, Bottas’ pit delta time was actually the same as Hamilton, and only two tenths slower than Max. Obviously, the team should’ve given him a better stop, but that was much closer than I thought.
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52-80

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2 hours ago, Longhorn Fever said:


Is there somewhere to look up every actual pit stop time and not the entire time in the lane? So, Bottas had a 2.24 in Bahrain? Didn’t he have 3 pits in that race with one being 10+ seconds. From this inexperienced viewer, most of VB’s pit stops seem to be training sessions for Hamilton’s stops. Granted, his third stop was in attempt to get him fastest lap, right?

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.2020-dhl-fastest-pit-stop-award.HLY5eDU9Xllr96VKd1ZKx.html

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.2021-dhl-fastest-pit-stop-award.1i44PbZrkoLdzYgjGHxfHs.html

 

Goddamn Redbull basically clocks a 2.0 in almost every single race

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