2018 San Antonio Spurs Offseason Thread -- Into the Great Unknown

[Patrick Bateman 3913]

5 minutes ago, texasstrong12 said:

Derrick White is good and will get some minutes for us next year. These summer league games are a waste of time for him. The Spurs robably just need to shut him down. 

They may in the last weekend (if we aren't vying for the SL title!).  More minutes for Lonnie, Metu and Blossomgame.....

[Gut Wagon 8065]

Trae with the “accidental” leg tangle. 

[Patrick Bateman 3913]

It's hilarious to me how some Spurs sites keeping listing White as a wing..... Dude is a combo guard who's running the offense in SL.  Still needs to sharpen his PG skill though.

Blossomgame has a NBA body, I'll give him that.  Be great to get that 3 point shot to fall consistently.

Lonnie sitting tonight.

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

19 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

It's hilarious to me how some Spurs sites keeping listing White as a wing..... Dude is a combo guard who's running the offense in SL.  Still needs to sharpen his PG skill though.

Blossomgame has a NBA body, I'll give him that.  Be great to get that 3 point shot to fall consistently.

Lonnie sitting tonight.

White seems to know what he's doing, but yea he also seems a tick slow on his decisions.  

[texasstrong12 4668]

 

Edited July 4, 2018 by texasstrong12

[A’Dam Psycho 1470]

I have some beach front on the moon to sale anyone who actually believes the Spurs have any leverage in this situation. Lakers aren’t budging on Kuzma and likely will only give up Ingram and picks. Spurs need to just pull the trigger so this circus can end

[SilasCoade 2622]

Can Minnesota bring anything to the table to facilitate Butler/Kawhi swap? Spurs would have a reasonable shot at holding on to Butler longer term. He's as near a replacement level player as they're likely to get.

[Kermit 3156]

3 hours ago, A’Dam Psycho said:

I have some beach front on the moon to sale anyone who actually believes the Spurs have any leverage in this situation. Lakers aren’t budging on Kuzma and likely will only give up Ingram and picks. Spurs need to just pull the trigger so this circus can end

The Spurs don't care. They'll either trade him for what they want to get, or he'll play this season and someone will pony up at the deadline. Or he'll play the entire year, walk,  and they'll have a lot of cap space the season after. Pop has all the job security and patience in the world and no amount of media pressure will make them cave. This is going to be so much fun. Nothing will make me happier than to see that autistic mute out there in a Spurs uniform as boos cascade down on his dumb head. 

[BigOrange1 6436]

can't believe you guys aren't more excited about ingram.  he is far and away the best prospect (at least in terms of current players) the spurs have a realistic shot at acquiring in a trade for kawhi.  some of you really like guys like kuzma or tobias harris more than ingram??

[ZanTheFan 49]

If this saga has taught us anything, it should be that the player's culture fit with the Spurs is just as important as the player's talent level -- maybe even more.

That said, do we know if Ingram is a "Spurs type" guy?

At a certain point, beggars can't be choosers.... But I don't know if PATFO feel like beggars at this point.

[Kermit 3156]

8 minutes ago, BigOrange1 said:

can't believe you guys aren't more excited about ingram.  he is far and away the best prospect (at least in terms of current players) the spurs have a realistic shot at acquiring in a trade for kawhi.  some of you really like guys like kuzma or tobias harris more than ingram??

I'm sure that Ingram has a fine NBA future in front of him. The Spurs want both Ingram and Kuzma. That's the problem for the Lakers. The reality is that Kawhi is better for a team than both of those guys combined, and that goes for the Spurs team. So, they'll wait knowing that they'll either get the trade that they want or they'll have Kawhi. 

[C-Man 27221]

If this saga has taught us anything, it should be that the player's culture fit with the Spurs is just as important as the player's talent level -- maybe even more.

That said, do we know if Ingram is a "Spurs type" guy?

At a certain point, beggars can't be choosers.... But I don't know if PATFO feel like beggars at this point.

That’s the thing. Leonard is/was the perfect “Spurs guy” — in other words a silent superstar — though it appears he’s allowed himself to be corrupted by those that are motivated by other things.

[thepop 4409]

11 minutes ago, C-Man said:

 

That’s the thing. Leonard is/was the perfect “Spurs guy” — in other words a silent superstar — though it appears he’s allowed himself to be corrupted by those that are motivated by other things.

 

We don’t actually know he was a perfect Spur. We made a lot of assumptions about Kawhi the person because he never spoke. 

[Machinator 32099]

Seems to me the assumption was that not speaking makes a player the perfect Spur.

[Patrick Bateman 3913]

50 minutes ago, BigOrange1 said:

can't believe you guys aren't more excited about ingram.  he is far and away the best prospect (at least in terms of current players) the spurs have a realistic shot at acquiring in a trade for kawhi.  some of you really like guys like kuzma or tobias harris more than ingram??

I’m not sure it’s anything against Ingram.  He’s a good young player with tons of potential it’s simply he’s probably not enough and it’s almosy universally agreed upon by analysts.  But I think most would be happy to have him except for the “hell no LA crowd”.  

It’s funny about all the misinformation out there.  One rumor is Ingram and a draft pick.... shitty deal, no wonder why the spurs passed.  Another, Spurs asked for Ingram, kuzma, Randle, Hart and 3 drafts picks.  Way too much for the Lakers to pay!  

Considering the most recent moves I think Philly is easier to trade with the contracts available.  I’m still very surprised the Lakers gave away Randle for essentially Rondo. Lakers fans the day before were talking about how he was a core piece.... he was their best player last year but if you’re going to make Lebron wait around, resigning Randle to a s-t deal would have been the wise move.... that could end up being a really bad mistake....

[ZanTheFan 49]

Seems to me the assumption was that not speaking makes a player the perfect Spur.

That is the assumption, I agree. I think it's more specific than that, though.

The Spurs Way, as I see it, is not airing dirty laundry. Dealing with family business in-house, behind closed doors.

Hell, as has been posited in this thread, even LaMarcus handled his desire to be traded in "the Spurs Way" -- and he immediately returned to his All-NBA form.

I like to think Kawhi is still a fit for this culture, but there's a lot more to the family angle, and ultimately blood is thicker than water.

[Gut Wagon 8065]

Since the TD draft, the only US collegian to have become a star in SA is Kawhi, right? There obviously have been some solid contributors from US colleges and high schools, including both Jacksons, Bowen, Barry, Kerr, Mills, Steve Smith, Green and obviously LMA. Drop Simmons, Neal and Murray in there, if you like. That might sound like a lot of guys, but not for two decades in the NBA. And most came to SA as developed role players. American-born players who grew into genuine stars here have been shockingly rare.

If you say that’s because we’ve always drafted late, I get it. But I wonder if a big reason we haven’t had the chronic “culture/loyalty” issues most franchises face is that we’ve usually had rosters devoid of American-born guys with meddling agents or other pot-stirrers. Makes you wonder if trying to avoid such situations was a key motivation to sign so many guys from overseas.

It might be somewhat coincidental that the Spurs family has been largely “foreign” for so long. But for whatever reasons, this franchise has been a model of low-drama operation, with virtually no blowups. That is, until an uncle from California came along. 

[XYZ 2154]

Is it uncle Dennis? I bet it’s uncle Dennis.

[Radical Larry 28588]

There's always an uncle. 

[ZanTheFan 49]

Since the TD draft, the only US collegian to have become a star in SA is Kawhi, right? There obviously have been some solid contributors from US colleges and high schools, including both Jacksons, Bowen, Barry, Kerr, Mills, Steve Smith, Green and obviously LMA. Drop Simmons, Neal and Murray in there, if you like. That might sound like a lot of guys, but not for two decades in the NBA. And most came to SA as developed role players. American-born players who grew into genuine stars here have been shockingly rare.
If you say that’s because we’ve always drafted late, I get it. But I wonder if a big reason we haven’t had the chronic “culture/loyalty” issues most franchises face is that we’ve usually had rosters devoid of American-born guys with meddling agents or other pot-stirrers. Makes you wonder if trying to avoid such situations was a key motivation to sign so many guys from overseas.
It might be somewhat coincidental that the Spurs family has been largely “foreign” for so long. But for whatever reasons, this franchise has been a model of low-drama operation, with virtually no blowups. That is, until an uncle from California came along. 

This is an observation I can get behind

[thepop 4409]

Pop has never been shy to admit he prefers coaching foreign born players.

[Michael Knight 12977]

Both TD and Kawhi were foreign born players

[Orca of Peace 109]

30 minutes ago, Michael Knight said:

Both TD and Kawhi were foreign born players

Kawhi was born in Los Angeles per Wiki.  Tim D in the US Virgin Islands which I suppose makes him a US citizen (?) 

[C-Man 27221]

Since the TD draft, the only US collegian to have become a star in SA is Kawhi, right? There obviously have been some solid contributors from US colleges and high schools, including both Jacksons, Bowen, Barry, Kerr, Mills, Steve Smith, Green and obviously LMA. Drop Simmons, Neal and Murray in there, if you like. That might sound like a lot of guys, but not for two decades in the NBA. And most came to SA as developed role players. American-born players who grew into genuine stars here have been shockingly rare.
If you say that’s because we’ve always drafted late, I get it. But I wonder if a big reason we haven’t had the chronic “culture/loyalty” issues most franchises face is that we’ve usually had rosters devoid of American-born guys with meddling agents or other pot-stirrers. Makes you wonder if trying to avoid such situations was a key motivation to sign so many guys from overseas.
It might be somewhat coincidental that the Spurs family has been largely “foreign” for so long. But for whatever reasons, this franchise has been a model of low-drama operation, with virtually no blowups. That is, until an uncle from California came along. 

Maybe. I tend to lean more on the idea — and you touched on it — that it’s because we’ve drafted so damn late every year.

[Michael Knight 12977]

44 minutes ago, Orca of Peace said:

Kawhi was born in Los Angeles per Wiki.  Tim D in the US Virgin Islands which I suppose makes him a US citizen (?) 

Kawhi wasn't born on this planet

[Orca of Peace 109]

6 minutes ago, Michael Knight said:

Kawhi wasn't born on this planet

planet hollywood

[chainsaw 9866]

If the Lakers don't give anything decent for Kawhi then fuck them, they don't get Kawhi for at least a year.  And by then who knows what happens.  Maybe LeBron gets Theisman'ed.  Maybe Kawhi marries a Kardashian and goes full Lamar Odom while he's "injured" for 2018-19.  

 

Either way, LeBron is going to be swept by the Warriors and maybe even loses in 5-6 to the Rockets before that can even happen.  All told i think the Lakers would rather have Kawhi now rather than having to wait and potentially lose out to the Clippers for him.  Meanwhile don't be surprised if the Warriors sign Kyrie Irving and Giannis for 2019-20.  

Edited July 5, 2018 by chainsaw

[Michael Knight 12977]

On 7/3/2018 at 5:13 PM, Gut Wagon said:

I think that earlier “misdiagnosis” was in regard to Mills coming off the 2014 title, or thereabouts. Someone will hop in here if I’m misstating it. 

Also the front office made good on his next contract

[Don Johnson 4753]

 

[Eastwood 4394]

Looks like he might have been celebrating a something a little too hard.

[Eskimohorn 5635]

 

Dude needs to have a conversation with Coach Pop, not only about history and democracy, but modern media relations. Maybe tour of Lackland and Sam Houston. He also should watch Bull Durham and get his cliches down.

[chainsaw 9866]

Lonnie is badass.

[Mitch Cumsteen 18548]

Two things to keep in mind as this Kawhi thing continues to unfold or if nothing happens for a while.

19 hours ago, Gut Wagon said:

Since the TD draft, the only US collegian to have become a star in SA is Kawhi, right? There obviously have been some solid contributors from US colleges and high schools, including both Jacksons, Bowen, Barry, Kerr, Mills, Steve Smith, Green and obviously LMA. Drop Simmons, Neal and Murray in there, if you like. That might sound like a lot of guys, but not for two decades in the NBA. And most came to SA as developed role players. American-born players who grew into genuine stars here have been shockingly rare.

If you say that’s because we’ve always drafted late, I get it. But I wonder if a big reason we haven’t had the chronic “culture/loyalty” issues most franchises face is that we’ve usually had rosters devoid of American-born guys with meddling agents or other pot-stirrers. Makes you wonder if trying to avoid such situations was a key motivation to sign so many guys from overseas.

It might be somewhat coincidental that the Spurs family has been largely “foreign” for so long. But for whatever reasons, this franchise has been a model of low-drama operation, with virtually no blowups. That is, until an uncle from California came along. 

I get where you are going with this and the backstory on Kawhi was that he was different from most US players because he didn't grow up in the AAU culture and wasn't a highly recruited guy out of high school and all that other stuff. So he was supposed to be different and humble and immune to the entitled bullshit that goes with all of that. Yeah, that didn't really work out like it was supposed to. 

Regardless, I think the motivation for all the foreign guys was more about the Spurs finding value in an untapped market when most teams weren't as heavily invested in overseas scouting. Their last several drafts have almost exclusively been US players. It sure didn't dissuade them from drafting Walker, White, Murray, and Anderson with four out of their last five first round picks. 

Some other things:

1. I'm pretty sure Manu is coming back. I was told that he's been working out like he's going to play next season.

2. They are very high on White and Murray going forward. Hopefully they aren't smelling their own farts too much, but they do like their young backcourt guys.

3. This should be obvious, but anything you hear about Kawhi and potential trades is not coming from the Spurs. It is all from Kawhi's side (i.e., Uncle Dennis) or other teams leaking shit or agents or wherever. So everything you hear needs to be taken with an enormous grain of salt. They just don't respond to any of this stuff. They see it all, but they don't ever engage. 

 

[Gut Wagon 8065]

1 hour ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

Two things to keep in mind as this Kawhi thing continues to unfold or if nothing happens for a while.

I get where you are going with this and the backstory on Kawhi was that he was different from most US players because he didn't grow up in the AAU culture and wasn't a highly recruited guy out of high school and all that other stuff. So he was supposed to be different and humble and immune to the entitled bullshit that goes with all of that. Yeah, that didn't really work out like it was supposed to. 

Regardless, I think the motivation for all the foreign guys was more about the Spurs finding value in an untapped market when most teams weren't as heavily invested in overseas scouting. Their last several drafts have almost exclusively been US players. It sure didn't dissuade them from drafting Walker, White, Murray, and Anderson with four out of their last five first round picks. 

Some other things:

1. I'm pretty sure Manu is coming back. I was told that he's been working out like he's going to play next season.

2. They are very high on White and Murray going forward. Hopefully they aren't smelling their own farts too much, but they do like their young backcourt guys.

3. This should be obvious, but anything you hear about Kawhi and potential trades is not coming from the Spurs. It is all from Kawhi's side (i.e., Uncle Dennis) or other teams leaking shit or agents or wherever. So everything you hear needs to be taken with an enormous grain of salt. They just don't respond to any of this stuff. They see it all, but they don't ever engage. 

 

There certainly has been a trend toward more US draftees. I feel it's mainly because the rest of the NBA has figured out the international options and is skimming more of that cream before the Spurs can do so. 

I'd always hoped that, between Kawhi's apparent demeanor and the fact he wasn't a much-acclaimed college star before hitting the NBA, he'd managed to avoid being the kind of problem child we now regularly find in the association. I suppose the entitled mindset could be spreading outside the US, but my impression is that the Spurs still see most international players as coachable and loyal in comparison to the average kid growing up immersed in US basketball culture. Until this huge blowup, everything about Kawhi seemed to make him much closer to one of those hungry foreigners than a member of the US diva brigade.       

[Newdoc 3439]

2 hours ago, Don Johnson said:

 

He may want to brush up on his Frederick Douglass history. While Douglass adamantly spoke against the celebration of freedom while people were enslaved, he still held that the ideals held in the Decleration were noble and true when applied equally to all Americans. 

And Lonnie could have worded all of that much better and gotten his point across.

NBA is going to have to keep their image clean if they expect maintain revenue because the league is going to be crap next year, especially the East.

[Gut Wagon 8065]

3 hours ago, Don Johnson said:

 

"Hey, Kawhi. Why wait seven years to alienate fans when you can start doing it in only two weeks?" 

[Patrick Bateman 3913]

Maybe Lonnie knows his history and understands Independence was formally declared on July 2nd and the document wasn't formally signed until August 2nd.... He just wants accuracy! 

Who cares, he's young, probably good to learn from it...

 

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

Maybe he never celebrates 4th o July because he's always in the gym working on his game.   We can hope right? 

[NoRagrets 1125]

Breaking News: LW4 has requested a trade to England.

[Assman 1830]

1 hour ago, NoRagrets said:

Breaking News: LW4 has requested a trade to England.

Spurs have requested either of these two in return:

[chainsaw 9866]

The one on the right, please.

[Patrick Bateman 3913]

PSA.  Spurs summer league is on NBATV at 6 pm CT vs the Jazz.  Going to try and catch some of it if I can....

[Hate 20108]

And the plot thickens...I guess.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nba/report-leonard-doesnt-want-to-compete-with-lebron-in-la/ar-AAzD3gP?li=BBnba9I&ocid=DELLDHP17

This whole Kawhi Leonard drama is becoming unbearable. The star forward previously requested a trade from the San Antonio Spurs earlier this offseason. It was then reported that he wanted to team up with LeBron James on the Los Angeles Lakers.

Once James signed with Los Angeles, other reports surfaced indicating that Leonard didn’t want to exist in James’ shadows with the Lakers. At that point, the Los Angeles Clippers became a real possibility.

Apparently, that’s no longer the case. During his recent podcast, ESPN’s Adrian Wojnarowski reported that Leonard is no longer intrigued by the idea of playing for the Clippers, primarily because he doesn’t want to compete with LeBron in the Los Angeles market.

“I’ve been told that one of the reasons (Kawhi Leonard) looks at going to the Clippers – is a little less motivated (to go to the Clippers) is because initially, the idea of Los Angeles was fine to him – he preferred the Lakers but was all right with the Clippers,” Wojnarowski noted. “But now that LeBron James is there, the idea of going head-to-head with LeBron – to have Kawhi with the Clippers and LeBron with the Lakers, and to maybe feel dwarfed by that. I’m told that’s become far less appealing for him.”

Let’s get this straight. Kawhi doesn’t want to play for the Lakers because of James’ presence on the team. He also doesn’t want to play for the Clippers because of James’ presence in Los Angeles. How fun.

The last few months have been filled with Leonard’s camp leaking information like this. He has not talked on the record about what happened with the Spurs last season, instead leaving that up to his handlers.

Now, Leonard is pushing back against the idea of heading to two teams that exist in the nation’s second-largest media market. Remember, it was previously noted that he was not a fan of the hoopla that would come with playing in such a large market.

If so, here’s an idea for Kawhi. Maybe remain with the Spurs in San Antonio. Just some food for thought.

[angelfacedmongoloid 80]

What a fucking dumbass

[chainsaw 9866]

This agency is definitely looking amateurish to all other athletes who would have otherwise considered signing on.

[thepop 4409]

 

[Gut Wagon 8065]

2 hours ago, NoRagrets said:

Breaking News: LW4 has requested a trade to England.

I'd never wanted to believe it before. I just assumed Kawhi was an innocent kid not well versed in media matters, and that was why he didn't come across as the most effervescent personality. But I'm honestly starting to wonder if maybe the elevator sometimes stops short of the top floor. 

[chainsaw 9866]

25 minutes ago, thepop said:

 

That sure sounds a hell of a lot like fraud.

[Patrick Bateman 3913]

Audio from Mike Wright.....

[Patrick Bateman 3913]

48 minutes ago, Hate said:

And the plot thickens...I guess.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nba/report-leonard-doesnt-want-to-compete-with-lebron-in-la/ar-AAzD3gP?li=BBnba9I&ocid=DELLDHP17

This whole Kawhi Leonard drama is becoming unbearable. The star forward previously requested a trade from the San Antonio Spurs earlier this offseason. It was then reported that he wanted to team up with LeBron James on the Los Angeles Lakers.

Once James signed with Los Angeles, other reports surfaced indicating that Leonard didn’t want to exist in James’ shadows with the Lakers. At that point, the Los Angeles Clippers became a real possibility.

Apparently, that’s no longer the case. During his recent podcast, ESPN’s Adrian Wojnarowski reported that Leonard is no longer intrigued by the idea of playing for the Clippers, primarily because he doesn’t want to compete with LeBron in the Los Angeles market.

“I’ve been told that one of the reasons (Kawhi Leonard) looks at going to the Clippers – is a little less motivated (to go to the Clippers) is because initially, the idea of Los Angeles was fine to him – he preferred the Lakers but was all right with the Clippers,” Wojnarowski noted. “But now that LeBron James is there, the idea of going head-to-head with LeBron – to have Kawhi with the Clippers and LeBron with the Lakers, and to maybe feel dwarfed by that. I’m told that’s become far less appealing for him.”

Let’s get this straight. Kawhi doesn’t want to play for the Lakers because of James’ presence on the team. He also doesn’t want to play for the Clippers because of James’ presence in Los Angeles. How fun.

The last few months have been filled with Leonard’s camp leaking information like this. He has not talked on the record about what happened with the Spurs last season, instead leaving that up to his handlers.

Now, Leonard is pushing back against the idea of heading to two teams that exist in the nation’s second-largest media market. Remember, it was previously noted that he was not a fan of the hoopla that would come with playing in such a large market.

If so, here’s an idea for Kawhi. Maybe remain with the Spurs in San Antonio. Just some food for thought.

Dude's camp is keystone cops..... Fuckin' amateurville.  He's really, really lucky the Spurs have stayed silent as not to torpedo his value.  I have a feeling after this is resolved, Kawhi and his camp are going to look petty.