2020-2021 NBA Thread of Insanity

[Machinator 32103]

 

[ztejas 44228]

3 minutes ago, Machinator said:

 

If Boston misses the playoffs - which is now a hilariously real possibility - is there a chance Ainge or Stevens get canned? I mean finishing behind the Knicks and Hawks is bad enough. 

[Machinator 32103]

 

[Vic Mackey 47953]

[shadow_operative 15932]

56 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

lol, wtf Bradley Beal? i like him, but he got all in his feelings out of nowhere on this one.

[conVINCEd 21477]

11 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

lol, wtf Bradley Beal? i like him, but he got all in his feelings out of nowhere on this one.

Which means there’s some truth there.

[shadow_operative 15932]

3 hours ago, Machinator said:

 

lol, and then he got the ball with five seconds left and his team down one and decided to pull up from deep (career .305 shooter) where he bricked the shit out of the shot and his team lost. he then went on in the post game to literally say out loud that he was patting himself on the back for breaking the record while declaring himself "the best play maker in the game".

jesus fucking christ Russ, i'm having a very tough time remembering a player who's made me do a total 180 on them like i have with you. you're such a selfish, self deluded, self congratulatory loser. thank god you play for a shit team that's never on TV. but congrats on winning the All Time Ball Hog Award tonight. 

Edited May 11, 2021 by shadow_operative

[immortal13 4059]

Nobody wants Golden State in a play in game right now 

[immortal13 4059]

1 minute ago, shadow_operative said:

lol, and then he got the ball with five seconds left and his team down one and decided to pull up from deep (career .305 shooter) where he bricked the shit out of the shot and his team lost. he then went on in the post game to literally say out loud that he was patting himself on the back for breaking the record while declaring himself "the best play maker in the game". jesus fucking christ Russ, i'm having a very tough time remembering a player who's made me do a total 180 on them like i have with you. you're such a selfish, self deluded, self congratulatory loser. thank god you play for a shit team that's never on TV. 

Sounds a lot like a certain somebody else....

[aggie08 21796]

1 minute ago, immortal13 said:

Nobody wants Golden State in a play in game right now 

They all want them in a series though. At least if the alternative is LAL.

[shadow_operative 15932]

1 minute ago, immortal13 said:

Sounds a lot like a certain somebody else....

yeah i know, it's crazy how many people here have done a total 180 on me since my worst days back on shaggy. i'm like the anti-Russell Westbrook, and I appreciate you pointing that out. 

[immortal13 4059]

1 minute ago, shadow_operative said:

yeah i know, it's crazy how many people here have done a total 180 on me since my worst days back on shaggy. i'm like the anti-Russell Westbrook, and I appreciate you pointing that out. 

I'm not a fan of his either. While I appreciate the statical achievement, there was some stat padding in there. But what I was referring to LeBron declaring himself the greatest player in the world 

[Post Oak 20562]

 

[aggie08 21796]

9 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

lol, and then he got the ball with five seconds left and his team down one and decided to pull up from deep (career .305 shooter) where he bricked the shit out of the shot and his team lost. he then went on in the post game to literally say out loud that he was patting himself on the back for breaking the record while declaring himself "the best play maker in the game".

jesus fucking christ Russ, i'm having a very tough time remembering a player who's made me do a total 180 on them like i have with you. you're such a selfish, self deluded, self congratulatory loser. thank god you play for a shit team that's never on TV. but congrats on winning the All Time Ball Hog Award tonight. 

I've admittedly been too hard on Russ in the past. Even if you told NBA players to purposely chase a triple-double every game, sometimes at the expense of making the right basketball play--which is what Russ clearly does--the number of players who could actually average one would be countable on one hand. It's massive effort.

But, here he is averaging another triple-double and breaking records, yet he's not going to make an All-NBA team, his true shooting percentage is hovering around 50%* (almost impossible to do in today's NBA...dude used to shoot 85% from the foul line), his PER is under 20, and his turnover rate is the highest of his career. He deserves credit for Washington making a little run to move out of the basement, but does anybody expect anything different than the usual Russ playoff implosion?

So, yeah, everyone's going to roll their eyes when you or your coach tries to put you in the upper echelon of guards to have ever played. It's obnoxious when LeBron makes his self-proclamations as well, but at least he has the skins on the wall and belongs in the conversation.

*For reference, Draymond Green is at 52% and is scared shitless to shoot.

[MNLonghornFUKM 8982]

lol, wtf Bradley Beal? i like him, but he got all in his feelings out of nowhere on this one.

Out of left field response from Beal after being complimented.

[Reynolds Woodcock 5097]

49 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

I've admittedly been too hard on Russ in the past. Even if you told NBA players to purposely chase a triple-double every game, sometimes at the expense of making the right basketball play--which is what Russ clearly does--the number of players who could actually average one would be countable on one hand. It's massive effort.

But, here he is averaging another triple-double and breaking records, yet he's not going to make an All-NBA team, his true shooting percentage is hovering around 50%* (almost impossible to do in today's NBA...dude used to shoot 85% from the foul line), his PER is under 20, and his turnover rate is the highest of his career. He deserves credit for Washington making a little run to move out of the basement, but does anybody expect anything different than the usual Russ playoff implosion?

So, yeah, everyone's going to roll their eyes when you or your coach tries to put you in the upper echelon of guards to have ever played. It's obnoxious when LeBron makes his self-proclamations as well, but at least he has the skins on the wall and belongs in the conversation.

*For reference, Draymond Green is at 52% and is scared shitless to shoot.

Yeah I’ve come around on Russ. Obviously he has his flaws, and he could never be the center piece of a championship team (and maybe not on a championship team at all), but he plays his ass off every night, really gives a shit, and his teammates generally seem to like him warts notwithstanding. He never deserved to be an MVP and is terrible end of game, but I enjoy watching him play.

[aggie08 21796]

1 minute ago, Reynolds Woodcock said:

Yeah I’ve come around on Russ. Obviously he has his flaws, and he could never be the center piece of a championship team (and maybe not on a championship team at all), but he plays his ass off every night, really gives a shit, and his teammates generally seem to like him warts notwithstanding. He never deserved to be an MVP and is terrible end of game, but I enjoy watching him play.

He honestly used to be one of my favorite players. If KD was the luxury car, I thought he was the engine, as I think KD needed a vocal, more aggressive running mate...at least at that stage of his career. People blame him for OKC not winning it all, but I tend to blame the Harden trade, the injury bug, the Spurs pulling the beautiful game out of their asses, and Steph/Klay in chronological order.

In retrospect, I've even come around to his MVP. His revenge tour was THE story of that season, so I have no problem with him winning it on effort and anger alone...even if it culminated in a Rockets/OKC series that was probably the ugliest, most shameful display of basketball I've ever seen.

But, if you insist on being included among the best--and get hilariously indignant when you don't get your "respect"--you have to expect a higher degree of scrutiny. How many talking heads were itching to unload their long-awaited "Steph can't carry a team and needs help to score" hot takes when Golden State started 0-2? (Only to quietly put those takes back in their pockets.) And he's obviously considerably more popular than Russ. Watch how quickly people turn on Jokic if he wins the MVP and gets bounced in the second round. It is what it is 

[shadow_operative 15932]

1 hour ago, aggie08 said:

He honestly used to be one of my favorite players. If KD was the luxury car, I thought he was the engine, as I think KD needed a vocal, more aggressive running mate...at least at that stage of his career. People blame him for OKC not winning it all, but I tend to blame the Harden trade, the injury bug, the Spurs pulling the beautiful game out of their asses, and Steph/Klay in chronological order.

In retrospect, I've even come around to his MVP. His revenge tour was THE story of that season, so I have no problem with him winning it on effort and anger alone...even if it culminated in a Rockets/OKC series that was probably the ugliest, most shameful display of basketball I've ever seen.

But, if you insist on being included among the best--and get hilariously indignant when you don't get your "respect"--you have to expect a higher degree of scrutiny. How many talking heads were itching to unload their long-awaited "Steph can't carry a team and needs help to score" hot takes when Golden State started 0-2? (Only to quietly put those takes back in their pockets.) And he's obviously considerably more popular than Russ. Watch how quickly people turn on Jokic if he wins the MVP and gets bounced in the second round. It is what it is 

now you've over corrected. you should never "come around" on his MVP award. Russ's entire season was hilariously gratuitous stat chasing that in the end amounted to nothing. every other team in the league starts their break when one of their bigs gets a rebound and then hits an outlet pass to their PG who is somewhere near mid court. then you have OKC, where Russell Westbrook is attacking the defensive glass, jumping over an otherwise uncontested Steven Adams for the rebound, after which he sprints up the floor past the rest of his team as he wildly tries to make some stats happen. that shit was a joke, and will always be a joke. Kawhi probably should have won it, but if not then Harden and LeBron were still better choices than Russ. the dude is a freakishly athletic 13 year old.

Edited May 11, 2021 by shadow_operative

[ztejas 44228]

On 5/10/2021 at 5:34 PM, ztejas said:

If Boston misses the playoffs - which is now a hilariously real possibility - is there a chance Ainge or Stevens get canned? I mean finishing behind the Knicks and Hawks is bad enough. 

So... one of them is definitely getting fired. They are a fucking trainwreck and have been most of this season. Just trying to figure out which one if not both. Maybe because I'm trying to figure out if their suckage has more to do with awful personnel management or dreadful underacheivement. 

Maybe Stevens jumps ship and wants to go coach somewhere else? 

[BigOrange1 6611]

there is no chance stevens gets fired and very little chance that ainge is let go.

[ztejas 44228]

12 minutes ago, BigOrange1 said:

there is no chance stevens gets fired and very little chance that ainge is let go.

Based on what? Maybe his contract extension? Boston is ruthless. They don't give a fuck. Maybe Ainge gets a longer leash because he's a Celtic but this experiment is clearly a failure. Tatum will never be a #1 on a title team. Stevens is not elevating these guys. You think Boston fans are cool seeing this team below .500?

[SilasCoade 2622]

44 minutes ago, ztejas said:

Based on what? Maybe his contract extension? Boston is ruthless. They don't give a fuck. Maybe Ainge gets a longer leash because he's a Celtic but this experiment is clearly a failure. Tatum will never be a #1 on a title team. Stevens is not elevating these guys. You think Boston fans are cool seeing this team below .500?

You think Tatum is what's holding  them back? They fucked up their chemistry with the Kyrie deal. Then did it again (to a much lesser extent) this year ditching glue guy Theis for T. Thompson. And they got fucked not recognizing that Kemba was past his "Best if used by" date. Tatum's a real one, Ainge is a fraud.

[ztejas 44228]

3 minutes ago, Llogg said:

You think Tatum is what's holding  them back? They fucked up their chemistry with the Kyrie deal. Then did it again (to a much lesser extent) this year ditching glue guy Theis for T. Thompson. And they got fucked not recognizing that Kemba was past his "Best if used by" date. Tatum's a real one, Ainge is a fraud.

No - Tatum is great. My point is only that as constructed they will never win a title. Which like you said is on Ainge. 

I mean, maybe Tatum could be that guy with the right roster around him (I doubt it) but this roster and coaching ain't it. 

[SilasCoade 2622]

True or false:

Swap Kemba and CP3 this year and Boston is the far better squad.

[ztejas 44228]

13 minutes ago, Llogg said:

True or false:

Swap Kemba and CP3 this year and Boston is the far better squad.

Than Phoenix? Probably. Not sure I'd say "far better" but I'd take 'em in 7. 

But you could argue CP3 is still a top 15 player so it's sort of a "no shit" proposition. 

[SilasCoade 2622]

2 minutes ago, ztejas said:

Than Phoenix? Probably. Not sure I'd say "far better" but I'd take 'em in 7. 

But you could argue CP3 is still a top 15 player so it's sort of a "no shit" proposition. 

Right but my point is that it's not totally unrealistic to think Boston could have come up with a package to have ended up with CP3 this year. They didn't b/c Ainge sucks.

[shadow_operative 15932]

On 5/9/2021 at 4:52 PM, Machinator said:

Julius Randle makes some absolutely ridiculous shots.

he really does. he's like a more athletic Jokic in this regard. he makes so many spinning/fade away jumpers from ridiculous angles, where the ball goes sky high and then floats down perfectly into the bottom of the net. when you first see him make a couple you think it's luck, but then he just keeps on sinking them.

[ztejas 44228]

4 minutes ago, Llogg said:

Right but my point is that it's not totally unrealistic to think Boston could have come up with a package to have ended up with CP3 this year. They didn't b/c Ainge sucks.

Yes. I understood what you were getting at. 

Or you know, just not shipping Rozier since he's pretty much just as good as Kemba considering how often Kemba is sidelined.

[Patrick Bateman 3966]

10 minutes ago, Llogg said:

True or false:

Swap Kemba and CP3 this year and Boston is the far better squad.

Very true.  Still not good enough to win a ship.  As good young talents as Tatum and Brown are, they're not good enough to build around and win a ship, at least not right now, maybe in time.  The issue is Ainge is so inconsistent mixing great draft picks with really shitty ones.  Same with trades, some memorable ones, others he's trying to forget.  Free Agency he's been a little less successful.  The last 7ish years he's really been meh.

[Machinator 32103]

2 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

The issue is Ainge is so inconsistent mixing great draft picks with really shitty ones. 

This is most GMs, to be fair.

[Patrick Bateman 3966]

8 minutes ago, Machinator said:

This is most GMs, to be fair.

Don't necessarily disagree, but if you want to win championships, you usually have to be good at 2 out of 3 for a stretch of time.  However you get your superstar, you need to be good at something and Ainge hasn't been lately.  Also, Tatum and Brown may be a little overrated at this time but probably moreso they're being rushed.  Folks are expecting too much, too soon.  Next year, they'll be making almost 54 million combined so they need to really start showing up.  Kemba's contract is so fucking bad.

 

 

[ztejas 44228]

49 minutes ago, Machinator said:

This is most GMs, to be fair.

But their draft capital has been insane lately. They stockpiled so many assets whether young guys showing promise on rookie deals or draft picks and they seem incapable of creating a contending roster with it. And no they weren't contenders in 2018 despite almost making the Finals - no one in the East was. It was just "who wants to get dusted by the Warriors in 4 games"? And since then they've gone downhill somehow. 

[ztejas 44228]

1 hour ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Also, Tatum and Brown may be a little overrated at this time but probably moreso they're being rushed.

They aren't overrated they just aren't #1 dudes. If they were the C's 2nd and 3rd best players they'd be an instant contender. How many teams post-merger have won without a top 5ish player in the league? Maybe the 89 and 90 Pistons - IT was probably top 10 but not top 5 at that point but sure as shit turned it up when he needed to- then from there the next team was the 04 Pistons - then maybe the 2011 Mavs but I'd say Dirk was a top 5 dude in those playoffs - then the 2014 Spurs (who are basically irreplicable for myraid reasons AFAIC). 

So if you REALLY wanted to split some hairs maybe 5 times in the last 45 years but I'd say it's more like twice in that span. Unless you tank to get a guy like Luka or Embiid or AD or get lucky with a Jokic or Giannis you need to acquire that guy in FA. Ainge has done neither. Mainly he's thrown a bunch of shit against the wall and rolled the dice that Kyrie or Tatum could be that guy.

Edited May 12, 2021 by ztejas

[Wulaw Horn 19595]

14 minutes ago, ztejas said:

They aren't overrated they just aren't #1 dudes. If they were the C's 2nd and 3rd best players they'd be an instant contender. How many teams post-merger have won without a top 5ish player in the league? Maybe the 89 and 90 Pistons - IT was probably top 10 but not top 5 at that point but sure as shit turned it up when he needed to- then from there the next team was the 04 Pistons - then maybe the 2011 Mavs but I'd say Dirk was a top 5 dude in those playoffs - then the 2014 Spurs (who are basically irreplaceable for myraid reasons AFAIC). 

So if you REALLY wanted to split some hairs maybe 5 times in the last 45 years but I'd say it's more like twice in that span. Unless you tank to get a guy like Luka or Embiid or AD or get lucky with a Jokic or Giannis you need to acquire that guy in FA. Ainge has done neither. Mainly he's thrown a bunch of shit against the wall and rolled the dice that Kyrie or Tatum could be that guy.

Which is why him not being in the Harden sweepstakes was stupid/too cute by half. 

[HookEm 2509]

Minnesota is so stupid. They have one job this year.... keep their 2021 draft pick which only has top 3 protection. Instead they win meaningless games and are going to give GSW a top 4-6 pick.

[Mitch Cumsteen 18963]

9 hours ago, ztejas said:

But their draft capital has been insane lately. They stockpiled so many assets whether young guys showing promise on rookie deals or draft picks and they seem incapable of creating a contending roster with it. And no they weren't contenders in 2018 despite almost making the Finals - no one in the East was. It was just "who wants to get dusted by the Warriors in 4 games"? And since then they've gone downhill somehow. 

Ainge completely squandered it away. They were loaded with good vets and young guys on rookie deals plus a ton more draft capital and it went completely to shit. They had bad luck with Gordon Heyward getting hurt, but a lot of the other stuff was avoidable. There were a lot of free agents over the years that Ainge could have make deals for, but he wouldn't pull the trigger. He has a reputation for being difficult to deal with.

The Kyrie move was a disaster. They ended up trading the 8th pick in the draft (what turned out to be Collin Sexton but there were a few good players still on the board) plus a solid role player in Jae Crowder for Kyrie, who destroyed their team chemistry and then left in free agency for nothing in return. That was an expensive two year rental. Horford, who seemed like a big chemistry guy for them, left for nothing. Heyward left for nothing. Kemba can't stay healthy. 

All that said, they should be playing better than .500 ball. I just looked it up and this is Brad Stevens 8th year with them. He is still so revered for the job he did in the first couple of years making chicken salad, but should he be?

[SilasCoade 2622]

19 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

Ainge completely squandered it away. They were loaded with good vets and young guys on rookie deals plus a ton more draft capital and it went completely to shit. They had bad luck with Gordon Heyward getting hurt, but a lot of the other stuff was avoidable. There were a lot of free agents over the years that Ainge could have make deals for, but he wouldn't pull the trigger. He has a reputation for being difficult to deal with.

The Kyrie move was a disaster. They ended up trading the 8th pick in the draft (what turned out to be Collin Sexton but there were a few good players still on the board) plus a solid role player in Jae Crowder for Kyrie, who destroyed their team chemistry and then left in free agency for nothing in return. That was an expensive two year rental. Horford, who seemed like a big chemistry guy for them, left for nothing. Heyward left for nothing. Kemba can't stay healthy. 

All that said, they should be playing better than .500 ball. I just looked it up and this is Brad Stevens 8th year with them. He is still so revered for the job he did in the first couple of years making chicken salad, but should he be?

💯☝️

They could have held onto a core of Tatum, Brown, Smart, Rozier, Hayward and turned that pick into SGA, Bridges, MPJ, Sexton. Ainge went all in that Hayward and Horford could balance Kyrie's mental instability, providing punch while letting the young guys grow into their roles.  Hayward's injury really was a kick in the nuts for that plan. Who knows if it could have worked without that injury. But it didn't and the move set them back considerably. I still like the combination of Tatum, Brown, and Smart a lot though. It sucks they basically dumped Theis for Wagner and then gave up on Wagner immediately. Why even make that trade?

[Underdog 29174]

Rick Pitino isn’t walking through that door.

[ztejas 44228]

2 hours ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

I just looked it up and this is Brad Stevens 8th year with them. He is still so revered for the job he did in the first couple of years making chicken salad, but should he be?

They just have to wait for LeBron to leave the East/retire KD to retire.

[MNLonghornFUKM 8982]

Minnesota is so stupid. They have one job this year.... keep their 2021 draft pick which only has top 3 protection. Instead they win meaningless games and are going to give GSW a top 4-6 pick.

Momentum for next year /sarcasm


Last 3 games vs playoff teams and still only 1-2 games from 2nd or 3rd worse. Could jockey and get a few more combinations with losses. Either way odds are they’ll pick outside of 3 even with #1 which they can’t get

[Fastbreak 4045]

Russ has a 75% win percentage in games he records a triple double.  Tell me again about stat chasing.

[Patrick Bateman 3966]

12 hours ago, Llogg said:

It sucks they basically dumped Theis for Wagner and then gave up on Wagner immediately. Why even make that trade?

Money.  He was on an expiring and they didn't feel they could re-sign him so they moved him to get under the luxury tax this year, hoping Robert Williams and TT could lock down the primary post positions.  Williams got hurt...... again.

 

[shadow_operative 15932]

39 minutes ago, Fastbreak said:

Russ has a 75% win percentage in games he records a triple double.  Tell me again about stat chasing.

a)where did you find that stat, and b)literally just watch him play.

[conVINCEd 21477]

My primary problem with Russ is that he should be the best defensive PG in the league and he is nothing close to that.

[Sbbruin 22142]

Lakers may backdoor their way into the 6th seed.  Got away with one without AD and LBJ.

[Machinator 32103]

Just now, Sbbruin said:

Lakers may backdoor their way into the 6th seed.  Got away with one without AD and LBJ.

Need either Dallas or Portland to go 0-2.

[Sbbruin 22142]

1 minute ago, Machinator said:

Need either Dallas or Portland to go 0-2.

Just saw they both won tonight. Oops.

[conVINCEd 21477]

2 minutes ago, Sbbruin said:

Lakers may backdoor their way into the 6th seed.  Got away with one without AD and LBJ.

Mavs have Toronto and Minnesota to wrap up the season.  Given the schizophrenic nature of their season, I fully expect them to lose one, but they won’t lose both.

[ztejas 44228]

1 hour ago, Fastbreak said:

Russ has a 75% win percentage in games he records a triple double.  Tell me again about stat chasing.

Is there any way I can just ignore a particular user on a particular forum? 

I mean some of you would love that when it comes to me probably. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

the one-handed touch finishes, the wrap around passes, the 41% shooting from deep, the sheer manipulation of the defense- I've never seen anything like him. 

Edited May 13, 2021 by shadow_operative