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2020-2021 NBA Thread of Insanity

ztejas

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Mitch Cumsteen
Mitch Cumsteen

I've seen Harden plenty -- pounding away to either try a step back three or getting a pick and going downhill and then forcing contact at the rack for his endless parade to the free throw line, or kic

Mitch Cumsteen
Mitch Cumsteen

As long as Russ plays for Washington and Scott Brooks, he's going to both obliterate the triple double record and render it meaningless. The Wiz are the perfect team for him -- they play at the fastes

Mitch Cumsteen
Mitch Cumsteen

Kobe was a ridiculously great basketball player but the narrative around him, especially posthumously, has become horribly distorted. He was a terrible teammate, to the point where the Lakers, even be

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d2o

d2o 1602

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Sandman said:

Indiana offered 10MM/yr to come back home and coach and he said no. I don't think he wants to coach anymore, much less recruit.

Yep, this for sure.   He can make damn good money, not really have to deal with players on a day to day basis and sleep in his own bed at a decent hour as many nights as he wants.    I'm not mad at him for choosing this over going back to CBB

 

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LTtxfan

LTtxfan 48979

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On 6/2/2021 at 4:57 PM, Brothahorn said:
On 6/2/2021 at 4:12 PM, Michael Knight said:
Jeff Van Gundy as a coach would be a disaster

Maybe Jeff and Mark can be co-coaches.

 

They both suck  as announcers...

Please let Jeff and Mark coach together... PLEEEEEZZZZZ

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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3903

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On 4/24/2021 at 1:33 PM, Patrick Bateman said:

I think the MVP is Jokic's to lose.  There's Giannis fatigue (for good reason).  Embiid is good but he's not Joker.  I'll say it ends up this way.

1.  Jokic

2.  Embiid

3.  Curry

4.  Giannis

5.  Harden?  (Being hurt really kills any chance).  Maybe Julius Randle actually.  Don't sleep.

 

 

Welp, I totally whiffed on #5.  CP3 and his influence on a young Suns team is a pretty good narrative so good on the writers.

 

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ztejas

ztejas 43266

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6 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Welp, I totally whiffed on #5.  CP3 and his influence on a young Suns team is a pretty good narrative so good on the writers.

 

Curry at 3 is embarassing. Didn't even make the playoffs. Lillard was almost as good and got his team to the 6 seed. Same with Luka.

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aggie08

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, ztejas said:

Curry at 3 is embarassing. Didn't even make the playoffs. Lillard was almost as good and got his team to the 6 seed. Same with Luka.

ryan reynolds eye roll GIF

Portland record with Dame in the lineup - 39-28 (3-2 without)

Golden State record with Steph in the lineup: 37-26 (2-7 without). On one of the worst rosters in the West, even before it was decimated by injuries.

Better in literally every statistical category except assists. Leading scorer in the NBA on some ridiculous efficiency. If you want to punish him for being injured for 9 games--which, had he played, they probably get the 6 seed--that's one thing, but he was objectively better than Dame.

 

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d2o

d2o 1602

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1 hour ago, aggie08 said:

ryan reynolds eye roll GIF

Portland record with Dame in the lineup - 39-28 (3-2 without)

Golden State record with Steph in the lineup: 37-26 (2-7 without). On one of the worst rosters in the West, even before it was decimated by injuries.

Better in literally every statistical category except assists. Leading scorer in the NBA on some ridiculous efficiency. If you want to punish him for being injured for 9 games--which, had he played, they probably get the 6 seed--that's one thing, but he was objectively better than Dame.

 

He is better than Dame but I totally agree with the thought that you cannot be a MVP is your team isn't in the playoffs.    Just how it is

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SilasCoade

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11 hours ago, Machinator said:

Derrick Rose received a first-place MVP vote (wonder if it was the fan vote) and someone left Jokic off their ballot altogether.

E3Zq0uBWEAQxL7R?format=jpg&name=large

I want to know the name of the casual fan with a vote who gave it to LeBron. This is not a lifetime achievement award. He didn't do shit to suggest he was worthy of MVP consideration this year. The Westbrook vote is more defensible than that since someone with no insight into the game could at least think he helped get Washington into the playoffs and put up some gaudy (empty) stats.

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Machinator

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9 minutes ago, Llogg said:

I want to know the name of the casual fan with a vote who gave it to LeBron. This is not a lifetime achievement award. He didn't do shit to suggest he was worthy of MVP consideration this year. The Westbrook vote is more defensible than that since someone with no insight into the game could at least think he helped get Washington into the playoffs and put up some gaudy (empty) stats.

There was a lot of media momentum for LeBron's MVP candidacy before the injury. Of course, if he had stayed healthy, he might have deserved 4th or 5th place votes.

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d2o

d2o 1602

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38 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

And that's why he finished 3rd...

He got the 2nd most 1st place votes.   I know the season was kinda weird with a lot of the favorites going down with injuries or having other conditions surrounding their season but no way should he have more votes than CP3 or others.

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aggie08

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Posted
Posted (edited)
25 minutes ago, d2o said:

He got the 2nd most 1st place votes.   I know the season was kinda weird with a lot of the favorites going down with injuries or having other conditions surrounding their season but no way should he have more votes than CP3 or others.

CP3 averaged 16/9/4.5. He's not their team's best player. Leadership, experience, and other intangibles obviously matter, but it can't be the leading argument. 5th is about right. Phoenix was red hot in the bubble last year; their young guys started figuring it out. They wouldn't have been the 2 seed without CP3, but they would have been comfortably in the playoffs.

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d2o

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16 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

CP3 averaged 16/9/4.5. He's not their team's best player. Leadership, experience, and other intangibles obviously matter, but it can't be the leading argument. 5th is about right. Phoenix was red hot in the bubble last year; their young guys started figuring it out. They wouldn't have been the 2 seed without CP3, but they would have been comfortably in the playoffs.

He's more valuable to them than Booker.   

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ztejas

ztejas 43266

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7 hours ago, aggie08 said:

ryan reynolds eye roll GIF

Portland record with Dame in the lineup - 39-28 (3-2 without)

Golden State record with Steph in the lineup: 37-26 (2-7 without). On one of the worst rosters in the West, even before it was decimated by injuries.

Better in literally every statistical category except assists. Leading scorer in the NBA on some ridiculous efficiency. If you want to punish him for being injured for 9 games--which, had he played, they probably get the 6 seed--that's one thing, but he was objectively better than Dame.

 

I don't care if he averaged 50 points a game he didn't make the playoffs - he shouldn't be 3rd in MVP voting. End of discussion. Good talk.

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ztejas

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5 hours ago, aggie08 said:

but they would have been comfortably in the playoffs.

Seriously doubt that. Your golden boy Curry couldn't make the playoffs but Phoenix would have been "comfortably in" without CP? Based on what, Monty William's brilliant coaching? 

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aggie08

aggie08 21434

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10 minutes ago, ztejas said:

I don't care if he averaged 50 points a game he didn't make the playoffs - he shouldn't be 3rd in MVP voting. End of discussion. Good talk.

So, if this was like any other year, when they clinched the 8 seed on the last day of the regular season, and he completed his goal of dragging that hospital ward of misfit spare parts to the playoffs, you would have had no problem with him finishing 3rd?

But, since this year's reward for the 8 seed was a meeting with the defending champs in one of the, like, 5 games that both of their superstars were healthy all year, him finishing 3rd is "embarrassing." That's some damn fine logic.

Aren't votes due before the play-in?

 

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ztejas

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9 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

So, if this was like any other year, when they clinched the 8 seed on the last day of the regular season, and he completed his goal of dragging that hospital ward of misfit spare parts to the playoffs, you would have had no problem with him finishing 3rd?

But, since this year's reward for the 8 seed was a meeting with the defending champs in one of the, like, 5 games that both of their superstars were healthy all year, him finishing 3rd is "embarrassing." That's some damn fine logic.

No. Top 4 in your conference should be the floor for winning MVP. Maybe top 6 as a floor for somehow finishing 3rd. Go ahead and defend Russell Westbrook's laughing stock MVP while you're at it. 

But you probably still think something silly like Curry is the best player in the league so not sure why I'm having this discussion. 

And it's not JUST that he finished 3rd - it's that his vote total shouldn't have been remotely close to Jokic or Embiid's. But ESPN/American media conspiracy gonna do it's thing.

Steph had a fun scoring year in his prime on a bad team that will ultimately be forgotten. I barely give him any legacy points at all for this season. He's a freaking 3 time NBA champion. 

Just look at the garbage Luka had yet made it to the 5 seed and took LA to 7 games. Dame's roster and coach were both a mess and he got them to the 6 seed and a game 7 against the actual MVP. If you think either of those guys teams make the playoffs without them then you're delusional. I know this award isn't based on the playoffs but Curry at 3 is such an eye-roll. If he was really that fucking great he wouldn't be sitting at home. 

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aggie08

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1 minute ago, ztejas said:

But you probably still think something silly like Curry is the best player in the league so not sure why I'm having this discussion. 

I've never thought that. I do think that he had one of the 3 or 4 best individual seasons, and I think he's one of maybe a handful of guys that could have dragged that bunch to the play-in. Without him, they would have competed for the most ping pong balls, as witnessed by last season.

...it still really irks you that he outplayed KD in 3 straight elimination games in 2016, and that the Warriors were always considered Steph's team, doesn't it? Let it go, man. KD is still better and will be remembered historically as the better player. It's all good.

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hobbes2702

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39 minutes ago, ztejas said:

No. Top 4 in your conference should be the floor for winning MVP. Maybe top 6 as a floor for somehow finishing 3rd. Go ahead and defend Russell Westbrook's laughing stock MVP while you're at it. 

But you probably still think something silly like Curry is the best player in the league so not sure why I'm having this discussion. 

And it's not JUST that he finished 3rd - it's that his vote total shouldn't have been remotely close to Jokic or Embiid's. But ESPN/American media conspiracy gonna do it's thing.

Steph had a fun scoring year in his prime on a bad team that will ultimately be forgotten. I barely give him any legacy points at all for this season. He's a freaking 3 time NBA champion. 

Just look at the garbage Luka had yet made it to the 5 seed and took LA to 7 games. Dame's roster and coach were both a mess and he got them to the 6 seed and a game 7 against the actual MVP. If you think either of those guys teams make the playoffs without them then you're delusional. I know this award isn't based on the playoffs but Curry at 3 is such an eye-roll. If he was really that fucking great he wouldn't be sitting at home. 

This is dumb

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aggie08

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1 hour ago, ztejas said:

Just look at the garbage Luka had yet made it to the 5 seed and took LA to 7 games. Dame's roster and coach were both a mess and he got them to the 6 seed and a game 7 against the actual MVP. If you think either of those guys teams make the playoffs without them then you're delusional. I know this award isn't based on the playoffs but Curry at 3 is such an eye-roll. If he was really that fucking great he wouldn't be sitting at home. 

Steph had a better winning percentage than Dame when he plays. Luka's was only slightly better. Golden State's team was considerably worse than Dallas or Portland's this season. Of their 10 best players on opening night (which was a bottom half of the conference roster to start with), 4 missed huge chunks of the season and weren't there down the stretch. That's not counting Klay.

They played an 8 man rotation the last month plus of the season, and I'm guessing that you couldn't name at least 4 of them without looking.

I'd have absolutely no issue whatsoever if Luka finished ahead of Steph. Personally, I would have gone back and forth on the two if I had a ballot on the last day of the regular season. But acting like Steph finishing 3rd is some sort grave basketball injustice is just a weird, obviously biased opinion. 

No, his season won't be remembered and celebrated years from now...but who the fuck remembers who finished 3rd in MVP voting in any random year?

Edited by aggie08
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Kermit

Kermit 3128

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1 minute ago, aggie08 said:

Steph had a better winning percentage than Dame when he plays. Luka's was only slightly better. Golden State's team was considerably worse than Dallas or Portland's this season. Of their 10 best players on opening night (which was a bottom half of the conference roster to start with), 4 missed huge chunks of the season and weren't there down the stretch. That's not counting Klay.

The played an 8 man rotation the last month plus of the season, and I'm guessing that you couldn't name at least 3 of them without looking.

I'd have absolutely no issue whatsoever if Luka finished ahead of Steph. Personally, I would have gone back and forth on the two if I had a ballot on the last day of the regular season. But acting like Steph finishing 3rd is some sort grave basketball injustice is just a weird, obviously biased opinion. 

No, his season won't be remembered and celebrated years from now...but who the fuck remembers who finished 3rd in MVP voting in any random year?

Some asshole named Kawhi finished third in 2017. Fuck that guy.

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ztejas

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36 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

.it still really irks you that he outplayed KD in 3 straight elimination games in 2016, and that the Warriors were always considered Steph's team, doesn't it?

Nah. KD will win another FMVP this year and when it's all said and done there will be a dozen guys between them on the all-time greats list. I'm not a Steph hater. Him proving that he can score 32 ppg on a shitty team does nothing for me in evaluating his all-time legacy. We all know he can do that. Bradley Beal scored 31 points per game this year on an arguably worse team and actually made the playoffs and yet I'm not seeing him on the MVP leaderboard anywhere. 

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aggie08

aggie08 21434

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6 minutes ago, ztejas said:

Nah. KD will win another FMVP this year and when it's all said and done there will be a dozen guys between them on the all-time greats list.

Possibly. Steph is already in the Top 20, so KD would have to be comfortably in the Top 10, which is a tough barrier to crack. But he obviously has the game to do so.

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ztejas

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6 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

They played an 8 man rotation the last month plus of the season, and I'm guessing that you couldn't name at least 3 of them without looking.

Steph Dray Wiggins. 

You're acting like Steph had a bunch of trash and made the Finals or something. He didn't even make the playoffs. And missing games tends to count against you in the MVP race. Him missing games isn't a good justification for his MVP case.

But like I said, MVP votes have always been dumb and that's why you have Steph finishing over Giannis because he's flashier and they don't want to award a guy 3 times in a row. 

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hobbes2702

hobbes2702 12845

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9 minutes ago, ztejas said:

Nah. KD will win another FMVP this year and when it's all said and done there will be a dozen guys between them on the all-time greats list. I'm not a Steph hater. Him proving that he can score 32 ppg on a shitty team does nothing for me in evaluating his all-time legacy. We all know he can do that. Bradley Beal scored 31 points per game this year on an arguably worse team and actually made the playoffs and yet I'm not seeing him on the MVP leaderboard anywhere. 

I mean if you only look at PPG you might think Bradley Beal had a season comparable to Steph’s. Maybe try looking a little deeper. Those players are on different planets this year.

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hobbes2702

hobbes2702 12845

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2 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Possibly. Steph is already in the Top 20, so KD would have to be comfortably in the Top 10, which is a tough barrier to crack. But he obviously has the game to do so.

Kd is already in the Top 15. That said this whole debate is weird tbh and not on the Aggie side.

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d2o

d2o 1602

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1 hour ago, aggie08 said:

Steph had a better winning percentage than Dame when he plays. Luka's was only slightly better. Golden State's team was considerably worse than Dallas or Portland's this season. Of their 10 best players on opening night (which was a bottom half of the conference roster to start with), 4 missed huge chunks of the season and weren't there down the stretch. That's not counting Klay.

They played an 8 man rotation the last month plus of the season, and I'm guessing that you couldn't name at least 4 of them without looking.

I'd have absolutely no issue whatsoever if Luka finished ahead of Steph. Personally, I would have gone back and forth on the two if I had a ballot on the last day of the regular season. But acting like Steph finishing 3rd is some sort grave basketball injustice is just a weird, obviously biased opinion. 

No, his season won't be remembered and celebrated years from now...but who the fuck remembers who finished 3rd in MVP voting in any random year?

JTA, Jordan Poole, Wiggins, Wiseman, and Dray.   What do I win.

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