A story about a pathetic man's downfall [34 Felony Convictions]

[kevwun 15890]

The guy McConnell fucked out of a Supreme Court seat being the one who finally takes down Trump would be some amazing karma.  Which is why it will probably never happen.

[BehoId, The Underminer! 11669]

Just now, hpslugga said:

This. Exactly this.

When your defense of the position “nothing will happen” revolves entirely around “he isn’t in prison already, so it’ll never happen,” you really don’t have any real permission to argue that this isn’t about impatience.

There is a decent historical record of the guys getting away with stuff.  The Ah! Well, nevertheless meme didn't spring up from nothing.

[BehoId, The Underminer! 11669]

1 minute ago, BehoId, The Underminer! said:

There is a decent historical record of the guys getting away with stuff.  The Ah! Well, nevertheless meme didn't spring up from nothing.

My bet is something like -- DJT: "What?  I had no idea those documents were in there.  I never opened the boxes."  Some flunkie: "Yes, I misunderstood DJT's request to pack the important stuff and ended up getting really bad papers, which I never explained to him. It's all my fault and now I'll go to jail for 5 years." 

[atomheartbevo 89792]

7 hours ago, Tuco said:

Keep in mind, Trumsters think Trump is literally one of the smartest people in the world.  They are profoundly stupid.  I do not trust them to calculate the risk here.  

Nobody here denies that most Trumpkins are dumbasses.

But they do have a strong, if misguided, sense of self-preservation.  I’d even argue that it’s a part of what makes them Trump supporters - they are scared their jobs are being taken by illegals, they are scared that their pensions will fail, that inflation will ruin their retirement, etc.  At the same time they are ignorant of the fact that Republicans had the tools to slow down illegal immigration, to shore up and improve things like medical care and safety nets for the elderly (look at recent Republican votes against things like insulin cost caps, etc.), but Republicans chose instead to take care of a small number of people (who have no financial worries and who benefit from illegal labor).

That sense of self-preservation is why the vast majority of them don’t fuck around and find out, because there has been enough dumbasses who did which helps to keep the rest in line. Thats why after that dumbass Ricky Shiffer got himself killed, nobody else took up arms and went out in a blaze of glory attacking the FBI like Shiffer told them to, all the while screaming “HIS NAME WAS RICKY SHIFFER!”

And going back to the original point of cops not joining up with militias because of losing their pensions/salaries - they have seen many people who completely destroyed their lives over small things, including successful people.

[atomheartbevo 89792]

15 minutes ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

I personally think that they have evidence of him selling shit.  I think they are just dotting i's and crossing t's, since to convict, it has to be beyond a reasonable doubt.  

I don’t know about selling, but they definitely know something that is a Big Fucking Deal, and Trump definitely crossed a red line with them.  I don’t feel like it’s as simple as him refusing to return the documents.

[TwiceHorn 31535]

5 minutes ago, BehoId, The Underminer! said:

There is a decent historical record of the guys getting away with stuff.  The Ah! Well, nevertheless meme didn't spring up from nothing.

Well, pre-presidency, he was no different than a bunch of other white, white-collar perpetrators that never faced criminal charges.

During his presidency, he was immune and it was beyond unlikely that he would see charges for anything.  So, the "we got him/ah well nevertheless" meme was a triumph of foolish hope.

There's nothing special about Donald Trump and his evasion of consequences, to date.  There is still a tiny shred of presidential privilege for crimes relating to his term in office, but that's about it.  He's exposed and the right people are paying the right kind of attention.

[atomheartbevo 89792]

2 minutes ago, longhornmatt said:

They’re going to be hesitant to indict because it’s almost statistically impossible that a jury won’t include some Trump supporter who will let him walk no matter how conclusively the evidence proves he’s guilty.  Then we get to listen to him talk about how he’s exonerated and campaign on how the deep state wrongfully tried to imprison him.

If the evidence is released at that point, and it would be leaked by somebody on the jury…that’s something Trump wouldn’t want.

[Pig Bellmont 8738]

6 minutes ago, longhornmatt said:

They’re going to be hesitant to indict because it’s almost statistically impossible that a jury won’t include some Trump supporter who will let him walk no matter how conclusively the evidence proves he’s guilty.  Then we get to listen to him talk about how he’s exonerated and campaign on how the deep state wrongfully tried to imprison him.

You’d be surprised. There were at least two hardcore Trumpers on Manafort’s jury in the EDVA and they convicted (before the pardon was issued) because the evidence of the crime was proven. I really don’t think jury selection or jury nullification will play much into the decision whether to indict 

[The Dog 44139]

 

[Horndog 2228]

13 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

I don’t know about selling, but they definitely know something that is a Big Fucking Deal, and Trump definitely crossed a red line with them.  I don’t feel like it’s as simple as him refusing to return the documents.

There have been reports that the MAL surveillance tapes (obtained through subpoena) showed boxes being removed from the storage room - after their return had been requested. That's a pretty BFD.

[aggie08 21531]

17 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

I don’t know about selling, but they definitely know something that is a Big Fucking Deal, and Trump definitely crossed a red line with them.  I don’t feel like it’s as simple as him refusing to return the documents.

Yeah, I doubt they subject their families to death threats and stoke a CiViL wAr!! over reclaiming documents that they would have been fine with Trump keeping had the door had a padlock.

[AnTiM 1669]

16 minutes ago, The Dog said:

This is as good an explanation of trump's mental process as I have ever seen.

 

Edited August 15, 2022 by AnTiM

[Red Five 40895]

8 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Yeah, I doubt they subject their families to death threats and stoke a CiViL wAr!! over reclaiming documents that they would have been fine with Trump keeping had the door had a padlock.

This is a good point. 

[Homercles 10206]

Look y’all…I’m a Poke, forged in the pessimistic burning dumpster that was the football program from 98-02.  I’ve had my heart ripped out multiple times and knew with absolute certainty that yet another shaky, flickering ray of hope was going to be snuffed out last year when Caleb Williams came to town.  It ended up being a last-second, incredible victory over the house that bag-o-dicks built.  
 

Let’s not assume it’s over just yet.  

Edited August 15, 2022 by Homercles

[chainsaw 9873]

I hate the waiting game. That said, I don't think we can assume nothing will happen any more than we can assume everything will happen. Garland isn't Mueller.

[956 Worldwide 34770]

2 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

I think I'm coming around to the conclusion that this crime won't be indicted, or, if it is, it will be in conjunction with the 1/6 crimes.

It seems the first priority was to get the documents back, with any criminal charges secondary.  This was a rather extreme way to do it, but given Trumpco's previous non-compliance, the only way.

And, it serves as a convenient trial balloon.  It's testing public sentiment and revealing those numbnuts likely to engage in violence, for current prosecution or further consideration in the event of a 1/6 indictment.

Your insight as a law dawg is really important, but I think there’s a gap in public understanding on the seriousness of TS/SCI marked information.  He got handled with kid gloves on this is the timeline is accurate and they indeed asked for them back first. With an “ordinary person,” you get your door kicked down to get that shit back.

Also, in cases like this there is often a precedent for setting things without charges or at least at a much lower level.  There are lots of incentives not to hash out this stuff if a courtroom if the assessment is that shit got back home safe. 

[The Dog 44139]

Answers some questions:

(2701 above should be 2071 - she sent a correction tweet later)

oops one more:

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

3 minutes ago, chainsaw said:

Garland isn't Mueller.

Mueller actually sent some high profile people to prison. 

[SizzleChest 8284]

1 hour ago, TwiceHorn said:

Not what I said at all.  Whatever happens, I think it is a part of a deliberate strategy.

Applying for and executing this warrant was not the move of someone cowed by political reaction.  Garland is clearly doing work here.  Also, doing on the qt and letting Trump be the one to publicize it, only to call his bluff on the unsealing of the warrant was a bit of a master stroke.

What I meant to say (and I think I said it) was that priority one here was to get the documents back.  Whether criminal charges follow is a secondary consideration, and, criminally, there are bigger fish to fry in the form of a 1/6 prosecution.  A lot of that is going to depend on what the documents are and whether there is evidence of their use for nefarious and unlawful purposes.

This was also really about letting Trump know the DOJ has CIs on the inside at MAL.  And the bit about fingerprints on the docs is only going to ramp up pressure to getting others in Trumpworld to flip.  Playing this out in the media was always going to be a short-term strategy for Trump.  Let Trump, his minions, lawyers, geeks, dipwads, etc. out themselves. And the open, online video threats from the Gravy Seals and Meal Team Six is just going to result in those people getting a knock on their door.  What they do after that is up to them.  Most of them will likely shut up and go underground, but with the knowledge their movements will be heavily monitored.

[Tuco 5077]

1 hour ago, Pig Bellmont said:

The devils advocate is that you indict on the counts you have the easiest chance at conviction. The Jan 6 stuff hinges on intent and knowledge, which is murkier than hanging on to documents that can damage our national security interests. The latter is simple and pretty black and white 

Edited to add that Capone went down for tax evasion 

This.  

And really, the great historical irony of Trump being charged for mishandling classified documents is just too hard to pass up.  Oh Great Spaghetti Monster in the Sky, make this happen.  Future generations demand it.  

[TwiceHorn 31535]

1 minute ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Your insight as a law dawg is really important, but I think there’s a gap in public understanding on the seriousness of TS/SCI marked information.  He got handled with kid gloves on this is the timeline is accurate and they indeed asked for them back first. With an “ordinary person,” you get your door kicked down to get that shit back.

Also, in cases like this there is often a precedent for setting things without charges or at least at a much lower level.  There are lots of incentives not to hash out this stuff if a courtroom if the assessment is that shit got back home safe. 

I don't have any particular special knowledge on this kind of thing, but I do generally know how processes work, like subpoenas, warrants, etc.

I don't think anyone should underestimate the seriousness of this, but, the point you make about having to hash out sensitive information in court is a very valid one because it does place that information at higher risk of disclosure.  In a lot of these cases, that cat is already out of the bag (Reality Winner, for example). 

I'm curious about puzzling out which documents were taken and why.

a) as a preliminary matter, I think all government employees tasked with packing out the WH would default toward delivery of material to NARA, these aren't Acme Movers following the homeowner's instructions;

b) as a result of a), someone had to instruct the movers pretty strongly to pack up certain shit for transport not to NARA, but to MAL, and maybe even some surreptitious efforts to avoid NARA-biased movers;

c) the ultimate direction of what to pack up and where to send it had to come from Trump, or at least with his knowledge; he's not detail-oriented, but someone had to have gotten his input at some point;

d) deciding which of the 15 boxes went back to NARA in Jan/Feb 2021 almost had to involve Trump for the same reason as c);

e) the subpoena compliance or lack thereof just couldn't have been inadvertent; Trump doesn't take such things seriously, clearly, but those charged with compliance had to and surely would have insisted upon speaking with Trump to the effect of "is this it, are you really sure, we can't fuck around with this;"

f) finally the "I don't have a dog, it's not my dog, you didn't see it, and my dog doesn't bite" shit I think pretty clearly indicates a culpable state of mind for Trump.

 

[Bullneck 19206]

2 hours ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

 

 

Pretty thin gruel.  But hey, they have airtime to fill.

[Seasick Sailor 3747]

20 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Law enforcement is not capable of containing fascism. This needs to be understood. 

Nor do they have any interest in doing so. They are the fascist.  

1 hour ago, longhornmatt said:

They’re going to be hesitant to indict because it’s almost statistically impossible that a jury won’t include some Trump supporter who will let him walk no matter how conclusively the evidence proves he’s guilty. 

Does anyone know what venue this case would have to be tried in? If it's in Florida, then the above may be true, but if it's D.C., it shouldn't be too hard to impanel a jury that doesn't include at least hard-core Trump supporters. 

[956 Worldwide 34770]

2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

I don't have any particular special knowledge on this kind of thing, but I do generally know how processes work, like subpoenas, warrants, etc.

I don't think anyone should underestimate the seriousness of this, but, the point you make about having to hash out sensitive information in court is a very valid one because it does place that information at higher risk of disclosure.  In a lot of these cases, that cat is already out of the bag (Reality Winner, for example). 

I'm curious about puzzling out which documents were taken and why.

a) as a preliminary matter, I think all government employees tasked with packing out the WH would default toward delivery of material to NARA, these aren't Acme Movers following the homeowner's instructions;

b) as a result of a), someone had to instruct the movers pretty strongly to pack up certain shit for transport not to NARA, but to MAL, and maybe even some surreptitious efforts to avoid NARA-biased movers;

c) the ultimate direction of what to pack up and where to send it had to come from Trump, or at least with his knowledge; he's not detail-oriented, but someone had to have gotten his input at some point;

d) deciding which of the 15 boxes went back to NARA in Jan/Feb 2021 almost had to involve Trump for the same reason as c);

e) the subpoena compliance or lack thereof just couldn't have been inadvertent; Trump doesn't take such things seriously, clearly, but those charged with compliance had to and surely would have insisted upon speaking with Trump to the effect of "is this it, are you really sure, we can't fuck around with this;"

f) finally the "I don't have a dog, it's not my dog, you didn't see it, and my dog doesn't bite" shit I think pretty clearly indicates a culpable state of mind for Trump.

 

What I am saying is that subpoenas are not usually issued if the feds believe you have TS/SCI information lurking in your home. They skip the fucking around and go straight to the (you) finding out. And for good reason, there is no time to waste to get it home and away from the grubby hands of whomever is shopping it or passing it around. And make no mistake— you do not, cannot take that shit home on accident and forget to bring it back.  You take it home because you want to do something illegal with it. 
 

As far as the packing it up and bringing it with him, there are a lot of questions.  It is certain that any employee who was tasked to pack up the Oval and White House held a security clearance themselves or were under constant supervision of someone who had one.  They’d have known to speak up when handling the documents. My fairly well educated guess is that a political level appointee ensured those documents avoided that process and got to MAL. 

[Hookah Horns 3083]

On 8/14/2022 at 8:23 AM, FirstTimeCaller said:

The entire "I took them home because I was working" excuse is so weird to me.

You stopped being president 18 months ago. Why do you still have them if that's the case? 

KRAMER
What did you want to see me about, Mr. Leland?

LELAND
Kramer, I’ve been reviewing your work. Quite frankly, it stinks.

KRAMER
Well, I ah.. been havin’ trouble at home and uh.. I mean, ah, you know, I’ll work harder, nights, weekends, whatever it takes.

LELAND
No, no, I don’t think that’s going to, do it, uh. These reports you handed in. It’s almost as if you have no business training at all.
I don’t know what this is supposed to be!

KRAMER
Well, I’m uh, just–tryin’ to get ahead.

LELAND
Well, I’m sorry. There’s just no way that we could keep you on.

KRAMER
I don’t even really work here!

LELAND
That’s what makes this so difficult.
 

[Bullneck 19206]

2 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

I think I'm coming around to the conclusion that this crime won't be indicted, or, if it is, it will be in conjunction with the 1/6 crimes.

It seems the first priority was to get the documents back, with any criminal charges secondary.  This was a rather extreme way to do it, but given Trumpco's previous non-compliance, the only way.

And, it serves as a convenient trial balloon.  It's testing public sentiment and revealing those numbnuts likely to engage in violence, for current prosecution or further consideration in the event of a 1/6 indictment.

I cheerfully disagree with you and think you're wrong.  Later in this thread The Dog posted some good tweets about what Trump is up against.

The US has their boot on his throat right now.  It may not be the first conviction that comes down (Fani might get him first) but the there is just too much for him to stop, and his friends and family aren't taking a bullet for him.

Edited August 15, 2022 by Bullneck

[Fastbreak 3992]

My bet is something like -- DJT: "What?  I had no idea those documents were in there.  I never opened the boxes."  Some flunkie: "Yes, I misunderstood DJT's request to pack the important stuff and ended up getting really bad papers, which I never explained to him. It's all my fault and now I'll go to jail for 5 years." 

5 years in the future there will be some guy trying to get his money from Trump, only to find out the 5 years he spent In the pen was pro-bono.

[Hermanator 7168]

33 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Your insight as a law dawg is really important, but I think there’s a gap in public understanding on the seriousness of TS/SCI marked information.  He got handled with kid gloves on this is the timeline is accurate and they indeed asked for them back first. With an “ordinary person,” you get your door kicked down to get that shit back.

It seems the asking for docs back first was both handling with kid gloves and closing a potential defense for Trump. They knew they had an inside informant or multiple ones. They probably had information on who to and what Trump and his people were communicating about these stolen docs. So by asking for them and visiting the place they prompted Trump to predictably have the most sensitive ones he was selling or planning to sell moved to the different location (I'm assuming inside the safe). 

Then they subpoena the surveillance tapes and now have a time line of we asked for them back on this date, they moved them on this date, and the raid shows these were the documents that were moved. That proves he was intentionally hiding certain documents, and if they have evidence of the sell or plan to sell those specific documents it proves the whole plan and the evidence spells it out. 

The coincidences and timing with this stuff, the Saudi's 2 billion dollar payment to the family, and knowing exactly who and what Trump is are too strong for this to be just a "we want our SCI documents back so we're going to raid a former president for them". 

Edited August 15, 2022 by Hermanator

[Biff Tannen 45735]

5 minutes ago, Hookah Horns said:

KRAMER
What did you want to see me about, Mr. Leland?

LELAND
Kramer, I’ve been reviewing your work. Quite frankly, it stinks.

KRAMER
Well, I ah.. been havin’ trouble at home and uh.. I mean, ah, you know, I’ll work harder, nights, weekends, whatever it takes.

LELAND
No, no, I don’t think that’s going to, do it, uh. These reports you handed in. It’s almost as if you have no business training at all.
I don’t know what this is supposed to be!

KRAMER
Well, I’m uh, just–tryin’ to get ahead.

LELAND
Well, I’m sorry. There’s just no way that we could keep you on.

KRAMER
I don’t even really work here!

LELAND
That’s what makes this so difficult.
 

perfect

[GopherRock 1768]

25 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Mueller actually sent some high profile people to prison. 

Garland sent Timothy McVeigh to the gurney and Terry Nichols, Ted Kaczinski, and Eric Rudolph to ADX Florence.

As noted by someone else above, Mitch McConnell might well now regret not hiding Garland in the minority on the Supreme Court.

[TwiceHorn 31535]

13 minutes ago, Bullneck said:

I cheerfully disagree with you and think you're wrong.  Later in this thread The Dog posted some good tweets about what Trump is up against.

The US has their boot on his throat right now.  It may not be the first conviction that comes down (Fani might get him first) but the there is just too much for him to stop, and his friends and family aren't taking a bullet for him.

Actually, if you look at the Georgia thing closely, it's not really any further along than DOJ.  They're still basically interviewing witnesses via grand jury, and apparently, that's not a grand jury that has the ability to indict, although they can probably go next door or upstairs for that.

I don't know what will happen.  And, I didn't say that this wouldn't result in an indictment, per se, just not one separate from 1/6.

Edited August 15, 2022 by TwiceHorn

[Tuco 5077]

54 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

That sense of self-preservation is why the vast majority of them don’t fuck around and find out, because there has been enough dumbasses who did which helps to keep the rest in line. Thats why after that dumbass Ricky Shiffer got himself killed, nobody else took up arms and went out in a blaze of glory attacking the FBI like Shiffer told them to, all the while screaming “HIS NAME WAS RICKY SHIFFER!”

And going back to the original point of cops not joining up with militias because of losing their pensions/salaries - they have seen many people who completely destroyed their lives over small things, including successful people.

I'll take the second paragraph first.  That's like Yogi saying "Nobody goes there anymore because it's too crowded."  Yes, people regularly completely destroy their lives over stupid shit. And yet it keeps happening.  

As far as Ricky Shiffer, there is stupid and there is completely crazy. The dude basically make a social media post and then jumped in his car thinking others would join him. That's just fucking crazy.  I don't think you could do that on an ISIS Facebook group and expect any success.

Keep in mind, this is not some hypothetical about the law enforcement helping "gravy seals."  It already happens.  Ahmaud Arbery.  Were the cops and the prosecutor worried about their pensions when they signed off on the self-defense?  Not in the slightest.  And, until one of the shitstains started showing videos of the murder, their pensions were safe.  Local cops are run by local governments, as designated by the local populations.  And local populations in rural America are racist as fuck.  

So, if we are talking about the sheriff's office grabbing their shotguns and taking the FBI on, I agree that's unlikely.  If we are talking about local LE supporting violent actions of right-wing extremists against minorities, it's already happening.  I think it is reasonable to expect that it could extent to protecting militia groups and covering up violence on Dems/liberal activists and organizers (think 60's in the South).  And, when some of the right wing militias are arrested, we'll get the Scooby Doo style reveal of the law enforcement when they take off the hoods.  

 

[Bullneck 19206]

1 hour ago, BehoId, The Underminer! said:

There is a decent historical record of the guys getting away with stuff.  The Ah! Well, nevertheless meme didn't spring up from nothing.

Nothing happened because trump was more powerful than his adversaries. Now he is less. He’s toast. 

[wildcat09 29384]

On 8/14/2022 at 9:21 AM, Aqua Buddha said:

There was a podcast a few years ago that predicted that very thing.  I forget the name but it was something about a new civil war.  I'd have to find out.  One scenario they laid out was militant groups in Northern California cutting off the water supply.

Also compared it to the Troubles in Ireland.  While not a civil war with armies, it would be pockets of armed resistance and they pointed out the IRA was never really that big.

It Could Happen Here. They resurrected it as a daily podcast about basically all the bad stuff going on in the world, but the original season is still available in the podcast feed. 

[The Dog 44139]

more from emptywheel:

 

 

[The Dog 44139]

 

It appears the obstruction and espionage cases are separate?

Edited August 15, 2022 by The Dog

[Chad Fuck 17772]

7 hours ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Can’t be emphasized enough that most of MAGA has a worldview shaped to a great deal by TV and movies.  They really are observers of a cinematic universe that has been created for them with storylines and villains and heroes. 

Just because this thread and your post reminded me of this.

[RomaVicta 30016]

1 hour ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

I personally think that they have evidence of him selling shit.  I think they are just dotting i's and crossing t's, since to convict, it has to be beyond a reasonable doubt.  

I agree. Trump didn't just randomly grab up an armful of documents and run out the door. He had a purpose. His every action is self-serving. 

I think the Saudi money to Kushner and Flynn's earlier attempt to get nuclear secrets to Saudi Arabia is highly suggestive of a deal attractive to Trump. Two billion dollars dwarfs even his mega-effort to drain the MAGA idiots of their last greasy quarter.

The intellligence about Macron suggests some sinister plan of revenge against the French president for his disdain of Trump and crushing the Donald's hand before Donald could crush Macron's. Trump is nothing if not petty.

Trump is a Russian asset through either kompromat or debt or both. No more needs to be written.

He stole with a purpose. He's arrogant and dumb enough to think he can outsmart federal investigators and prosecutors. I am not closed to the idea that his fucking around may indeed lead to finding out.

[TwiceHorn 31535]

59 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Mueller actually sent some high profile people to prison. 

He did. He wasn't as impotent as people like to claim or think. But he was never going to indict trump or push separation of powers issues. And neither would anyone else who would have been appointed special counsel. 

[F250 28818]

39 minutes ago, Fastbreak said:

5 years in the future there will be some guy trying to get his money from Trump, only to find out the 5 years he spent In the pen was pro-bono.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

26 minutes ago, GopherRock said:

Garland sent Timothy McVeigh to the gurney and Terry Nichols, Ted Kaczinski, and Eric Rudolph to ADX Florence

I’m not trying to bash Garland here but to act like he and Mueller aren’t cut from similar cloth is a bit ludicrous. 

[chainsaw 9873]

1 hour ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Mueller actually sent some high profile people to prison. 

Not enough of them. At the end of the day, he carried water for the republican party.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13523]

Mueller's investigation was about collecting the information and not so much about imprisonments. Trump was always going to let anyone out especially if they played ball, Johnny Dangerously style. 

Manafort lied to Mueller and Trump ultimately pardoned him. Trump could have just commuted the sentence but gave Manafort the full pardon. As an aside, Manafort now admits to forgetting the truth with Mueller.

[RomaVicta 30016]

15 hours ago, Gil Bang said:

 

Someone asked for clarification of the above which I also needed. Meadows was referring to the tweets below.

 

 

[C-Man 27262]

1 hour ago, Bullneck said:

Pretty thin gruel.  But hey, they have airtime to fill.

Rupert and Lachlan need to be thrown in the Sarlac pit

[Pig Bellmont 8738]

41 minutes ago, The Dog said:

 

It appears the obstruction and espionage cases are separate?

The way I read that DOJ filing is that the sealed warrant at issue has *nothing* to do with documents at MAL (uses the language “completely unrelated”. The obstruction and espionage cases wouldn’t meet that standard- Which means it’s a warrant for evidence regarding separate crimes the public (and maybe Trump) isn’t aware of yet. 

[Fudge Nuggets 19223]

2 hours ago, longhornmatt said:

They’re going to be hesitant to indict because it’s almost statistically impossible that a jury won’t include some Trump supporter who will let him walk no matter how conclusively the evidence proves he’s guilty.  Then we get to listen to him talk about how he’s exonerated and campaign on how the deep state wrongfully tried to imprison him.

Then someone doxes said juror and his house gets burned down, hopefully with him in it.

[chainsaw 9873]

31 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

He did. He wasn't as impotent as people like to claim or think. But he was never going to indict trump or push separation of powers issues. And neither would anyone else who would have been appointed special counsel. 

I assume by this you mean there are people out there who would have indicted Trump but none of those people would have received any consideration for this job.

[Pig Bellmont 8738]

 

[BehoId, The Underminer! 11669]

2 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

The way I read that DOJ filing is that the sealed warrant at issue has *nothing* to do with documents at MAL (uses the language “completely unrelated”. The obstruction and espionage cases wouldn’t meet that standard- Which means it’s a warrant for evidence regarding separate crimes the public (and maybe Trump) isn’t aware of yet. 

 

It reads to me that the AUSA is saying that the second case has nothing to do with Trump.  They NYT referenced a case number for some other investigation.