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A story about a pathetic man's downfall [34 Felony Convictions]

Francisco 2.0

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31536

Posted
Posted

This Smith cat seems like a pretty good appointment.

Unlike Mueller, he's never strayed very far into bureaucracy and has always remained a prosecutor/trial lawyer.

The closest thing to a bureaucrat he's been is head of the Public Integrity Section, as pointed out above, but they say he was extremely hands on with younger/less-experienced prosecutors and a great supporter and teacher.

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Beau Vine
Beau Vine

To be fair, President Trump’s four years in office weren’t so bad, except when when he incited an insurrection against the government, mismanaged a pandemic that killed nearly half a million Americans

Bama Chick
Bama Chick

Y’all about to get a great visual representation of Cullman, Alabama. Only good things to come out of Cullman are the Britt brothers (Roll Tide!) and orange rolls from All Steak restaurant. That pla

ChiTownDoc
ChiTownDoc

You seem really pissed off for a nontrumper.  Just laugh at the trumpers, bro.  They’re really gullible dumbfucks who worship this orange blob…you know, people completely unlike yourself.  

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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29194

Posted
Posted
30 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

This Smith cat seems like a pretty good appointment.

Unlike Mueller, he's never strayed very far into bureaucracy and has always remained a prosecutor/trial lawyer.

The closest thing to a bureaucrat he's been is head of the Public Integrity Section, as pointed out above, but they say he was extremely hands on with younger/less-experienced prosecutors and a great supporter and teacher.

still can’t get over the fact that when confronted with the idea of finding the right dude to get into this, they had to go all the way to the fucking hague to find him. 

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safe sex

safe sex 11754

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Posted (edited)
30 minutes ago, Willfully Horn said:

Oil companies enjoyed record peodits during Jimmy’s term, too.

image.png.d514d2b107a542dab44be9f510a187d6.png

For sure, his neoliberalism is one of the worst things about his presidency. The first step down Reagan's path.

But he was the most honest president of the 20th century and set higher ethical and transparency standards than any other administration as well. He doomed his reelection chances with his honesty and commitment to moral principles.

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Willfully Horn

Willfully Horn 8049

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1 minute ago, safe sex said:

For sure, his neoliberalism is one of the worst things about his presidency. The first step down Reagan's path.

But he was the most honest president of the 20th century and set higher ethical and transparency standards than any other administration as well. He doomed his reelection chances with his honesty and commitment to moral principles.

Huh. I have thought gas prices, the hostage crisis, and Reagan’s treasonous deal with Iran caused him to br a one term president.

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BehoId, The Underminer!

BehoId, The Underminer! 11669

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12 hours ago, henrygandorf said:


this is a preview of what the next 2 years will be like and i am the opposite of here for it. 

For a dude that claims to be America First, he sure does hate the English language.  
 

Im the most innocent person ever.  No one has ever not committed a crime more than I’ve not committed it.  

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Goredho

Goredho 17419

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31 minutes ago, Bullneck said:

So this is actually a picture of Jack Smith?  First of all, the name sounds made up.  Very Netflix "story of a secret agent out to avenge his partner's killing" or 24 or Bourne Identity.  He actually looks like the "bad guy."

 

 

Who had Dark Brandon using blood magic to resurrect Dick Marcinko on their bingo card?

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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 30018

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49 minutes ago, Bullneck said:

So this is actually a picture of Jack Smith?  First of all, the name sounds made up.  Very Netflix "story of a secret agent out to avenge his partner's killing" or 24 or Bourne Identity.  He actually looks like the "bad guy."

 

 

You're right, sir. You were at that parking space first. I will move my car so you can have what is rightfully yours.

And thank you.

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Chooky

Chooky 13319

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The most Trump shit ever is Trump not just claiming innocence, but claiming to be "the most innocent person ever." The most innocentest. Before him, nobody had ever seen anything so innocent. 

That's an argument you'd hear between napoleon dynamite and kip. I can't do another year of this dumbass nonsense. 

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Red Five

Red Five 40895

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25 minutes ago, Chooky said:

The most Trump shit ever is Trump not just claiming innocence, but claiming to be "the most innocent person ever." The most innocentest. Before him, nobody had ever seen anything so innocent. 

That's an argument you'd hear between napoleon dynamite and kip. I can't do another year of this dumbass nonsense. 

"It was a perfect phone call!"

"You've been impeached over it."

"Perfect I tell you!"

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Biff Tannen

Biff Tannen 45741

Posted
Posted
27 minutes ago, Chooky said:

The most Trump shit ever is Trump not just claiming innocence, but claiming to be "the most innocent person ever." The most innocentest. Before him, nobody had ever seen anything so innocent. 

That's an argument you'd hear between napoleon dynamite and kip. I can't do another year of this dumbass nonsense. 

But can you do another 5? 

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WhatTheBuck

WhatTheBuck 28798

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16 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Mueller had no way to force Trump to an interview.  The best he could have done is subpoena him to a grand jury, where his testimony would be secret, if not entirely the 5th/executive privilege.  And there could have been a "constitutional crisis" about that, as well, which he said in something he was disinclined to provoke.

The government has no way to compel a defendant to testify, other than before a grand jury.

That his live testimony would be a "perjury trap" was not the reason Mueller didn't pursue it, it was Trumpco's lame excuse as to why he was unwilling to give full cooperation with the investigation.  The investigation was almost wholly dependent on whatever cooperation he would provide.

The other thing is that I don't think he would have prosecuted Trump even if he could because the law is hazy on the corrupt intention, and because of the limitations on his ability to gather evidence.  So he wasn't going to say something that wasn't accurate.  He went as far as the facts and circumstances would take him.

Interview, interrogate, question...pick whatever verb you like. I don’t mean “interview” as in coming and speaking in Mueller’s office alone. I think you know that. I’m talking about testifying in person under oath as opposed to answering written questions like Mueller allowed Trump to do  I think that should’ve been obvious from the context. (Suggestion for lawyers: when speaking with a layperson in the court of public opinion, try to get the general gist of what they’re saying, don’t seize upon one word you feel was used inappropriately and belabor that trivial point.)

So yeah, Mueller should’ve had Trump testify before a grand jury just like Starr got Clinton to do in ‘98. Starr subpoenaed Clinton’s testimony. Clinton opted to testify voluntarily and Starr withdrew the subpoena. So there’s precedent. Mueller should’ve played tough and issued a subpoena if necessary. John Dowd would’ve tried to quash it and he threatened Mueller that he would do so during a meeting in Mueller’s office on Mar 5, 2018. That meeting is documented in Fear by Bob Woodward.

”Dowd knew he was gambling and daring Mueller by threatening to fight a grand jury subpoena. That was his design, sending a message that if Mueller wanted to go the grand jury route, this was what it would look like. He would fill his motions with exhibits. And the district judge would spend two weeks reading them.”

It goes on...

”He had a final argument. The perjury trap was what Mueller’s team did, he charged. ‘You did it to Flynn, you did it to Gates, you did it to [George] Papadopolous,’ a former campaign aide. ‘You guys, that’s the game you played.’ Rick Gates, a Manafort business associate and Trump’s deputy campaign chairman, had one of the best lawyers sitting next to him and had still lied. ‘You guys gave him no time to prepare. And now he’s got a felony, Bob, that’s exactly what I told the president: that’s what they’re going to do to you in an interview.’”

There’s that word interview. It wasn’t the only time Dowd used it to describe the act of Trump sitting down to testify in the Mueller investigation.

I think Mueller should’ve played hardball. I think he might have been cowed by Dowd banging the table and making threats. But fuck Dowd and fuck Trump. The stakes were pretty damn high. We’re talking not only about suspicious actions by the president and his campaign correlated to and coinciding with efforts by a foreign power to help him get elected but also about his efforts to obstruct the investigation into those actions. The cover-up. It wasn’t about a president getting a blow job in the Oval Office. It was serious business.

Woodward reports that Trump (foolishly) wanted to testify but Dowd kept counseling against that. But they saw it as a real possibility. During the time it was under consideration I saw Rudy Giuliani going on tv and shouting that Clinton’s testimony only lasted 4 hours so they’d better not make Trump testify any longer than that.

The book also reports on a Mar 12 meeting between Trump’s and Mueller’s team. This is in the final chapter of the book which ends before the report is released. I assume Dowd was a primary source for this section. (Also an interview but obviously that word can apply equally under different circumstances and in different settings.)

”[Dowd] hoped against hope that Mueller was going to say he was inclined to decline prosecution and say he needed the president’s testimony just to write a report to Rosenstein, the deputy attorney general.

“Mueller’s team, Quarless and three others, dictated 49 questions and Jay Sekulow took notes. Nearly all concerned Trump’s attitude, opinions, decision making or conclusions about major players such as Flynn, Comey and Sessions. Some inquired about Donald Jr. and the famous meeting at Trump Tower, and the offer from a Russian lawyer to provide dirt on Hillary Clinton. Others concerned real estate development in Russia.

”The broad range of subjects validated what the news was reporting on what Mueller was investigating.

”This is horseshit, Dowd thought. Second-year-law-school questions. Many had been answered. To have Trump answer them, of course, would be a catastrophe because Trump could erupt and say absolutely anything. On one level, Dowd thought the broad range of questions suggested that Mueller had nothing and wanted to go on a giant fishing expedition. Setting a perjury trap for the volatile Trump would be child’s play.

”‘There’s no case here,’ Dowd told Mueller.

”‘I need the president’s testimony,’ Mueller said, ‘What was his intent on Comey?’”

[...several paragraphs of back and forth...]

”’Intent, Dowd continued, ‘all the documents and testimony’ answer that. ‘You asked witnesses what he [the president] said and what he did and when he did it. I submit all that stuff in real time.’ That was all that was needed to show the president’s intent.

“Mueller was not buying.

“Dowd and Sekulow left the building.

“‘What do you think?’ Sekulow asked.

”He ain’t testifying,’ Dowd said. It had been a complete fantasy to think that Mueller would decline prosecution.”

I don’t know in what sense Dowd was using the term “prosecution” above. Maybe you can help me out with that.

The fear of the “perjury trap” on the part of Trump’s lawyers was real, they knew that Trump was a lying motherfucker, and they raised the issue of the perjury trap explicitly in their objections to in-person testimony. I say too fucking bad. Make him testify, let them fight it, and see what happens.

I really don’t want to derail the discussion about the current Special Counsel with talk about the previous one, but I think it’s a legitimate complaint to say that Mueller could have and should have done more. I think he was too cautious and risk-averse. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to say he turned out to be soft when he had been made out to be a rock. So while I’m hoping for the best from the new Special Counsel, I’m prepared for the worst. As you know I’ve tended to err on the side of pessimism in matters where Trump is concerned and so far that’s proven to be a reliable approach.

 

 

 

 

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WhatTheBuck

WhatTheBuck 28798

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16 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

That is what he said, repeatedly.  "The report speaks for itself."

What he didn’t say was that Barr lied. That was the point. People who thought Barr was accurately representing what was in the report weren’t going to go read the report. The crucial point was that Mueller should have said out loud that Barr lied to the American people to protect the president. He should’ve said that Barr was being deceptive when he claimed that Mueller found no collusion. Mueller stated in his report that collusion is not a legal term so it’s not possible to determine collusion.

Barr was a political actor pursuing a political objective with that deception. He wasn’t behaving as an officer of the Justice Dept. Mueller should have said so. THEN he could have gone on to remind the people, again, to read his report for themselves. Yes, the word was already out to the people to read the report. That wasn’t the point at all. The point was that Barr was a corrupt fucking liar serving the interests of the president and not his oath of office nor his duty to the country. 

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 89799

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, GhostOfTomJoad said:

"Nobody knows more about taxes/infrastructure/ computers/ military weapons systems/biomedical research/ et al than me. Believe me."

Well, Trump avoided paying taxes, avoided military service, avoided paying contractors, so clearly he’s an expert in taxes, infrastructure, and military.

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Js1

Js1 85574

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Posted
1 minute ago, WhatTheBuck said:

What happens to Truth Social if Trump goes back to spending all his time on Twitter?

It’ll be like Shaggy Texas when everyone left - kiddie porn and some guy and his 6 socks talking to each other

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 89799

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Some are claiming Trump has said he won’t return, with the reason being that he has some kind of exclusive deal (for a piece of the platform).

Would be hilarious if Musk spent his Saturday night coming up with a way to bring Trump back, and Trump doesn’t come back.

Of course, the people discussing the legalities of Trump’s return are posting shit like this

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