Dallas Cowboys 2021 Offseason Thread: Fuck It All

[immamac 42917]

23 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

The real lesson is do one of two things. Get lucky with a reclamation project like the Titans did with tannehill, or find a way for Dak to drop his girl and date someone who makes more than everyone in the NFL like Giselle. 
 

Or just hope Dak continues to improve and accept that this is the going rate for a top 10 qb. The only somewhat valid argument is that we shouldn’t have paid him because of how far away we are from being a contender. With the coach we have, the contracts we have, and the roster we have, we might be more than 3-4 years away from truly contending. But saying “he doesn’t deserve that kind of money” isn’t a valid argument. He does deserve that kind of contract. He’s proven he’s a franchise qb. It’s just, MAYBE we shouldn’t have been that team to pay him. If a team that was a qb away gave him that kind of money, nobody would bat and eye. We just have to pray to the football gods we can actually draft good defensive players. 

Tannehill was good af in miami dude, he isn't a reclamation. Miami just fucking sucked donkey dick. 

Dak isn't an above average QB.

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

16 minutes ago, immamac said:

Tannehill was good af in miami dude, he isn't a reclamation. Miami just fucking sucked donkey dick. 

Dak isn't an above average QB.

I actually agree with your point about tannehill. But if you don’t even think Dak is an above average qb, there’s really no point in engaging in a debate. Your definition of average must be different than my definition of average when it comes to starting qbs in the nfl. 

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

Dwayne Haskins, Taylor Heineke, Daniel Jones, Carson Wentz, Jalen Hurts.

Cowboys division rivals wish they had an average QB.

Anyways, Dallas wasn't winning a Super Bowl any time soon with Dak or no Dak. Jerry Jones and his son are still the GM.

[immamac 42917]

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/nfl-quarterback-rankings-2019-best-worst-1-32/11p5evm1b6g0v1tbu8lvzo5rzq

There's 6 tiers

1. Elite - MVP candidates
2. Good AF but not MVP caliber
3. Maybe great, maybe not?
4. Solid, consistently good for a long time QB's
5. 2nd years trying to solidify starter roles
6. Shitters or olds

Dak sits firmly in the 3rd tier, and at the very bottom after the injury. He's not done anything great and now his leg got tiger woodsed (only half though) 

He's not worth 140M in Jerseys, merch, wins, nothing. He's not worth that kinda money especially when the jets have the 2nd overall pick and you can move up to get some great young star and bring in one of the other quarterbacks from the 4 or 2 tier which are basically going to be the same or better guaranteed for significantly less money. 

If Dak had won 4 or 5 playoff games by this time in his career I'd say fuck yeah lock this guy down it's fine tuning that isn't right. But this whole team is fucking detuned around 2 pretty "meh" overpayed guys in zeke and dak.

Fuck the cowboys man, I want to like them so much, but I just know there is 0 chance. 

@RGBIII I suggest you weed out the Cowboys from your commitment choices.

 

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

8 minutes ago, immamac said:

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/nfl-quarterback-rankings-2019-best-worst-1-32/11p5evm1b6g0v1tbu8lvzo5rzq

There's 6 tiers

1. Elite - MVP candidates
2. Good AF but not MVP caliber
3. Maybe great, maybe not?
4. Solid, consistently good for a long time QB's
5. 2nd years trying to solidify starter roles
6. Shitters or olds

Dak sits firmly in the 3rd tier, and at the very bottom after the injury. He's not done anything great and now his leg got tiger woodsed (only half though) 

He's not worth 140M in Jerseys, merch, wins, nothing. He's not worth that kinda money especially when the jets have the 2nd overall pick and you can move up to get some great young star and bring in one of the other quarterbacks from the 4 or 2 tier which are basically going to be the same or better guaranteed for significantly less money. 

If Dak had won 4 or 5 playoff games by this time in his career I'd say fuck yeah lock this guy down it's fine tuning that isn't right. But this whole team is fucking detuned around 2 pretty "meh" overpayed guys in zeke and dak.

Fuck the cowboys man, I want to like them so much, but I just know there is 0 chance. 

@RGBIII I suggest you weed out the Cowboys from your commitment choices.

 

Here I was talking shit about how nobody is taking arguments from 2018-2019 (before Kellen Moore was his offensive coordinator), and now one of the mods of surly is taking a list from before the 2019 season to back his argument. JFC. Like I said, man. If you don’t think the guy is above average there’s no point in even talking about this. 
 

Also, if we equate your tiers list to 2021, there’s probably 4 qbs that are in your tier one. Maybe 5 if you want to throw Watson into that mix. But qbs 6-12ish all fall in that tier 2. 

Edited March 10, 2021 by youdunnf'dup

[immamac 42917]

I was using the ratings guide and putting my own ratings from this year on that, it's why I didn't include players in each tier. 

Average QB's in the league don't necessarily exist, they ride the bench. 

[totallynotabuttpirate 5403]

10 hours ago, youdunnf'dup said:

Asking for them to improve is just asking too much. 

Nah, with Nolan and his garbage scheme gone they should be in the 17-20 range at least. The major improvement will be not giving up 35 points in the first half. Unfortunately with Quinn, that will just be moved to the second half.

[futureman 22530]

blake bortles has more playoff wins than dak.

case closed. this argument is over. 

[RGBIII 22840]

1 hour ago, immamac said:

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/nfl-quarterback-rankings-2019-best-worst-1-32/11p5evm1b6g0v1tbu8lvzo5rzq

There's 6 tiers

1. Elite - MVP candidates
2. Good AF but not MVP caliber
3. Maybe great, maybe not?
4. Solid, consistently good for a long time QB's
5. 2nd years trying to solidify starter roles
6. Shitters or olds

Dak sits firmly in the 3rd tier, and at the very bottom after the injury. He's not done anything great and now his leg got tiger woodsed (only half though) 

He's not worth 140M in Jerseys, merch, wins, nothing. He's not worth that kinda money especially when the jets have the 2nd overall pick and you can move up to get some great young star and bring in one of the other quarterbacks from the 4 or 2 tier which are basically going to be the same or better guaranteed for significantly less money. 

If Dak had won 4 or 5 playoff games by this time in his career I'd say fuck yeah lock this guy down it's fine tuning that isn't right. But this whole team is fucking detuned around 2 pretty "meh" overpayed guys in zeke and dak.

Fuck the cowboys man, I want to like them so much, but I just know there is 0 chance. 

@RGBIII I suggest you weed out the Cowboys from your commitment choices.

 

A smart person wouldn’t have them in their top 5, they are still somehow in my top 3 which just proves I am not a smart man...let’s see if I can wisen up by NSD when the Pod drops

[C-Man 27254]

6 hours ago, Drew said:

Says the guy who has NO idea how the Salary Cap or QB markets work.  Just wait and see worse QB's than Dak blow past him over the summer.  Dak will literally be the 5th highest paid QB by training camp and 7th or 8th by next offseason.  This will be a bargain by then.

Exactly.

Fucking THIS.  The Cap hit is ALL that matters.  22.5 mil this year is LESS than Goff/Wentz, Teddy Bridgewater AND Timmy G.  Dak is better than ALL of them.  Jesus.

Yeah this whole myth that a QB can't take up more than a certain % of the cap has been overblown for years.  Now that Dak is BELOW that % people are still saying he's taking up too much cap?!?

Absolutely, except in 2017 when he had NO weapons in he 2nd fucking year. But apparently he's supposed to be a future HOFer and Manning in his prime by year 2.

Yes in 2017 when he literally had NO weapons.  Broken down Dez, old slow Witten, body catching aging Williams, and a short slot receiver.  2017 is literally the ONLY year anyone can hold against Dak and completely forget he was a 2nd year player, in a run first offense that lost it's RB and behind an OL that was falling apart. 

You said before you werent, but  yes, you ARE a Dak hater.  You claim not to be then post this garbage.  Even if you think Romo was better, he was not a entire fucking tier above him.  Dak has done as much as Romo had, if not MORE, in his first 4 years.

He's not wroth 22.5 mil against the cap this year? 33 mil next year? If they don't renegotiate(as I suspect) in year 3, then he'll finally be 40 mil a year.  But guess what? The TV money hits before then and the cap will explode.  

This deal is literally a WIN fucking WIN since the Cowboys were able to make Dak's cap hits extremely manageable, while also paying Dak what he DESERVED and EARNED.

People hating on this are fucking biased as shit and just grasping as straws.  You guys are no better than Futureman trolling so much he actually believes the shit he spews.

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

Not sure Jerry and Stephen Jones understand how to construct a roster around the salary cap either so Cowboys fans are in good shape. They've always believed giving their best players anything they want then filling out the rest of the roster with spares. 

Main problem with the Dak contract is its only a 4 year contract so in three years he's going to want top 3 QB money again. There's no "discount" years moving forward. Fast forward to the next negotiation and he will be asking for more than Mahomes as that will be the new going rate.

Edited March 10, 2021 by Loch Ness Monster

[Pam Cummings 9654]

12 hours ago, immamac said:

When was the last cowboys playoff win? ah yes 2018, and before that? right right right, 2014. Oh shit, what about before that? ohhhhh you got me 2009. 

Seems like a really well run organization. Would definitely bet on them winning a playoff game this season.

OK? So they should let him walk and wander the desert with Quincy Carters and washed up vets like Matt Cassell until they luck out in the draft again? I don't see how there was a "correct" decision for them here. 

[immamac 42917]

Just now, Pam Cummings said:

OK? So they should let him walk and wander the desert with Quincy Carters and washed up vets like Matt Cassell until they luck out in the draft again? I don't see how there was a "correct" decision for them here. 

Build a playoff team with decent QB then get big name QB in draft or buying them. 

Baker mayfield isn't even that good, but he has a good enough team around him. 

[Pam Cummings 9654]

6 minutes ago, immamac said:

Build a playoff team with decent QB then get big name QB in draft or buying them. 

Baker mayfield isn't even that good, but he has a good enough team around him. 

You can't build a SB contender paying big numbers to skill players, just won't happen. Jerry loves paying guys who suck up to him and are "good soldiers" who won't question anything he does. That's how this team works. Dak's skill level is irrelevant, so that's why i say good for that young man for getting some money at least. They won't win with him, and they wouldn't win without him.

 

Besides, it's easier to get out of "bad" QB contracts. For one, in 2 years every QB contact signed this year will look like a "great deal". For another, even if he completely sucks, some team will still trade for him if the Cowboys decide they want to move on. The Rams got out of Goff's contract and actually upgraded at that position.

Edited March 10, 2021 by Pam Cummings

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

One reason it made sense to pay Dak was the other QBs in the division are Taylor Heineke, Daniel Jones, and Jalen Hurts. If you can make the playoffs you at least give the team a chance to go on a run. If we had Patrick Mahomes in Philly or something then yeah, full rebuild. 

[Pam Cummings 9654]

13 minutes ago, Loch Ness Monster said:

One reason it made sense to pay Dak was the other QBs in the division are Taylor Heineke, Daniel Jones, and Jalen Hurts. If you can make the playoffs you at least give the team a chance to go on a run. If we had Patrick Mahomes in Philly or something then yeah, full rebuild. 

Another thing is that Jackson, Allen, and Mayfield are all gonna get huge contracts as well, and you needed to get ahead of that.

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

18 minutes ago, Loch Ness Monster said:

One reason it made sense to pay Dak was the other QBs in the division are Taylor Heineke, Daniel Jones, and Jalen Hurts. If you can make the playoffs you at least give the team a chance to go on a run. If we had Patrick Mahomes in Philly or something then yeah, full rebuild. 

And this is the main argument against the rebuilding narrative that I kept throwing out and why it just doesn’t make sense to do it right now. We have no good excuse to miss the playoffs next year. 

[immamac 42917]

21 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

And this is the main argument against the rebuilding narrative that I kept throwing out and why it just doesn’t make sense to do it right now. We have no good excuse to miss the playoffs next year. 

Yet the cowboys will miss the playoffs, likely due to self inflicted fuckups. 

[Richard Kimball 1496]

31 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

And this is the main argument against the rebuilding narrative that I kept throwing out and why it just doesn’t make sense to do it right now. We have no good excuse to miss the playoffs next year. 

Jerry is 78 or so, knocking on 80. He doesn't have time for a complete rebuild.

Yay! We signed Dak! Now, what about the rest of the team? Well, shit.

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

3 hours ago, immamac said:

Build a playoff team with decent QB then get big name QB in draft or buying them. 

Baker mayfield isn't even that good, but he has a good enough team around him. 

I think baker is better than you’re giving him credit for. At least when OBJ isn’t on the field for some unexplainable reason. 

2 hours ago, immamac said:

Yet the cowboys will miss the playoffs, likely due to self inflicted fuckups. 

I mean, you’re not wrong. I expect that’s how it’ll play out. Washington has a better coach than us and they’re just a qb away. NYG has a good defense, and if they finally stop fucking around and give daniel Jones a real life number one wr, they could unlock him. I bet Kenny Golladay goes to the giants.

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

Drafting Taco, Trysten Hill, keeping Tyrone Crawford, Jaylon Smith, LVE etc is what happened. Lots of flops on defense by the front office.

[futureman 22530]

was Taco a bad draft pick?  should we have taken someone else in that spot?

[Hate 20136]

was Taco a bad draft pick?  should we have taken someone else in that spot?

Usually, picking a taco is advised. In this case...not so much.

[Gene Parmesan 4014]

10 minutes ago, futureman said:

was Taco a bad draft pick?  should we have taken someone else in that spot?

Just throwing darts at a list of eligible names couldn't have been worse pick than Taco.  TJ Watt is the most often cited could have/should have face palm.

[futureman 22530]

1 minute ago, Gene Parmesan said:

Just throwing darts at a list of eligible names couldn't have been worse pick than Taco.  TJ Watt is the most often cited could have/should have face palm.

are you sure?

[Gene Parmesan 4014]

5 minutes ago, futureman said:

are you sure?

I was, but now you have me questioning everything I thought I knew.

[bullzak 422]

Over the last few years since Parcells the Cowboys have wasted some elite rosters with bad coaching. 

This roster isnt even elite but with McCarthy coaching it wont matter. Hes a meathead. 

Dak is good enough to do some damage if the team is a contender but that defense is dogshit and he cant fix that. Going to score some points though if he is upright. 

As for his cap hit a lot of buzz that the cap is about to explode so probably not that big a deal for an NFL starter. 

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

Only real question as far as players already in the building is if the team should pick up LVE's 5th year option and if Dallas is going to let Michael Gallup walk eventually. 

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

3 minutes ago, Loch Ness Monster said:

Only real question as far as players already in the building is if the team should pick up LVE's 5th year option and if Dallas is going to let Michael Gallup walk eventually. 

I don’t think there’s any question we’re letting Gallup walk. LVE is tricky. Someone mentioned maybe they should try to sign him long term at an injury risk discount right now. I don’t think that’s the worst idea idea in the world. 

[Catdaddyhorn 3447]

46 minutes ago, Loch Ness Monster said:

Only real question as far as players already in the building is if the team should pick up LVE's 5th year option and if Dallas is going to let Michael Gallup walk eventually. 

It would be great if we could trade Gallup to a team like maybe Miami or even Green Bay whose main WR (Adams) target is entering the last year of his contract rather than give him up for absolutely nothing. 

Edited March 10, 2021 by Catdaddyhorn

[Machinator 32099]

 

[futureman 22530]

what’s the status of aldon smith?

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

Jesus David Helman is so corny sometimes. “Let’s boogie”

[Trey3216 15352]

18 hours ago, immamac said:

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/nfl-quarterback-rankings-2019-best-worst-1-32/11p5evm1b6g0v1tbu8lvzo5rzq

There's 6 tiers

1. Elite - MVP candidates
2. Good AF but not MVP caliber
3. Maybe great, maybe not?
4. Solid, consistently good for a long time QB's
5. 2nd years trying to solidify starter roles
6. Shitters or olds

Dak sits firmly in the 3rd tier, and at the very bottom after the injury. He's not done anything great and now his leg got tiger woodsed (only half though) 

He's not worth 140M in Jerseys, merch, wins, nothing. He's not worth that kinda money especially when the jets have the 2nd overall pick and you can move up to get some great young star and bring in one of the other quarterbacks from the 4 or 2 tier which are basically going to be the same or better guaranteed for significantly less money. 

If Dak had won 4 or 5 playoff games by this time in his career I'd say fuck yeah lock this guy down it's fine tuning that isn't right. But this whole team is fucking detuned around 2 pretty "meh" overpayed guys in zeke and dak.

Fuck the cowboys man, I want to like them so much, but I just know there is 0 chance. 

@RGBIII I suggest you weed out the Cowboys from your commitment choices.

 

So much to unpack here.  WTF are you giving away to jump to the Jets’ pick?   2 #1’s and this year’s #2 more than likely.   Sounds like a fucktarded idea.  
 

 

[Machinator 32099]

 

[Machinator 32099]

 

[Trey3216 15352]

27 minutes ago, Machinator said:

 

They’ll also do Amari Cooper and Lawrence and have another $20mm-ish on top of that 

[Armybrat 40874]

[TonyTexas 10524]

Just keep kicking that can down the road, Jerrah

[Vic Mackey 47129]

 

[Vic Mackey 47129]

9 minutes ago, TonyTexas said:

Just keep kicking that can down the road, Jerrah

Nothing wrong with it. Get the best guys you can get in here to try and win and worry about the rest later. This isn't the MLB or NBA where you have a lot of time to build a core. The window in this league is extremely short.

[Viper 12111]

 

[TonyTexas 10524]

4 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

Nothing wrong with it. Get the best guys you can get in here to try and win and worry about the rest later. This isn't the MLB or NBA where you have a lot of time to build a core. The window in this league is extremely short.

I’m curious to know what makes you think the Cowboys have a window that they need to take advantage of. What has changed that puts them on the brink of a championship?

[LTtxfan 49331]

REVISED....

2021 Dallas Cowboys Draft Picks

• 1st: 10th overall
• 2nd: 44th overall
• 3rd: 75th overall
• 3rd: 99th overall (compensatory pick)
• 4th
• 4th: 138th overall (compensatory pick)
• 5th: 178th overall (compensatory pick)
• 6th
• 6th: 226th overall (compensatory pick)
• 7th

[LTtxfan 49331]

 

[futureman 22530]

1 minute ago, LTtxfan said:

 

read the thread, numbnuts. 

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

Draft is a long time away but if we stick at 10 Slater OT outta NW and Surtain the Bama CB are my two favorites. One concern with not going DB is you may end up with the next Chido in the 2nd round instead of a difference maker. Flip side is Tyron Smith is a big question mark moving forward.

People have been mentioning wanting to draft a damn TE at 10th overall (Pitts). No.

[Nicole44 22072]

I’m hoping with our new DC we will have better draft picks. We will need to hit in the later rounds. Though this is gonna be true for every team. We tend to suck beyond round three. Not always but mostly. 

[Patrick Bateman 3918]

2 hours ago, Loch Ness Monster said:

Draft is a long time away but if we stick at 10 Slater OT outta NW and Surtain the Bama CB are my two favorites. One concern with not going DB is you may end up with the next Chido in the 2nd round instead of a difference maker. Flip side is Tyron Smith is a big question mark moving forward.

People have been mentioning wanting to draft a damn TE at 10th overall (Pitts). No.

Pitts is going to be a monster, specifically in fantasy, but unfortunately the team has so many holes and TE isn't glaring if Jarwin gets back at full strength.  I wouldn't hate drafting him, but that would mean we should trade Gallup, which they maybe should do regardless.  One thing they need to really do at the TE position is resign Blake Bell.  Guy is a road grader of a blocker and really helped out on the edges.  Now pair him with a couple of competent OTs coming back and you can do some damage.  

This is a good question.  That would point to Surtain or Farley.  

On LVE.  I agree.  Not with his neck issues, so LB needs to be of note in the draft.

 

Edited March 11, 2021 by Patrick Bateman

[Hate 20136]

They signed Dak!!! What else do you need?