Dallas Cowboys 2021 Offseason Thread: Fuck It All

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

1 hour ago, Drew said:

 

Also remember 2017 Tyron missed 6 or so games, LG was a swinging door, and we had the great Chaz Green starting.  It wasn't a banner year either. The ONLY time they had a truly great OL was 2016.  2019 wasn't that bad, but Fred was obviously not where he was before after the Diagnosis.

The myth that Dak has ALWAYS had a great OL is the one that's false.  He's had decent to good ones to bad...but outside of 2016, it's never been great.

Same conversation, different day.

drew: the oline isn’t that good.

me: but PFF does this for a living and it’s been top 10 literally every season except last year throughout Dak’s career. You have to compare it to the other lines in the league.

drew: PFF ShmeFF. I trust my eyes more than PFF. Unless they fit my narrative of course. Then I agree with PFF. 
 

let me just save you a few keystrokes so we don’t clog up the thread with the exact same debate.

Edited April 12, 2021 by youdunnf'dup

[Catdaddyhorn 3444]

23 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

Same conversation, different day.

drew: the oline isn’t that good.

me: but PFF does this for a living and it’s been top 10 literally every season except last year throughout Dak’s career. You have to compare it to the other lines in the league.

drew: PFF ShmeFF. I trust my eyes more than PFF. Unless they fit my narrative of course. Then I agree with PFF. 
 

let me just save you a few keystrokes so we don’t clog up the thread with the exact same debate.

@youdunnf'dupHelp me out here. Every time I've seen you post those PFF Oline ratings I remember it being a preseason rating of what Olines are going to be the best for the upcoming season. I don't really remember you posting a post-season PFF rating. Obviously this subtle distinction matters because grades based on best case scenarios for the upcoming season as opposed to after-the-fact grades on what actually happened in the preceding year can tell 2 different stories. 

Edited April 12, 2021 by Catdaddyhorn

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

50 minutes ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

@youdunnf'dupHelp me out here. Every time I've seen you post those PFF Oline ratings I remember it being a preseason rating of what Olines are going to be the best for the upcoming season. I don't really remember you posting a post-season PFF rating. Obviously this subtle distinction matters because grades based on best case scenarios for the upcoming season as opposed to after-the-fact grades on what actually happened in the preceding year can tell 2 different stories. 

I don’t know if they do it weekly, or quarterly in the season (and I’m sure as shit not about to go digging right now), but PFF puts out their grades for how each unit does on both offense and defense. Then at the end of the year, they take their averages and give an end of season yearly ranking. Outside of last year, Dallas has consistently had a top 10 offensive line. Ask Russell Wilson what a shit offensive line looks like. Ask Matt Stafford what a shit offensive line looks like. Ask Watson. Hell, ask Andy Dalton last year what a shit offensive line looks like. Every oline has injuries, and nobody has depth on the oline. Great oline play is rare. Throughout most of Dak’s career, plenty of qbs and coaches would trade their oline situation for ours. That’s the main point I’m getting at in all of this. It’s never been “bad”, comparatively speaking, outside of last year.

[Catdaddyhorn 3444]

3 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

I don’t know if they do it weekly, or quarterly in the season (and I’m sure as shit not about to go digging right now), but PFF puts out their grades for how each unit does on both offense and defense. Then at the end of the year, they take their averages and give an end of season yearly ranking. Outside of last year, Dallas has consistently had a top 10 offensive line. Ask Russell Wilson what a shit offensive line looks like. Ask Matt Stafford what a shit offensive line looks like. Ask Watson. Hell, ask Andy Dalton last year what a shit offensive line looks like. Every oline has injuries, and nobody has depth on the oline. Great oline play is rare. Throughout most of Dak’s career, plenty of qbs and coaches would trade their oline situation for ours. That’s the main point I’m getting at in all of this. It’s never been “bad”, comparatively speaking, outside of last year.

2020 not in top 10 https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-final-2020-offensive-line-rankings

2019 #4 https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-offensive-line-rankings-following-2019-regular-season

2018 not in top 10 https://www.pff.com/news/pro-2018-nfl-offensive-line-rankings-all-32-teams-units-after-week-17

2017 #4 https://www.pff.com/news/pro-ranking-all-32-offensive-lines-from-the-2017-nfl-season

2016 #2 https://www.pff.com/news/pro-ranking-all-32-nfl-offensive-lines-this-season

 

[Coach pop a bitch 5459]

So jerry wants Kyle Pitts. Any other year I would love it but after going lamb last year and not helping out the secondary I'm not sure the defense can afford it. The best way to help dax is to build a solid D 

[Catdaddyhorn 3444]

Drafting Kyle Pitts is absolute malpractice, but we're used to that. Drafting him without the combo platter of a plan to trade away one of either Gallup or Amari in an effort to get extra picks and/or defensive players is an exercise in complete inanity,. 

Edited April 12, 2021 by Catdaddyhorn

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

30 minutes ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

2020 not in top 10 https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-final-2020-offensive-line-rankings

2019 #4 https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-offensive-line-rankings-following-2019-regular-season

2018 not in top 10 https://www.pff.com/news/pro-2018-nfl-offensive-line-rankings-all-32-teams-units-after-week-17

2017 #4 https://www.pff.com/news/pro-ranking-all-32-offensive-lines-from-the-2017-nfl-season

2016 #2 https://www.pff.com/news/pro-ranking-all-32-nfl-offensive-lines-this-season

 

My apologies. I was off by one year. Not sure why I remembered seeing them 9th in 2018. So 3 of 5 years they were top 5 (including 2017 and 2019 where we missed the playoffs), one year they were in the top half at 14, and last year they were dog shit like we all knew they were. My original point still stands. Outside of last year, it’s never been a bad offensive line. This idea that it has been anything other than a good offensive line (outside of last year) is just false when compared to the rest of the league. We have to stop comparing it to what it looked like in 2014 and 2016 and compare it to the rest of the league. 

Edited April 12, 2021 by youdunnf'dup

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

22 minutes ago, Coach pop a bitch said:

So jerry wants Kyle Pitts. Any other year I would love it but after going lamb last year and not helping out the secondary I'm not sure the defense can afford it. The best way to help dax is to build a solid D 

 

16 minutes ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

Drafting Kyle Pitts is absolute malpractice, but we're used to that. Drafting him without the combo platter of a plan to trade away one of either Gallup or Amari in an effort to get extra picks and/or defensive players is an exercise in complete inanity,. 

Jags-Lawrence 

Jets-Wilson

49ers-Jones

Falcons-Fields

Bengals-Sewell

Dolphins-Chase

Lions-Slater

Panthers-Waddle

Broncos-Surtain

Dallas-???

 

Dont you almost have to take Pitts there? You’d think we could trade out of that pick with Trey Lance still on the board, but what if you can’t? Reach for Horn or Parsons? Because if you can’t trade out of that pick in this scenario, you’re picking between those 3 guys. Pitts is CLEARLY the best player on the board in that scenario. Hope he goes before we pick so we don’t have to make that decision, but I don’t think the scenario I just listed is that crazy...

 

[Catdaddyhorn 3444]

1 minute ago, youdunnf'dup said:

 

Jags-Lawrence 

Jets-Wilson

49ers-Jones

Falcons-Fields

Bengals-Sewell

Dolphins-Chase

Lions-Slater

Panthers-Waddle

Broncos-Surtain

Dallas-???

 

Dont you almost have to take Pitts there? You’d think we could trade out of that pick with Trey Lance still on the board, but what if you can’t? Reach for Horn or Parsons? Because if you can’t trade out of that pick in this scenario, you’re picking between those 3 guys. Pitts is CLEARLY the best player on the board in that scenario. Hope he goes before we pick so we don’t have to make that decision, but I don’t think the scenario I just listed is that crazy...

 

Yeah in that specific scenario with no option to trade out you make the pick. And honestly you probably make the pick regardless of whether you can trade out, but with Pitts now in the fold you do everything you can to exchange Gallup or Cooper for defensive help. What absolutely shouldn't happen is the Cowboys trading up to get yet another pass catcher. 

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

2 minutes ago, Dr. Beeper said:

Fuck no. You trade down. 

Lol did you read my post? I said if you can’t trade down. If nobody wants to trade up you can’t trade down. Unless you’re willing to give up the 10th pick for pennies on the dollar. Is that what you were saying they should do in that situation? Just give up 10th pick for the 26th pick and a bag of balls? 

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

2 minutes ago, Dr. Beeper said:

That’s a really dumbass hypothetical. You can always trade down. Particularly when a universally beloved prospect like Pitts comes along. 

Jesus fucking Christ. You’ve now either ducked two questions or you didn’t read either. First I say what if you can’t trade down and you don’t answer. Then I say what if you don’t get good value, aka would you trade down for pennies on the dollar. You ducked that question too. How about just say you don’t have a good answer or answer either fucking question lol. Because it’s a realistic possibility whether you like it or not. 

[Catdaddyhorn 3444]

17 minutes ago, Dr. Beeper said:

That’s a really dumbass hypothetical. You can always trade down. Particularly when a universally beloved prospect like Pitts comes along. 

No actually there's a been a paradigm shift in the recent past. Bob Sturm wrote an article detailing just how much more difficult and less fruitful in terms of returning assets trading down has become over the past 5 or 6 drafts. Unless there's a well regarded QB in the mix (not sure that Trey Lance qualifies) the return has diminished. 

Edited April 13, 2021 by Catdaddyhorn

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

Think there's only 13 or so true blue chippers in the draft (mostly offense). Would probably hang in there and take the best non-QB on the board rather then getting stuck with a guy that's 50/50 to be meh in the late 1st and then only picking up a 2nd rounder. Something like 66% of 2nd rounders end up being busts so that wouldn't entice me enough.

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

3 minutes ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

No actually there's a been a paradigm shift in the recent past. Bob Sturm wrote an article detailing just how much more difficult and less fruitful in terms of returning assets trading down has become over the past 5 or 6 drafts. Unless there's a well regarded QB in the mix (not sure that Trey Lance qualifies) the return has diminished. 

We got trade raped when we traded down with the 49ers back in ‘13. If we didn’t luck out and draft Travis Fredrick, that would’ve been a god awful trade. But it’s just a ridiculous scenario according to Doc. Even though it’s happened with our own team before lol. As soon as I saw his response I don’t know why I took the bait. 

[Patrick Bateman 3911]

3 hours ago, youdunnf'dup said:

 

Jags-Lawrence 

Jets-Wilson

49ers-Jones

Falcons-Fields

Bengals-Sewell

Dolphins-Chase

Lions-Slater

Panthers-Waddle

Broncos-Surtain

Dallas-???

 

Dont you almost have to take Pitts there? You’d think we could trade out of that pick with Trey Lance still on the board, but what if you can’t? Reach for Horn or Parsons? Because if you can’t trade out of that pick in this scenario, you’re picking between those 3 guys. Pitts is CLEARLY the best player on the board in that scenario. Hope he goes before we pick so we don’t have to make that decision, but I don’t think the scenario I just listed is that crazy...

 

With Lance on the board, it'd be difficult to imagine a scenario where teams aren't trying to trade up, the question would be how far does Dallas want to fall back?  Directly behind us are two NFC East teams (NY and Philly), at 13 SD doesn't need a QB.  If Pitts is there, is SD tempted?  We could trade back to 13 and then take Horn or Darrisaw, who ever is left at 13.  Minnesota at 14 and NE at 15 both probably would be interested if Lance fell.  But at 15, who would be there?  Maybe Darrisaw.  Other guy to consider is the Edge rusher, Ojulari.  But knowing Dallas, they would look at Jaelan Phillips because he's an injury risk.  The other idea is to trade back around 20 and take Farley.

However, in your scenario, you have to make a pick at 10, then you take Pitts and don't think twice.  Pitts is an elite prospect vs Horn, who is a very good prospect.

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

18 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

With Lance on the board, it'd be difficult to imagine a scenario where teams aren't trying to trade up, the question would be how far does Dallas want to fall back?  Directly behind us are two NFC East teams (NY and Philly), at 13 SD doesn't need a QB.  If Pitts is there, is SD tempted?  We could trade back to 13 and then take Horn or Darrisaw, who ever is left at 13.  Minnesota at 14 and NE at 15 both probably would be interested if Lance fell.  But at 15, who would be there?  Maybe Darrisaw.  Other guy to consider is the Edge rusher, Ojulari.  But knowing Dallas, they would look at Jaelan Phillips because he's an injury risk.  The other idea is to trade back around 20 and take Farley.

However, in your scenario, you have to make a pick at 10, then you take Pitts and don't think twice.  Pitts is an elite prospect vs Horn, who is a very good prospect.

For the record, I do agree with the bold. You should be able to get a decent haul for a qb prospect like Lance. I could easily see us fucking it up though and not getting the right amount of value. And if that’s what’s going to happen I’d rather just say fuck it and take Pitts. Let’s put it that way. 

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

Idk guys like Travis Kelce, George Kittle, Gronk help take teams to Super Bowls. Not saying Kyle Pitts will be those guys but that's the ultimate dream. A guy that DBs are too small to cover and LBs are too slow.

If an Aaron Donald or Jalen Ramsey was there at 10 sure take that guy but there's not many elite defensive prospects this year. 

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

If Dallas goes defense at 10 it will probably be CB. Sort of a mixed bag if you look at recent history.

DBs that have gone 7-15 overall in the last 10 drafts: CJ Henderson, Minkah Fitzpatrick, Malik Hooker, Marshon Lattimore, Eli Apple, Vernon Hargreaves, Karl Joseph, Trae Waynes, Justin Gilbert, Kyle Fuller, Dee Milliner, DJ Hayden, Kenny Vaccaro, Mark Barron, Stephon Gillmore 

[kevwun 15774]

9 hours ago, Loch Ness Monster said:

Idk guys like Travis Kelce, George Kittle, Gronk help take teams to Super Bowls. Not saying Kyle Pitts will be those guys but that's the ultimate dream. A guy that DBs are too small to cover and LBs are too slow.

If an Aaron Donald or Jalen Ramsey was there at 10 sure take that guy but there's not many elite defensive prospects this year. 

Dak's gonna throw for 400 a game and they'll finish 8-8 at best because they can't stop the other team from scoring.

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

8 hours ago, Loch Ness Monster said:

If Dallas goes defense at 10 it will probably be CB. Sort of a mixed bag if you look at recent history.

DBs that have gone 7-15 overall in the last 10 drafts: CJ Henderson, Minkah Fitzpatrick, Malik Hooker, Marshon Lattimore, Eli Apple, Vernon Hargreaves, Karl Joseph, Trae Waynes, Justin Gilbert, Kyle Fuller, Dee Milliner, DJ Hayden, Kenny Vaccaro, Mark Barron, Stephon Gillmore 

Shit, look at Jeff Okudah last year. Number 3 overall pick, everyone’s number one corner by a wide margin heading into the draft, and I definitely wouldn’t trade Diggs for him straight up. 

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

1 hour ago, kevwun said:

Dak's gonna throw for 400 a game and they'll finish 8-8 at best because they can't stop the other team from scoring.

Not sure a Surtain II or Horn really changes that in 2021. Rookie corners usually struggle.

If the Cowboys managed the salary cap well they could have added a few starters without injury concerns to the defense in FA so could definitely go BPA. Still not sure that means we should take a lesser talent just because he fits a big need. The draft is a total crapshoot so would be careful being desperate. 

[DougO 5243]

I'm not gonna say the Cowboys should definitely not take any particular position player at 10. But a 10 isn't a 20. You have pick 10 you better fucking nail it, it better be a player worthy of 10 that going to be a stud for your team for many years, not a reach or cutesy pick. All the QBs play so much in their favor that the 10 they have is almost like a 5. Don't blow it, Jerry.

[Pam Cummings 9640]

On 4/12/2021 at 11:51 PM, Loch Ness Monster said:

Idk guys like Travis Kelce, George Kittle, Gronk help take teams to Super Bowls. Not saying Kyle Pitts will be those guys but that's the ultimate dream. A guy that DBs are too small to cover and LBs are too slow.

If an Aaron Donald or Jalen Ramsey was there at 10 sure take that guy but there's not many elite defensive prospects this year. 

Kelce- drafted in the 3rd round

Kittle- drafted in the 5th round

Gronk- fucking second rounder

 

 

I feel like i'm living in crazy land with everyone talking about drafting Pitts that high. That's fucking madness.

[irishtexan 11518]

It doesn't matter because there's no way in hell Pitts falls to 10. Everyone's talking about Pitts being the Chase Young of this draft in that he's as close to a sure thing as exists. Who knows if that will happen, but that's the buzz. The concern is that Jerry pulls a Jerry and trades a second round pick to move up four spots to take him. That's the nightmare scenario.

It seems relatively simple, if Surtain is there, you take him. If he's gone, you pick Slater. If both are gone, you take Horn. Anyone else that isn't a receiver (which we absolutely can't draft) and who plays a position of need is probably a reach at 10

[UTDD 362]

On 4/12/2021 at 5:44 PM, Catdaddyhorn said:

2020 not in top 10 https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-final-2020-offensive-line-rankings

2019 #4 https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-offensive-line-rankings-following-2019-regular-season

2018 not in top 10 https://www.pff.com/news/pro-2018-nfl-offensive-line-rankings-all-32-teams-units-after-week-17

2017 #4 https://www.pff.com/news/pro-ranking-all-32-offensive-lines-from-the-2017-nfl-season

2016 #2 https://www.pff.com/news/pro-ranking-all-32-nfl-offensive-lines-this-season

 

These rankings kind of make sense to me based on gut feel and observation.  Last year was a nightmare, but I thought 2019 was a very troubling year overall because I felt a lot of good pieces were there to do well as a team.  I had hoped a new coach was a good fix...but even so, I have no blame for 2020 at all (well...shitty defensive coaching) versus 2019.  I think the luxury of the line for some years has made some fans not appreciate what an average offensive line really is...or way below average.  I'd love the Cowboys to nail a good OL with a pick, I don't think the health/age issues are small concerns anymore.

About Pitts, who knows but reports are multiple teams have him at #2 on their Boards.  I doubt he makes it to the 10th pick, but of course could I see Jerry trading up...

[LTtxfan 49173]

1 hour ago, irishtexan said:

It doesn't matter because there's no way in hell Pitts falls to 10. Everyone's talking about Pitts being the Chase Young of this draft in that he's as close to a sure thing as exists. Who knows if that will happen, but that's the buzz. The concern is that Jerry pulls a Jerry and trades a second round pick to move up four spots to take him. That's the nightmare scenario.

It seems relatively simple, if Surtain is there, you take him. If he's gone, you pick Slater. If both are gone, you take Horn. Anyone else that isn't a receiver (which we absolutely can't draft) and who plays a position of need is probably a reach at 10

SIAP... Heard a scenario of Dallas trading back to #15 pick with New England if early part of draft is all offensive... hopefully add a couple more picks including a 2nd rounder

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

Jerry is crazy but I seriously doubt he trades up from 10 this year. 

I would be most excited about Slater/Surtain but its easy to imagine a scenario where an offensive weapon is the highest rated player on the board. Then you would be forced to take a slightly lower talent if you wanted defense, possibly trade down if someone wants a QB.

[irishtexan 11518]

18 minutes ago, LTtxfan said:

SIAP... Heard a scenario of Dallas trading back to #15 pick with New England if early part of draft is all offensive... hopefully add a couple more picks including a 2nd rounder

Dropping from 10-15 probably means none of your top realistic targets will be available, as Surtain, Horn, and Slater will all probably be gone by 15. In that scenario, you're choosing between the tier 2 CBs, the tier 2 OL, rolling the dice with Farley's back, taking a chance on one of the DE/Edge guys - all of whom seem to have some question marks - or taking one of the LBs like Mikah Parsons or Zaven Collins. Maybe it's worth it depending on how you have these guys graded? But I'd be pretty confident that I got a good player that can come in and contribute immediately with Surtain, Horn, or Slater, and I don't have the same confidence in anyone else that can be realistically got at 15. And considering our draft history with Round 2/3 players, an extra 2 doesn't seem worth the drop-off in talent from 10-15. 

Edited April 14, 2021 by irishtexan

[boilerhorn 1375]

I scanned a few mock drafts and have summarized the projected Dallas pick and the Pitts pick.

Of the 11 drafts, Pitts is drafted outside the top 10 3 times.  Dallas picks Surtain 6 times, Slater 2 times, Horn 2 times, and Javon Holland 1 time.  Dallas selects Pitts 0 times, which means its a virtual certainty .

To me, the only certain pick is Lawrence at #1.  Aside from that, the "insiders" are guessing just as much as we are.

ESPN - Kiper

• 4: Miami (via trade) - Kyle Pitts
• 10: Patriots (via trade w/ Dallas) - Justin Fields
• 15: Dallas - Jaycee Horn, CB

ESPN - Tannenbaum

• 10: Dallas - Patrick Surtain II
• 12: Eagles - Kyle Pitts

ESPN - McShay

• 4: Atlanta - Kyle Pitts
• 10: Dallas - Jaycee Horn (Surtain taken at 8, Fields drops to 11)

NFL.com Zierlein

• 6: Eagles - Kyle Pitts
• 10: Dallas - Rashawn Slater, T, Northwestern

NFL.com Maurice Jones-Drew

• 10: Dallas - Jevon Holland, S, Oregon
• 15: Patriots - Kyle Pitts

NFL.com Chad Reuter

• 4: Atlanta - Kyle Pitts
• 10: Dallas - Patrick Surtain II

The Sporting News

• 10: Dallas - Patrick Surtian II
• 12: Eagles - Kyle Pitts

CBS Sports

• 6: Miami - Kyle Pitts
• 10: Dallas - Patrick Surtain II

Walter Football

• 4: Atlanta - Kyle Pitts
• 10: Dallas - Patrick Surtain II

The Athletic

• 6: Miami - Kyle Pitts
• 10: Dallas - Patrick Surtain II

TD Wire

• 6: Miami - Kyle Pitts
• 10: Dallas - Rashawn Slater, T, Northwestern

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

Maurice Jones-Drew must be on drugs

[DougO 5243]

95 percent of those "insider" guys are just posers who read from the same cheat sheets and the same goofy fake draft guru blogs.

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

Man, if we could get kiper’s scenario and end up with Horn that would be pretty sick. You’d have to get a good haul for a qb trade up in the top 10 so if we did AND got Horn that’s easily best case scenario. Again, hopefully Miami or Atlanta just takes Pitts so we don’t have to cross that bridge. 

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

Could have seen Horn lasting until 15 before the Caleb Farley injury concerns. Wouldn't touch Farley with a 10 foot pole. Back injuries never get better. 

[Patrick Bateman 3911]

4 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

SIAP... Heard a scenario of Dallas trading back to #15 pick with New England if early part of draft is all offensive... hopefully add a couple more picks including a 2nd rounder

That's from Kiper.

5 hours ago, irishtexan said:

It doesn't matter because there's no way in hell Pitts falls to 10. Everyone's talking about Pitts being the Chase Young of this draft in that he's as close to a sure thing as exists. Who knows if that will happen, but that's the buzz. The concern is that Jerry pulls a Jerry and trades a second round pick to move up four spots to take him. That's the nightmare scenario.

It seems relatively simple, if Surtain is there, you take him. If he's gone, you pick Slater. If both are gone, you take Horn. Anyone else that isn't a receiver (which we absolutely can't draft) and who plays a position of need is probably a reach at 10

Agreed.  Not against taking Pitts (folks who look at him as a conventional TE and not more of a WR playing TE, probably were cheering the Zeke pick), but in no way do you move up for him.  

 

4 hours ago, irishtexan said:

Dropping from 10-15 probably means none of your top realistic targets will be available, as Surtain, Horn, and Slater will all probably be gone by 15. In that scenario, you're choosing between the tier 2 CBs, the tier 2 OL, rolling the dice with Farley's back, taking a chance on one of the DE/Edge guys - all of whom seem to have some question marks - or taking one of the LBs like Mikah Parsons or Zaven Collins. Maybe it's worth it depending on how you have these guys graded? But I'd be pretty confident that I got a good player that can come in and contribute immediately with Surtain, Horn, or Slater, and I don't have the same confidence in anyone else that can be realistically got at 15. And considering our draft history with Round 2/3 players, an extra 2 doesn't seem worth the drop-off in talent from 10-15. 

Horn isn't really considered in that elite grouping so if the WRs all fall then moving to 15 for Darrisaw or Edge isn't a terrible idea.  Horn was considered a teens/20ish guy until about 2 weeks ago with Farley's back issues making him fall and Horn was considered the 3rd best CB and mocks project needs most of all.  

So much anxiety is put into the first round selection, folks often forget there's tons of other picks and Dallas hasn't been hitting on a lot of them.  Brugler says we draft another safety which is sort of weird since we just signed 2 (1 hybrid) and drafted another last year.

 

[Machinator 32099]

 

[LTtxfan 49173]

Blogging The Boys article for pick #44 possibility...

Syracuse Ifeatu Melifonwu

https://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2021/4/14/22382724/why-ifeatu-melifonwu-could-be-the-answer-at-pick-44-for-the-cowboys-in-the-draft

 

[LTtxfan 49173]

Skipping offseason program could be costly for some Dallas Cowboys

Apr 13, 2021.  Todd ArcherESPN Staff Writer

FRISCO, Texas -- If the NFL Players Association has its way, 18 Dallas Cowboys could have to forfeit a little more than $5 million in base salary in 2021.

Last week, Cleveland Browns center JC Tretter, the NFLPA president, urged players to skip the voluntary offseason programs that begin next week across the league.

If that were to happen, quarterback Dak Prescott, defensive end DeMarcus Lawrence, receiver Amari Cooper, running back Ezekiel Elliott, linebacker Jaylon Smith, guard Zack Martin and tackles Tyron Smith and La'el Collins could have to forfeit $500,000 each from their base salary because of a de-escalator for missing at least 84.375% of the Cowboys' offseason program.

Prescott, who signed a four-year, $160 million deal that included a record $66 million signing bonus, has a $9 million base salary.

Tight end Blake Jarwin, linebacker Tarell Basham and cornerbacks Anthony Brown and Jourdan Lewis have $250,000 de-escalators. Kicker Greg Zuerlein, cornerback C.J. Goodwin, tackle Ty Nsekhe and defensive ends Brent Urban and Carlos Watkins have $100,000 de-escalators. Safety Darian Thompson has a $50,000 de-escalator.

Defensive end Randy Gregory doesn't have a de-escalator like the other 18 players, but would forfeit the $180,000 offseason workout bonus that is part of the one-year extension he signed last year.

The only part of the NFL offseason that is mandatory is the June minicamp. Traditionally, the Cowboys have had near 100% attendance at the voluntary program, in part because almost all of the players live in the area all year.

Tretter wrote on the NFLPA website, "many of the changes this past year -- like no in-person offseason workouts/practices, the extended acclimation period before training camp and no preseason games -- gave us a year of data that demonstrates maintaining some of these changes long-term is in the best interest of the game."

The NFL moved to a virtual offseason program last year because of the coronavirus pandemic.

Phase I of the offseason program begins Monday, and players will be allowed to work out at the team facilities in small groups under the COVID-19 protocols. In a memo to the teams last month, the NFL said meetings early in the offseason program will continue to be virtual, but it does not anticipate an entirely virtual offseason program in 2021.

A plan for in-person, on-field work -- such as organized team activities and the minicamp -- has not been agreed to as of yet.

[Loch Ness Monster 3533]

IF the Cowboys trade down Zaven Collins could be the target. Rumors they have a 1st round grade on him. 

[DougO 5243]

I respect Kiper because he watches his own tape, gathers his own info, and doesn't give a rat's ass about anyone else's mocks. He projects what he projects on his own.

He's sometimes way off, but he's doin' his own work, and he's an encyclopedia of draft knowledge and a lot more. I like hearing him talk, even on occasions when he's full of shit. Most other guys are just looking over someone else's shoulder or using special insider access to get info, which is often misinformation, as well.

I just wish he would move to the NFL Network and replace that douche Jeremiah, and fill the huge void in draft coverage that Mayock left.

[LTtxfan 49173]

1 hour ago, DougO said:

I respect Kiper because he watches his own tape, gathers his own info, and doesn't give a rat's ass about anyone else's mocks. He projects what he projects on his own.

He's sometimes way off, but he's doin' his own work, and he's an encyclopedia of draft knowledge and a lot more. I like hearing him talk, even on occasions when he's full of shit. Most other guys are just looking over someone else's shoulder or using special insider access to get info, which is often misinformation, as well.

I just wish he would move to the NFL Network and replace that douche Jeremiah, and fill the huge void in draft coverage that Mayock left.

Mock Drafts are always interesting... I especially enjoy the player rankings of different experts including Kiper's Top 300.

Found Kiper's most recent Top 10 Player Rankings

• 1. Trevor Lawrence, QB, Clemson
• 2. Kyle Pitts, TE, Florida
• 3. DeVonta Smith, WR, Alabama
• 4. Ja'Marr Chase, WR, LSU
• 5. Jaylen Waddle, WR, Alabama
• 6. Justin Fields, QB, Ohio State
• 7. Zach Wilson, QB, BYU
• 8. Penei Sewell, OT, Oregon
• 9. Rashawn Slater, OL, Northwestern
• 10. Alijah Vera-Tucker, OL, USC

 

Edited April 16, 2021 by LTtxfan

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

I have a gut feeling Fields goes #1

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

29 minutes ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

I have a gut feeling Fields goes #1

Lol what? The jags have already given Lawrence the playbook. Do you mean 3rd?

[Patrick Bateman 3911]

32 minutes ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

I have a gut feeling Fields goes #1

Probably just indigestion....

 

[EvilCaseMcCoy 691]

12 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

Lol what? The jags have already given Lawrence the playbook. Do you mean 3rd?

He didn't learnt it good enough.  Just rumors y'all.

[Gigglebush 107]

On 4/14/2021 at 1:40 PM, Loch Ness Monster said:

Could have seen Horn lasting until 15 before the Caleb Farley injury concerns. Wouldn't touch Farley with a 10 foot pole. Back injuries never get better. 

Serious back injuries are the reason Gronk fell all the way to the Patriots in round 2. He was able to play 4 years before his next back injury and that one wasn't season ending. Farley's a risk for sure but I'd bet he'll have a long career in the league.

Edited April 16, 2021 by Gigglebush

[Mileslong 4727]

Think there's only 13 or so true blue chippers in the draft (mostly offense). Would probably hang in there and take the best non-QB on the board rather then getting stuck with a guy that's 50/50 to be meh in the late 1st and then only picking up a 2nd rounder. Something like 66% of 2nd rounders end up being busts so that wouldn't entice me enough.

This is the prudent thing to do. I’ve never thought the Cowboys were good enough in rounds 2 and 3 to acquire multiple picks there while passing on a first rounder that could help immediately.

Pittsburgh and Baltimore almost always stay put and take the best player at the position they need and they are constantly competitive.

Stay put and take Slater or Surtain, if they are gone, take the next highest player on their board sans QB and move on. Moving down for multiple 3rd, 4th and 5th round picks in the future is maddening.

[futureman 22453]

10 hours ago, EvilCaseMcCoy said:

He didn't learnt it good enough.  Just rumors y'all.

I mean, Fields and Urban do have a history. 

[Patrick Bateman 3911]

Interesting comp.

Uhm..... we should be on the phone with Hurst's agent right now.

 

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

2 hours ago, Mileslong said:

This is the prudent thing to do. I’ve never thought the Cowboys were good enough in rounds 2 and 3 to acquire multiple picks there while passing on a first rounder that could help immediately.

Pittsburgh and Baltimore almost always stay put and take the best player at the position they need and they are constantly competitive.

Stay put and take Slater or Surtain, if they are gone, take the next highest player on their board sans QB and move on. Moving down for multiple 3rd, 4th and 5th round picks in the future is maddening.

I feel like we’re pretty damn good in the 3rd round. We generally suck in round 2 but round 3 is a money spot for us most years 

[Patrick Bateman 3911]

4 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

I feel like we’re pretty damn good in the 3rd round. We generally suck in round 2 but round 3 is a money spot for us most years 

We're slightly above average in the 3rd, I'd say, if it's last decade.  Longer than that (say 20 years )and it gets worse overall although getting a top 5 TE in NFL history helps. 

Last 10 years:

Gallimore (who knows)

C McGovern (who knows)

Gallup (Yes, please)

Jourdan Lewis (meh)

Maliek Collins (eh)

Chaz Green (Okay, this doesn't look good)

Terrence Williams (not bad)

JJ Wilcox (meh)

Ty Crawford (strong pick)

DeMarco (nice pick)

 

So probably too early to judge Gallimore or McGovern, but wins are Gallup, TWill, Crawford and DeMarco.  Shitty picks are Chaz Green (who was heavily criticized on draft day), JJ Wilcox, M Collins (he was good for like half a season once).  Lewis is TBD maybe.  He started out well and has gotten worse.  Is that scheme or just can't play?