87th Texas Legislature

[Anastasis 23394]

5 hours ago, JimmyJames said:

I’d rate him a slight net positive for the board given his clear vaccine positions

The only meritorious posts I make are on the food threads. 

[tantric superman 4667]

8 hours ago, HRSchenker said:

What's the bill number for the legislation that caused the Dems to flee?

I think it was more of a rule, not a bill.

[JimmyJames 12271]

1 minute ago, Anastasis said:

The only meritorious posts I make are on the food threads. 

Well I’ll have to check those out then as I believe I’m a pretty good chef. 

[Anastasis 23394]

5 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Well I’ll have to check those out then as I believe I’m a pretty good chef. 

You should check out the other subs on this board from time to time. 

[JimmyJames 12271]

Just now, Anastasis said:

You should check out the other subs on this board from time to time. 

You are correct sir. 

[hobbes2702 12847]

10 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

The only meritorious posts I make are on the food threads. 

Can confirm. The chili always makes me envious 

[Anastasis 23394]

Just now, hobbes2702 said:

Can confirm. The chili always makes me envious 

 @jimmyjazz posts on that topic should be bookmarked. 

[hobbes2702 12847]

Just now, Anastasis said:

 @jimmyjazz posts on that topic should be bookmarked. 

They really should be permanently plastered at the top of that forum.

[jimmyjazz 45560]

I'm pretty sure there are a couple of dozen folks on surly that can make a better pot of red than I can.  I'm just trying to get better.

[workswithseed 2037]

17 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

I'm pretty sure there are a couple of dozen folks on surly that can make a better pot of red than I can.  I'm just trying to get better.

Snowdog hasn't been around that I've noticed, so you're a good contender.

[StassneyHorn 6540]

13 hours ago, Anastasis said:

@StassneyHorn you are inside baseball right? Would be interested in hearing your perspective as you unpack what is happening here with sb3 in the context of HB 3979?

To be blunt I haven’t spent much time thinking about it. Not so much worried about restrictions on what teachers can say/do or the ineffectual consequences of the bill, but what the textbook end product looks like. No administrator is going to waste time shadowing teachers speech for the most part so imo there isnt much teeth to this, but it does make fun headlines.

[tx 3 putt 76409]

10 minutes ago, StassneyHorn said:

No administrator is going to waste time shadowing teachers speech for the most part so imo there isnt much teeth to this, but it does make fun headlines.

 

it'll make great headlines come an election year 

[washparkhorn 9935]

42 minutes ago, StassneyHorn said:

To be blunt I haven’t spent much time thinking about it. Not so much worried about restrictions on what teachers can say/do or the ineffectual consequences of the bill, but what the textbook end product looks like. No administrator is going to waste time shadowing teachers speech for the most part so imo there isnt much teeth to this, but it does make fun headlines.

I wouldn't be concerned with most administrators if I was a teacher in Texas.

The karens are the problem - and they will be out in force on Nextdoor, facebook and in school board meetings. 

[Anastasis 23394]

1 hour ago, StassneyHorn said:

To be blunt I haven’t spent much time thinking about it. Not so much worried about restrictions on what teachers can say/do or the ineffectual consequences of the bill, but what the textbook end product looks like. No administrator is going to waste time shadowing teachers speech for the most part so imo there isnt much teeth to this, but it does make fun headlines.

I guess I was getting more at the arguments around the legislative intent of SB3 as a "clean up" bill to fix the overly detailed specifications included in HB 3979, which was passed earlier in the session. That bill made very specific and untenable requirements applicable to each grade level's curriculum.  So the Republicans needed to pass a shitty clean up SB to fix their shitty HB, incompetence on top of incompetence, shooting themselves in the face with headlines that they are removing MLK from the curriculum in the process (They also removed George Washington and Thomas Jefferson). 

This thread details what I was getting at...

Quote

 

Peter A. Shulman 

@pashulman

When Texas Republicans passed their H.B. 3979, they tried to balance it’s misguided awfulness—and assuage critics—with a list of *positive* civil rights topics for teachers to continue to teach. It’s a good list! https://legiscan.com/TX/text/HB3979/2021…

Peter A. Shulman 

@pashulman

It’s also a ridiculously detailed and lengthy list in an already-confusing bill. Is every social studies class in Texas supposed to include every name, document, & event—in this bill? Does it supplement existing state standards? What gets cut to make room? Why these & not others?

Peter A. Shulman 

@pashulman

Obviously, this was a poorly thought out way to make social studies curricula. It’s bad for schools & teachers and a bad precedent for the future. Set aside that Texas’s school curricula are already highly centralized & politicized. At least they are made through a known process.

Peter A. Shulman 

@pashulman

So now Texas Republican are trying to pull the excessive details from state law. And it looks like they are trying to remove teaching about civil rights itself. They’re not, but they have only themselves to blame for this situation This is what moral panic creates.

 

 

[atomheartbevo 89452]

They are still going to tailor it so that kids aren't taught about the whole slave thing with the Confederacy and the original Anglo Texans. 

[bolverk 29405]

@AnastasisI get where you're coming from on not wanting the legislation to be too proscriptive. It's a decent argument, one that I largely agree with.

But we also know how text books are selected by the partisan State Board of Education, an elected body with no shortage of kooks that has a history of making some seriously retrograde decisions. By explicitly eliminating some important topics from the Senate version, I fear that it will empower the kooks to intentionally exclude them from the next round of text books the state purchases. And, it's certainly fair to think the publishers might just go ahead and now omit many of those topics so they don't have to go round and round in an expensive/inflammatory selection process. It's going to be a shit show anyway; it already is. But, as we are wont to do in this state, this will only make things work.

Earlier I read a short article praising this little YouTube (yeah, I know but hopefully at least one poster will watch @workswithseed) history series covering little known stories in the US and decided to check a few out. It's low budget and I'm not sold on the guy's delivery, but this series of short 5-6 minute clips gives a nice little overview about the history of fucked up text books.

(Btw, for whatever reason, this guy looks a lot like how I've always imagined you to be. /no homo)

Spoiler

 

 

 

 

 

 

[wildcat09 29261]

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

I guess I was getting more at the arguments around the legislative intent of SB3 as a "clean up" bill to fix the overly detailed specifications included in HB 3979, which was passed earlier in the session. That bill made very specific and untenable requirements applicable to each grade level's curriculum.  So the Republicans needed to pass a shitty clean up SB to fix their shitty HB, incompetence on top of incompetence, shooting themselves in the face with headlines that they are removing MLK from the curriculum in the process (They also removed George Washington and Thomas Jefferson). 

This thread details what I was getting at...

 

Boooooooo posting tweets.

[workswithseed 2037]

I like this guy, @bolverk. He doesse pretty funny shit to the asshole neo Confederates.

[Guest Lobo]

I think The Japanese had better general officers (Navy & Army) than the United States did.  But when you're fighting on the side of evil, I think that kinda washes out tactical superiority.  Man, southerners really cling to some bizarre shit.  

[bolverk 29405]

13 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

I like this guy, @bolverk. He doesse pretty funny shit to the asshole neo Confederates.

49 minutes!?!?

 

[NameAlreadyInUse 5106]

On 7/17/2021 at 10:15 PM, Anastasis said:

I am not sure what is hard to understand.  My starting point was a statement that I wish we could try to do something more substantive, maybe actually discuss the text of the bill. I posted the full text of SB3.  I was asked about the prohibition section, and I then marked up the parts that I do and do not take issue with, and those parts that are concerning and require closer inspection. I am not sure why that resulted in you accusing me of duplicity and half ass retracting it when you saw your error, but here we are. I got not problem with you NAIU, just be less reactive. 

I was reacting to the part where you said something to the effect of, if you don't like it, you should leave the state.  Try to be less inflammatory in your statements if you want me to be less reactive.  Now, I may not have taken that to be quite so inflammatory had I not missed your caveats the first time through, and that's the reason that I retracted that part of the post.  I still don't understand why you went hard in the love it or leave it paint when you seem to have many of your own misgivings about the bill.  And that's what I was looking for you to flesh out.

Also, not sure how I feel about local control on this.  I didn't get an education on evolution until college because local control meant my honors biology teacher could unilaterally decide based on her religion what was worthy of study in our biology textbook and what wasn't.  And she did decide that evolution wasn't real so we were going to skip that section.  And she told us were were skipping for that reason, so we got less teaching and some baptist proselytizing for good measure.  

[MissingInAction 24824]

3 hours ago, washparkhorn said:

I wouldn't be concerned with most administrators if I was a teacher in Texas.

The karens are the problem - and they will be out in force on Nextdoor, facebook and in school board meetings. 

Exactly. I know three former teachers and all of them quit within two years of getting their degrees because the parents are just fucking terrible.

[bolverk 29405]

3 minutes ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

Also, not sure how I feel about local control on this.  I didn't get an education on evolution until college because local control meant my honors biology teacher could unilaterally decide based on her religion what was worthy of study in our biology textbook and what wasn't.  And she did decide that evolution wasn't real so we were going to skip that section.  And she told us were were skipping for that reason, so we got less teaching and some baptist proselytizing for good measure.  

Having also attended high school in West Texas (you're from the South Plains area, right?), that is exactly how my biology teacher handled not teaching evolution. He came right out and said we were skipping the chapter.

[Anastasis 23394]

3 minutes ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

I was reacting to the part where you said something to the effect of, if you don't like it, you should leave the state....I still don't understand why you went hard in the love it or leave it paint when you seem to have many of your own misgivings about the bill.  And that's what I was looking for you to flesh out.

What I said was "If an individual finds prohibiting teaching these things in public school offensive, it's better off for all of us that that individual resides in another state." I don't think that that was going too hard to the paint, and these were the specific prohibitions I was referencing and quoted.  But I understand that the post didn't land.      

(i)  one race or sex is inherently superior to another race or sex;

(ii)  an individual, by virtue of the individual's race or sex, is inherently racist, sexist, or oppressive, whether consciously or unconsciously;

(iii)  an individual should be discriminated against or receive adverse treatment solely or partly because of the individual's race or sex;

(iv)  an individual's moral character, standing, or worth is necessarily determined by the individual's race or sex;

(v)  an individual, by virtue of the individual's race or sex, bears responsibility for actions committed in the past by other members of the same race or sex;

(vi)  an individual should feel discomfort, guilt, anguish, or any other form of psychological distress on account of the individual's race or sex;

 

16 minutes ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

Also, not sure how I feel about local control on this.  I didn't get an education on evolution until college because local control meant my honors biology teacher could unilaterally decide based on her religion what was worthy of study in our biology textbook and what wasn't.  And she did decide that evolution wasn't real so we were going to skip that section.  And she told us were were skipping for that reason, so we got less teaching and some baptist proselytizing for good measure.  

I hear you.  So what is the right level where that curriculum is hashed out.  It's not the individual classroom teacher for examples such as the one your provide, it's not the lege or the SBOE for reasons that other's have articulated, so where? I think that the sweet spot is at the school district level.  Probably not perfect and you can get a district that goes flat earth on you, but seems like the best compromise.  

[bolverk 29405]

18 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

I hear you.  So what is the right level where that curriculum is hashed out.  It's not the individual classroom teacher for examples such as the one your provide, it's not the lege or the SBOE for reasons that other's have articulated, so where? I think that the sweet spot is at the school district level.  Probably not perfect and you can get a district that goes flat earth on you, but seems like the best compromise.  

For better or worse, our federal constitutional framework leaves educational policy at the state level. If I were to reform how instructional materials were handled, I'd probably not have a partisan education board selected through elections like we have now - not sure in the least how that's managed. It's kind of liked the fucked up system of electing judges and sheriffs, which should be reserved for another thread.

I'm not sure how you fix it though other than strip the SBOE from its power to pick books and have a failsafe in there to blunt the influence of folks who continue to elect these dimwits. I know that doesn't sound very democratic, but we're already seeing how local elections are becoming increasingly partisan and radicalized, because it takes so few votes and so little money, that we're electing fitlumps and Karens across the state.

My preference would be to have some sort of committee comprised of a mixture of higher education experts in their respective subject matter alongside public school teachers all selected by their peers to determine an appropriate curriculum done through the TEA and whatever its equivalent is at the higher ed level. I guess the SBOE could still be elected, but their oversight on curriculum would be diminished while still retaining their general administrative oversight capacity.

I dunno. It's the end of the day. I'm tired and am all out of ideas.

[NameAlreadyInUse 5106]

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

I hear you.  So what is the right level where that curriculum is hashed out.  It's not the individual classroom teacher for examples such as the one your provide, it's not the lege or the SBOE for reasons that other's have articulated, so where? I think that the sweet spot is at the school district level.  Probably not perfect and you can get a district that goes flat earth on you, but seems like the best compromise.  

That seems fair to me most of the time.  I'm certain the school board in my hometown would've had something to say about the biology teacher if they knew about it, but I'm also certain that most of the kids in my class didn't tell their parents about it because a) less work, and b) parents went to the same church and agreed with the teacher, so they likely never knew about it.  However, with the groups trying to radicalize small town councils and school boards, I don't know if long term even that is the right strategy.  

As to the other, water under the dam.

[atomheartbevo 89452]

2 hours ago, workswithseed said:

I like this guy, @bolverk. He doesse pretty funny shit to the asshole neo Confederates.

Yeah, he's very funny at times and loves to shit on the neo-Confederates/Lost Cause types.  It pisses them off, because he's fascinated with the Confederacy and has talked about it quite a bit.

Last year he did a Q&A and people lost their shit in the comments, because somebody asked what he thought of the secession movement in the 1860s and what he thinks of it now, and he talked about how he thought it was incredibly fucking stupid for them to secede.

He has some good New Orleans history stuff.  His videos about being a tour guide in NO match up with the tour we did.

[workswithseed 2037]

2 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Yeah, he's very funny at times and loves to shit on the neo-Confederates/Lost Cause types.  It pisses them off, because he's fascinated with the Confederacy and has talked about it quite a bit.

Last year he did a Q&A and people lost their shit in the comments, because somebody asked what he thought of the secession movement in the 1860s and what he thinks of it now, and he talked about how he thought it was incredibly fucking stupid for them to secede.

He has some good New Orleans history stuff.  His videos about being a tour guide in NO match up with the tour we did.

His witch hunter stuff might be the funniest stuff on his channel the though. All are sinners and will likely go to hell, especially if you worship that pagan holiday called Christmas.

[Bullneck 18987]

16 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

They are still going to tailor it so that kids aren't taught about the whole slave thing with the Confederacy and the original Anglo Texans. 

Quote

Texas Senate Bill Drops Teaching Requirement That Ku Klux Klan Is ‘Morally Wrong’

Eliminated requirements also include the writings of Martin Luther King Jr., United Farm Workers leader Cesar Chavez and suffragist Susan B. Anthony.

 

[Neonmoon 38127]

[4th&Five 41461]

 

[atomheartbevo 89452]

Holy fuck this state is so fucking embarrassing.

Good job Texas, you've passed up Florida, Ohio, Oklahoma, and Alabama.  All you need to do is elect a child molester to a statewide position, and the journey is complete.

[NameAlreadyInUse 5106]

50 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Holy fuck this state is so fucking embarrassing.

Good job Texas, you've passed up Florida, Ohio, Oklahoma, and Alabama.  All you need to do is elect a child molester to a statewide position, and the journey is complete.

I'm pretty sure we've already fucked around and done that too, we're just waiting to find out.

[Brisketexan 104629]

57 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Holy fuck this state is so fucking embarrassing.

Good job Texas, you've passed up Florida, Ohio, Oklahoma, and Alabama.  All you need to do is elect a child molester to a statewide position, and the journey is complete.

I've said it before, but it continues to bear repeating: we've made it rather clear that we're just Mississippi with oil.

 

EDIT: and better food.  We've definitely got better food.

Edited July 20, 2021 by Brisketexan

[NameAlreadyInUse 5106]

What, you don't like shitty tamales cooked in paper?

[atomheartbevo 89452]

Honestly, this is a really good thing for them to fuck around with right now.  You would think they would lay low after the 2020 election since it was the logical thing to do and just punt this to the next legislature in 2023 (the Texas legislature only meets every two years for you out-of-staters), but no, they are putting themselves on everybody's radar and saying the quiet things out loud.

This is getting a lot of attention, and not the kind of attention they want.

It may not cost the Rs any statewide positions, but it's driving the kind of anger that could easily cost them legislature and Congressional seats.

[Ghost of LL 15492]

So with the Legislature's funding running out on September 1--and that includes all legislative staff, LBB and Legislative Council--has anybody given any thought as to how they're actually going to do redistricting?

[StassneyHorn 6540]

Census numbers should be in by Aug 16th for redistricting. First point of bipartisan business should be making Abbott take an L on staff pay

Edited July 27, 2021 by StassneyHorn

[hookemATL 11611]

There are so many people that work for legislative support agencies that busted their tits during a terrible session, only to have their livelihoods threatened by Wheels McCuntface and the rest of the GOP goon squad. Even if it doesn’t come to be and funding is restored, it just pisses me the fuck off that they could be so callous toward the folks that do the actually nitty gritty work that makes tx lege function. 
 

May they all EABOD, choke, then die. 

[Celery Man 20886]

 

[Brisketexan 104629]

 

Our state government is actively trying to be the worst in the nation. Because that’s how you own tha libz, who expect things like “human decency” and “competence.” Man, that’ll show em!

[Js1 85115]

So the Texas Dems headed back to DC?

At this point, just keep denying the quorum. 

[NameAlreadyInUse 5106]

I mean they committed to that path awhile ago I would think.  

[StassneyHorn 6540]

Census numbers should be coming out within 10 days for redistricting 

[softlynow 1784]

1 hour ago, Celery Man said:

 

No agenda item on requiring daycare staff and librarians to carry two types of semi-automatic firearm and a clip point Bowie knife while on duty. This is pussy RINO shit. 

[ChuckNorrisActionJeans 2659]

Phew....for a second there, I thought we were done dunking on trans kids and turning our attention to critical infrastructure.

[High Plains Drifter 10978]

1 hour ago, StassneyHorn said:

Census numbers should be coming out within 10 days for redistricting 

 

So what happens if there is still no quorum? How does redistricting go then? Anybody?

[Ghost of LL 15492]

34 minutes ago, High Plains Drifter said:

 

So what happens if there is still no quorum? How does redistricting go then? Anybody?

Fuck the quorum.  How do you do redistricting with no legislative staff, since Abbott so wisely vetoed the Legislature's budget?

If Abbott doesn't give a clean call for Article X appropriation and redistricting, that issue is going to be resolved by the courts.

[Updawg 2261]

Phew....for a second there, I thought we were done dunking on trans kids and turning our attention to critical infrastructure.

Not as long as there are libs to own

[High Plains Drifter 10978]

 

 

Which court(s)? Federal, state, district, Tx supreme?