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All Encompassing Mortgage and Real Estate Thread

UTPhil2006

By UTPhil2006
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Chewbacca

Chewbacca 7773

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Is anyone in this thread deeply involved with the purchase and/or development of multi-family housing? I’m interested to getting some perspective from people who work in it every day. There might be some benefits for anyone that is willing to give me a few minutes to discuss it.
Yes. What do you want to know?
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mchookem
mchookem

alrighty...i haven't wanted to jinx anything so i've been pretty quiet... but we just closed on our new home in Denver this morning so i can now officially say YEAH! 😃 in a nutshell - we sold

Esque
Esque

Thank you for this - gave me a good laugh.  But also a good reminder of how the general public does not understand what is going on in real estate and thus why so many get caught offsides when the tid

Neonmoon
Neonmoon

Realtor: You should list your house at 500K Client: But three houses down the street sold for 700K Realtor: Yeah, but those are overvalued due to pandemic Fed policy and institutional invest

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Sbbruin

Sbbruin 21842

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Posted (edited)
50 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

Is anyone in this thread deeply involved with the purchase and/or development of multi-family housing? I’m interested to getting some perspective from people who work in it every day. There might be some benefits for anyone that is willing to give me a few minutes to discuss it.

Why yes.  We are putting together a syndicate right now.  please email me your questions to sucker@ponzi.net 

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Sbbruin

Sbbruin 21842

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On 7/15/2020 at 1:33 PM, Wulaw Horn said:

This is funny- I read the first paragraph and thought to myself- I can’t believe this is Quicken and doesn’t involve someone at UWM. Then I kept reading and saw it was the UWM ceo that fucked her and started laughing. 
Those guys hate each other. This sheds a little light I guess. 

BTW, Theresa Niemiec:

spacer.png

Would, of course.

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drewlaws

drewlaws 126

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Signed on my 3% refi with Phil/Thad/Danna this week. They did my loan when I bought the home last August when another lender was struggling with my unique SE income. I'm a PITA to deal with so kudos to them for working with me twice in a year.

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UTPhil2006

UTPhil2006 3807

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On 7/16/2020 at 9:28 PM, drewlaws said:

Signed on my 3% refi with Phil/Thad/Danna this week. They did my loan when I bought the home last August when another lender was struggling with my unique SE income. I'm a PITA to deal with so kudos to them for working with me twice in a year.

Thanks bud.  When and if the Astros let us in again I'll buy you another beer pregame again.

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UTPhil2006

UTPhil2006 3807

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3 minutes ago, Captainant said:

at this point yall will need to buy a whole section to celebrate all the loans and homes yall have closed during the pandemic

Literally just said to Thad on Saturday we're gonna have to go on tour all over the state to buy beers/tickets for everyone we've done since we last did Prodigy Happy Hours in December

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ZB'Tejas

ZB'Tejas 593

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2 minutes ago, UTPhil2006 said:

Literally just said to Thad on Saturday we're gonna have to go on tour all over the state to buy beers/tickets for everyone we've done since we last did Prodigy Happy Hours in December

Agree! Mark me down as another satisfied repeat customer. Thanks to Phil, Thad and Danna for helping me take advantage of these great rates and locking in some serious savings.

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UTPhil2006

UTPhil2006 3807

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1 hour ago, ZB'Tejas said:

Agree! Mark me down as another satisfied repeat customer. Thanks to Phil, Thad and Danna for helping me take advantage of these great rates and locking in some serious savings.

Yeah Jumbo rates are phenomenal right now with that Lender.. glad we could get you locked in.

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BradInATX

BradInATX 9208

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Not sure if this is the place, but I have some random moving questions

- Moving a 3500 sqft house, is $2,000 about the right price for a mover? Have received two quotes in that ballpark, like both companies, just want to make sure it's a reasonable price.

- What would I expect to pay for a sprinkler system for a back and front yard that probably total about 1/3 acre? Installed, including one area that is completely surrounded by concrete (inside of a circle drive). Assuming there wasn't PVC run through the driveway in advance.

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TKthunder2

TKthunder2 4989

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3 hours ago, TKthunder2 said:

Anyone have a good contractor that would be willing to quote work on a remodel in Austin?
 

FYI my first offer that we were contingent on just came back to us while we’re still waiting to hear back on #2.

And offer #2 was accepted.  So now we have 5 days to figure out wtf we are doing...

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19069

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1 hour ago, Enchubben said:

my builder's preferred lender offering 2.85 on 30 year fixed. Bananas.  

That’s a pretty good price for a builders lender. I’d do 2.75 likely for you today, but that would be without the goodies a builder kicks in to deal with his lender. 
they charging you an my points or origination?  
I assume you are talking 30 year. If 15 that’s a shit deal. 

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Enchubben

Enchubben 5510

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1 hour ago, Wulaw Horn said:

That’s a pretty good price for a builders lender. I’d do 2.75 likely for you today, but that would be without the goodies a builder kicks in to deal with his lender. 
they charging you an my points or origination?  
I assume you are talking 30 year. If 15 that’s a shit deal. 

Yea 30 years. $3k coming from lender and $5k coming from builder to use this bank without charging any points. I was surprised because a month ago she quoted me 3.25% and I told her I would be shopping that around.

$1425 in origination fees. Even with that, $8k goes a long way.

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19069

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3 minutes ago, Enchubben said:

Yea 30 years. $3k coming from lender and $5k coming from builder to use this bank without charging any points. I was surprised because a month ago she quoted me 3.25% and I told her I would be shopping that around.

$1425 in origination fees. Even with that, $8k goes a long way.

That’s pretty good. In realm of preferred builder lender it’s amazing. 

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Murfdogg21

Murfdogg21 4412

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Is there a simple equation to estimate total costs (“closing costs”) on a new or refi at whatever the current advertised rates are? And is there anyway to accurately estimate how many points above the advertised rate you’d have to go in order to have a zero cost loan?

I bothered Thad on this for about two weeks on my refi by going back and forth a hundred times whenever the rates changed a hair. It would’ve been easier to just track myself and then reach out to pull the trigger. 

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UTPhil2006

UTPhil2006 3807

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11 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

Any advice on the Rockport Tx market??

What about it?

 

7 hours ago, Frieda’s Boss said:

This question is relevant to my interests as well. Would be a refi

 

25 minutes ago, ZB'Tejas said:
10 hours ago, Horns99 said:

 


What are the jumbo rates now?

 

 

7 hours ago, Frieda’s Boss said:

This question is relevant to my interests as well. Would be a refi

My Jumbo refi I just closed on was 3.5%

Depends on LTV and credit mostly, but this is where we are mainly quoting at 3.5%

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UTPhil2006

UTPhil2006 3807

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10 hours ago, Murfdogg21 said:

Is there a simple equation to estimate total costs (“closing costs”) on a new or refi at whatever the current advertised rates are? And is there anyway to accurately estimate how many points above the advertised rate you’d have to go in order to have a zero cost loan?

I bothered Thad on this for about two weeks on my refi by going back and forth a hundred times whenever the rates changed a hair. It would’ve been easier to just track myself and then reach out to pull the trigger. 

Depends on Escrow vs. no Escrow as escrowing right now is collecting 9-10 months so there's a lot being rolled in that will be eventually refunded (minus 2 months), so prepaids are a bit higher at this part of the year.  As far as true closing costs (UW, Title, Appraisal, etc) there's not necessarily a general percentage.  On a 300k loan it looks to be about ~4000 or so.  That also fluctuates on how recent the refinance was (title doesn't charge as much if the refinance or purchase previous was done recently).  There is no tried and true origination/points to cover costs method as each lender's backside credit is going to be different.  One lender may really want to sell a 2.99 vs one lender may want to move 3.125's and the back end would be different on those where the origination comes into play.  Plus the compound interest on taking a higher rate will end up costing more in the long run.

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hornian

hornian 5212

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I bought a new house before we moved/listed our old house (both in Austin, moving to 78731 from 78759). In case anyone is wondering what the Austin Real Estate market is like right now:

Wound up doing a jumbo mortgage on new house, because rates were so low it wasn't worth trying to do a 2nd mortgage to get to conforming and then pay off when we sold old home - I had 20% without the sale of that house so just planning to use funds from sale of old home to do projects on new house and pay off some higher interest rate debt. Got a great rate - tried to get Phil/Thad my business on that one, but they were honest that they couldn't touch the rate with their lenders. I appreciate that honesty.

Officially closed on new house on Monday of last week, moved on Thursday (still not completely moved out - stuff left in garage at old house we are getting a little at a time). Listed old house on Friday 7/17 (that was a beast getting it ready to show the day after a move) for a price that was a little under the appraised value (we have a recent appraisal for a HELOC before we knew we were going to be moving). Realtor hosted open house on Saturday 7/18. Had multiple offers by Sunday 7/19. Realtor told everyone to get highest/best offer in by 6:00 p.m. Monday 7/20.

We wound up with a total of 6 offers, all at or over asking. Several of them were cash offers, all were fairly quick close.

Officially under contract as of about 9:00 a.m. on 7/21 for about 105% of asking price (and a little over our recent appraisal - so we had an appraisal waiver be part of the deal). We also had house pre-insepcted and said we aren't making any repairs, it truly is as-is. 

So, my anecdotal experience is that it's still a seller's market, at least in NW Austin. 

Now I'm already spending the money from the sale of my old house on a huge landscaping project (cleared about a 1/4 acre of cedars and scrub brush, going to terrace and make backyard more usable) before I even have it - always a smart idea. 

Edited by hornian
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hornian

hornian 5212

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39 minutes ago, ZB'Tejas said:

Not just NW Austin... a house over here in East Austin was just redone (really nice btw) and listed at just below 1M. It had 20 showings in the first day and 14 offers by the next day. 5 of those cash offers and several above list.

I don't even know how many showings we had over the weekend (not counting open house). Our neighbors told us there were cars lined up (because only one showing in house at a time due to COVID) all day Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. 

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Gil Bang

Gil Bang 25944

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On 7/20/2020 at 8:44 PM, Murfdogg21 said:

Is there a simple equation to estimate total costs (“closing costs”) on a new or refi at whatever the current advertised rates are? And is there anyway to accurately estimate how many points above the advertised rate you’d have to go in order to have a zero cost loan?

I bothered Thad on this for about two weeks on my refi by going back and forth a hundred times whenever the rates changed a hair. It would’ve been easier to just track myself and then reach out to pull the trigger. 

There are calculators out there.   The one that I  use is provided by a title co and it's CA only. 

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aggie08

aggie08 21497

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53 minutes ago, hornian said:

I don't even know how many showings we had over the weekend (not counting open house). Our neighbors told us there were cars lined up (because only one showing in house at a time due to COVID) all day Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. 

I wonder how much of the surge is directly COVID-related.  Like pools and RV sales, everyone is trying to improve their quality of life while socially "isolated".  A lot of people whose houses are starting to feel mighty small, myself included.

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19069

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18 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

I wonder how much of the surge is directly COVID-related.  Like pools and RV sales, everyone is trying to improve their quality of life while socially "isolated".  A lot of people whose houses are starting to feel mighty small, myself included.

Yep. I think this is completely going on in a lot of places. And also I think there are a fair amount of sellers not necessarily wanting to put house on the market right now with Covid. It’s led to an inventory problem in a lot of areas we are dealing with. 

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19069

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On 7/20/2020 at 11:44 PM, Murfdogg21 said:

Is there a simple equation to estimate total costs (“closing costs”) on a new or refi at whatever the current advertised rates are? And is there anyway to accurately estimate how many points above the advertised rate you’d have to go in order to have a zero cost loan?

I bothered Thad on this for about two weeks on my refi by going back and forth a hundred times whenever the rates changed a hair. It would’ve been easier to just track myself and then reach out to pull the trigger. 

This is horseshoes and hand grenades for Texas and it can break down at super high yields to lenders on the backside but this is what I’d say:

3500-4500 closing costs depending on if we can get an appraisal waiver and price of the loan (and decency of the loan) for title. 
 

typically (and this isn’t always the case but it’s typical) every time I move you up 1/8 of a point I get 50 extra bips from my lender. So, that means if you have a $400,000 loan I’m going to move you up 1/4 of a point to pay for all your costs. 
mid you have a $200,000 loan I’m going to move you up 1/2 a point. 
If you tell me that you want to pay me points for the absolute lowest rate I’m going to try to talk you out of it, and if I can’t I’m going to charge you about 2% as an up front fee and then I’m going to lower your rate 1/2 a point and you get the money at the same price I borrow it at. 
All figures there are roughly speaking, but that’s about what the going rate is for money. 
Also, there’s usually a big flashing blinking light that says- price it here stupid. 
Example from the other day- 2.5% paying back 50 bips, 2.625 paying 90 bips, 2.75 paying 208 bips. I’m pricing a no points no help for you with closing costs all day long at 2.75. Of

you are looking to pay points on this I’d literally jump in front of you as tell you- No, don’t do that. 
To finish that chart- 2.875 was paying 245 bips and 3.0 was paying 285 or 290 bips. 
then 3.125 was paying 330 bips 3.25 was paying 335 bips and 3.375 was paying 350 bips. There is, in that chart, no value to locking a deal at 3.25 or 3.5- doesn’t move the needle enough on money back to the customer to make up for a higher interest rate. 
rates that make sense in this scenario would be:

2.5 paying 1.5 discount points

2.75- no points- no fees

3.0% and I will pay you 100 bips in closing costs

3.125 and I will pay you 150 bips on closing costs. 
I wouldn’t do 2.625, 2.875 or anything above 3.125- none of those made any mathematical sense on the pricing matrix. 
this is me- we work off 200 bips. Many lenders work off 250 or 300 bips so they’d move the pricing up the scale 1/8-3/8 of a point respectively, but there will still be an obvious mathematical stay away zone on the rate sheet, for, reasons like what Phil said. 
and that’s a peak behind the curtain to see how the mortgage world works. 

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horncyclist

horncyclist 1387

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I'm still looking at doing a cash-out refinance. Every lender I've talked to has said that points are required for a cash out right now. So I'm looking at 3.375 plus $4700 in points. My questions to the Surly mortgage wizards....is this what you're seeing on cash out? Are banks just viewing these as riskier so are making sure the'yre getting paid? Have you ever seen this before? When I was looking at this before, the cash out versus straight refinance difference was an eight to a quarter of a percentage point. 

Final question. Do you see rates staying low? The points required were $12000 three weeks ago, $4700 now but with so much economic uncertainty I could see that changing again.

Wish we were in a different situation to take advantage of of the lower rates but we need the cash to pay off a HELOC so a straight refi isn't an option. On the plus side, by paying off the HELOC, I'm cutting the I'm paying on the total home debt substantially so the break even point ends up only being about two years out. This is is a good deal for us but would rather have the $4700 in my pocket instead of the lender.

 

 

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19069

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4 hours ago, horncyclist said:

I'm still looking at doing a cash-out refinance. Every lender I've talked to has said that points are required for a cash out right now. So I'm looking at 3.375 plus $4700 in points. My questions to the Surly mortgage wizards....is this what you're seeing on cash out? Are banks just viewing these as riskier so are making sure the'yre getting paid? Have you ever seen this before? When I was looking at this before, the cash out versus straight refinance difference was an eight to a quarter of a percentage point. 

Final question. Do you see rates staying low? The points required were $12000 three weeks ago, $4700 now but with so much economic uncertainty I could see that changing again.

Wish we were in a different situation to take advantage of of the lower rates but we need the cash to pay off a HELOC so a straight refi isn't an option. On the plus side, by paying off the HELOC, I'm cutting the I'm paying on the total home debt substantially so the break even point ends up only being about two years out. This is is a good deal for us but would rather have the $4700 in my pocket instead of the lender.

 

 

 No. Unless you have low credit

score or maybe a little loan thy doesn’t make sense (or a jumbo loan could be a factor)

 

just did a 30 year cash out no points at 3.125 today for a well qualified borrower. 
also- that amount of points seems very excessive- unless you are going to be there forever and you know that take the higher rate. Even if you are going to be there forever it might make sense to do a cash out now without points and in exactly a year refinance that into a rate term. 
I’m of the opinion rates are going to be low until we get a vaccine or cure or herd immunity for the ‘Roma,  but if I knew that for sure I’d be on a beach retired instead of slogging away at a day job. 

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UTPhil2006

UTPhil2006 3807

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4 hours ago, horncyclist said:

I'm still looking at doing a cash-out refinance. Every lender I've talked to has said that points are required for a cash out right now. So I'm looking at 3.375 plus $4700 in points. My questions to the Surly mortgage wizards....is this what you're seeing on cash out? Are banks just viewing these as riskier so are making sure the'yre getting paid? Have you ever seen this before? When I was looking at this before, the cash out versus straight refinance difference was an eight to a quarter of a percentage point. 

Final question. Do you see rates staying low? The points required were $12000 three weeks ago, $4700 now but with so much economic uncertainty I could see that changing again.

Wish we were in a different situation to take advantage of of the lower rates but we need the cash to pay off a HELOC so a straight refi isn't an option. On the plus side, by paying off the HELOC, I'm cutting the I'm paying on the total home debt substantially so the break even point ends up only being about two years out. This is is a good deal for us but would rather have the $4700 in my pocket instead of the lender.

 

 

How long has this cash out with this lender been going?  Looking back it looks like you started it in March at 3.75.. just making sure this guy isn't jerking you around.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45899

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11 hours ago, hornian said:

Officially under contract as of about 9:00 a.m. on 7/21 for about 105% of asking price (and a little over our recent appraisal

If you don't mind me asking, how did that appraisal compare to the TCAD appraisal for the property?  (I do understand that the two can be far apart.)

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hornian

hornian 5212

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1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

If you don't mind me asking, how did that appraisal compare to the TCAD appraisal for the property?  (I do understand that the two can be far apart.)

I contest my TCAD appraisal every year, so, you know, I keep that low on purpose. 

Let me put it this way - my TCAD appraisal this past year was $16K above what I purchased it for 5 years ago. The appraisal I had done recently was $145K above what I paid for it 5 years ago. So there was a a pretty wide difference. 

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 45899

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Same here.  My appraisal this year was flat, and up 4.5% the year prior, but in general I've done a pretty good job at keeping the assessment down.

I'm just wondering if there is an impending crash coming, and where homeowners are seeing sales prices VS the only widely available "appraisal".

I can't believe prices have held up, to be honest.  I've been a homeowner in Austin since 1989, save 1 year, and I've seen a bunch of dips.  Almost all of them came ahead of obvious economic downturns.  This time it seems like prices are almost immune to what's going on, and frankly, I'm very skeptical.

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