Daily Texan: UHS moves to provide hormone replacement therapy, LGBTQ students keep up the pressure

[Johnny Sack 8397]

Just now, David Dennison said:

Which is exactly why we don't put issues that affect minority groups up to a popular vote.

Did you not read the thread?  Troph claimed society agreed with zer

[troph 24916]

28 minutes ago, slorch said:

If you put public funding of tranny conversion and hormone therapies to a popular vote, there is zero chance it would prevail.

Nor would public funding of ED pills, I’m not asking for public funding. I’m saying your views about trans issues is in the minority.  

[David Dennison 18993]

 

2 minutes ago, slorch said:

I wasn't suggesting a vote. either.

 

Troph said my views are outdated and dwindling.  'tis false.

 

They might still be held by the majority, but they are, in fact, outdated and dwindling.

That's a good thing!

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

You're still paying for a ton of stuff you don't want to pay for. 

I have to pay taxes.

Where I work is my choice.

 

Why you cannot discern between the two situations is not my problem.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

 

They might still be held by the majority, but they are, in fact, outdated and dwindling.

That's a good thing!

That's why this horseshit rolled in Travis County...the eastern most province of California.

 

you motherfuckers keep celebrating the destruction of shit that works.  before long, we'll be broke economically like those sumbeeches.

Edited April 30, 2018 by slorch

[David Dennison 18993]

Just now, slorch said:

I have to pay taxes.

Where I work is my choice.

Why you cannot discern between the two situations is not my problem.

Why can't you understand that your taxes aren't paying for this?

[Guest]

1 minute ago, David Dennison said:

Why can't you understand that your taxes aren't paying for this?

UT isn't publicly funded?  health services costs on campus are not subsidized by public monies?

low income students don't receive public monies while attending UT?

[David Dennison 18993]

1 minute ago, slorch said:

UT isn't publicly funded?  health services costs on campus are not subsidized by public monies?

low income students don't receive public monies while attending UT?

Sure it is. That doesn't mean this particular treatment is publicly funded.

But beyond that, are you saying you don't want your taxes to go toward anything you disagree with politically?

 

[Celery Man 21021]

20 minutes ago, slorch said:

I have to pay taxes.

Where I work is my choice.

 

Why you cannot discern between the two situations is not my problem.

Apparently it is

[troph 24916]

Do you think new civil rights laws are needed to reduce discrimination against lesbian,
gay, bisexual or transgender people, or not?

51 Yes, new laws needed
46 No, not needed
3 No opinion
Gallup May 3-May 7, 2017

Do you think public schools should allow transgender students to use bathrooms and locker rooms that are consistent with the gender they identify with or don’t you think so?

48 Yes/Should
45 No/Should not
8 Don’t know/No answer
Quinnipiac University March 2-March 6, 2017

Do you think more acceptance of transgender people would be a good thing for the country, a bad thing for the country, or do you think that it would not make much difference either way?

41 Good thing
14 Bad thing
42 Not much difference
3 Don’t know/No answer
Quinnipiac University March 2-March 6, 2017

Just your impression, in the United States today, is there a lot of discrimination
against…transgender people, or not?

64 Yes, there is a lot of discrimination
30 No, not a lot of discrimination
6 Don’t know/Refused
PRRI February 10-February 19, 2017

Do you strongly favor, favor, oppose or strongly oppose…laws that require transgender
individuals to use bathrooms that correspond to their sex at birth rather than their
current gender identity?

19 Strongly favor
20 Favor
22 Oppose
31 Strongly oppose
8 Don’t know/Refused
PRRI February 10-February 19, 2017

Do you strongly favor, favor, oppose or strongly oppose…laws that would protect gay,
lesbian, bisexual, and transgender people against discrimination in jobs, public
accommodations, and housing?

42 Strongly favor
28 Favor
11 Oppose
15 Strongly oppose
5 Don’t know/Refused
PRRI February 10-February 19, 2017

Now, as I read some statements on a few different topics, please tell me if you completely
agree, mostly agree, mostly disagree or completely disagree with each one….Bullying of
gay, lesbian, and transgender teenagers is a major problem in our schools…Do you
completely agree, mostly agree, mostly disagree or completely disagree?

35 Completely agree
30 Mostly agree
18 Mostly disagree
11 Completely disagree
6 Don’t know/Refused
PRRI February 10-February 19, 2017

Now, as I read some statements on a few different topics, please tell me if you completely
agree, mostly agree, mostly disagree or completely disagree with each one….Legal
protections that apply to gay and lesbian people should also apply to transgender
people…Do you completely agree, mostly agree, mostly disagree or completely disagree?

43 Completely agree
30 Mostly agree
10 Mostly disagree
12 Completely disagree
5 Don’t know/Refused
PRRI February 10-February 19, 2017

if you had to choose, which comes closest to your view? Transgender people should be allowed to use the public restrooms of the gender with which they currently identify,
required to use the public restrooms of the gender they were born into

51 Allowed to use the public restrooms of the gender with which they currently identify
46 Required to use the public restrooms of the gender they were born into
3 No answer
Pew Research Center for the People & the Press, August 16-September 12, 2016

Now, we would like to get your views on some issues that are being discussed in the
country today. Do you strongly favor, favor, oppose, or strongly oppose…laws that would
protect gay, lesbian, bisexual, and transgender people against discrimination in jobs,
public accommodations, and housing?

38 Strongly favor
34 Favor
13 Oppose
10 Strongly oppose
5 Don’t know/Refused
PRRI August 10-August 16, 2016

Now, we would like to get your views on some issues that are being discussed in the
country today. Do you strongly favor, favor, oppose, or strongly oppose…laws that
require transgender individuals to use bathrooms that correspond to their sex at birth
rather than their current gender identity?

15 Strongly favor
20 Favor
23 Oppose
30 Strongly oppose
12 Don’t know/Refused
PRRI August 10-August 16, 2016

http://pollsandvotes.com/PaV/2017/07/recent-polling-transgender-issues/

Edited April 30, 2018 by troph

[NameAlreadyInUse 5132]

 

3 hours ago, Caddox said:

So you're going with "I don't believe you." Good talk. 

Yes, until you prove otherwise.  I've played this game before when it was me in the hot seat instead of Troph.  The language you used to begin your post is the exact language I've heard about myself for years from people who were not going to be happy until I was either dead, in jail or converted to straightness.  If your wording was just an unfortunate coincidence then I'm prepared to adjust my opinion, but I'm not there yet.  Would you like to clarify what you meant?

[El Diablo 4232]

8 hours ago, futureman said:

this is a question of mental health.  what we should be doing is providing counseling and psychotherapy to these people instead of trying to turn biology on its head by throwing hormones at them.  

Dr. Futureman has spoken. Medical professionals care primarily about outcomes. Guess which route provides the best outcome for the patient? Guess which provides the most cost effective outcome for the patient and the provider?

[NameAlreadyInUse 5132]

2 hours ago, slorch said:

Not true.

 

The dispute is what I should be on the hook for financially.

 

IDGAF about what you or anyone else wants to call themselves.  Do it on your own fucking dime.

 

Just like everything else right now, this is not about freedom.  It's about extracting some sick sense of "retribution" against people who might disagree.  

 

Do whatever the fuck you want.  Don't tell me to pay for it.

And how, exactly, are you on the hook?  #1, you never went to UT so you never paid the fees as part of your tuition, and #2, you aren't sending your kids to UT.  And if I listen to you and stop treating for something so you don't have to pay for it, does that mean I should also stop treating everything else because some Christian Scientist is up in arms that he's paying for medical treatments for others?  Or mental health services because Tom Cruise and his merry band of Scientologists think they are full of shit?

Why do you get to draw the line on what you are willing to pay for and the rest of us don't?

Edited April 30, 2018 by NameAlreadyInUse
fuckup

[El Diablo 4232]

8 minutes ago, El Diablo said:

Dr. Futureman has spoken. Medical professionals care primarily about outcomes. Guess which route provides the best outcome for the patient? Guess which provides the most cost effective outcome for the patient and the provider?

More to my point...If someone thinks they're a refrigerator you could spend countless hours and dollars trying to convince them that they're not a refrigerator. OR you could just use them to store food in. 

 

Uh, something like that.

[troph 24916]

Yeah you just went off the rails Diablo... I mean you didn’t say dolphin or giraffe but seriously a fucking refrigerator?  They don’t have tits and ass so why the heck would anyone want to be one?

[futureman 22562]

so do y’all think we should be amputating limbs from people with body integrity identity disorder or that we should counsel them?

[Johnny Sack 8397]

I think we should try and help those with gender identity issues.  But does anyone know what is effective?

If someone wants to transition to a gender and can do it in a way that helps them, let’s do it.  

We should also consider helping their loved ones. It has to be devastating to their parents, siblings and kids. Maybe more societal acceptance can lessen that. 

[troph 24916]

3 minutes ago, futureman said:

so do y’all think we should be amputating limbs from people with body integrity identity disorder or that we should counsel them?

Unrelated issue.  And FYI there is no amputation.  It’s inverted.  #wemaverick #forgeinrelations 

[safe sex 11800]

1 minute ago, Johnny Sack said:

I think we should try and help those with gender identity issues.  But does anyone know what is effective?

If someone wants to transition to a gender and can do it in a way that helps them, let’s do it.  

We should also consider helping their loved ones. It has to be devastating to their parents, siblings and kids. Maybe more societal acceptance can lessen that. 

Transition is effective.

[futureman 22562]

1 minute ago, troph said:

Unrelated issue.  And FYI there is no amputation.  It’s inverted.  #wemaverick #forgeinrelations 

lulz

[troph 24916]

Just now, trauma babe said:

Transition is effective.

we can’t accept trans voices and our care givers on this subject, only cisgender white men have the knowledge, aptitude and life experience to really know.

[futureman 22562]

how is it unrelated exactly?  it’s just confused people believing with all their heart in something that is not real. 

[troph 24916]

1 minute ago, futureman said:

lulz

Glad you think this is funny asshole.  Lulz your own fucking self dipshit.  It’s the proven treatment for those with gender dysphoria, period. Ain’t no corollary to amputation.  None whatsoever.  But then you knew the tissue that makes a vagina makes a penis. And you knew that trans folk get to move on and live a productive life after treatment.  It’s not funny.  Not one bit of it.

[NameAlreadyInUse 5132]

2 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

I think we should try and help those with gender identity issues.  But does anyone know what is effective?

If someone wants to transition to a gender and can do it in a way that helps them, let’s do it.  

We should also consider helping their loved ones. It has to be devastating to their parents, siblings and kids. Maybe more societal acceptance can lessen that. 

Yes, what's effective is providing hormones to allow a person to express the gender they believe they are.  It's pretty straightforward. But you were upthread arguing against that treatment plan, so maybe that's not the answer you want to hear.

As for loved ones, I agree.  But the hardness for family is largely because of the stigma.  And the stigma remains because people are against just letting doctors treat their patients without a big political showdown about it.  So all we have to do as a society is stop making snide comments about fags and trannies, and quit trying to pass laws that make it harder for LGBT+ people to just go about their daily lives, and shut the fuck up about what a health care provider might decide with a patient about what is in the best interest of that patient. We do that, and the stigma will fall apart, and it will be way less hard for the loved ones of LGBT+ people to deal with the fact that their loved one is LGBT+.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

20 minutes ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

Yes, what's effective is providing hormones to allow a person to express the gender they believe they are.  It's pretty straightforward. But you were upthread arguing against that treatment plan, so maybe that's not the answer you want to hear.

As for loved ones, I agree.  But the hardness for family is largely because of the stigma.  And the stigma remains because people are against just letting doctors treat their patients without a big political showdown about it.  So all we have to do as a society is stop making snide comments about fags and trannies, and quit trying to pass laws that make it harder for LGBT+ people to just go about their daily lives, and shut the fuck up about what a health care provider might decide with a patient about what is in the best interest of that patient. We do that, and the stigma will fall apart, and it will be way less hard for the loved ones of LGBT+ people to deal with the fact that their loved one is LGBT+.

I don’t think I was arguing against trans treatment. I’m pretty sure I’ve said I don’t know what to do and I’m sympathetic towards helping people with gender identity issues  

I was railing against the anti man program Texas has adopted.  Where they have a masculinity program and are hiring a woman’s studies major to fix people like me.  

[austingirl 2192]

3 hours ago, slorch said:

If you put public funding of tranny conversion and hormone therapies to a popular vote, there is zero chance it would prevail.

Can you not say "tranny"? Jesus. 

38 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

I don’t think I was arguing against trans treatment. I’m pretty sure I’ve said I don’t know what to do and I’m sympathetic towards helping people with gender identity issues  

I was railing against the anti man program Texas has adopted.  Where they have a masculinity program and are hiring a woman’s studies major to fix people like me.  

Are you a member of the Male Men?

But seriously, from what I can tell, it looks like the program is just trying to get people to stop being dicks to people who don't fit the traditional definition of masculinity. 

1 hour ago, troph said:

we can’t accept trans voices and our care givers on this subject, only cisgender white men have the knowledge, aptitude and life experience to really know.

Hi, Troph!

Anyway, from my understanding, non-student funds aren't paying for the HRT, but even if they were I would not personally mind (I know, y'all are shocked). I am a white, cis, straight, fairly well-off woman and have never struggled with gender identity, but...there but for the grace of God I go, you know?

[Celery Man 21021]

Yeah, if you took that one article as balanced reporting of what it was about, you’d be both an idiot and understandably alarmed.  And the collection of graphics that have been posted here and only focus on gay/trans don’t do much to dispel the notion that it’s not about a balanced look at modern masculinity.  But a discussion of modern healthy conceptions of masculinity that are different that Gary Cooper or Genghis Khan seems like a reasonable thing to happen in a college campus particularly now (in the midst of #metoo).

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4979]

1 hour ago, troph said:

Yeah you just went off the rails Diablo... I mean you didn’t say dolphin or giraffe but seriously a fucking refrigerator?  They don’t have tits and ass so why the heck would anyone want to be one?

A bleached-blonde mama with a streak of mean
She knew how to knuckle
And she knew how to scuffle and fight
And the roller derby program said
That she were built like a 'fridgerator with a head
The fans called her "Tuffy"
But all her buddies called her "Spike"

[austingirl 2192]

Also, that PJ Media site is hilarious. Like this quiz in the middle of the masculinity program article:

And then some of the actual quiz questions:

 

[hornian 5230]

I'm not wading through 2+ pages, but for me supporting people with gender dysphoria and/or transgender people boils down to this:

Is a human life worth it? I say, yes, it is. 

Is preventing a suicide worth it? Again, I say, yes, it is.

Does this effect me in any way? No, it doesn't.

Then why should I do anything but support it?

 

 

 

[Dahobbs 17717]

Good to see that slorch is still a terrible person. I was worried the new site might change things. 

[DigglerontheHoof 21263]

9 hours ago, hornian said:

I'm not wading through 2+ pages, but for me supporting people with gender dysphoria and/or transgender people boils down to this:

Is a human life worth it? I say, yes, it is. 

Is preventing a suicide worth it? Again, I say, yes, it is.

Does this effect me in any way? No, it doesn't.

Then why should I do anything but support it?

 

 

 

cosign.  Not only that, I don't think I know anyone who struggles w/ gender identity (I'm sure I might but no one has gone public w/ it, if so).

If this helps people go live a happy, productive life....get to it. 

[troph 24916]

If you are opposed to trans health care benefits in group insurance policies, then you support discrimination against me and my transgender brothers and sisters.  It’s thats simple.

 

looks like slorch took his insurance / get off my lawn post down.  Good, it was disgusting.

Edited May 1, 2018 by troph

[Anastasis 23471]

29 minutes ago, troph said:

If you are opposed to trans health care benefits in group insurance policies, then you support discrimination against me and my transgender brothers and sisters.  It’s thats simple.

Depends what you are talking about in terms of "benefits". If we are talking about hormone therapy for gender transitioning, shit should be dirt cheap and low prevalence, rx coverage really shouldn't be impacted and I have never heard of PBM company deploying blanket utilization management on hormone therapies based on sex. Shouldn't even register in an actuarial calculus. An insurance company might restrict gender reassignment surgery because of the high cost (100-200k), and the potential for adverse selection which could undermine their risk pool.  But if we are talking large employer group, should be fine.  Individual market and small group could pose substantial risk. 

Edited May 1, 2018 by Anastasis

[troph 24916]

11 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Depends what you are talking about in terms of "benefits". If we are talking about hormone therapy for gender transitioning, shit should be dirt cheap and low prevalence, rx coverage really shouldn't be impacted and I have never heard of PBM company deploying blanket utilization management on hormone therapies based on sex. Shouldn't even register in an actuarial calculus. An insurance company might restrict gender reassignment surgery because of the high cost (100-200k), and the potential for adverse selection which could undermine their risk pool.  But if we are talking large employer group, should be fine.  Individual market and small group could pose substantial risk. 

I’ve got three employees on my plan.  There were no plans offered that excluded full benefits.  thankfully insurers recognize as much risk in discrim suits as they do the possible cost of care.  

It’s not okay to refuse to cover basic health care in a health care policy because of cost when that exclusion adversely impacts a class of people that suffer tremendous discrimination based on their class.

in addition, I’d argue the $30-40k it costs to cover GRS/SRS is preemptive medicine avoiding millions possibly on a botched suicide.

but yes I agree re hormones.  I paid $30 for a three month supply of estrogen (still haven’t met my deductible).  So anyone balking at that cost is flat out supporting discrimination in health care.

Edited May 1, 2018 by troph

[Anastasis 23471]

I don't disagree with any of that, but the procedures will still be subject a greater level of scrutiny and utilization management, esp the high cost surgery. This is just a reality grounded in cost, and doesn't have anything to do with discrimination because of your class. It's the math of risk sharing and controlling the potential for adverse selection.  You can check your policy and the coverages, but I would guess that there are multiple layers of mental health assessments, prior authorizations, and prior treatment requirements involved before they pay for the surgery.

[troph 24916]

Insurance managing care for everyone is a reality of insurance - not evidence of discrimination.  Excluding basic health care to begin with is discrimination. Btw, doctors have their own protocols too - waiting lists, multiple psych and medical doctor referrals, etc.  that’s a non-issue to me.

Edited May 1, 2018 by troph

[Guest]

14 hours ago, troph said:

If you are opposed to trans health care benefits in group insurance policies, then you support discrimination against me and my transgender brothers and sisters.  It’s thats simple.

 

looks like slorch took his insurance / get off my lawn post down.  Good, it was disgusting.

I deleted no posts.

 

Disagreeing with this PC bullshit is not disgusting.  It also does not make me a bad person, as others have accused.  it doesn't mean I hate you are wish you ill will.  i just think you should handle it on your own.  It is absolutely discretionary.

 

Gotdam you motherfuckers are eaten up with "agree with us, fund our shit, or go to hell."

 

Our society is on crazy pills.

Edited May 2, 2018 by slorch

[DanRydell 799]

14 minutes ago, slorch said:

I deleted no posts.

 

Disagreeing with this PC bullshit is not disgusting.  It also does not make me a bad person, as others have accused.  it doesn't mean I hate you are wish you ill will.  i just think you should handle it on your own.  It is absolutely discretionary.

 

Gotdam you motherfuckers are eaten up with "agree with us, fund our shit, or go to hell."

 

Our society is on crazy pills.

Admittedly this is somewhat low down the list of reasons you’re a bad person.

That you still fail to comprehend that nobody other than the patient or their health insurance is being asked to pay for these treatments is far more insufferable.

Edited May 2, 2018 by DanRydell

[Dahobbs 17717]

20 minutes ago, DanRydell said:

Admittedly this is somewhat low down the list of reasons you’re a bad person.

That you still fail to comprehend that nobody other than the patient or their health insurance is being asked to pay for these treatments is far more insufferable.

It is almost as if he doesn't realize that the University actually offers health insurance that students pay for. And maybe he doesn't realize that offering health insurance for students while also paying for the doctors is a way to keep healthcare costs down.  I also think others misunderstand healthcare provided on campus. The University hires real doctors, just like any other medical facility. Which shouldn't be all that surprising since it now also has a medical school. Oh, and it runs the best cancer treatment center period (MD Anderson). Don't worry Slorch, you don't subsidize that either.

Edited May 2, 2018 by Dahobbs

[troph 24916]

Yeah it’s disgusting that you think my basic health care which I pay for no different than you is “PC bullshit” and some kinda cram down on you and that I shouldn’t be entitled to the same health care you get because you think my health care needs are cosmetic and elective. PC bullshit is me holding back and not telling you what your views are.  My health care is nothing of the sort.  But your views - that I should not be able to get basic health care coverage and should be entirely outside the health insurance system for my basic care?  bigotry and hate and it’s completely disgusting.  Black and white.  No two ways about it.  

Edited May 2, 2018 by troph

[NameAlreadyInUse 5132]

1 hour ago, slorch said:

I deleted no posts.

 

Disagreeing with this PC bullshit is not disgusting.  It also does not make me a bad person, as others have accused.  it doesn't mean I hate you are wish you ill will.  i just think you should handle it on your own.  It is absolutely discretionary.

 

Gotdam you motherfuckers are eaten up with "agree with us, fund our shit, or go to hell."

 

Our society is on crazy pills.

Once again I will ask you why you get to draw the line instead of Tom Cruise or a Christian Scientist?

[Mappable 37]

Interesting to note that the Blue Cross Plan for UT below specifically excludes reproductive therapies that use the same hormones:

https://myahpcare.com/wp-content/uploads/2018-19-UT-System-Brochure-FINAL_original-1.pdf

17. Any expenses incurred in connection with sexual dysfunction, sterilization reversal, vasectomy reversal ;
18. In-vitrofertilization;
19. Promotion of fertility through extra-coital reproductive technologies including, but not limited to, artificial insemination, intrauterine insemination, super ovulation uterine capacitation enhancement, direct intra-peritoneal insemination, trans-uterine tubal insemination, gamete intra-fallopian transfer, pronuclear oocyte stage transfer, zygote intra-fallopian transfer, and tubal embryo transfer;

[ousuxndallas 65]

Surly has become too queer. Bunch of homos migrated over.