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The US and Korea

RomaVicta

By RomaVicta
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HenryJames
HenryJames

Un-N-Out?

Dbeasy
Dbeasy

Reading the butthurt in here reminds me yet again that 95% of our population, including the posters on here, are simply incapable of perceiving anything political in any way other than reinforcing the

Goredho
Goredho

My inconsequential thoughts:   1. Dbeasy is right.  This is a first step in a change in the handling of NK.  The status quo was surely not the answer, so something different needed to be tried.  

Pods

Pods 7622

Posted
Posted
49 minutes ago, Caracara said:

You know the military exercises lift is totally provisional, right?  Somebody should have asked him about that.

 

Ok. You would have prepared for the genius "Do you trust him, " question.  But maybe it's an asian thing, and Trump knows how important it is for KIM to look good to Korea, so Trump is playing that game to get the deal done and in 15 years the gulags and nukes and famine and systematic torture will be gone.  You'll still have to live with memory of our flag next to theirs, but there could be upside.

 

No, I would have done that as part of the meeting, so it would have been a natural response. Part of this meeting should have been discussing previous NK violations and how that cannot happen again. That should clearly lay out the consequences for not following their commitments. Of course, Trump didn't actually require them to commit to anything other than a vague denuke promise they've given multiple times before in stronger fashion. 

Trump answered yes because he does trust Un. Trump is an idiot. 

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Posted
Posted
31 minutes ago, Caracara said:

I was hoping all those would happen in the first day, but I guess I greatly overestimated our hand.

No, you correctly estimated our hand. You overestimated the ability of our card player. The dumbass card player is the one that threw away most of the good cards for free and then yelled Uno. 

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Caracara

Caracara 41

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Pods said:

No, I would have done that as part of the meeting, so it would have been a natural response. Part of this meeting should have been discussing previous NK violations and how that cannot happen again. That should clearly lay out the consequences for not following their commitments. Of course, Trump didn't actually require them to commit to anything other than a vague denuke promise they've given multiple times before in stronger fashion. 

Trump answered yes because he does trust Un. Trump is an idiot. 

link to the transcripts of the meeting por favor.  And I can't find the previous stuff with Pompeo either. Got that?

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Caracara

Caracara 41

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

You have to separate what Trump got out of the Summit vs what the United States got out of the Summit.

The two are not synonymous on the international stage.

Is this a process, or do you need a final answer by Thursday?  The international stage of perception may change as things progress. But I bet a lot of Koreans are thankful this is happening.  And others.

 

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Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, Caracara said:

link to the transcripts of the meeting por favor.  And I can't find the previous stuff with Pompeo either. Got that?

You are being obtuse. If it was discussed in the meeting and agreed to, it would be in the signed joint agreement. It's not, because Trump is an idiot that gave away a shitload of cards for a vague promise of denuclearization. 

 

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Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Caracara said:

Is this a process, or do you need a final answer by Thursday?  The international stage of perception may change as things progress. But I bet a lot of Koreans are thankful this is happening.  And others.

 

A lot of Koreans would have been far happier if Trump hadn't kicked the hornet's nest in the first place. The only one that could put them in any danger was, and is, the Donald. NK will not act, unless in self-defense or before a perceived American attack on them. 

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Caracara

Caracara 41

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Pods said:

You are being obtuse. If it was discussed in the meeting and agreed to, it would be in the signed joint agreement. It's not, because Trump is an idiot that gave away a shitload of cards for a vague promise of denuclearization. 

 

No I'm not being obtuse. I'm giving you a hard time because you think you know what everyone is, what everyone thinks, and everything that happens behind closed doors

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Dahobbs

Dahobbs 18192

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Caracara said:

Is this a process, or do you need a final answer by Thursday?  The international stage of perception may change as things progress. But I bet a lot of Koreans are thankful this is happening.  And others.

 

Thankful what is happening? That Trump is no longer threatening war for no reason? I'm totally thankful for that. I'm not entirely clear what is happening with these meetings other than Trump saying he is awesome. Doesn't seem like we've gotten anything for it, yet. But, as I've said before, I also think our previous approach with North Korea was entirely flawed. We get McDonald's in there and most of our other complaints will slowly solve themselves. Economic integration is better pathway to peace than isolation. If these meetings ultimately result in that, I'm ok with it. I also completely trust Trump to screw it up and throw a tantrum at some point when it becomes profitable to do so.

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Posted
Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, Caracara said:

No I'm not being obtuse. I'm giving you a hard time because you think you know what everyone is, what everyone thinks, and everything that happens behind closed doors

I have a pretty good idea who Donald Trump is and I'm fairly certain of things he didn't discuss behind closed doors. They did not discuss anything that even slightly criticized NK. Trump hit him with full flattery mode. In case it wasn't obvious enough, they made a fucking Hollywood trailer for a murderous dictator for fuck's sake. 

Edited by Pods
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Caracara

Caracara 41

Posted
Posted
Just now, Pods said:

I have a pretty good idea who Donald Trump is and I'm fairly certain of things he didn't discuss behind closed doors. They did not discuss anything that even slightly criticized NK. Trump hit him with full flattery mode. In case it wasn't obvious enough, they made a fucking Hollywood trailer for him for fuck's sake. 

Did you see the part of the trailer that emphasized, now or never? one final chance. Watch it again

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Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Caracara said:

Did you see the part of the trailer that emphasized, now or never? one final chance. Watch it again

No thank you. That video was an abomination and a massive propaganda win for Kim, again given away for literally nothing. It should never have been made.  

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Bama Chick

Bama Chick 28596

Posted
Posted

Thanks for the video @Anastasis!

I've been at or recovering from my concert so I missed most of the news and coverage of this fiasco so thanks to y'all for catching me up!

I was in the middle of this beautifulness and didn't give a shit about Kim or Trump or this messy world and it was glorious!

 

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Dahobbs

Dahobbs 18192

Posted
Posted

 

Just now, Caracara said:

OK, y'all think Trump should not be "kicking the hornets nest," and that he's fucking everything up, because mostly "dotard." "he's giving it all away"

All that's left to do is figure out the degree of calamity that will ensue.

Yes? Have you not seen how he operates? Did you not see the "rocket man" tweets earlier this year? You say you're not being obtuse, but your posts in this thread suggest otherwise. 

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Caracara

Caracara 41

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

 

Yes? Have you not seen how he operates? Did you not see the "rocket man" tweets earlier this year? You say you're not being obtuse, but your posts in this thread suggest otherwise. 

right now, what do the rocket man quotes mean or matter?

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Dahobbs

Dahobbs 18192

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, Caracara said:

right now, what do the rocket man quotes mean or matter?

Uh, that literally the only problem he has "solved" is the one he created for no reason on his own? Again, if he gets concrete verifiable concessions of some sort from North Korea, great. So far, his "agreement" doesn't even meet the threshold of our previous agreements with them, so not much of a reason for any excitement. And if he gets upset he is just going to tweet stupid things again and ratchet the tension up. That is what he does. It is a pattern. And it isn't a hidden one. 

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MaybeACoordinator

MaybeACoordinator 8350

Posted
Posted

I have been harping on this for forever, but nothing about North Korea matters so long as you leave them alone. Yes, it sucks for the 30 million people who live there, but exactly nobody really wants regime change there except the few North Koreans who are aware of the outside world. Manufactured crisis, non-solution, and the beat goes on. 

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Dolemite

Dolemite 143

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Caracara said:

I think peace is in the air. And possibly reform.  That's my opinion.  It's an ideal worth taking a new, non-lethal tack for.

I agree. He saw the life his grandfather and father led. A life where they were constantly on guard for potential threats on their life. Living in isolation, having to suck up to the Chinese etc.

Little Kim seems like the type who sees the benefit of joining the world community. Cutting ties with Iran etc, and I think that is where he wants to go for the future. 

 

Edited by Dolemite
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David Dennison

David Dennison 19441

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, Dolemite said:

I agree. He saw the life his grandfather and father led. A life where they were constantly on guard for potential threats on their life. Living in isolation, having to suck up to the Chinese etc.

Little Kim seems like the type who sees the benefit of joining the world community. Cutting ties with Iran etc, and I think that is where he wants to go for the future. 

You only agree because you support Donald Trump.

But if Barack Obama makes moves toward peace, hoooooo boy.

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted

Trump recognizes his base is so brainwashed by Fox News and dumb that he can sit there and say on live TV that he will lie to everyone in the future if things go wrong, never admit he was wrong and lie and blame the dems, or Obama or Hillary or the moon or something and they still lap it up like the straight up morons that they are. 

 

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Texas73

Texas73 422

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, JimmyJames said:

Trump recognizes his base is so brainwashed by Fox News and dumb that he can sit there and say on live TV that he will lie to everyone in the future if things go wrong, never admit he was wrong and lie and blame the dems, or Obama or Hillary or the moon or something and they still lap it up like the straight up morons that they are. 

 

Objectivity and critical thinking skills died years ago. 

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WhatTheBuck

WhatTheBuck 28904

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Trump recognizes his base is so brainwashed by Fox News and dumb that he can sit there and say on live TV that he will lie to everyone in the future if things go wrong, never admit he was wrong and lie and blame the dems, or Obama or Hillary or the moon or something and they still lap it up like the straight up morons that they are. 

It really is that simple. 

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Caracara

Caracara 41

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Trump recognizes his base is so brainwashed by Fox News and dumb that he can sit there and say on live TV that he will lie to everyone in the future if things go wrong, never admit he was wrong and lie and blame the dems, or Obama or Hillary or the moon or something and they still lap it up like the straight up morons that they are. 

 

I recognized it as him making a joke about his own mercurial PR tactics.  When I sit here watching poster after poster regurgitating the same simple talking points that boil down to "dotard," and I consider that it's the same propaganda being pumped out 24/7 by the press....

I don't feel like the brainwashed one.

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted
Just now, Caracara said:

I recognized it as him making a joke about his own mercurial PR tactics.  When I sit here watching poster after poster regurgitating the same simple talking points that boil down to "dotard," and I consider that it's the same propaganda being pumped out 24/7 by the press....

I don't feel like the brainwashed one.

Holy shit that’s your retort!?! 

Fuck off. 

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David Dennison

David Dennison 19441

Posted
Posted
Just now, Caracara said:

I recognized it as him making a joke about his own mercurial PR tactics.  When I sit here watching poster after poster regurgitating the same simple talking points that boil down to "dotard," and I consider that it's the same propaganda being pumped out 24/7 by the press....

I don't feel like the brainwashed one.

Do you feel naive?

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Caracara said:

Didn't mean to make y'all so angry.  Having an opinion that counters yours isn't trolling.

Liars and defenders of liars make me angry. Sorry bout that fella and sorry it doesn’t make you angry.

“Mercurial PR tactics?” That’s a good one. Let’s at least agree to call a lie a lie and a liar a liar. When you lie you don’t get to excuse it that you were joking, at least once you reached the age of 5 years old. 

But you never will. Because it doesn’t earn you a paycheck. 

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David Dennison

David Dennison 19441

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Dolemite said:

Like when he rid the middle east of chemical weapons held by Syria?

 

You do realize he asked the Republican controlled Congress to authorize military force in Syria, right? Please tell me you know that.

They demurred.

Edited by David Dennison
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Dolemite

Dolemite 143

Posted
Posted
Just now, David Dennison said:

You do realize he asked the Republican controlled Congress to authorize military force in Syria, right? Please tell me you know that.

Asked permission from Republicans to fulfill a promise he made? So pitiful. 

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted

The trolls are literally running out of material. The arguments they make are now so absurd its not worth responding to unless to point out that once again, they’re trolling.

He’s not lying! He’s joking! That’s his great mercurial PR skills! LOL!!!! Smiley emoji!?!!!

Sad!

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