The White House Correspondents' Dinner

[Brisketexan 104464]

16 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

If only I were as smart as you and brisket I would know how scared to be!

And the sun never set on the British Empire.

And Rome would never fall.

And no bunch of colonial upstarts can defeat the British military.

And Texas had no chance of beating the Huskers to win the 1996 Big 12 title (to be fair, I shared that belief -- James Brown proved me wrong).

No modern airliner will ever crash, there's too many safety systems.

And we could go on.

As someone who lives in that world, I understand that our institutions and the rule of law are only as strong as our collective will and willingness to uphold them.  Those can vanish in, effectively, an instant.

All it takes is for several things to go wrong, in sequence.  Which will never happen...until it does.

And being cavalier about the risks, as opposed to reacting strongly and cautiously when even ONE safety system fails, is exactly how we end up crashing.  Let's go back to the airplane thought -- your next flight has a warning light on the dash.  But hey, it's just one warning light, one system.  They'll surely take off, right?  Nope.  The loss of even ONE layer of safety is deemed an unacceptable risk when you have a $30 million plane with 140 passengers on board.  That's the smart and prudent approach when it comes to commercial air travel.  I'm suggesting that it is likewise smart and prudent when it comes to the ongoing security and functionality of the Republic.

 

[Sawbonz 27375]

Let me know when you throttle back to strong and cautious reactions from histrionic fatalism   One sign of that would be not questioning the character and courage of people who are concerned about trump, but not to a degree you deem acceptable 

[Brisketexan 104464]

3 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

Let me know when you throttle back to strong and cautious reactions from histrionic fatalism   One sign of that would be not questioning the character and courage of people who are concerned about trump, but not to a degree you deem acceptable 

Insufficient alarm about an existential threat is a character defect.  I'm okay making that judgment.  Folks who demonstrate insufficient alarm about such risks are the kind of folks who get our asses killed, metaphorically speaking.  I don't like such folks.  In fact, I see them as part of the problem.  I'm comfortable with that.

[Sawbonz 27375]

And you are the arbiter?  You are a textbook zealot. And I’m perfectly comfortable saying I want nothing to do with you or your type 

Edited May 1, 2018 by Sawbonz

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

1 minute ago, Sawbonz said:

And you are the arbiter?  You are a textbook zealot. 

Where do you see this ship called America sailing? 

[Sawbonz 27375]

Just now, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Where do you see this ship called America sailing? 

I see Dems taking the house in 2018, trump gone by 2020 at the latest, and likely the democrats having both houses and the WH in 2021. I hope they make good choices when they get it

 

i don’t see any scenario where the republic is in jeopardy 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

1 minute ago, Sawbonz said:

I see Dems taking the house in 2018, trump gone by 2020 at the latest, and likely the democrats having both houses and the WH in 2021. I hope they make good choices when they get it

 

i don’t see any scenario where the republic is in jeopardy 

Donald Trump is president of the United States.

If this isn't a warning sign that the republic is in jeopardy, I don't know what is. 

[lemonlime 5503]

6 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Donald Trump is president of the United States.

If this isn't a warning sign that the republic is in jeopardy, I don't know what is. 

Also, his lies and shredding of norms.   He already lied about the 2016 election, saying there were millions of fraudulent votes and that the election was rigged against him.  What do people (Sawbonz) think is going to happen if he loses in 2020?   That Trump and his merry band of sycophants will just shrug and let the adults run things?

[JimmyHoffa 1188]

For fuck sakes. Some of you must be on some pretty powerful anti depression meds and sleeping pills as I don't know how you get through the day with as much fucking whining and crying about Trump being President. Get a fucking paperbag and breath into it for awhile. 

Look the guy is a total and complete asshat but give me a fucking break with this end of the democracy bullshit. And if you can't get over yourself and see the real reason why he was elected the 1st time it can and will happen again. 

If you hate the guy so much quit making excuses for why he was elected and give those that you might not 100% agree with some positive alternatives. The fucking far right didn't elect Donald Trump it was the moderates and independents but go ahead and keep fucking that "racists elected Trump" chicken and you will lose again. 

[Mojo Hand 4580]

12 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

I see Dems taking the house in 2018, trump gone by 2020 at the latest, and likely the democrats having both houses and the WH in 2021. I hope they make good choices when they get it

 

i don’t see any scenario where the republic is in jeopardy 

That doesn't happen magically.  It takes a lot of hard work from the opposition.  It takes people freaking out about the state of the Republic and taking action.  It takes bothsiders recognizing that, right now, one side is much worse, and joining forces. 

[Sawbonz 27375]

Are you arguing that is not currently happening? Because IRL in my experience that is exactly what is happening

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

4 minutes ago, JimmyHoffa said:

For fuck sakes. Some of you must be on some pretty powerful anti depression meds and sleeping pills as I don't know how you get through the day with as much fucking whining and crying about Trump being President. Get a fucking paperbag and breath into it for awhile. 

Look the guy is a total and complete asshat but give me a fucking break with this end of the democracy bullshit. And if you can't get over yourself and see the real reason why he was elected the 1st time it can and will happen again. 

If you hate the guy so much quit making excuses for why he was elected and give those that you might not 100% agree with some positive alternatives. The fucking far right didn't elect Donald Trump it was the moderates and independents but go ahead and keep fucking that "racists elected Trump" chicken and you will lose again. 

It's not hate for Trump. 

It's the fact that our republic CHOSE a complete idiot with fascist tendencies.

We are a nation for the people by the people and the people fucking suck.

Trump has little to do with it. 

[Mojo Hand 4580]

1 minute ago, Sawbonz said:

Are you arguing that is not currently happening? Because IRL in my experience that is exactly what is happening

It's happening, but the very freakout you are criticizing is part of it. 

[Brisketexan 104464]

19 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

And you are the arbiter?  You are a textbook zealot. And I’m perfectly comfortable saying I want nothing to do with you or your type 

Sure, I'm the arbiter about all kinds of shit.  I make judgments about people all the time.  It's how I cast my ballot for a certain candidate and not another.  It's how I choose what people to associate with and invite into my home, and vice-versa.

I've never been a zealot about much of anything in my life.  I'm not a young man, either.  But I've never seen anything even close to this alarming.  The number of nightmarish parallels with other historical failures and horrors are too many to count.  I'm sure that during other historical shitshows, there were plenty of "go along and get along" types who wanted nothing to do with the folks who sounded the alarm.  Those go along-get along types were wrong then.  And they are wrong now.

11 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Donald Trump is president of the United States.

If this isn't a warning sign that the republic is in jeopardy, I don't know what is. 

This.  We CHOSE that.  And it's not so much that we chose it (I actually understand -- not necessarily agree with, but understand -- the "he's not Hillary" vote)...but that we then defend and normalize who he is and what he does.

1 minute ago, JimmyHoffa said:

For fuck sakes. Some of you must be on some pretty powerful anti depression meds and sleeping pills as I don't know how you get through the day with as much fucking whining and crying about Trump being President. Get a fucking paperbag and breath into it for awhile. 

Look the guy is a total and complete asshat but give me a fucking break with this end of the democracy bullshit. And if you can't get over yourself and see the real reason why he was elected the 1st time it can and will happen again. 

If you hate the guy so much quit making excuses for why he was elected and give those that you might not 100% agree with some positive alternatives. The fucking far right didn't elect Donald Trump it was the moderates and independents but go ahead and keep fucking that "racists elected Trump" chicken and you will lose again. 

I don't make any excuse for why he was elected.  He was elected because we are a Republic of weak, scared shitheels, angry far-right racists and xenophobes (and plenty more who just have the decency not to march in public), and a large enough group that goes along with anything, who combined to create a just-big-enough coalition to win.  And, because Hillary was a shittacular candidate whose unlikeability was surpassed by her arrogance in not campaigning in key states.

Trump is one problem.

The continuing large block of the voters who support him is another.

The utter failure of Congress to conduct itself as a legitimate, independent branch of the government, with real responsibilities and power, is another.

The utter failure of the "party of opposition" to demonstrate real leadership or creative thought is another.

That creates one shitty layer cake, and it ain't going away anytime soon.

[Hank Scorpio 17712]

2 hours ago, EMAWesome said:

Real reporting like reporting that the NRA has banned guns from it's convention when in reality it is the Secret Service banning the guns due to the presence of Mike Pence at the convention? Real reporting like claiming that the MLK bust went missing in the White House when Trump took over?  Real reporting like Brian Ross claiming Trump met with Russian officials before the election when he actually met with them after the election?  Real reporting that has inaccurately reported stories involving Trump every fucking week since he became president?

ahahaahaha there it is

[Pescado_Rojo 19327]

2 hours ago, EMAWesome said:

Real reporting like reporting that the NRA has banned guns from it's convention when in reality it is the Secret Service banning the guns due to the presence of Mike Pence at the convention? Real reporting like claiming that the MLK bust went missing in the White House when Trump took over?  Real reporting like Brian Ross claiming Trump met with Russian officials before the election when he actually met with them after the election?  Real reporting that has inaccurately reported stories involving Trump every fucking week since he became president?

Wait a minute... The Secret Service told the NRA no guns? Did I miss the email blast from the NRA calling the Secret Service Traitors and demanding their members take action and boycott?

[TahoeHorn 107]

sawbonz,

 

I'm with you.  This country is run by 325MM people.  The government, and much less the President, play a far, far smaller role than people indicate.  And that's good.

The President has a bunch of problems.  But when I go down the list of things he's actually done - appointments he's made, orders he's given, bills he's signed - I see more good than bad.  I wish it were better.  There are a bunch of unforced errors (e.g. travel ban, being Putin's Bitch, raising tariffs).  And there are some missed opportunities.  But he's shoving in the right direction (e.g. tax cuts, judicial appointments, deregulation, no bow and apologize).

 

But, most of all, he isn't Hillary!  

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

8 minutes ago, TahoeHorn said:

(e.g. tax cuts, judicial appointments, deregulation,

Consolidation of wealth and power is a good thing in Tahoe’s world.

[lemonlime 5503]

14 minutes ago, TahoeHorn said:

being Putin's Bitch

 

14 minutes ago, TahoeHorn said:

no bow and apologize

 

 

 

Within the same post even.  It's like talking points mad libs.

[wildcat09 29187]

1 hour ago, Sawbonz said:

I see Dems taking the house in 2018, trump gone by 2020 at the latest, and likely the democrats having both houses and the WH in 2021. I hope they make good choices when they get it

 

i don’t see any scenario where the republic is in jeopardy 

What happens when Trump refuses to recognize the validity of the election in the event he loses in 2020?

[wildcat09 29187]

18 minutes ago, TahoeHorn said:

sawbonz,

 

I'm with you.  This country is run by 325MM people.  The government, and much less the President, play a far, far smaller role than people indicate.  And that's good.

The President has a bunch of problems.  But when I go down the list of things he's actually done - appointments he's made, orders he's given, bills he's signed - I see more good than bad.  I wish it were better.  There are a bunch of unforced errors (e.g. travel ban, being Putin's Bitch, raising tariffs).  And there are some missed opportunities.  But he's shoving in the right direction (e.g. tax cuts, judicial appointments, deregulation, no bow and apologize).

 

But, most of all, he isn't Hillary!  

This is the worst trolling you've ever done.

[cactusflinthead 27593]

Tahoe don't care. He got his. 

[Sbbruin 21697]

1 hour ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Where do you see this ship called America sailing? 

Across the finish line first, bitches!

[Sawbonz 27375]

27 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

What happens when Trump refuses to recognize the validity of the election in the event he loses in 2020?

Tell me your estimate of the odds of that happening. What should our realistic “preparation “ for that occurrence be (other than calling people names on the internet)?  Do I need to buy that bucket o slop meal plan? Guns and ammo and a bunker? I thought only right wing nuts thought about stuff like that 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

I think it’s a safe bet Trump won’t be leaving the White House quietly.

I don’t know how it’s going to play out but I’m 99% sure it will be ugly.

[Bat Guano 359]

4 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

Tell me your estimate of the odds of that happening. What should our realistic “preparation “ for that occurrence be (other than calling people names on the internet)?  Do I need to buy that bucket o slop meal plan? Guns and ammo and a bunker? I thought only right wing nuts thought about stuff like that 

Seriously? Odds of Trump refusing to recognize that he loses the election? Or gets impeached? I'd put it right at 100 fucking percent. And I don't know about the bucket o' slop or ammo, but we better be fucking prepared for it, because it's gonna happen.

[Sawbonz 27375]

I like how you throw impeachment in there as a hedge. No shit. 

Forget impeachment and for the sake of argument he is the 2020 nominee and loses

Other than a court challenge because of a narrow margin, what do you really see him doing? I want details

[jimmyjazz 45513]

I think the military (or maybe the FBI) would step in and remove him.

The bigger question is "what would then happen in middle America".  And I think THAT would be ugly.  I would not be surprised one bit if lives were lost.

[Sbbruin 21697]

I imagine Trump being like Cruise in Taps when he is asked to leave the White Hosue

 

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

1 minute ago, jimmyjazz said:

 

I think the military (or maybe the FBI) would step in and remove him.

 

US Marshals 

[Sawbonz 27375]

2 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

I think the military (or maybe the FBI) would step in and remove him.

The bigger question is "what would then happen in middle America".  And I think THAT would be ugly.  I would not be surprised one bit if lives were lost.

Ballpark odds there is military intervention after a trump loss

[Bat Guano 359]

1 minute ago, Sawbonz said:

I like how you throw impeachment in there as a hedge. No shit. 

Forget impeachment and for the sake of argument he is the 2020 nominee and loses

Other than a court challenge because of a narrow margin, what do you really see him doing? I want details

Not a hedge, an expansion - lose an election OR impeachment, either one and he'll refuse to recognize it, or even comprehend it. Court challenge is a given; besides that, at the very least he'll whip up an absolute shitstorm of outrage among his followers, and he might very well go further, and refuse to leave. I truly wouldn't put it past him.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

I don’t see a world where Trump gets the GOP nomination in 2020 or even runs.

[Sawbonz 27375]

Ok impeachment, loss, wherever. Then he loses whatever court challenge might be available. Whoever is in charge shows up and tells him Gtfo. What are the odds he refuses and initiates an armed confrontation 

[David Dennison 18605]

Just now, Sawbonz said:

Ok impeachment, loss, wherever. Then he loses whatever court challenge might be available. Whoever is in charge shows up and tells him Gtfo. What are the odds he refuses and initiates an armed confrontation 

That's assuming anyone defends him.

[Sawbonz 27375]

1 minute ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I don’t see a world where Trump gets the GOP nomination in 2020 or even runs.

No shit. But we need to prepare for when he loses and declares himself president for life

[Bat Guano 359]

6 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I don’t see a world where Trump gets the GOP nomination in 2020 or even runs.

Then you seriously underestimate Trump's ego and the sycophancy of the modern Republican party. If he's not impeached he will run, and he'll win the nomination. Who will run against him? Of those, who will beat him? Who in the party will oppose him? Hell, Tahoe would vote for him next time around; just look at those glorious appointments and policies.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

I think he will go via the Nixon way.

Stupid Watergate can have no other ending.

[seven 1366]

No way he refuses to leave. He might not "accept" it, but he'll just bitch on twitter/fox and friends and that's all. Some of you dudes need to grip reality. 

[hobbes2702 12771]

4 minutes ago, seven said:

No way he refuses to leave. He might not "accept" it, but he'll just bitch on twitter/fox and friends and that's all. Some of you dudes need to grip reality. 

And when he continually tells his supporters that it’s rigged against him what do you think they will do? 

[seven 1366]

Probably bitch about rigged elections while fucking their siblings and livestock 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

5 minutes ago, hobbes2702 said:

And when he continually tells his supporters that it’s rigged against him what do you think they will do? 

They are pussies. Just like Trump.

[Newdoc 3429]

59 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

No shit. But we need to prepare for when he loses and declares himself president for life

Lol. Okay.

[seven 1366]

Exactly, huge cowards like Tahoe 

[wildcat09 29187]

1 hour ago, Sawbonz said:

Tell me your estimate of the odds of that happening. What should our realistic “preparation “ for that occurrence be (other than calling people names on the internet)?  Do I need to buy that bucket o slop meal plan? Guns and ammo and a bunker? I thought only right wing nuts thought about stuff like that 

Well he challenged the validity of an election he won, so I'd say they're pretty fucking good. And I've got no clue what happens after he does that. It's not something we've ever had to consider before. 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

When asked if she's surprised at the level of controversy over her performance:

Wolf: I wasn't expecting this level, but I'm also not disappointed there's this level. I knew what I was doing going in. I wanted to do something different. I didn't want to cater to the room. I wanted to cater to the outside audience, and not betray my brand of comedy. I actually, a friend of mine who helped me write, he gave me a note before I went on which I kept with me which was, "Be true to yourself. Never apologize. Burn it to the ground."

Gross: When you say you didn't want to cater to the room, you didn't want to betray who you are as a comic, what would it have meant to cater to the room and how would that have betrayed who you are as a comic?

Wolf: I think a lot of it and what I've seen in the past is they poke little fun, they kind of poke fun at deeper dives in news media. They'll go kind of table by table pointing at people and making fun of them, in a way that I think used to be fun because the dinner used to have the president there, it used to be we're all poking fun of each other, the president's going to poke fun at us, we're going to hit back. Now it seems like it's a much more serious environment and to kind of not go after the big issues and just have a little fun in the room seemed just not as exciting to me.

On advice Seth Meyers gave her about performing at the White House Correspondents' Dinner and the expectation that "women will be nice.":

Michelle Wolf: I mean, I'm honestly – I wouldn't change a single word that I said. I'm very happy with what I said, and I'm glad I stuck to my guns.

Gross: After one of your jokes about the women's march and the, I can't say the word, the p - - - - hats that women wore, and then you made a joke about female genitalia, you said, and I quote, "You should've done more research before you got me to do this." I got the impression you really meant that.

Wolf: Yeah, I mean, I think I don't know maybe I'm projecting this, but I think sometimes they look at a woman and they think "Oh, she'll be nice," and if you've seen any of my comedy you know that I don't – I'm not. I don't pull punches. I'm not afraid to talk about things. And I don't think they expected that from me. I think they still have preconceived notions of how women will present themselves and I don't fit in that box.

On being criticized for being a feminist comic making jokes about women's appearances:

Michelle Wolf: I think they didn't pay attention to what was said.

Gross: I'm wondering if you think it's maybe a little bit sexist to think that Sarah Sanders as a woman needs to be protected from a couple of jokes at a roast, because I haven't heard men be protected that way at roasts?

Wolf: Yeah, I mean, if there is two people that I actually made fun of their looks on Saturday it was Mitch McConnell and Chris Christie and no one is jumping to their defense. I made fun of Mitch McConnell's neck and I did a small jab at Chris Christie's weight and no one is jumping to their defense.

Gross: And every comic makes jokes about Trump's hair, about the length of his tie. I mean, I'm just talking about physical things here, I'm not talking about all the other jokes they make about President Trump, but his hair and his tie are the constant butt of jokes. So, again, is there anything else you'd like to say about the fact that that you're a feminist comic, you criticized a woman with a couple of jokes, like the punchlines were about her, and so many people feel the need to defend her in a way that I haven't heard men defended at roasts?

Wolf: I think one of the things about being a comic is getting to actually, as a woman, I have access to hit women in a way that men might not be able to hit them with jokes. I don't mean physically hit. But you know, because I'm a woman, I can say things about women because I know what it's like to be a woman, if that makes any sense.

Gross: So you felt like you had more liberty in saying what you said about Sarah Sanders and if a man had said it it might've been uglier?

Wolf: I think in general when I talk about women, like in my special when I talked about Hillary, I called Hillary a bitch, which you later find out is a compliment. But no, I don't think a man could've gotten away with saying that. It would've sounded misogynistic.

 

https://www.npr.org/about-npr/607099827/fresh-air-interview-with-michelle-wolf

[Incredulity 11532]

Wolf: I think in general when I talk about women, like in my special when I talked about Hillary, I called Hillary a bitch, which you later find out is a compliment. But no, I don't think a man could've gotten away with saying that. It would've sounded misogynistic.

Perfect, another shining example of how we are all equal, until that doesn’t fit the need.

[safe sex 11659]

Why is it so hard to understand that words have different strengths depending on who says them?

[EMAWesome 101]

15 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Consolidation of wealth and power is a good thing in Tahoe’s world.

If we wanted consolidation of wealth and power we would have voted for Hillary.  That has been her occupation for the last two and a half decades.

[WhatTheBuck 28700]

10 minutes ago, EMAWesome said:

If we wanted consolidation of wealth and power we would have voted for Hillary.  That has been her occupation for the last two and a half decades.

Oh really? She hasn't consolidated much wealth or power. 

Maybe find a new trope.