UT's next basketball coach - discussion/debate

[Sheep Have Wool 1053]

Some of you are letting a dipshit named Hermanator futureman the absolute fuck out of you.

[Guest]

LMAO at the mindset that Terry isn't "fancy enough." because that is what a bunch of y'all are saying.

Fancy gets you jack shit.   Not saying terry is the answer, but automatically writing him off is a pure UT athletics move.

[JesusSweatDuck 17781]

Can we get back to discussing the next coach? We already have a thread to talk about that dumbass Beard

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, slorch said:

LMAO at the mindset that Terry isn't "fancy enough." because that is what a bunch of y'all are saying.

Fancy gets you jack shit.   Not saying terry is the answer, but automatically writing him off is a pure UT athletics move.

I actually agree with that general mindset but Terry is a proven mediocre head coach and has already shown it in his current capacity. Beard wasn’t “fancy” and he was the best thing that happened to this program since Barnes and would’ve exceeded him. You know this because he’s the best thing to happen to Tech since, ever, including Dickey and Knight. 

And it’s natural to want something really good to replace what could’ve been a 20-year head coach with titles. We know Terry isn’t that. 

Edited January 15, 2023 by Porterhouse

[Pancho 44757]

16 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

That’s football not basketball.  But I would say cdc would consider keeping flood if he got us to the sugar 

Why does the sport matter?

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Porterhouse said:

I actually agree with that general mindset but Terry is a proven mediocre head coach and has already shown it in his current capacity. Beard wasn’t “fancy” and he was the best thing that happened to this program since Barnes and would’ve exceeded him. You know this because he’s the best thing to happen to Tech since, ever, including Dickey and Knight. 

I don't dispute Beard's accolades.

The other mindset I described absolutely exists though.

[Dendox 102]

Will this help with Oats?

 

https://www.si.com/college/alabama/.amp/bamacentral/darius-miles-charged-with-capital-murder

 

Or is this worse than Beard on the morality scale?  
 

Team Beard - sue me. 

[Sheep Have Wool 1053]

2 minutes ago, slorch said:

LMAO at the mindset that Terry isn't "fancy enough." because that is what a bunch of y'all are saying.

Fancy gets you jack shit.   Not saying terry is the answer, but automatically writing him off is a pure UT athletics move.

You're right: I'd hate to miss out on the next assistant to have a decent year with a team Beard built. How's that working out for you?

[ClubWhatever 12128]

1 minute ago, Dendox said:

Will this help with Oats?

 

https://www.si.com/college/alabama/.amp/bamacentral/darius-miles-charged-with-capital-murder

 

Or is this worse than Beard on the morality scale?  
 

Team Beard - sue me. 

I know nothing about Oats, but how does this article impugn him?  Did he recruit this fellow?

[ChiTownDoc 21151]

5 minutes ago, slorch said:

I don't dispute Beard's accolades.

The other mindset I described absolutely exists though.

Facts

Edited January 15, 2023 by ChiTownDoc

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, Sheep Have Wool said:

You're right: I'd hate to miss out on the next assistant to have a decent year with a team Beard built. How's that working out for you?

a Sweet 16, Big XII COTY,  and struggling after turning over roster, yet still has promise.

Not too shabby. To be fair Adams is probably gone after this season, regardless.  We'll see.

Edited January 15, 2023 by slorch

[Dendox 102]

9 minutes ago, ClubWhatever said:

I know nothing about Oats, but how does this article impugn him?  Did he recruit this fellow?

Fair point. Twitter rope a dope. I’m the dope. 
 

still think getting rid of Beard sucks. 

[HookEm 2467]

Quote

He's a good guy doing an OK job in a shitty situation. You can't look at the on court performance and be happy with it.

I think he is doing a little better than OK.  The whole Beard situation had the potential of completely splintering the team going into a brutal Big-12 slate.  I think he has done a great job under those circumstances. 

I mean, he is 8-1 with wins over Massey #16, at #32, #41, at #59.  Only loss was to the #11 team (although it was pretty painful). Yes it seems like we should be winning bigger than we are, but a lot of those would be close losses in previous years. 

Again, I think we can do better, but give the man his due. 

[Js1 85310]

27 minutes ago, slorch said:

LMAO at the mindset that Terry isn't "fancy enough." because that is what a bunch of y'all are saying.

Fancy gets you jack shit.   Not saying terry is the answer, but automatically writing him off is a pure UT athletics move.

It’s not that he isn’t fancy. It’s that he’s not been a HC worth hiring at a program like Texas to run the whole damn thing.

CDC’s MO is not to hire a mediocre former G5 coach. The last interim at Texas to get promoted to full time led the team to a national title, but at least he had P5 experience as the former HC at Michigan prior to Texas.

I hope he goes on a nice run to the Sweet 16 or beyond and Texas hires Oats and Terry stays or gets a pretty good G5/lower P5 gig.

Y’all can have him if you want, actually. Since you seem to think he’s legit 

[Guest]

27 minutes ago, slorch said:

I don't dispute Beard's accolades.

The other mindset I described absolutely exists though.

It does, but more in football and baseball. See the Sark hire response. In basketball we have a very pedestrian history for a school of our overall athletic stature.  We have the Barnes years of ‘01-‘08, Penders’ E8 year, and then a bunch of average basketball overall in between. I don’t think we expect Coach K - except when we might have JUST lost our Coach K. That is human nature. 

Edited January 16, 2023 by Porterhouse

[perfectchaos007 6634]

36 minutes ago, ClubWhatever said:

I know nothing about Oats, but how does this article impugn him?  Did he recruit this fellow?

Only way I could see this affecting Oats in any way is if they somehow tie this murder with "lack of institutional control", but that seems like a major stretch 

Edited January 16, 2023 by perfectchaos007

[UTEE97 3518]

3 hours ago, slorch said:

a Sweet 16, Big XII COTY,  and struggling after turning over roster, yet still has promise.

Not too shabby. To be fair Adams is probably gone after this season, regardless.  We'll see.

We will take the sweet 16 this year and hire someone else at the end of the season so as not to replicate Tech's mistakes.

Edited January 16, 2023 by UTEE97

[SL Xpress 7513]

5 hours ago, HookEm said:

If Terry gives us a solid tourney run (Sweet 16 all the way up to potential Final Four), I’m fine giving him another year. Or give him a multi year deal, but with a very low buyout. But under no circumstances would I sign him to a long term deal without multiple good years.

That's not realistic. You can't recruit with a one year deal. And Texas is going to pay him a market rate for a head coach. It won't be $5m per year, but they're not going to cheapen the deal. Not to mention he's going to get 4 years regardless, unless he's Charlie Strong bad. 

Texas has had so few Elite Eight runs in its history - never mind Final Fours, of which it only has 1 in the 64 team era, and one more in the 40s when only 4 teams were invited. You have to give him the job at that point. I wouldn't be happy with it, because there is nothing Rodney Terry is going to do this year to make me a believer. But he'd certainly deserve it, regardless of my feelings about him as a coach. 

I guess you have to give him the job with a Sweet Sixteen run. Although man, I really struggle with that one. Rodney Terry is not a leader. Honestly, I'm just kind of dreading it. Which sucks. 

I really want to see who Texas can bring in. I'm hopeful we can make another really great hire. 

[SL Xpress 7513]

1 hour ago, slorch said:

LMAO at the mindset that Terry isn't "fancy enough." because that is what a bunch of y'all are saying.

Fancy gets you jack shit.   Not saying terry is the answer, but automatically writing him off is a pure UT athletics move.

 

I can't speak to being "fancy enough." I don't think I care about fancy all that much, although I'm not sure what you mean by it here.

But Rodney Terry didn't exactly just step on the 40 acres. He was a long time assistant under Barnes. I didn't have a great opinion of him then. I always liked the other assistants on staff more than him. Frank Haith. Rob Lanier. Russ Springmann. I didn't like his command of X's and O's. I thought he was a good recruiter, but not necessarily great. He was always extremely loyal to Barnes - EXTREMELY - and I'm assuming the same could be said for Beard. But I have no faith in him being a top 10 in the country type head coach. And his track record at Fresno State and UTEP dove tails with that. Frankly, when I watch the team play with him in charge post arrest, they're not as organized, the substitution patterns don't make as much sense, they're not as fundamentally sound on both ends of the floor - the team just isn't as good. It's a step down from Beard on virtually every level. I don't want to put up with multiple years of that. 

So I don't know if that means I'm automatically writing him off, but I'm definitely writing him off. Hey, he's got an extended job interview right now. He makes a deep run in the tournament, they're going to have to keep him. That's just how it is. 

[Underdog 28611]

5 hours ago, Porterhouse said:

Terry has zero chance. Discussion of Terry is initiated by idiots. Someone said Steve Fisher above as a comp. Lol. Lemme know when Terry wins a natty. This roster isn’t good enough to win a natty without a great coach getting lucky, and Terry let KSU score 116 points in Austin. He’s not getting a short-term deal, either. For fuck’s sake, think before you post. 

Reading is fundamental. 

[billfromlaketravis 11456]

The team looks different post Beard. They’re playing hard, but extremely dumb. I think back to the washing machine analogy in Christmas Vacation. 
 

Probably need a perfect draw to make the Elite 8.

This is a damned shame. Rice is already one of my favorite players of the last 20 years. 

Edited January 16, 2023 by billfromlaketravis

[shadow_operative 15932]

kenpom schedule prediction under chris beard:

 

kenpom schedule prediction after a few weeks of rodney terry:

 

all of this talk about what terry could do to become our next HC is insane. have you people not been watching or something? this team looks nothing like it did under beard, we are markedly worse across the board. we were smothering teams in defense while pushing the tempo on offense and scoring efficiently. now we have no identity, and are a clearly inferior team. i cant believe how many posts have been dedicated to talking about rodney terry becoming our next HC. it's ridiculous. the same board that crushes Barnes and his results now wants to talk about hiring one of his former assistants who is a vastly inferior coach. this beard situation has exposed how little our fans know/care about basketball. 

[Js1 85310]

Thank you Derka 

Edited January 16, 2023 by Js1

[billfromlaketravis 11456]

I want Terry to remain on staff. He’s a recruiting witch, but a poor HC. He probably understands this as he left a HC position to be an assistant at Texas. 
 

Is Oats out now because one of his players caught a murder charge? I’d say Belmont should be cautious for sure given what Beard put us through. 

[TommysTinyTowels 785]

Terry’s path to the job is CDC getting turned down by probably Oats first, then Musselman and then maybe Cal or whoever else CDC has on his “why not give them a call” list. If he keeps striking out suddenly Terry will be CDC’s favorite son and my fears will be realized.
The press and the support of whatever players/recruits we have left and how far he gets in the tourney will be a small influence.

*all bets are off if he wins the whole MF’er

 

[jimmyjazz 45898]

This team was built by Chris Beard to play a certain way.  Rodney Terry either refuses to or simply can't coach them in that manner.

Hiring Rodney Terry would basically be a complete crapshoot, even if he had made a deep tournament run.  He clearly doesn't value the same skill sets or style of play that Chris Beard did.  So, we'd be watching him retool the program and hoping he doesn't completely fuck us over in the meantime.

We are benefitting from Beard's obsession with tough-minded, (mostly) mature athletes who tend to be fairly selfless.  Rodney doesn't seem to be able to connect with those guys, or at least extract the same level of play from them.  He would likely be unable to continue to recruit them, even though he has had a decent hand in getting these guys on campus, because they came to play for Beard, not Terry.

It would be one of the worst decisions possible.  If we're gonna move away from Beard's style of coaching and play, then let's at least find someone who has already succeeded at P5 basketball more than Rodney Terry has.

[HookEm 2467]

I don’t think a single person on this board is advocating for hiring Rodney Terry.

I’m only saying that it is possible for me to change my mind. But having watched the team the last few weeks, it is incredibly unlikely.

[Js1 85310]

13 minutes ago, billfromlaketravis said:

I want Terry to remain on staff. He’s a recruiting witch, but a poor HC. He probably understands this as he left a HC position to be an assistant at Texas. 
 

Is Oats out now because one of his players caught a murder charge? I’d say Belmont should be cautious for sure given what Beard put us through. 

I don’t think so. Oats didn’t murder someone or was an accessory 

[jimmyjazz 45898]

51 minutes ago, Js1 said:

I don’t think so. Oats didn’t murder someone or was an accessory 

Yeah, 'bama ain't Baylor.

[El Squared 1802]

7 hours ago, Porterhouse said:

Terry has zero chance. Discussion of Terry is initiated by idiots. Someone said Steve Fisher above as a comp. Lol. Lemme know when Terry wins a natty. This roster isn’t good enough to win a natty without a great coach getting lucky, and Terry let KSU score 116 points in Austin. He’s not getting a short-term deal, either. For fuck’s sake, think before you post. 

Interesting as to why a guy that didn’t succeed as HC in a couple other spots now as an assistant found the light and should take control. Not saying it cannot happen but is it really reasonable to expect success at the next level from  Terry’s resume?

[El Squared 1802]

1 hour ago, billfromlaketravis said:

I want Terry to remain on staff. He’s a recruiting witch, but a poor HC. He probably understands this as he left a HC position to be an assistant at Texas. 
 

Is Oats out now because one of his players caught a murder charge? I’d say Belmont should be cautious for sure given what Beard put us through. 

Unless Oates supplied the murder weapon or covered up the crime somehow , his elimination as a candidate is quite premature.

[HornOnTheBayou 8921]

The tournament is a crap shoot. The number of games we win in this year's tournament should have absolutely no bearing on whether or not Terry is the future coach. We'll probably end up in the 3-6 seed range which means heavy favorite in the first round, toss-up to make the sweet 16. So we're going to base the next coaching hire on if Cunningham can make a couple of his threes? That's asinine. 

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Underdog said:

Reading is fundamental. 

You’ve got to qualify your statement.  I already said if Terry wins a natty, keep him. I also gave multiple reasons why Terry cannot and won’t do what Fisher did. Reading is fundamental. 

[Rickylovesweed 14293]

2 hours ago, TommysTinyTowels said:

Terry’s path to the job is CDC getting turned down by probably Oats first, then Musselman and then maybe Cal or whoever else CDC has on his “why not give them a call” list. If he keeps striking out suddenly Terry will be CDC’s favorite son and my fears will be realized.
The press and the support of whatever players/recruits we have left and how far he gets in the tourney will be a small influence.

*all bets are off if he wins the whole MF’er

 

There are about 10 candidates that CDC would have to miss on before Terry is the option. 

[Rickylovesweed 14293]

The team definitely looks different post-Beard but I would say the primary reason all boils down to Hunter.

He's terrible right now. Not sure the team would look like it did with Beard but that would solve a lot of problems if Hunter started playing better. 

[Hermanator 7038]

3 hours ago, billfromlaketravis said:

 

Is Oats out now because one of his players caught a murder charge? I’d say Belmont should be cautious for sure given what Beard put us through. 

"His players are murdering people? 

Runs too loose of a ship. No accountability.

Would look bad on the university. "

 - Surly Non Basketball fans who like to put their bullshit here but never watch a game. 

 

Of course they'd still hire him since he didn't get arrested. But is hiring the coach who's recruiting murderers all that much better than giving your own winning coach who had a single off the court incident a 2nd chance?

1 hour ago, HornOnTheBayou said:

The tournament is a crap shoot. The number of games we win in this year's tournament should have absolutely no bearing on whether or not Terry is the future coach. We'll probably end up in the 3-6 seed range which means heavy favorite in the first round, toss-up to make the sweet 16. So we're going to base the next coaching hire on if Cunningham can make a couple of his threes? That's asinine. 

If we end up as a six 6 the rest of conference went horribly wrong. Like only winning 1 or 2 more game the rest of the season wrong. 

[BigOrange1 6436]

11 minutes ago, Hermanator said:

"His players are murdering people? 

Runs too loose of a ship. No accountability.

Would look bad on the university. "

 - Surly Non Basketball fans who like to put their bullshit here but never watch a game. 

 

Of course they'd still hire him since he didn't get arrested. But is hiring the coach who's recruiting murderers all that much better than giving your own winning coach who had a single off the court incident a 2nd chance?

If we end up as a six 6 the rest of conference went horribly wrong. Like only winning 1 or 2 more game the rest of the season wrong. 

you've proven repeatedly that you're a fucking moron but if you think a 17-16 team is going to be a six seed you're even dumber than you appear to be.

[SL Xpress 7513]

3 hours ago, billfromlaketravis said:

I want Terry to remain on staff. He’s a recruiting witch, but a poor HC. He probably understands this as he left a HC position to be an assistant at Texas. 

 

He's not a recruiting witch. He's a good recruiter. Not a great recruiter. If things hadn't happened with Beard and Terry had left for somewhere else, the staff wouldn't have missed a beat. He's loyal, and he knows the ends and outs of the UT hierarchy and money guys. That's valuable, but it's not something that can't be learned by someone else. This idea that he's some kind of recruiting god gets parroted around here a lot. He's not, and he never has been. He's good, not great. I wouldn't mind seeing him stay on staff if that's what he and the new guy chooses, but I won't be shedding any tears if he and UT have to part ways. I'll be grateful for his time at Texas, and especially stepping in in an inadequate way under difficult circumstances.

[Hermanator 7038]

8 minutes ago, BigOrange1 said:

you've proven repeatedly that you're a fucking moron but if you think a 17-16 team is going to be a six seed you're even dumber than you appear to be.

It was an exaggeration but they would have to shit the bed royally to be a 6 seed. No need to get emotional and start name calling. But I guess if that's what you want I don't mind doing it too you worthless pie faced cunt

[SL Xpress 7513]

4 hours ago, longhornmatt said:

Terry would get the job if we go to the Final Four or better.  He won't if we go the Sweet Sixteen, and I really doubt it even with an Elite Eight.  This team was number 2 in the country when Beard's shit hit the fan. Everyone knows we were a championship contender, and everyone knows Rodney Terry isn't the hottest coaching candidate we could get.  He only gets the job if the team does so well this year that the fanbase falls in love, and that only happens with a Final Four.  We may not have a history of actual success, but we have expectations as if we do.  Texas and this fanbase don't get all hot and bothered by anything less than truly competing to win it all.   

The drop off has already been noticeable enough that I doubt we ever get to test this theory, anyway.  I hope we keep winning and go on a run, but this feels much more like a team walking a tightrope (like some of Barnes's teams that started strong and withered away, except with a much more obvious catalyst) than a team that is gearing up to contend for a Big 12 title, much less a national title.

The conference slate is heavily back loaded, too. 

I don't know. I don't see any way Terry does well enough to keep the job, but I'll have that fear until the season is over. 

[Rickylovesweed 14293]

54 minutes ago, SL Xpress said:

 

He's not a recruiting witch. He's a good recruiter. Not a great recruiter. If things hadn't happened with Beard and Terry had left for somewhere else, the staff wouldn't have missed a beat. He's loyal, and he knows the ends and outs of the UT hierarchy and money guys. That's valuable, but it's not something that can't be learned by someone else. This idea that he's some kind of recruiting god gets parroted around here a lot. He's not, and he never has been. He's good, not great. I wouldn't mind seeing him stay on staff if that's what he and the new guy chooses, but I won't be shedding any tears if he and UT have to part ways. I'll be grateful for his time at Texas, and especially stepping in in an inadequate way under difficult circumstances.

But a lot of players do like him. He would help keep players here which is valuable. 

Keeping a few of Morris, Hunter, Mitchell (long-shot), Anamekwe, and Brumbraugh would go a long way next year. 

[SL Xpress 7513]

50 minutes ago, Rickylovesweed said:

But a lot of players do like him. He would help keep players here which is valuable. 

Keeping a few of Morris, Hunter, Mitchell (long-shot), Anamekwe, and Brumbraugh would go a long way next year. 

It doesn't matter. Players can move on. They're not going to stay because Terry was kept as an assistant, and it's not worth trying to create continuity if you're hiring the wrong coach to do it. Which Terry is. 

The right coach will get his players in quickly. Especially with the portal and the people committed to making NIL work. 

Edit - btw, the more staff that we keep on in Austin, the more staff that will be gutted once Beard gets another job, especially a decent one, which I think is going to happen extremely quickly after the charges are dropped. It's extraordinarily doubtful we're hiring anyone as charismatic as Beard, who support staff will stick around for even though Beard is the one who hired them. Unless the wage discrepancy is so high they simply don't see themselves being able to afford the move. 

Edited January 16, 2023 by SL Xpress

[hobbes2702 13032]

6 hours ago, Hermanator said:

"His players are murdering people? 

Runs too loose of a ship. No accountability.

Would look bad on the university. "

 - Surly Non Basketball fans who like to put their bullshit here but never watch a game. 

 

Of course they'd still hire him since he didn't get arrested. But is hiring the coach who's recruiting murderers all that much better than giving your own winning coach who had a single off the court incident a 2nd chance?

If we end up as a six 6 the rest of conference went horribly wrong. Like only winning 1 or 2 more game the rest of the season wrong. 

Somehow every post you make is dumber

[Burt Macklin 19020]

19 hours ago, Deej said:

That's one way to punish his fiance...make her live in College Station.

Think of what that would do to her career. Trewly Clean Chicken Coops just doesn’t have the same ring to it. 

[Red Five 40852]

9 hours ago, Hermanator said:

But is hiring the coach who's recruiting murderers all that much better than giving your own winning coach who had a single off the court incident a 2nd chance?

Hur dur. Dude just stop. 

[MotownHorn 1761]

13 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

kenpom schedule prediction under chris beard:

 

kenpom schedule prediction after a few weeks of rodney terry:

 

all of this talk about what terry could do to become our next HC is insane. have you people not been watching or something? this team looks nothing like it did under beard, we are markedly worse across the board. we were smothering teams in defense while pushing the tempo on offense and scoring efficiently. now we have no identity, and are a clearly inferior team. i cant believe how many posts have been dedicated to talking about rodney terry becoming our next HC. it's ridiculous. the same board that crushes Barnes and his results now wants to talk about hiring one of his former assistants who is a vastly inferior coach. this beard situation has exposed how little our fans know/care about basketball. 

I'm truly not trying to argue or belittle you here, but personally I care a lot more about the actual games themselves than KenPom predictions.

And we're 7-1 in the games themselves. With the one loss coming when the other team's players all looked like cross between peak Michael Jordan and peak Steph Curry.

Personally I'm just gonna sit back and see how the games play out. 

[Post Oak 20209]

10 hours ago, Hermanator said:

"His players are murdering people? 

Runs too loose of a ship. No accountability.

Would look bad on the university. "

 - Surly Non Basketball fans who like to put their bullshit here but never watch a game. 

 

Of course they'd still hire him since he didn't get arrested. But is hiring the coach who's recruiting murderers all that much better than giving your own winning coach who had a single off the court incident a 2nd chance?

If we end up as a six 6 the rest of conference went horribly wrong. Like only winning 1 or 2 more game the rest of the season wrong. 

You seem pretty set on minimizing the DV angle which seems strange to me.  I'm trying to think of other people who might try to minimize domestic violence incidents. 

[BigOrange1 6436]

10 hours ago, Hermanator said:

It was an exaggeration but they would have to shit the bed royally to be a 6 seed. No need to get emotional and start name calling. But I guess if that's what you want I don't mind doing it too you worthless pie faced cunt

this team's 4 conference wins are by a combined 17 points.  take out the ok state game and 3 of the wins are by a combined 7 points.  if you don't think losses are coming, you aren't watching the same team I am.  if they finish 10-8 in conference play and lose the tennessee game, that is a 21-10 regular season.  that is a 5-6 seed resume.  that is completely feasible and would not consist of shitting the bed royally at all.

[Valmy77 13226]

Most of the key players in this team are seniors. This is a win or bust season and wanting to keep the team intact is not a reason to keep Terry. The team isn't going to be intact. 

Beard was building a culture where we could essentially reload every year. With him not around to do the reloading the next couple years might be rough, especially if we screw up this hire. Can Terry do that, even if he cuts down the nets in April? 

[Valmy77 13226]

46 minutes ago, BigOrange1 said:

this team's 4 conference wins are by a combined 17 points.  take out the ok state game and 3 of the wins are by a combined 7 points.  if you don't think losses are coming, you aren't watching the same team I am.  if they finish 10-8 in conference play and lose the tennessee game, that is a 21-10 regular season.  that is a 5-6 seed resume.  that is completely feasible and would not consist of shitting the bed royally at all.

They either stop fucking around in the first half or they will soon find...losses. You might be able to do this shit at home for a few games but yeah it is going to get ugly soon unless they play well in both halves.