UT's next basketball coach - discussion/debate

[Underdog 28,747]

I'd like to hear more about the pink sauce fountain. 

[jimmyjazz 45,996]

Oh shit.

[Pancho 44,861]

We are keeping Terry. Prepare yourselves.

[NoName 16,363]

4 minutes ago, Pancho said:

We are keeping Terry. Prepare yourselves.

[SL Xpress 7,516]

16 minutes ago, Pancho said:

We are keeping Terry. Prepare yourselves.

The good news is he’ll only be here 4 to 5 years at the most. 

[MoJames 8,244]

Just now, SL Xpress said:

The good news is he’ll only be here 4 to 5 years at the most. 

[Herpa Derpa 6,126]

14 minutes ago, Pancho said:

We are keeping Terry. Prepare yourselves.

Yep. He'll get votes for B12COY and NCOY for leading this team out of the morass to a conference title chance and a 1-3 seed. Hard to argue he hasn't done everything he can to earn a full shot. He's going to be given a chance to fail. Just hope he doesn't.

[UTEE97 3,522]

Has any of our young players improved throughout the season? Only Carr is playing better. SJR was a studd before he got here, so I don't attribute his performance to any coaching he received here. Allen has regressed or stayed about the same as last year. Neither Mitchell nor Morris improved as the season progressed. If you’re going to hire Terry, shouldn't you consider player development?

[jimmyjazz 45,996]

4 minutes ago, UTEE97 said:

If you’re going to hire Terry, shouldn't you consider player development?

We've never done so in football, why should we start with basketball?

[SL Xpress 7,516]

I know I'm Debbie Downer, and the team deserves our full support, but this is at the heart of my mixed feelings regarding their every success. It's not fair to the team. Heck, it's not fair to the staff, up to and including Rodney Terry. But I'm really unexcited about that guy being the next head coach. I know who that guy is. He's not changing. Expecting him to be better is not realistic, and won't happen. It doesn't mean he'll be bad, but he won't be great, and after not being great for 5 years we'll give someone else a crack at it. 

But it's not like there would be any guarantee if someone else got the job. I'd just prefer to roll the coach hiring dice with another option and see how it goes. 

I guess I just hope it ends up being enough of a magical season so the next five years of somewhat disappointing results ends up being worth it. 

[Hookem2147 21,344]

Jfc it is an Instagram post congratulating a coach for being named a finalist for an award.

You think the social media manager is involved in this search?

Some of y’all are ridiculous. Being anything but happy if this team wins important games down the stretch is being a little bitch, especially if your hesitation for happiness comes out of fear for something that hasn’t even happened. 

Edited February 17, 2023 by Hookem2147

[Hookem2147 21,344]

25 minutes ago, UTEE97 said:

Has any of our young players improved throughout the season?

‘Have any of our…..2…. young players who play improved throughout the season?’ Isn’t an argument I would spend much time on.

[SL Xpress 7,516]

25 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

Being anything but happy if this team wins important games down the stretch is being a little bitch, especially if your hesitation for happiness comes out of fear for something that hasn’t even happened. 

Sure. I don't have any problem being characterized as being a little bitch regarding my feelings about Terry being the next head coach and what circumstances lead to that. They still exist and that's that. 

I don't think it's a foregone conclusion, however. Some kind of decision will be made at the end of the season, when that occurs. So what happens between now and then will play a significant factor. 

[Js1 85,445]

31 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

Jfc it is an Instagram post congratulating a coach for being named a finalist for an award.

You think the social media manager is involved in this search?

 

Actually if the program didn’t even acknowledge it, THAT would be super shitty. 

[Pancho 44,861]

33 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

Jfc it is an Instagram post congratulating a coach for being named a finalist for an award.

You think the social media manager is involved in this search?

Some of y’all are ridiculous. Being anything but happy if this team wins important games down the stretch is being a little bitch, especially if your hesitation for happiness comes out of fear for something that hasn’t even happened. 

Literally no one said they were unhappy if the team wins. You just completely made this up.

[Hookem2147 21,344]

6 minutes ago, SL Xpress said:

So what happens between now and then will play a significant factor

We don’t know this. For all we know CDC has his mind made up that he’s going in another direction unless Terry takes us on some insane run.

And if this team makes the final 4 and we are “forced” to keep Terry then we will cross that bridge if we get there but that would be some first world type problems considering this would be an extremely attractive destination for players coming off a final 4 berth

 

Edited February 17, 2023 by Hookem2147

[SL Xpress 7,516]

1 minute ago, Hookem2147 said:

We don’t know this. For all we know CDC has his mind made up that he’s going in another direction "unless Terry takes us on some insane run."

And if this team makes the final 4 and we are “forced” to keep Terry then we will cross that bridge if we get there but that would be some first world type problems considering this would be an extremely attractive destination coming off a final 4 berth.

You literally just ended up agreeing with me, and yet you somehow make it sound like you're disagreeing. That's a gift.

[Hookem2147 21,344]

2 minutes ago, Pancho said:

Literally no one said they were unhappy if the team wins. You just completely made this up.

 

44 minutes ago, SL Xpress said:

I know I'm Debbie Downer, and the team deserves our full support, but this is at the heart of my mixed feelings regarding their every success.

 

[Pancho 44,861]

1 minute ago, Hookem2147 said:

 

 

Do you not know what mixed feelings mean? It’s been stated numerous times that we can be happy and want the team to succeed while also being sad we are keeping Terry. You can have both. 
 

What’s not clear is why you keep getting upset at this line of reasoning.

[Hookem2147 21,344]

3 minutes ago, SL Xpress said:

You literally just ended up agreeing with me, and yet you somehow make it sound like you're disagreeing. That's a gift.

I just went back and I misread your original post. Thought you said what happens between now and the start of the tournament will go a long way in determining Terry’s future.

If we go 5-0 in our next 5 games and they bow out in the second round, we know what is happening.

[SL Xpress 7,516]

4 minutes ago, Pancho said:

Literally no one said they were unhappy if the team wins. You just completely made this up.

Well, in fairness I've never been unhappy about the team winning, but I have mixed feelings about the team experiencing significant success. I'll also say I think it's fair if people want to attack me for that attitude. I attack myself in whatever small way. But it's still there. 

Like I've said to you, I don't think it's possible to separate the likelihood of Terry being the next head coach from how much success the team experiences under his watch. The two are indelibly conflated. But it's not like I'm truly unhappy when the team wins. That would be churlish. I'm simply not as unmitigatedly happy as I'd prefer. 

[SL Xpress 7,516]

2 minutes ago, Pancho said:

Do you not know what mixed feelings mean? It’s been stated numerous times that we can be happy and want the team to succeed while also being sad we are keeping Terry. You can have both. 
 

What’s not clear is why you keep getting upset at this line of reasoning.

That's how I feel right there. 

[Hookem2147 21,344]

Just now, Pancho said:

Do you not know what mixed feelings mean? It’s been stated numerous times that we can be happy and want the team to succeed while also being sad we are keeping Terry. You can have both. 
 

What’s not clear is why you keep getting upset at this line of reasoning.

Because if we are playing in the second weekend for the first time in 15 years a month from now, there ain’t gonna be one mixed emotion in my mind. I want us to go all the way.

Maybe I’m compartmentalizing this season and the coaching search differently than others. 

[UTEE97 3,522]

42 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

‘Have any of our…..2…. young players who play improved throughout the season?’ Isn’t an argument I would spend much time on.

You seem to be pro Terry no matter what. I won't expect you to "spend any time on" seeing if our two 5 stars got developed.

[jimmyjazz 45,996]

2 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

Because if we are playing in the second weekend for the first time in 15 years a month from now, there ain’t gonna be one mixed emotion in my mind. I want us to go all the way.

Maybe I’m compartmentalizing this season and the coaching search differently than others. 

How do you consistently misread almost every opinion on this thread?

[Hookem2147 21,344]

Just now, UTEE97 said:

You seem to be pro Terry no matter what. I won't expect you to "spend any time on" seeing if our two 5 stars got developed.

^coming from the guy who said Terry talks funny and players won’t listen to him. No agenda here!

Please point to one post I’ve made saying we should 100% keep Terry. Just one.

 

[UTEE97 3,522]

3 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

^coming from the guy who said Terry talks funny and players won’t listen to him. No agenda here!

Please point to one post I’ve made saying we should 100% keep Terry. Just one.

 

You may not have said it but you have been trying desperately to make points in favor of keeping him. It makes me wonder if there is a personal connection between the two of you.

As a Texas fan, you should want what's best for the program, not what's besr for a coach you like. If we hire Terry, it will be a step down from Beard. I don't think any fan should be championing for that. And yes, development should matter a lot. To me, wins and losses in the interim year mean less because they are less indicative of the future. You have to be able to look beyond the superficial if you're the AD. 

[Hookem2147 21,344]

34 minutes ago, UTEE97 said:

You may not have said it but you have been trying desperately to make points in favor of keeping him. It makes me wonder if there is a personal connection between the two of you.

As a Texas fan, you should want what's best for the program, not what's besr for a coach you like. If we hire Terry, it will be a step down from Beard. I don't think any fan should be championing for that. And yes, development should matter a lot. To me, wins and losses in the interim year mean less because they are less indicative of the future. You have to be able to look beyond the superficial if you're the AD. 

I’ll DM you a voice memo and you can let me know if we are related 

I was one of the first people in this thread throwing out names of external candidates. My preference is that we bring in an outside hire and try to retain Terry in some sort of assistant role to ensure that Holland and Johnson end up here. But I also acknowledge that the various scenarios of how this season could end could make that setup unrealistic.

Edited February 17, 2023 by Hookem2147

[jimmyjazz 45,996]

Anybody trying to handicap the exact scenario in which CDC has to extend a long-term offer to RT is dreaming.  He has so many factors to consider that most of us can't even begin to contemplate -- the school's reputation, the fans, the big money donors, the available pool of other coaches -- and we're basically in the dark.  CDC isn't.

All I can do is identify headwinds and tailwinds for Terry.  Kicking WVU's ass was a tailwind.  Shitting the bed against Tech was a headwind.  Beyond that?  I have no idea if a Final Four ices the deal, or if a Sweet Sixteen does the same.  What does a conference title do?  A conference tournament title?  A first-round loss in the NCAA?  (I'm pretty sure I know the answer to that one.)

Stop getting so fucking fussy about people not seeing it exactly the same way.  Yes, we are all bringing in our own biases.  My particular bias is that Terry was an absolutely "meh" D1 coach at two stops, so I don't have a lot of hope he will suddenly become a top 10 coach here.  Could I be wrong?  Oh, hell yes.  Ask my wife.

[Slacks 6,825]

2 hours ago, UTEE97 said:

 If you’re going to hire Terry, shouldn't you consider player development?

Do you know the player development plan, expectations, and metrics by which player development was expected to be measured?

Or are you making something up?

[UTEE97 3,522]

19 minutes ago, Slacks said:

Do you know the player development plan, expectations, and metrics by which player development was expected to be measured?

Or are you making something up?

It's not as complicated as you make it out to be. 5 star basketball recruits don't come with a 3-year development plan like football recruits. 

[realgreggym 835]

Player development does not occur during the season. Kids get experience during the season. Most of a players development comes during the offseason and usually the greatest increase in development comes after the kid's freshman year. If Coach Terry is our coach, you can determine whether or not, he and the staff are capable of player development. Until then, its 100% speculation.

[UTEE97 3,522]

16 minutes ago, realgreggym said:

Player development does not occur during the season. Kids get experience during the season. Most of a players development comes during the offseason and usually the greatest increase in development comes after the kid's freshman year. If Coach Terry is our coach, you can determine whether or not, he and the staff are capable of player development. Until then, its 100% speculation.

Experience leads to development. Mitchell's play has regressed throughout the season and Morris hasn't improved much. Both players get minutes but are rarely productive. There are other 5 star freshmen playing in the Big 12 that are contributing a lot to their teams. Don't even get me started on Tyrese Hunter. He was playing much better earlier in the season. 

Edited February 17, 2023 by UTEE97

[jimmyjazz 45,996]

Yeah, the idea that we can't yet judge the play of Dillon, Arterio, and Tyrese is lunacy.  I don't know the percentage of 5-stars who reach the end of their freshman season looking like a lottery pick, but Dillon and Arterio aren't at the top of my list.  Dillon may go on athleticism and potential, I get it, but I've seen a shit ton of 5-stars do more their freshman year.  I'd hazard a guess I've seen a shit-ton of other power 5 conference Freshman of the Year (or whatever) look better than Tyrese in year 2, also.

[ztejas 43,509]

9 minutes ago, UTEE97 said:

Mitchell's play has regressed throughout the season

That definitely isn't true. 

[realgreggym 835]

11 minutes ago, UTEE97 said:

Experience leads to development. Mitchell's play has regressed throughout the season and Morris hasn't improved much. Both players get minutes but are rarely productive. There are other 5 star freshmen playing in the Big 12 that are contributing a lot to their teams. Don't even get me started on Tyrese Hunter. He was playing much better earlier in the season. 

You can't compare our kids to kids on other teams. Every situation is different.  I will discuss Hunter when you know exactly what his situation is. You don't know and neither do I.  There was thought that he had been hurt but I think that his problems are more mental since Beard got fired, Also, when kids make the jump to college they may have to adjust and with someone like Mitchell who really was successful because of his athletic ability rather than having a game, it may take time.

[UTEE97 3,522]

17 minutes ago, ztejas said:

That definitely isn't true. 

[UTEE97 3,522]

6 minutes ago, realgreggym said:

You can't compare our kids to kids on other teams. Every situation is different.  I will discuss Hunter when you know exactly what his situation is. You don't know and neither do I.  There was thought that he had been hurt but I think that his problems are more mental since Beard got fired, Also, when kids make the jump to college they may have to adjust and with someone like Mitchell who really was successful because of his athletic ability rather than having a game, it may take time.

We can make excuses or we can accept the fact that neither of our young players have improved. I guess we all have our biases. 

[CTC2 2,798]

46 minutes ago, UTEE97 said:

Experience leads to development. Mitchell's play has regressed throughout the season and Morris hasn't improved much. Both players get minutes but are rarely productive. There are other 5 star freshmen playing in the Big 12 that are contributing a lot to their teams. Don't even get me started on Tyrese Hunter. He was playing much better earlier in the season. 

I don't think that is accurate about Mitchell.  

[realgreggym 835]

1 hour ago, UTEE97 said:

We can make excuses or we can accept the fact that neither of our young players have improved. I guess we all have our biases. 

I am not making excuses. I am speaking from experience. Believe whatever you like.

[shadow_operative 15,932]

4 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

How do you consistently misread almost every opinion on this thread?

ive been trying to figure out who hookem2147 actually is, and i'm zeroing in on him being immortal. it would explain a lot.

[shadow_operative 15,932]

2 hours ago, realgreggym said:

Player development does not occur during the season. Kids get experience during the season. Most of a players development comes during the offseason and usually the greatest increase in development comes after the kid's freshman year. If Coach Terry is our coach, you can determine whether or not, he and the staff are capable of player development. Until then, its 100% speculation.

player development happens during the season all the time, especially with stud freshmen. jarrett allen was mediocre to at times terrible during the non con schedule his freshman year, only to end up being a totally different player during conference season. there's an adjustment period, particularly for most 5* stud freshmen who've been the unquestioned alpha their entire lives. it's not unreasonable to want or expect your 5*, potential one-and-done freshmen to get better as the season goes along.

[shadow_operative 15,932]

er, wait, what i meant to say was 😂👌🏼😳💰😍🏆🙏🏼🤮🙄👏🏼🏆👊🏼🥳🥶🥵😱🤯🫠😵‍💫🤑👺😈💩👻😹👅👶🏾👮🏻

Edited February 18, 2023 by shadow_operative

[UTEE97 3,522]

Surly likes to argue just for argument's sake, even on topics that should be evident to everyone, like players not getting better throughout the season. I know we are used to sucking in major sports for a long time, but it doesn't have to continue. We don't have to settle any more!

[realgreggym 835]

52 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

player development happens during the season all the time, especially with stud freshmen. jarrett allen was mediocre to at times terrible during the non con schedule his freshman year, only to end up being a totally different player during conference season. there's an adjustment period, particularly for most 5* stud freshmen who've been the unquestioned alpha their entire lives. it's not unreasonable to want or expect your 5*, potential one-and-done freshmen to get better as the season goes along.

You're making my point. You're confusing experience for development. Development is when you are in the off season and go to the gym and shoot 300 or 400 3s a day. Development is when you hit the weight room to get bigger and stronger. It's when you practice improving your skills. That doesn't mean that you don't get netter during the season but it's the hard work during the off season that makes you more successful during the season.

[Slacks 6,825]

4 hours ago, UTEE97 said:

It's not as complicated as you make it out to be. 5 star basketball recruits don't come with a 3-year development plan like football recruits. 

Terry has been their head coach for how long? 

Come on, man. The dude just became the coach two months ago.  How tf is he supposed to significantly develop players in two months after unexpectedly becoming head coach one day out of the blue? John Wooden wouldn't be able to do that.

Why can't winning be the bar? Can we not just win games and be happy?

Narrator: No. No they cannot.

 

 

[Catdaddyhorn 3,446]

On 2/15/2023 at 8:46 PM, shadow_operative said:

it would be hilarious if we hired buzz williams and then won a bunch of titles. anyone here have an in with the basketball gods?

Just because you still love Buzz Williams despite his incredible level of suck doesn't mean the rest of us do. 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

36 minutes ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

Just because you still love Buzz Williams despite his incredible level of suck doesn't mean the rest of us do. 

lol i definitely no longer am wanting him to be considered as a potential HC here, i just think that would be hilarious. 

[UTEE97 3,522]

3 hours ago, Slacks said:

Terry has been their head coach for how long? 

Come on, man. The dude just became the coach two months ago.  How tf is he supposed to significantly develop players in two months after unexpectedly becoming head coach one day out of the blue? John Wooden wouldn't be able to do that.

Why can't winning be the bar? Can we not just win games and be happy?

Narrator: No. No they cannot.

 

 

Who said we are not happy to be winning? We are discussing if he should be our next coach, and most people believe that we should aim higher. We still have a tough stretch of games left, so we will see if we can keep winning at the same rate. Also, winning this year may not mean winning next year when all the veteran guys are gone. That's why we are discussing if he can develop young players. 

[shadow_operative 15,932]

when shaka was shoved out, how many assistant coaches did we want to hire? how many assistants did CDC interview for the position? zero and zero? right.

so, now that we're replacing an actual elite cbb coach, why do so many suddenly think we're going to hire a guy who started this season as an assistant? is RT the best assistant coach in America? is he an up and coming wunderkind? no? then why does anyone here think that CDC is even entertaining the idea of hiring Terry barring a final four/national title run? i just don't get it at all, how so many people here can think so lowly of CDC to think that he's just sitting there waiting to see how far we go in the tour ey before he figures out if RT is right for the job or not.