UT's next basketball coach - discussion/debate

[shadow_operative 15932]

11 minutes ago, ztejas said:

It wouldn't even be close. 

seriously. they've already done these polls, and UVA doesn't land anywhere on the list, while Texas is essentially behind only the blue bloods in terms of how desirable the job is. rex is clueless as usual. you have to really, really not know what the hell you're talking about to claim that UVA is "clearly superior" to Texas when it comes to where you could build a winning program. just totally clueless. 

[David Dennison 18772]

3 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

seriously. they've already done these polls, and UVA doesn't land anywhere on the list, while Texas is essentially behind only the blue bloods in terms of how desirable the job is. rex is clueless as usual. you have to really, really not know what the hell you're talking about to claim that UVA is "clearly superior" to Texas when it comes to where you could build a winning program. just totally clueless. 

This is correct, all things being equal. In the case of Tony Bennett, however, the situation is a little different because he already heads a winning program that is more successful than Texas. 

[Guest]

34 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

This is correct, all things being equal. In the case of Tony Bennett, however, the situation is a little different because he already heads a winning program that is more successful than Texas. 

I’ve got the fat mental case on Ignore but a terrible feature of that is viewing quoted posts. Lol at polling. I imagine the football job would ‘poll’ the same way. I strongly suspect we are a program that polls well in these surveys, but when it comes to nut cutting time, targeted coaches don’t ultimately join us - “that’s an attractive job, but the headache and expectations aren’t for me”. So, polling ultimately means dick. Beard was obviously a great get, but we had a clear inside track. I am anxious to see what transpires now and hope I’m wrong. My comments were made expressly with Tony Bennett in mind, and my quoted thought above is likely similar to what he’s say. 

[MotownHorn 1742]

12 hours ago, MAUFRAIS said:

What about Dave matthews? We have one less of him.

I see that as advantage Austin, personally 

[MAUFRAIS 6591]

Of course. Coming from a town with such an iconic music tradition.

[Js1 85166]

6 minutes ago, Porterhouse said:

“that’s an attractive job, but the headache and expectations aren’t for me”

So they're mentally weak coaches because they can't handle that? Every program has expectations, pressure and headaches.  Shitty ADs, meddling boosters, expectations of making the 2nd weekend without a 15 year gap in between, actually competing for a conference title. 

Jesus Christ, if you can make the Sweet 16 once every 2 or 3 years at Texas, you'll get an extension and a raise.  Sprinkle in an Elite 8 every 3-5 years and the occasional Final Four once or twice a decade and it's your job for as long as you want it. 

Also, the so-called "headache" that is LHN will be gone, donezo, kaput after the 2023-24 athletic season. I also think it's not much of a headache.  Being employed by DeLoss, Patterson and Perrin was a bigger headache than LHN.  

[Texas Wahoo 3383]

1 hour ago, David Dennison said:

This is correct, all things being equal. In the case of Tony Bennett, however, the situation is a little different because he already heads a winning program that is more successful than Texas. 

I think the biggest potential fly in the ointment is that Bennett already won a title at UVA.  While that will not keep him in his job forever, it will buy him a hell of a lot of goodwill even if he goes through a few tough seasons.

[Texas Wahoo 3383]

20 hours ago, Prepuce of Doom said:

A portion of our fanbase will never like anyone. It's not always the same people, but we still have a bunch of idiots who are seriously butthurt over Self leaving for Kansas 20 years ago. And others upset that we hired Bruce Weber instead of Thad Matta. Every fanbase has these people, but I think we have more vocal "perpetual malcontents" than many. 

But you're not wrong - we have lost a lot of games this season in ways that are very disappointing and troubling, and which do not inspire a ton of confidence in how things are going. We might just have a shitty/uncoachable roster somehow, and our lack of depth at PG is a real problem, but the fact that we could beat anyone or lose to anyone on any given night doesn't elicit a ton of faith in the leadership. 

I don't think our AD would let him go without a big fight, and while I count myself among the concerned and annoyed based on how this team has fizzled, and how all of our tournament exits under BU have gone down, I think it would be nuts to let him get away right now. 

But if he did, my first call would be to Dennis Gates at MizNoz. 

For what little it's worth, some of "insiders" at Illinois seem to think that Calipari is the most likely to end up at Texas due to interest on both sides, with Jerome Tang (reportedly not interested), Eric Musselman, and Underwood as the next tier of targets. Allegedly, CDC personally dislikes Sean Miller. No idea how reliable this is though... 

I do not follow Illinois basketball other than my dad, who went there for undergrad.  He gets his news from places like espn.com and "watches" the games through a play by play app when he watches anything, so he's not exactly plugged into the program.  However, he has seen enough articles about Underwood treating the players poorly that he seems to be a bit predisposed to be skeptical of Underwood.

[Eskimohorn 5625]

I don’t know what D1 coaches would say. Seems like you do and I’m not sure why. 
The bullshit that coaches in football and then basketball from winning here. If coaches are in it to win, then UVA is clearly superior. 

In my lifetime, UVA has had 2 Top 25 finishes without Tony Bennett and Ralph Sampson. Take those dudes away, and they’re wandering the wilderness.

8/15 Top 25 all-time are during Bennett’s tenure, since 1970 when that was a thing.

[jimmyjazz 45679]

I don't know about Top 25, but I know they played Houston in the Final Four w/o Sampson.  They were definitely a bit of a fleeting "blueblood", though.  Their track record isn't historically as strong as most would think.

It's no coincidence one of their endearing legacies is their loss to Chaminade.

Edited March 1, 2023 by jimmyjazz

[royiv 9180]

8 minutes ago, Eskimohorn said:

In my lifetime, UVA has had 2 Top 25 finishes without Tony Bennett and Ralph Sampson. Take those dudes away, and they’re wandering the wilderness.

8/15 Top 25 all-time are during Bennett’s tenure, since 1970 when that was a thing.

To be fair, you could come up with a very similar metric for Texas during that same time period.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Js1 said:

So they're mentally weak coaches because they can't handle that? Every program has expectations, pressure and headaches.  Shitty ADs, meddling boosters, expectations of making the 2nd weekend without a 15 year gap in between, actually competing for a conference title. 

Jesus Christ, if you can make the Sweet 16 once every 2 or 3 years at Texas, you'll get an extension and a raise.  Sprinkle in an Elite 8 every 3-5 years and the occasional Final Four once or twice a decade and it's your job for as long as you want it. 

Also, the so-called "headache" that is LHN will be gone, donezo, kaput after the 2023-24 athletic season. I also think it's not much of a headache.  Being employed by DeLoss, Patterson and Perrin was a bigger headache than LHN.  

Patterson yes, DeLoss and Perrin were great relative to LHN commitments. I don’t think the expectations are unreasonable for hoops, and probably overspoke, but I wouldn’t want to leave a great gig to fuck with LHN for even 1 year. But y’all are speaking like we are a destination school in hoops and we aren’t. 

[Eskimohorn 5625]

To be fair, you could come up with a very similar metric for Texas during that same time period.

Yeah Rick Barnes is responsible for 8/11. And late Barnes/Shaka era isnt pretty. But Penders made us more relevant in recruiting and lifetime we have better winning % by about 30 points.

[Guest]

25 minutes ago, Eskimohorn said:

In my lifetime, UVA has had 2 Top 25 finishes without Tony Bennett and Ralph Sampson. Take those dudes away, and they’re wandering the wilderness.

8/15 Top 25 all-time are during Bennett’s tenure, since 1970 when that was a thing.

Stated otherwise: 1 title and 3 FFs since ‘81, and a better history than Texas. 

[jimmyjazz 45679]

13 minutes ago, Porterhouse said:

Stated otherwise: 1 title and 3 FFs since ‘81, and a better history than Texas. 

Nobody said Texas has a better history than UVa, you fucking stooge.

[Guest]

39 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Nobody said Texas has a better history than UVa, you fucking stooge.

I never said they did.  By the way, the poster I responded to was strongly suggesting just that. Why are you so angry?

[jimmyjazz 45679]

3 minutes ago, Porterhouse said:

I never said they did.  By the way, the poster I responded to was strongly suggesting just that. Why are you so angry?

No he wasn't.  Look, we're all well aware that UVa won a recent title and had a good run with Sampson on the court.  I don't think anyone would suggest Texas can historically equal that.  Can we put this to bed?

[Red Five 40724]

1 hour ago, Eskimohorn said:

Yeah Rick Barnes is responsible for 8/11.

I at first read this.... differently. ("where's the damn popcorn gif??")

[Prepuce of Doom 21036]

2 hours ago, Texas Wahoo said:

I do not follow Illinois basketball other than my dad, who went there for undergrad.  He gets his news from places like espn.com and "watches" the games through a play by play app when he watches anything, so he's not exactly plugged into the program.  However, he has seen enough articles about Underwood treating the players poorly that he seems to be a bit predisposed to be skeptical of Underwood.

I don't want to derail this thread any more than to just agree that Underwood is definitely a shouter, and the fanbase has very polarized opinions on whether this is okay or not, but at this point, none of the players should be surprised by that. Some prefer that style of coaching, while others definitely don't.

Underwood's time in Champaign pretty closely correlates with the recent "wild west" landscape of college basketball with the less restrictive transfer rules, the COVID year exception fucking up class balance and eligibility, and of course the entire NIL situation, so I don't think it's fair to conclude that he has a greater degree of player departures than average, even though that may objectively be the case. But he also inherited a complete dumpster fire, so some amount of roster turnover is to be expected anyway. 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

No he wasn't.  Look, we're all well aware that UVa won a recent title and had a good run with Sampson on the court.  I don't think anyone would suggest Texas can historically equal that.  Can we put this to bed?

[HookEm 2450]

I think UT can make a very attractive offer to Bennett - and Austin is right smack in the center of a lot of talent in Texas.  But lets not act like Charlottesville is a long way from any good talent.  They are within an easy drive of talent hotbeds of in DC, Maryland, North Carolina and Pennsylvania.  And Virginia itself has good talent.  And the whole Northeast is MUCH closer than in Austin. 

Bottom line, I don't think PROXIMITY to talent will make a difference.  Ability to GET that talent with big NIL deals is a different story.  

 

[Eskimohorn 5625]

I never said they did.  By the way, the poster I responded to was strongly suggesting just that. Why are you so angry?

Bennett and Ralph Sampson (freak talent) are two individuals most responsible for their history. Between Bennett and Sampson they were worse than Texas. Historically they have a lower winning % by a significant margin.

Remove Bennett from the equation, they instantly become 2nd tier. They’re Clemson or BC. Texas has more to offer recruits and coaches. Bennett is part of their program prestige.

With that being said: Great university. Beautiful small town. Think quality of life checkmark goes to Cville.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Eskimohorn said:

Bennett and Ralph Sampson (freak talent) are two individuals most responsible for their history. Between Bennett and Sampson they were worse than Texas. Historically they have a lower winning % by a significant margin.

Remove Bennett from the equation, they instantly become 2nd tier. They’re Clemson or BC. Texas has more to offer recruits and coaches. Bennett is part of their program prestige.

With that being said: Great university. Beautiful small town. Think quality of life checkmark goes to Cville.

Okay. But not to Bennett. I think you should cross him off (then). 

And lol at “except for Sampson and the guy who is coaching them right now, the one that won a title”. You can’t fucking exclude those things. 

[SL Xpress 7505]

3 minutes ago, Porterhouse said:

Okay. But not to Bennett. I think you should cross him off (then). 

And lol at “except for Sampson and the guy who is coaching them right now, the one that won a title”. You can’t fucking exclude those things. 

I don't know who we get if we move on from Terry.

But if we make a list of outlandish hires, starting with Jay Wright, Billy Donovan, moving on to Eric Musselman, Tony Bennett seems like the least outlandish. Which is not the same to say he's likely. But no one on this thread is saying that anyway. It's a hopeful thread, with people talking about who they'd hope to have Texas hire. Not the slam dunk thread where we're talking about the coach at North Texas. There's no one on the slam dunk thread that's going to get our juices flowing, so why bother spending time talking about who they might be?

[Js1 85166]

Sorry RT

[Loop 1604 227]

Keeping RT would be a massive mistake CDC. I hope you know that…

[shadow_operative 15932]

please stop arguing with rex about this absurd idea that the UVA job is more desirable than the Texas job. he has zero clue what he's talking about, and zero desire to have an earnest conversation. "oh, what, they polled the coaches and they all said that Texas was a top flight job and nobody mentioned UVA? those coaches are lying, and would pass on Texas if offered both jobs." seriously?!? that's his response to that, and y'all are gonna keep arguing with this moron? a moron who we all know doesn't even follow this sport? to begin with? no. stop.

also, lol at rex having me on ignore. what kind of staggering mental weakness must a person have to feel like they need to have an internet poster on ignore? that's so sad.

Edited March 2, 2023 by shadow_operative

[Hookem2147 20990]

3 hours ago, Loop 1604 said:

Keeping RT would be a massive mistake CDC. I hope you know that…

Whoa! I hope someone notifies him!

[TejasPedro 1849]

Who’s the top dog in the big east, why aren’t we looking there? That conference used to be the cream of the crop for basketball. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

1 minute ago, TejasPedro said:

Who’s the top dog in the big east, why aren’t we looking there? That conference used to be the cream of the crop for basketball. 

[perfectchaos007 6603]

7 minutes ago, TejasPedro said:

Who’s the top dog in the big east, why aren’t we looking there? That conference used to be the cream of the crop for basketball. 

This is a great troll. pos rep

[royiv 9180]

6 minutes ago, TejasPedro said:

Who’s the top dog in the big east, why aren’t we looking there? That conference used to be the cream of the crop for basketball. 

[Js1 85166]

I bet that guy running Havoc at Texas would be too legit to quit 

[MuellerHorn 4203]

We can put RT as HC next year to bed now, right?

Edited March 2, 2023 by MuellerHorn

[closetohumping 17416]

2 hours ago, longhornmatt said:

Bennett would objectively be my top choice, at least out of the guys you could make a plausible argument for leaving their current job (i.e., no fantasies of poaching Bill Self or getting Coach K / Jay Wright reenergized and out of retirement scenarios).  Texas is a better job than UVA, but Bennett isn’t the classic money whip candidate. He likes wholesome religious places and he turned down a raise after winning the title and asked the school to use that money for facilities instead.  I don’t think he’s going to be like, “Oh wow, Austin is just my vibe!  And I demand $7 million instead of my current $4,500,000 if you want me to stay you cheapskates!” 

If there is an angle to poach him, I think it ultimately would come down to NIL and program support.  UVA and their alumni are most likely always going to be highly snooty about NIL and supporting athletics in general.  They don’t behave like Big State U for sports. I’m sure that’s annoying for a college basketball coach, and it becomes a much bigger problem with NIL turning everything into an open bidding war.

I wouldn't describe Charlottesville as wholesome.  Pretty liberal place no?  

[The Dog 43884]

[Herpa Derpa 6118]

2 hours ago, longhornmatt said:

he turned down a raise after winning the title and asked the school to use that money for facilities instead.

Could be because he's an altruistic soul that wanted to spread the rewards around to all who contributed and continue to build for the future. Could be because he recognized the woeful lack of support his program had previously received and knew it was the only way he could get the basic facilities he needed to compete.

Need another title to get further improvements? Need regular reinvestment in all aspects of the program to build a legacy? Won't have these issues at Texas.

Bottom line is that Texas betters UVA in every metric when it comes to what can be offered to a D1 basketball coach. The only question is Bennett himself. I don't know enough of his story to have an idea of what is the main motivation. Does he want to be a Mark Few who builds a program to perennial contender through his own success, or does he have an eye on nabbing a blue blood when available? Is he the type of Shenandoah Valley Christian (think Falwell) that would view Austin as Satan's playground? I have no idea. But I do know that absent a personal reason for turning down an offer, Texas will be able to provide anything he desires.

[Herpa Derpa 6118]

11 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

I wouldn't describe Charlottesville as wholesome.  Pretty liberal place no?  

It has the wholesomeness you get with a population of only 40k and a significant elite college vibe. Not Mayberry wholesome, but Dave Matthews wholesome.

[closetohumping 17416]

10 minutes ago, Herpa Derpa said:

It has the wholesomeness you get with a population of only 40k and a significant elite college vibe. Not Mayberry wholesome, but Dave Matthews wholesome.

I've heard some stories about Dave Matthews that will tell you he definitely ain't wholesome.  Besides, Texas is the bible belt.

[Herpa Derpa 6118]

38 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

I've heard some stories about Dave Matthews that will tell you he definitely ain't wholesome.  Besides, Texas is the bible belt.

I was referring to the milquetoast nature of a DMB track. Edge, it does not possess.

And Texas may be the bible belt, but Shenandoah Valley evangelism is the bible ligature. Those folks can make First Baptists seem downright liberal.

Edited March 2, 2023 by Herpa Derpa

[South Austin 52225]

Dave Matthew's Band sucks worse than Chris Beard's choice in women.

[TejasPedro 1849]

I’m gonna say Chris Beard’s woman probably sucks better. I wanna believe she is some kind of wonderful. 

[Deej 76657]

59 minutes ago, South Austin said:

Dave Matthew's Band sucks worse than Chris Beard's choice in women.

[CTC2 2763]

3 hours ago, MuellerHorn said:

We can put RT as HC next year to bed now, right?

Absolutely 

[royiv 9180]

1 hour ago, South Austin said:

Dave Matthew's Band sucks worse than Chris Beard's choice in women.

Who is Dave Matthew?

[South Austin 52225]

20 minutes ago, royiv said:

Who is Dave Matthew?

I think he did a duet once with Stevie Nick.

[Hermanator 7001]

7 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

 

also, lol at rex having me on ignore. what kind of staggering mental weakness must a person have to feel like they need to have an internet poster on ignore? that's so sad.

Maybe if you had utilized it you wouldn't have a verb named after you that means to fuck a thread up

[ClubWhatever 12105]

I think Cronin is greedy enough to jump. For 6 or 7 mil over 10. 

[txduck87 985]

Who’s the top dog in the big east, why aren’t we looking there? That conference used to be the cream of the crop for basketball. 

This guy should be available after this season.

[shadow_operative 15932]

23 minutes ago, Hermanator said:

Maybe if you had utilized it you wouldn't have a verb named after you that means to fuck a thread up

fuck up a thread*