Shaka Smart - Out at UT In at Marquette

[Red Five 40862]

If Shaka runs havoc at Marquette and has a bunch of success I can't be responsible for my actions. 

[Pancho 44856]

6 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

They’re a college basketball blue blood. I would assume most coaches around the country would view that as a better job than Texas, but again. I could be wrong. 

Actually, several media folks have surprising stated Texas is the better job opening right now over Indian because of what I’ve been saying on this (and other sites) for years—no fan pressure.  

We just want you to win.  

[DiceHands 349]

7 minutes ago, Red Five said:

If Shaka runs havoc at Marquette and has a bunch of success I can't be responsible for my actions. 

I dont get why we never even tried that here.  I thought that was why we hired him.  We never got that same Shaka we saw at VCU. 

[jinx 2635]

6 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

They’re a college basketball blue blood. I would assume most coaches around the country would view that as a better job than Texas, but again. I could be wrong. 

I don’t disagree in general. But I think the Nebraska comp someone made is accurate. Indiana has been nothing for decades, but the expectation is national titles like the old days. Meanwhile the Horns are running an NBA factory that can’t win a single game in the tourney. I know which one I would sign up for if I was a coach. 

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

2 minutes ago, Pancho said:

Actually, several media folks have surprising stated Texas is the better job opening right now over Indian because of what I’ve been saying on this (and other sites) for years—no fan pressure.  

We just want you to win.  

*native Americans

cmon pancho. It’s 2021 

[Longboard Horn 40331]

57 minutes ago, Pimphand said:

Thank god he left because this way CDC can't keep him around.  Now all CDC can do is buttfuck the hiring process and get us another alcoholic to represent the university. Maybe we can get a full AA convention up in here.

Not cool, man. I assume you're referring to Sark.

1. Sark is sober

2. Alcohol addiction is NOT  a joke! 

3. Get fucked!

[youdunnf'dup 2147]

5 minutes ago, jinx said:

I don’t disagree in general. But I think the Nebraska comp someone made is accurate. Indiana has been nothing for decades, but the expectation is national titles like the old days. Meanwhile the Horns are running an NBA factory that can’t win a single game in the tourney. I know which one I would sign up for if I was a coach. 

You guys are probably right. I didn’t realize it had been that long for IU. I don’t follow college basketball that closely when Texas isn’t good so it’s been awhile before this year. 

[Brandywine 1316]

10 hours ago, Beau Vine said:

Our athletic department buys $500 couch pillows by the truckload and you want to get chintzy on coaches' salaries?

So-then your answer is “Yes”? 😊

[Dr. Teeth 5845]

Someone just compared a 2 seed losing by one point to a 15 seed losing by 30 to help cope with getting a bad coach. What is Marquette’s academic reputation?

[jinx 2635]

23 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

You guys are probably right. I didn’t realize it had been that long for IU. I don’t follow college basketball that closely when Texas isn’t good so it’s been awhile before this year. 

I actually went to look it up since I was just talking from memory. I remembered a loss in the national championship, but didn’t realize it was way back in 2002. They have four Sweet Sixteen appearances since 94, which seems to be the year they really fell off.  Last National Championship was 87.

You are correct that the name says basketball much more than Texas, but the production since the early 90s is basically on par with us.

Edit to add that someone on the Horn said we are top 20 all time in basketball wins. I’m guessing that is largely due to longevity of our program, but that was news to me.  

Edited March 27, 2021 by jinx

[Underdog 28710]

Texas is a sleeping Giant of a job, Lemons, Penders and Barnes have proven you can do big things with Texas basketball.  Hopefully this doesn't turn into a UK/Donovan courtship where all signs point to a coming home to roost only to be turned down.  

[DanTheHorn 4933]

1 hour ago, shadow_operative said:

lmao. sweet, simple Marquette fans just have no idea who they just hired.

 

Wow we may never see this again. Two fan bases that are totally ecstatic about a coaches move.

Shaka is leaving. Longhorn fans reaction.

 

Shaka is coming. Marquette fans.

 

[Beau Vine 54251]

1 hour ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

A significant percentage of the NCAA doesn't even play baseball.

Really?  What is that percentage?

[Underdog 28710]

12 minutes ago, DanTheHorn said:

Wow we may never see this again. Two fan bases that are totally ecstatic about a coaches move.

Shaka is leaving. Longhorn fans reaction.

 

Shaka is coming. Marquette fans.

 

Meanwhile, in Hoops Heaven... 

[Ghost of Shag 2614]

Some of you underestimate this job. The talent and resources at Texas are as good as almost any job in the nation. No we’re not a “blue blood,” but we’re as good a job as Indiana if not better. This isn’t 1985.

You get the right coach here and he can compete with all the big boys year in and year out, without the expectations of a blue blood. 
 

 

[WJC88 97]

4 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

i actually agree with everything you said after this, but this part isn't true. i really wish that i could expound more, but i can't do so without outing/doxxing the former players who've told me some stories about Shaka. the bottom line is this (and i've alluded to this before)- i know for a fact that Shaka, who does represent the university well and who puts up a pretty great public image, has a nasty habit of playing mind games with/freezing out guys who aren't "his guys". whether it's a player he inherited, or a player who for whatever reason found himself at odds with Shaka, coach Smart has treated some of his players in some seriously immature and at times downright fucked up ways. like, you'd be upset and angry and like, "ok, fuck Shaka Smart" if you knew what i know. again, this is such lame shit for me to be posting; i know that. i wish i could get more specific, but i can't.

here is something i can say though- during the entire six years that Shaka was here, how many of his starters were ever demoted or benched, and how many of his bench players ever *earned* a larger role? we all know that these things rarely happened during Shaka's time as HC here, and that is emblematic of what i'm talking about. if you're one of Shaka's guys, what can you do to get benched? to lose minutes? to have your role reduced? unfortunately, the only answer (which is "cross Shaka Smart") has nothing to do with on-court performance. his guys are his guys, and the other guys don't matter. 

Jordan Barnett and James Banks? Shaka had no use for them; G Tech and Mizzou were very happy to take them off his hands. Prince Ibeh? gets no PT until Cam breaks his foot. Turns out to be the Big XII DPOY. Royce Hamm and Brock Cunningham? these dudes couldn't even get meaningful run in November/December games, and then all they did was save Shaka's job when injuries forced him to play them during the stretch run of Big XII play. Demarcus Holland and Kendal Yancy? Holland went from the team captain, senior leader, first-in/last-out, Big XII all-defense team member to being demoted and actually sat out of games that he was healthy for. Yancy rode the pine on our 11 win team until Shaka said "fuck it" and played him and it turned out that he was one of our more steady, calm, and consistent players. Greg Brown gets upset with something and, as sometimes happens with teenagers, needs to be calmed down. the result? he plays a total of 6 minutes vs ACU in a game where they outrebound us on the offensive glass 18-5. Matt Coleman could have taken three consecutive shots from half court and not been punished at all, but GB III needs to be taught some lesson for being upset with Shaka, in the most important game of Shaka's career no less.

meanwhile, Ramey and Jones will pull up from 23 feet with 25 seconds left on the shot clock with Texas down by 7 with 2:30 left and it doesn't move Shaka's needle. Matt Coleman can *disappear* for an entire half or more, and there will be no discernible amount of coaching, benching, teaching, nothing from Shaka. Matt will just play his standard 35 minutes and he'll either figure it out at some point or he won't. Ramey can aimlessly drive, leave his feet, take a bad shot/turn the ball over three times in five possessions, and Shaka doesn't notice. meanwhile Royce Hamm breathes wrong and he's out of the mix. 

again, i seriously wish that i could tell specific stories without doxxing people who trusted me with said stories, but i can't. all i can do is point to the above anecdotes and hope that y'all can connect the dots here with regards to Shaka being this "great man". if you're his guy, he's your mentor and role model. if you aren't, then the guy can be a total charlatan who fucks with your head and tries to gaslight you into submission. there are certainly worse guys out there- he's no Gregg Marshall- but he's not the guy he portrays himself to be, and i won't be rooting particularly hard for him moving forward. 

I appreciate your take. 

The title is still fucked up.

44 minutes ago, DiceHands said:

I dont get why we never even tried that here.  I thought that was why we hired him.  We never got that same Shaka we saw at VCU. 

We did get the Shaka from VCU. People didn't watch enough VCU basketball to be informed.

[Machinator 32099]

Herman was much more of an ass and did much more damage to the university and yet the title for his departure was much more dignified.

Change it, @immamac.

[Catdaddyhorn 3446]

7 minutes ago, Beau Vine said:

Really?  What is that percentage?

Significant is a bit of hyperbole, but when you have a number of Power 5 conference schools like Wisconsin, Syracuse, Colorado, and others not even bothering to field a team it's difficult to say the sport rates as high as college basketball. 

[Pancho 44856]

9 minutes ago, WJC88 said:

I appreciate your take. 

The title is still fucked up.

We did get the Shaka from VCU. People didn't watch enough VCU basketball to be informed.

Yeah I’m not a fan of the thread title either, especially compared to the Herman thread title.

But I don’t own this website, so...

[Beau Vine 54251]

4 minutes ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

Significant is a bit of hyperbole, but when you have a number of Power 5 conference schools like Wisconsin, Syracuse, Colorado, and others not even bothering to field a team it's difficult to say the sport rates as high as college basketball. 

Pretty sure no one actually said that.  So now you have hyperbole and strawman.  

[Red Five 40862]

He was told to find work elsewhere and would have been fired if he didn't, so it's kind of the opposite of "quitting". 

[SquishMitten 10414]

Thank god he left because this way CDC can't keep him around.  Now all CDC can do is buttfuck the hiring process

The fuck you talking about? You don’t think CDC played a huge role in getting Shaka out of here?!! Dude was convinced it was in his best interest to walk away from a $7 million buyout. That’s a hell of a feat.

[Catdaddyhorn 3446]

9 minutes ago, Ghost of Shag said:

Some of you underestimate this job. The talent and resources at Texas are as good as almost any job in the nation. No we’re not a “blue blood,” but we’re as good a job as Indiana if not better. This isn’t 1985.

You get the right coach here and he can compete with all the big boys year in and year out, without the expectations of a blue blood. 
 

 

Exactly!!! The high school basketball landscape in the state has changed significantly since we joined the Big12 and even more in the last 15 years. The 1st school from Texas to get an NCAA basketball championship in nearly 60 years will have the opportunity to launch themselves into a different stratosphere in terms of how it's viewed in the sport. Just this year alone there were 4 or 5 schools from Texas ranked in the top 10 for the first time ever.  With college coaching heavyweights like Coach K, Roy Williams, Izzo, Boeheim, and others approaching the end of their careers, the sport is ripe for a tremendous paradigm shift. Hopefully we can get ourselves a coach who is capable of taking advantage of it. 

[Blotto 23557]

33 minutes ago, Beau Vine said:

Really?  What is that percentage?

About 300 of the ~350 ncaa div 1 schools play baseball. 

Edited March 27, 2021 by Blotto

[Catdaddyhorn 3446]

8 minutes ago, Beau Vine said:

Pretty sure no one actually said that.  So now you have hyperbole and strawman.  

You may want to take a look at the initial post I replied to to begin the discussion. 

[TxTower 652]

Thank god he left because this way CDC can't keep him around.  Now all CDC can do is buttfuck the hiring process and get us another alcoholic to represent the university. Maybe we can get a full AA convention up in here.

I’m sure this was meant to be completely sarcastic but still - not cool.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[RockyMountainHighHorn 890]

1 minute ago, TxTower said:

I’m sure this was meant to be completely sarcastic but still - not cool.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not cool at all. Would love to wish alcoholism/addiction on him for a day but I wouldn’t wish that on anyone. So I’ll copy what a previous poster said and say-get fucked...futureman style. 

[boilerhorn 1393]

44 minutes ago, jinx said:

I actually went to look it up since I was just talking from memory. I remembered a loss in the national championship, but didn’t realize it was way back in 2002. They have four Sweet Sixteen appearances since 94, which seems to be the year they really fell off.  Last National Championship was 87.

They've really struggled for quite some time and have not been consistent winners since Knight left.  Aside from the trip to the finals, Davis underperformed, but I never thought he was up to the task at Indiana.  Sampson was on his way to rebuilding the juggernaut, but he got punted for cheating.  I thought Crean and Miller would be good there, but they also failed.

Purdue has won 9 in a row and 13 of the last 14 against IU.  Miller won 0 against Purdue.  You have to beat your rival on occasion, but I am fine with that.

[TxTower 652]

So now you have hyperbole and strawman.  

The life blood of Cloak Room.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[clapclapclap 9000]

12 hours ago, Beau Vine said:

Yeah, I'd hate for the University of Texas to go bankrupt by paying the basketball coach too much.

I guess you're unaware that UT had signed up with Griddy.

[Js1 85384]

3 hours ago, ClubWhatever said:

It’s interesting to me that the Texas website and official social media don’t even acknowledge that Shaka left.  It’s like, poof, he’s dead to us. 

Something from Texas

 

[Js1 85384]

 

[Pancho 44856]

 

[JimmyJames 12271]

3 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

the NIT win means nothing to me. i couldn't even tell you who we played in the final. there have been a million regular season games that meant more to me than winning the NIT. 

It was almost a little embarrassing. Just showed how massively we underachieved that year. 

[The Ace of Aces 5192]

2 hours ago, Red Five said:

If Shaka runs havoc at Marquette and has a bunch of success I can't be responsible for my actions. 

It’s definitely going to happen. But success is relative - VCU is equal to or better than MU is almost every way expect pay. 

[immamac 42864]

I don't really understand. Shaka was basketball Charlie Strong, but instead of losing to Kansas he lost to ACU which is arguably worse. Then he quit instead of getting fired to salvage whatever remains of his career. 

All this feel good bullshit is just that. Bullshit.

I get it he was a nice guy, but maybe I'm jaded from talking to Derka too much.

[Js1 85384]

Yeah you might be. He didn’t drag it out, he didn’t force us to fire him and collect a fat check.  No bad headlines about Texas firing him or any of that BS. 

You’re coming at this from the wrong angle.  We parted ways in the best way possible for both us and him. 

[Catdaddyhorn 3446]

1 minute ago, immamac said:

I don't really understand. Shaka was basketball Charlie Strong, but instead of losing to Kansas he lost to ACU which is arguably worse. Then he quit instead of getting fired to salvage whatever remains of his career. 

All this feel good bullshit is just that. Bullshit.

I get it he was a nice guy, but maybe I'm jaded from talking to Derka too much.

Being mediocre doesn't make you the worst coach in school history. Shaka was middling. He wasn't Charlie Strong. 

[83Horn 1642]

4 minutes ago, immamac said:

I don't really understand. Shaka was basketball Charlie Strong, but instead of losing to Kansas he lost to ACU which is arguably worse. Then he quit instead of getting fired to salvage whatever remains of his career. 

All this feel good bullshit is just that. Bullshit.

I get it he was a nice guy, but maybe I'm jaded from talking to Derka too much.

I keep seeing people say this, but it is so objectively wrong.  Charlie Strong never came anywhere near any championships of any kind.  He did win a few big games, i.e. Notre Dame, ou (once), and did beat Baylor more often than not, at a time when Baylor was still flying high.  However, his teams were, with very rare exception, completely outmanned, outcoached, and outplayed on the field.  At the very least, the basketball team did just do something that hasn't been done at Texas in about a quarter century in winning a conference tournament championship.  I know the NIT is not what people expect, but it does give the team a championship (of sorts), and hangs another banner in the rafters.  Charlie's teams never even had a single season where they won more games than they lost.  At the very worst, Shaka's teams were treading water; at best, Charlie's teams were sinking fast.  Please stop with the "Shaka was basketball Charlie Strong".

[Machinator 32099]

Shaka also finished in 3rd place in the Big 12 twice at Texas while Strong's teams went 6th, 5th, 6th. And we're a football school.

This is not to pump up Shaka but to emphasize how bad Strong was.

[immamac 42864]

2 minutes ago, 83Horn said:

I keep seeing people say this, but it is so objectively wrong.  Charlie Strong never came anywhere near any championships of any kind.  He did win a few big games, i.e. Notre Dame, ou (once), and did beat Baylor more often than not, at a time when Baylor was still flying high.  However, his teams were, with very rare exception, completely outmanned, outcoached, and outplayed on the field.  At the very least, the basketball team did just do something that hasn't been done at Texas in about a quarter century in winning a conference tournament championship.  I know the NIT is not what people expect, but it does give the team a championship (of sorts), and hangs another banner in the rafters.  Charlie's teams never even had a single season where they won more games than they lost.  At the very worst, Shaka's teams were treading water; at best, Charlie's teams were sinking fast.  Please stop with the "Shaka was basketball Charlie Strong".

Dude he lost to ACU 52-53. Did you watch any of the games? He literally was out coached, out manned and out played. You can donk your way to a winning record in college basketball. He had a losing record in conference play, which you know...actually matters. He was also abhorrent at developing talent and keeping clear talent here. He also sucked keeping assistants who weren't dogshit. He wasn't good, like at all, by any measurable. 

[phdhorn 6224]

14 hours ago, youdunnf'dup said:

If by sniff the idea you mean use as leverage but never truly consider it, then yes. I agree. But Texas isn’t enough of a step up for a coach the caliber of Beard. This ain’t football or baseball. Basketball is 3rd in the pecking order. If Kentucky came calling that’s an easy decision. Beard isn’t leaving tech unless a basketball blue blood came calling. We are not even close to that.

 

Whether Beard comes here or not, I don't think this is as true now as in the old days (say before social media).  If anything, Texas would be the absolutely perfect job.  Because it's got monstrous resources, profile, and presence (easily a Top 10 university in recognition, THE flagship for the entire SW U.S.).  What it doesn't have are the ghosts of Smith, Rupp, Knight, etc. to live up to.  In the old days, your crowning achievement was a stint at the perennial legacy universities, where the best kids would come for more TV and exposure.  Now of course the playing field is much more even - TV packages, conference contracts, and the endless social media vehicles means that a kid from Little Eastern Western Washington Vermont Tech can have as much exposure as one of the big boys - the only difference being perhaps less eyeballs in the Tourney (if the school is too small).  But even in these days,  things are evening out.  More <5 seeds in this tourney than (almost?) ever, granted it was a weird year due to covid.  Anyway Texas will always be in the running for the best kids in this region, and a high profile would attract some other kids.

Texas is like the Triple Crown winning thoroughbred that no one's been able to train.  It's got the best stables, hay, track facilities - and money.  It's just a matter of time until a great coach steps in - while football is sucking up all the pressure - and does his thing.  Sure the biggest egos might want to be at a UCLA or Villanova or UNC or whatever to step up against some of these ghosts, but things have changed today where a potentially great coach doesn't need to go to a perennial historical team - get into a Final Four or even one tourney championship - they're up there with the greats, and don't need a Carolina to enhance their legacy.

Sooner or later some guy is going to realize what's here (the new arena isn't a bad pull) and CDC I think is committed to the Texas of < 1990, where every sport (alas, except basketball during that time) is ruthlessly competitive.

In these days, any good coach will get money - it's way, way beyond that.  I don't think Beard would come here simply if a bigger truck backs up.  Money only goes so far.  It's the atmosphere and facilities and how much they can do what they want.  No reason Texas can't be that.  The Big XII is a baskeball conferene right now - it is - and so there's no reason it wouldn't be attractive.

There's another guy on the radar who I think would come here in a hearbeat and win.. I'll wait until the tourney is over (they're still in it).  More later if Beard declines.

Edited March 27, 2021 by phdhorn

[SDG 3319]

29 minutes ago, immamac said:

I don't really understand. Shaka was basketball Charlie Strong, but instead of losing to Kansas he lost to ACU which is arguably worse. Then he quit instead of getting fired to salvage whatever remains of his career. 

All this feel good bullshit is just that. Bullshit.

I get it he was a nice guy, but maybe I'm jaded from talking to Derka too much.

Found the problem...  

If you think he quit then I got some ocean front property in Arizona for you.  

[Herpa Derpa 6126]

30 minutes ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

Being mediocre doesn't make you the worst coach in school history. Shaka was middling. He wasn't Charlie Strong. 

This. The Shaka era ended better than a number of former coaches, including Kaiser Bob and Leon Black. Kaiser's greatest achievement was a single NIT appearance, ffs.  Shaka wasn't great like Barnes, or even pretty good like Penders or Lemons. But he wasn't the worst.  Charlie was/is/and hopefully forever will be, the worst.

Edit to add that if you think the 53-52 loss was Charlie level, let me help you recalibrate. Charlie never even makes it to that game, and if by some miracle of COVID forfeits he did, he would lose 86-41 to that same ACU school.  Just stop. Shaka was relatively terrible, he wasn't Charlie Strong terrible.

Edited March 27, 2021 by Herpa Derpa

[Duane Moore 5243]

I think the similarity of Smart and Strong is that they were both widely liked coaches but the time came for both when everyone in the fan base, administration, and media realized they just couldn’t get the job done and had to go. 

[clapclapclap 9000]

8 minutes ago, phdhorn said:

There's another guy on the radar who I think would come here in a hearbeat and win.. I'll wait until the tourney is over (they're still in it).  More later if Beard declines.

Juwan Howard for sure.

[Machinator 32099]

 

[immamac 42864]

Just now, SDG said:

Found the problem...  

If you think he quit then I got some ocean front property in Arizona for you.  

Lmao all these hot takes, he took another job at another school and quit. That's exactly what happened. Are you saying someone came to his house and threatened to kill him if he didn't leave? 

He voluntarily left. If it was involuntary he would have gotten 7 million and the same fucking job. 

[immamac 42864]

Just now, Machinator said:

 

Oh looky there. Quit, not fired. 

[83Horn 1642]

3 minutes ago, immamac said:

Dude he lost to ACU 52-53. Did you watch any of the games? He literally was out coached, out manned and out played. You can donk your way to a winning record in college basketball. He had a losing record in conference play, which you know...actually matters. He was also abhorrent at developing talent and keeping clear talent here. He also sucked keeping assistants who weren't dogshit. He wasn't good, like at all, by any measurable. 

Honestly, I don't disagree with anything you said here, except the highlighted part.  Yes, I did watch many of the games, until I couldn't take it any more.  I knew that any double digit second half lead would likely be pissed away, and we'd lose, or maybe win, by one or two points. I get the aggravation...we all see it...we ALL see it.  I still don't think the comparison to Charlie is a good one.  As pointed out above, Charlie was possibly the worst coach in the history of Texas football.  Shaka was not the worst coach of Texas Men's Basketball, even in my lifetime.  I think your emotions are still raw from the ACU loss, and that's understandable, but age has taught me that it is better to control my emotions...or to stop caring.  Take your pick.