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2021 Chicago Cubs - @%#$ Ricketts

shnsajax

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Carl Spackler

Carl Spackler 3488

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You feel bad today, but the sun will come up tomorrow.  It's a gut punch and I'm melancholy when I think about that '16 team and how it's almost all gone now, but I understand why Hoyer & Co. did what they did.  We were under .500 and essentially out of the playoff hunt with those guys in the lineup, and most (if not all) of them would have been gone after this season in free agency anyway.  So the Cubs had to get what they could for them while the team had the chance.  You can make the argument that Hoyer could/should have gotten more in some of these trades, but that's a somewhat different issue.  And other teams weren't gonna overpay for short-term rentals.

I'll probably watch that Game 7 tonight and raise a glass to Rizzo, Bryant, Baez, et al.  It will be bittersweet to watch knowing that five years later the core of the team has been dismantled, but we'll always have that World Series Championship.  And if the Cubs played their cards right and do some player development over the next few years, maybe we'll see another World Series win down the road.   

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shnsajax

shnsajax 3591

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25 minutes ago, Carl Spackler said:

You feel bad today, but the sun will come up tomorrow.  It's a gut punch and I'm melancholy when I think about that '16 team and how it's almost all gone now, but I understand why Hoyer & Co. did what they did.  We were under .500 and essentially out of the playoff hunt with those guys in the lineup, and most (if not all) of them would have been gone after this season in free agency anyway.  So the Cubs had to get what they could for them while the team had the chance.  You can make the argument that Hoyer could/should have gotten more in some of these trades, but that's a somewhat different issue.  And other teams weren't gonna overpay for short-term rentals.

I'll probably watch that Game 7 tonight and raise a glass to Rizzo, Bryant, Baez, et al.  It will be bittersweet to watch knowing that five years later the core of the team has been dismantled, but we'll always have that World Series Championship.  And if the Cubs played their cards right and do some player development over the next few years, maybe we'll see another World Series win down the road.   

Yep all of this. This was the roster on Opening Day 2014, one season away from playing in the NLCS. Now the Cubs aren't doing this next year, but the Red Sox are a pretty good example of winning now after turning to complete shit and reloading again. Rizzo has been garbage since 2019, Baez is overrated the defense and the dongs save him, I hope we will bring back Bryant but I doubt he will comeback. Heyward unfortunatly has 2 seasons left but we have little money on the books and a chance to reload the farm very quickly now.

Spoiler

PITCHERS (12 + 3 DL)

11-Kyuji Fujikawa, RHP (15-Day DL)

29-Jeff Samardzija, RHP

33-Carlos Villanueva, RHP

36-Edwin Jackson, RHP

37-Travis Wood, LHP

39-Jason Hammel, RHP

40-James Russell, LHP

41-Jose Veras, RHP

46-Pedro Strop, RHP

49-Jake Arrieta, RHP (15-Day DL)

52-Justin Grimm, RHP

53-Wesley Wright, LHP

55-James McDonald, RHP (60-Day DL)

56-Hector Rondon, RHP

63-Brian Schlitter, RHP

CATCHERS (2)

12-John Baker

5-Welington Castillo

INFIELDERS (6)

13-Starlin Castro

15-Darwin Barney

24-Luis Valbuena

30-Mike Olt

44-Anthony Rizzo

64-Emilio Bonifacio

OUTFIELDERS (5)

6-Ryan Sweeney

19-Nate Schierholtz

20-Justin Ruggiano

21-Junior Lake

51-Ryan Kalish

 

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GlenFromTheMailRoom

GlenFromTheMailRoom 1613

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1 hour ago, Carl Spackler said:

You feel bad today, but the sun will come up tomorrow.  It's a gut punch and I'm melancholy when I think about that '16 team and how it's almost all gone now, but I understand why Hoyer & Co. did what they did.  We were under .500 and essentially out of the playoff hunt with those guys in the lineup, and most (if not all) of them would have been gone after this season in free agency anyway.  So the Cubs had to get what they could for them while the team had the chance.  You can make the argument that Hoyer could/should have gotten more in some of these trades, but that's a somewhat different issue.  And other teams weren't gonna overpay for short-term rentals.

I'll probably watch that Game 7 tonight and raise a glass to Rizzo, Bryant, Baez, et al.  It will be bittersweet to watch knowing that five years later the core of the team has been dismantled, but we'll always have that World Series Championship.  And if the Cubs played their cards right and do some player development over the next few years, maybe we'll see another World Series win down the road.   

Right here is the issue.  We don’t develop SHIT.  There hasn’t been a single player the Cubs have brought up outside of every single player they just traded away.

The Cubs are awful at player development.  Let’s not pull punches here and pretend like this a good thing.

We gave awful contracts to awful players (Heyward), didn’t invest in young starting pitching, spent every single offseason only concerned about the bull pen.  
 

This is self caused.  Hoyer isn’t Theo and nothing we got today is solving anything anytime soon.  We gave away 20ish all star appearances, the best closer in baseball, multiple gold gloves, an nl mvp, the soul of a Cubs team that won the first World Series in 100 years.

wrap you mind around this - we gave up gleyber torres for a rental.  What the fuck did we get?

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Carl Spackler

Carl Spackler 3488

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31 minutes ago, GlenFromTheMailRoom said:

Right here is the issue.  We don’t develop SHIT.  There hasn’t been a single player the Cubs have brought up outside of every single player they just traded away.

The Cubs are awful at player development.  Let’s not pull punches here and pretend like this a good thing.

We gave awful contracts to awful players (Heyward), didn’t invest in young starting pitching, spent every single offseason only concerned about the bull pen.  
 

This is self caused.  Hoyer isn’t Theo and nothing we got today is solving anything anytime soon.  We gave away 20ish all star appearances, the best closer in baseball, multiple gold gloves, an nl mvp, the soul of a Cubs team that won the first World Series in 100 years.

wrap you mind around this - we gave up gleyber torres for a rental.  What the fuck did we get?

Trust me -- I feel your pain.  Been a Cubs fan for 50 years.  Am I happy tonight?  Not at all.  I think Hoyer should have done more to retain some of these guys.  And I agree that the Cubs have had issues developing players, though you and I both know that your third sentence is an exaggeration.  And I think Hoyer could have gotten better return in some of the trades.

But ask yourself this:  Would you have been happier if the Cubs had retained all of those guys, limped through the remainder of the season, missed the playoffs, and then watched most (if not all) of those guys ride off in the free agency sunset with no return whatsoever?

It's a shit sandwich either way, IMO.

 

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shnsajax

shnsajax 3591

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3 hours ago, GlenFromTheMailRoom said:

Right here is the issue.  We don’t develop SHIT.  There hasn’t been a single player the Cubs have brought up outside of every single player they just traded away.

The Cubs are awful at player development.  Let’s not pull punches here and pretend like this a good thing.

We gave awful contracts to awful players (Heyward), didn’t invest in young starting pitching, spent every single offseason only concerned about the bull pen.  
 

This is self caused.  Hoyer isn’t Theo and nothing we got today is solving anything anytime soon.  We gave away 20ish all star appearances, the best closer in baseball, multiple gold gloves, an nl mvp, the soul of a Cubs team that won the first World Series in 100 years.

wrap you mind around this - we gave up gleyber torres for a rental.  What the fuck did we get?

Basically every problem you mention was from Theo and the same problems he had with Boston after winning the WS. But your right the development is a problem, we over extended in the international pool and that basically left us dry for a couple of years. I do however agree with what happened today. If we are going to do the firesale, you do it 100%. Unfortuantly the Qualified Offer isn't worth what it was 2 years ago, otherwise you keep Bryant and make him that offer. Every single one of these guys minus Kimbrel is a FA this offseason. 

I mean going into the next offseason, what do you really offer Rizzo who is hitting around .230 the last two seasons and averaging about a 1.2 WAR? What do you offer Baez who in 2020 hit (.203/.238/.360/.599) and in 2021 is hitting (.248/.292/.484/.775), obviously you want to keep Bryant but hes already turned down $200 million and you couldn't get a deal done this past off season. But you are risk the next several seasons with more bad contracts if you pay the wrong price for Rizzo and Baez.

It sucks, but this is really where we are and there is still a chance you could bring one of them back next year. Also Brennan Davis who was the MVP of the Future Game looks like he will be a great player when his time comes, which is probably next year.


 

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Dewey

Dewey 3286

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They won a WS, but I feel like it was a waste. When they needed BP help, they did jack shit and it cost us in back to back seasons. When they went after BP help, they filled the pin with average arms, they finally get a closer and he can't find his stuff for a season and a half. 

The core has many good years in front of them and poof, bye. I'm mostly bitter towards ownership,  but Theo too. I don't have much faith in Jed. 

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Fletch

Fletch 5800

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54 minutes ago, Dewey said:

They won a WS, but I feel like it was a waste. When they needed BP help, they did jack shit and it cost us in back to back seasons. When they went after BP help, they filled the pin with average arms, they finally get a closer and he can't find his stuff for a season and a half. 

The core has many good years in front of them and poof, bye. I'm mostly bitter towards ownership,  but Theo too. I don't have much faith in Jed. 

This is why I wish we snagged Andrew Miller instead of Chapman. He would’ve been around a few years whereas Chapman was a (worth it) rental. 
 

csb time. Was watching the 2011 mlb draft with a friend. Wanted to see where jumgmann ended up. Cubs picks come up and I’m like “yessss!!!!! Pull the trigger!!!” And they too Baez instead and I was pissed. That aged well

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shadow_operative2.0

shadow_operative2.0 16012

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Lot of moving parts. 

Quote

Catcher Yan Gomes and the Chicago Cubs are in agreement on a two-year, $13 million contract, sources familiar with the deal told ESPN's Jeff Passan.

The team also is set to sign Clint Frazier, the former New York Yankee, to a one-year contract, sources told ESPN's Jesse Rogers. Terms of that deal weren't immediately known.

Gomes, 34, hit a combined .252 with 14 home runs and 52 RBIs between the Washington Nationals and Oakland Athletics last season. Washington traded Gomes to the A's at the trading deadline.

He threw out 31% of attempted base stealers last season (19 of 43) and had a .990 fielding percentage. 

——

He also has experience at first base and as a designated hitter, giving the Cubs some options should they field a team with both Contreras and Gomes and the DH becomes universal. Last year, the Cubs set a record by using nine different backup catchers behind Contreras, so at minimum Gomes should shore up that role.

 

 

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