2018 NBA Offseason Thread -- News, Free Agency, Trades, Etc

[Machinator 32099]

Reference to the kid's show SpongeBob SquarePants.

[Orca of Peace 109]

[SilasCoade 2622]

Pro move by Pelicans picking up Randle instead of banking on Boogie's recovery from a career threatening injury.

[Jhawk 1075]

My biggest question is the following, now that they have cousins on the roster they can pay him whatever he wants next year right? Sure it will put them in luxury tax hell but technically couldn’t they give Klay, cousins, and green $20mm each and just eat the taxes next year? If the owners are willing to pay, they have 4 more years of dominance. 

[aggie08 21504]

20 minutes ago, Llogg said:

Pro move by Pelicans picking up Randle instead of banking on Boogie's recovery from a career threatening injury.

That's pretty much what it boils down to: that one team that could afford to take a multi-year risk on Boogie banked on the younger, healthy player.  Others have echoed this, but I think it's a great move on New Orleans' part.

[Orca of Peace 109]

I'm hoping there's a huge mixup with their agency management where Demarcus shows up at the Minnesota Vikings camp and Kirk at the GS facility. 

[aggie08 21504]

13 minutes ago, Jhawk said:

My biggest question is the following, now that they have cousins on the roster they can pay him whatever he wants next year right? Sure it will put them in luxury tax hell but technically couldn’t they give Klay, cousins, and green $20mm each and just eat the taxes next year? If the owners are willing to pay, they have 4 more years of dominance. 

No.  They don't have his Bird Rights, and they're well, well over the cap.  He's a 5 month rental and nothing else.  (Unless he plays so poorly that the market is still bleak, and he'd come back for $6.4M, the most they can offer him.)

Edited July 3, 2018 by aggie08

[Jhawk 1075]

Got it. Appreciate the clarification. 

['stache 21818]

So should the east just be relegated to a lower division? The disparity is absurd.

[Mitch Cumsteen 18550]

This is all a function of the players union not opting for cap smoothing after the new TV deal kicked in. What a complete joke the league has turned into.

 

[Orca of Peace 109]

1 minute ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

This is all a function of the players union not opting for cap smoothing after the new TV deal kicked in. What a complete joke the league has turned into.

 

all teams have the same rules, so why can't another become Super Team 2 ? 

[d2o 1602]

40 minutes ago, Jhawk said:

My biggest question is the following, now that they have cousins on the roster they can pay him whatever he wants next year right? Sure it will put them in luxury tax hell but technically couldn’t they give Klay, cousins, and green $20mm each and just eat the taxes next year? If the owners are willing to pay, they have 4 more years of dominance. 

he has to be there 3 yr before GSW has Bird rights on him so no they cannot pay him whatever they want until they have his Bird rights.

[aggie08 21504]

6 minutes ago, Orca of Peace said:

all teams have the same rules, so why can't another become Super Team 2 ? 

All teams didn't draft 3 of their 4 best players, so unless everyone plays for pennies on the dollar (or a certain Russian billionaire trades you a dozen picks for 50 year old KG), it's really, really hard to collect and keep all-stars.

[d2o 1602]

13 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

This is all a function of poor GM work. What a complete joke the league has turned into.

 

FIFY.  Just cause the money was there didn't mean they needed to give people like Alan Crabbe, Kent Bazemore, Marvin Williams and others 17M+/yr for 4-5 yrs.

Edited July 3, 2018 by d2o

[C-Man 27230]

17 minutes ago, d2o said:

FIFY.  Just cause the money was there didn't mean they needed to give people like Alan Crabbe, Kent Bazemore, Marvin Williams and others 17M+/yr for 4-5 yrs.

 

17 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

All teams didn't draft 3 of their 4 best players, so unless everyone plays for pennies on the dollar (or a certain Russian billionaire trades you a dozen picks for 50 year old KG), it's really, really hard to collect and keep all-stars.

 

26 minutes ago, Orca of Peace said:

all teams have the same rules, so why can't another become Super Team 2 ? 

 

29 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

This is all a function of the players union not opting for cap smoothing after the new TV deal kicked in. What a complete joke the league has turned into.

 

Whatever the reason(s), the NBA is quickly turning into an immediate punch-out for me.

[Jhawk 1075]

39 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

This is all a function of the players union not opting for cap smoothing after the new TV deal kicked in. What a complete joke the league has turned into.

 

It is insane to me how the NBA protects its own.  Guys like brian colangelo are almost royalty even though he is awful.  Donald sterling and anyone with the clippers for so long.  Doc Rivers is seen as a coaching savant.  Most of all, the players always protect each other. the players have always defended guys like Melo as one of the best players and best teammates but when the rubber hits the road, no one has ever elected to go play with him (except amare).

This is pretty typical of the NFL as well.  It seems the mantra is "don't change anything because it is working on the whole and we don't want outside eyes looking into our business."  It is insane the amount of recycled bullshit that is going on in the NBA.

[Mitch Cumsteen 18550]

39 minutes ago, d2o said:

FIFY.  Just cause the money was there didn't mean they needed to give people like Alan Crabbe, Kent Bazemore, Marvin Williams and others 17M+/yr for 4-5 yrs.

You are correct of course, but I was talking more specifically about Kevin Durant going to the Warriors. They could have never fit him into their cap otherwise. The whole point of the salary cap was to bring competitive balance to the league (especially for smaller market teams) and to protect owners/GMs from themselves. You throw in a one time bubble like that and then everything got out of whack and here we are today. It was terrible for the league.

[Huckleberry 32956]

43 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

All teams didn't draft 3 of their 4 best players, so unless everyone plays for pennies on the dollar (or a certain Russian billionaire trades you a dozen picks for 50 year old KG), it's really, really hard to collect and keep all-stars.

Yep, the only fanbase that should be upset about this is maybe Oklahoma City. The Warriors kicked the draft's ass for Curry, Thompson, and Green. Who else has drafted three all stars (again, aside from OKC although the Thunder's picks were #2, #4, and #3 overall) like that?

Too much whining is being done about signing Durant and now Cousins. People are ignoring that the foundation for this run was the draft.

[Aqua Buddha 14598]

Maybe I'm late to the game on this but I was reading something about Boogie's injury being worse than most fans think.  (The point was that all the NBA people realize it and that's why there was very tepid interest.)  Supposedly, he won't come back until maybe February and the history of NBA players coming back from an achilles tear is abysmal.  

If that's the case, let's pump the brakes and props to New Orleans for getting out of that and into a younger player at the same position.

[C-Man 27230]

8 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Yep, the only fanbase that should be upset about this is maybe Oklahoma City. The Warriors kicked the draft's ass for Curry, Thompson, and Green. Who else has drafted three all stars (again, aside from OKC although the Thunder's picks were #2, #4, and #3 overall) like that?

Too much whining is being done about signing Durant and now Cousins. People are ignoring that the foundation for this run was the draft.

Sure but Durant going to the Warriors absolutely destroyed whatever competitive balance that was left in the league. My guess is the Curry-Thompson-Green (minus Durant) were good for two titles before the league caught up. Now they're looking at four in five years, perhaps more.

[d2o 1602]

7 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

You are correct of course, but I was talking more specifically about Kevin Durant going to the Warriors. They could have never fit him into their cap otherwise. The whole point of the salary cap was to bring competitive balance to the league (especially for smaller market teams) and to protect owners/GMs from themselves. You throw in a one time bubble like that and then everything got out of whack and here we are today. It was terrible for the league.

The KD part is true.   A few other things went into that as well.  Taken further though if Steph doesn't have all the ankle trouble he doesn't get signed to the small deal which allowed them to have the space as well.

 

More importantly, this summer is completely different if all those shitty teams didn't go hog wild with their cap space a couple yrs back.    There were only like 3 -5 teams with any real space this summer and whole bunch of other teams trying to dump those shitty deals they signed a couple yrs back.

[Huckleberry 32956]

So in other words it's exactly like situations the NBA has seen before (Rodman to Bulls in exchange for Will fucking Perdue, etc.).

[Murfdogg21 4413]

Yeah, you have to wonder if GS makes the finals the past two years without Durant, between Houston and OKC (or wherever else Durant would have signed).

The diehard fans will still watch, but does the NBA realize they are potentially losing a generation of fans in many markets where they have zero percent chance of a championship? I grew up thinking even if you got the 6 seed there was a chance. Even as a casual Rockets fan I don’t feel very confident unless CP3 stays healthy and an arm falls off of one of the splash bros. I can only imagine what casual fans in the rest of the country feel like. I am not offering a way to fix it by the NBA, because if Allstars want it bad enough they could all sign somewhere for minimums and live off endorsement money, but damn if it isn’t an uncompetitive league. 

Edited July 3, 2018 by Murfdogg21

[Francisco 2.0 32395]

10 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

Maybe I'm late to the game on this but I was reading something about Boogie's injury being worse than most fans think.  (The point was that all the NBA people realize it and that's why there was very tepid interest.)  Supposedly, he won't come back until maybe February and the history of NBA players coming back from an achilles tear is abysmal.  

If that's the case, let's pump the brakes and props to New Orleans for getting out of that and into a younger player at the same position.

Yeah, that's the thing.   Dominique Wilkins is the only player that I can think of that came back and played close to the level he was playing at prior to his tear.  

[Vic Mackey 47064]

6 minutes ago, C-Man said:

Sure but Durant going to the Warriors absolutely destroyed whatever competitive balance that was left in the league. My guess is the Curry-Thompson-Green (minus Durant) were good for two titles before the league caught up. Now they're looking at four in five years, perhaps more.

Yep. I don't know why an injured Cousins as a few month rental is the tipping point for so many when Durant completely ruined any competitive balance in the West 2 offseasons ago. He is a top 3-5 player and joined a 73 win team who just went to 2 straight Finals. Yet now so many on here are up in arms about this move?

I hate both the moves just being a fan of the NBA but this pales in comparison to Durant joining.

[Murfdogg21 4413]

4 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

So in other words it's exactly like situations the NBA has seen before (Rodman to Bulls in exchange for Will fucking Perdue, etc.).

Not really arguing, but many teams and fans thought they had at least some chance of upsetting the Bulls during that era (Pacers, Knicks, Rockets (wish they had met in a finals), hell the pasty gangsters from Utah took them to 6 games twice!).

[Huckleberry 32956]

1 minute ago, Murfdogg21 said:

Not really arguing, but many teams and fans thought they had at least some chance of upsetting the Bulls during that era (Pacers, Knicks, Rockets (wish they had met in a finals), hell the pasty gangsters from Utah took them to 6 games twice!).

So Houston fans didn't think they had a chance a couple of months ago? There have been two seasons of ERMAGERD UNBEATABLE WARRIORS and in one of them they were less than 50% to get to the Finals until Chris Paul got hurt.

[Vic Mackey 47064]

Just now, Murfdogg21 said:

Not really arguing, but many teams and fans thought they had at least some chance of upsetting the Bulls during that era (Pacers, Knicks, Rockets (wish they had met in a finals), hell the pasty gangsters from Utah took them to 6 games twice!).

Don't forget the Sonics. They took them to 6. You are right, the Bulls were damn good and above everyone else but there was still hope for other teams. The Pacers and Knicks gave them some good series in their run. All those Finals I can remember with Jordan went 6 games. These Warriors are not just above everyone else, they are light years away. Houston taking them to 7 last season was fool's gold. GSW has another gear they can turn on even when down almost 20 that no other team can touch. 

[d2o 1602]

7 minutes ago, Murfdogg21 said:

Yeah, you have to wonder if GS makes the finals the past two years without Durant, between Houston and OKC (or wherever else Durant would have signed).

The diehard fans will still watch, but does the NBA realize they are potentially losing a generation of fans in many markets where they have zero percent chance of a championship? I grew up thinking even if you got the 6 seed there was a chance. Even as a casual Rockets fan I don’t feel very confident unless CP3 stays healthy and an arm falls off of one of the splash bros. I can only imagine what casual fans in the rest of the country feel like. I am not offering a way to fix it by the NBA, because if Allstars want it bad enough they could all sign somewhere for minimums and live off endorsement money, but damn if it isn’t an uncompetitive league. 

You were a kid with a completely unrealistic expectation.

[Vic Mackey 47064]

Anthony Davis just bought a $7.5million home in LA. I know athletes have multiple homes all over but it is shaping up like the Lakers are going to be Super Team 2 here in the next few years. Possibly could have Lebron, Kawhi and AD to try and knock off the Warriors. At this point, fuck it. Might as well happen.

http://www.tmz.com/2018/07/02/anthony-davis-buys-california-mansion-7-5-million/

[aggie08 21504]

16 minutes ago, Murfdogg21 said:

Yeah, you have to wonder if GS makes the the past two years without Durant, between Houston and OKC (or wherever else Durant would have signed).

The diehard fans will still watch, but does the NBA realize they are potentially losing a generation of fans in many markets where they have zero percent chance of a championship? I grew up thinking even if you got the 6 seed there was a chance. Even as a casual Rockets fan I don’t feel very confident unless CP3 stays healthy and an arm falls off of one of the splash bros. I can only imagine what casual fans in the rest of the country feel like. I am not offering a way to fix it by the NBA, because if Allstars want it bad enough they could all sign somewhere for minimums and live off endorsement money, but damn if it isn’t an uncompetitive league. 

What did the previous generation think their team's chances were with MJ, Magic, and Bird?  And what NBA were you watching where you felt like a 6 seed--other than the defending NBA champions who slacked off all regular season--could win it all.  It's been Celtics, Lakers, Piston, Bulls, Spurs, Heat, and Warriors.  With very few random outliers.

 

Edited July 3, 2018 by aggie08

[Murfdogg21 4413]

Well fuck then they should go back to only two teams per conference make the playoffs if nobody else has a chance and quit wasting everyone’s time. 

Edited July 3, 2018 by Murfdogg21

[d2o 1602]

Just now, Murfdogg21 said:

Well fuck then they should go back to only two teams per conference make the playoffs if nobody else has a chance and quit wasting everyone’s time. 

Were the Conf finals and Finals the only playoff series you enjoyed?

[C-Man 27230]

10 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

So in other words it's exactly like situations the NBA has seen before (Rodman to Bulls in exchange for Will fucking Perdue, etc.).

Rodman was being a fuckstick in SA and Pop (then the GM) hated him. He'd separated his shoulder in a motorcycle accident and missed half the 94-95 season and probably wasn't 100 percent healthy for the playoffs that year. Perdue was a very useful bench piece for the '99 champs. 

[Chuckie Finster 22694]

9 minutes ago, d2o said:

You were a kid with a completely unrealistic expectation.

Can't tell if serious?

[C-Man 27230]

11 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

All those Finals I can remember with Jordan went 6 games.

The Bulls first title was a 4-1 win over the Lakers.

[d2o 1602]

1 minute ago, Chuckie Finster said:

Can't tell if serious?

so one 6 seed.......that was the defending champion.........means that all 6 seeds had a chance?

 

I can't tell if YOU are serious

[C-Man 27230]

The thing that's changed is that these guys -- I'm talking about the very cream-of-the-crop NBA superstars -- are all buddies with each other off-the-court. There's no real rivalry between them anymore. It never would've occurred to Bill Russell to join forces with Wilt Chamberlain, or Larry Bird with Magic Johnson or later with Michael Jordan. And nobody wanted to play with Isaiah Thomas.

[Huckleberry 32956]

7 minutes ago, C-Man said:

Rodman was being a fuckstick in SA and Pop (then the GM) hated him. He'd separated his shoulder in a motorcycle accident and missed half the 94-95 season and probably wasn't 100 percent healthy for the playoffs that year. Perdue was a very useful bench piece for the '99 champs. 

You just proved my point.

"San Antonio has traded a future Hall of Famer to the best team in the league in exchange for a useful bench piece."

"Sacramento has traded DeMarcus Cousins to Golden State in exchange for Swaggy P."

People would be going ballistic despite the fact Cousins isn't at Rodman's level.

Edited July 3, 2018 by Huckleberry

[C-Man 27230]

1 minute ago, Huckleberry said:

You just proved my point.

"San Antonio has traded a future Hall of Famer to the best team in the league in exchange for a useful bench piece."

What point was that? That what is happening today is the same thing that was happening in the mid--90's? I don't recall that being a regular occurrence at the time.

[d2o 1602]

4 minutes ago, C-Man said:

The thing that's changed is that these guys -- I'm talking about the very cream-of-the-crop NBA superstars -- are all buddies with each other off-the-court. There's no real rivalry between them anymore. It never would've occurred to Bill Russell to join forces with Wilt Chamberlain, or Larry Bird with Magic Johnson or later with Michael Jordan. And nobody wanted to play with Isaiah Thomas.

Those guys were all boys too.    They just never reached free agency to do anything about it back then. 

 

[Murfdogg21 4413]

5 minutes ago, d2o said:

Were the Conf finals and Finals the only playoff series you enjoyed?

Do you enjoy watching series where the underdog has 0.0% chance? Apparently there was no chance for anyone outside the two or three best teams to win, so sayeth the surl.

 

I was being facetious about that. Like I said earlier, I came into being an NBA fan in the Jordan era, but with so many other powerful teams: Hakeem et al Rockets, whatever version of the Knicks from year to year, Reggie/Smits/Jackson/Davis Bros. on the Pacers, Barkley/KJ/Majerle Suns, Mourning and Howard on the Heat, Malone and Stockton’s jazz, Kemp and Payton in Seattle, Shaq and Penny in Orlando, etc. If you were a fan of one of those teams, you thought you had some statistical chance of winning. The angry Surly mob that just likes to whack people is cracking on the 12 year old version of me that believed in a David Stern universe someone could upset Michael Jordan. Dynasties can be great in sports because some love them and everyone else hates them and wants to beat them. When 90+% of all fans think there is no chance of an upset, the sport is not exciting. 

[C-Man 27230]

6 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

You just proved my point.

"San Antonio has traded a future Hall of Famer to the best team in the league in exchange for a useful bench piece."

"Sacramento has traded DeMarcus Cousins to Golden State in exchange for Swaggy P."

People would be going ballistic despite the fact Cousins isn't at Rodman's level.

I'm confused. I'm talking about free agent signings, not trades. I don't really care about the Cousins thing anyway. IMO, the Pelicans actually came out ahead on this deal, effectively getting Randle for Boogie.

[d2o 1602]

From 1979 until 1992 the champion was a #1 seed.   93 and 94 the champ was a #2.   Outside of the Rockets no team lower than a 3 seed has won a title.

[Chuckie Finster 22694]

11 minutes ago, d2o said:

so one 6 seed.......that was the defending champion.........means that all 6 seeds had a chance?

 

I can't tell if YOU are serious

Say what you will, actually seeing it happen can do wonders for perception.  We're going on half a decade now where unless you are the #1 seed in the West or have Lebron on your team, you have no shot.  

[d2o 1602]

1 minute ago, Murfdogg21 said:

Do you enjoy watching series where the underdog has 0.0% chance? Apparently there was no chance for anyone outside the two or three best teams to win, so sayeth the surl.

 

I was being facetious about that. Like I said earlier, I came into being an NBA fan in the Jordan era, but with so many other powerful teams: Hakeem et al Rockets, whatever version of the Knicks from year to year, Reggie/Smits/Jackson/Davis Bros. on the Pacers, Barkley/KJ/Majerle Suns, Mourning and Howard on the Heat, Malone and Stockton’s jazz, Kemp and Payton in Seattle, Shaq and Penny in Orlando, etc. If you were a fan of one of those teams, you thought you had some statistical chance of winning. The angry Surly mob that just likes to whack people is cracking on the 12 year old version of me that believed in a David Stern universe someone could upset Michael Jordan. Dynasties can be great in sports because some love them and everyone else hates them and wants to beat them. When 90+% of all fans think there is no chance of an upset, the sport is not exciting. 

I enjoy watching basketball played at its highest level.    There were PLENTY of great games/series in the early rounds of the playoffs.

 

None of those teams had a real chance.   The Jazz were about as close as there was during that time.    You're romanticizing the past.     Its not much different than the present.    The only real difference is the players are controlling where they go now.    The result is exactly the same but many don't like the appearance that the "inmates are running the asylum"

[d2o 1602]

1 minute ago, Chuckie Finster said:

Say what you will, actually seeing it happen can do wonders for perception.  We're going on half a decade now where unless you are the #1 seed in the West or have Lebron on your team, you have no shot.  

so like it was from 1979 until 1992?

[Huckleberry 32956]

5 minutes ago, C-Man said:

I'm confused. I'm talking about free agent signings, not trades. I don't really care about the Cousins thing anyway. IMO, the Pelicans actually came out ahead on this deal, effectively getting Randle for Boogie.

I'm talking about it all, and in particular the end result being dominant teams in the NBA. It's not really elucidating to say that this kind of thing didn't happen in free agency in the 1980s considering free agency wasn't a thing.

[Surlybastard 65]

8 minutes ago, d2o said:

Those guys were all boys too.    They just never reached free agency to do anything about it back then. 

 

Magic and Isiah were definitely known for being pals(they did that silly kiss thing before each finals game in 88 or 89 up until Magic put a hard foul on Isiah or something like that) but I think Isiah was determined to win in Detroit and wanted to beat both the Celtics and Lakers in order to do it. Its a different culture now. We just have to accept it. No going back.

[C-Man 27230]

3 minutes ago, d2o said:

Those guys were all boys too.    They just never reached free agency to do anything about it back then. 

 

Maybe. But do you think many -- if any -- of those guys would've taken the Durant approach if they could have? My NBA-watching goes back to the early 80's. Very few of the all-time greats failed to win at least one title. The Pistons had to figure out a way to dethrone the Celtics, the Bulls had to figure out a way to beat the Pistons, the rest of the league had to figure out how to beat the Bulls and so on and so forth.

What Durant did was unprecedented. After blowing a 3-1 lead in the WCF, rather than figure out how they can close the Warriors out next time he decides to join them as a FA.